1.—13b

16

Hon. Mr. Fowlds (in answer to Mr. Hogg): The Native teachers would be in the same position as the other teachers. Mr. Hogben (in answer to Mr. Sidey): I have said that I am opposed to centralisation. 13. Mr. Sidey. Do you not think that the best way would bo to enlarge the power of the School Committees?—lt depends what you mean. Are you going to provide each Committee with an expert officer like an Inspector? And how can a School Committee exercise the power of transfer? 14. That could be done between the Committee and the central authority?— The Committees are in a better position than they were originally under the Act of 1877. Formerly a Board might send the names of fifty candidates to a Committee without indicating any order of preference; but now the Board has to put in order the names of those candidates it considers qualified for the position. So the Board has now to indicate to the Committee what its intention is. Mr. Hogben (in answer to Mr. T. Mackenzie) : I do not think the name "monitor " is better than "probationer." A monitor is one who looks after children a little younger than himself; a probationer is one who has had two or three years in a secondary school, and has declared his intention to become a teacher, and is put into a school in order to prove his capacity. 15. Mr. T. Mackenzie. But the term is associated with the odium of persons who are being reformed ?—I do not see that there is anything in that. The term is used in connection with schools, hospitals, and so forth, all over the world. I do not see that any great harm would be done by leaving subclause (2) of clause 5 to regulation ; but it is useful to state a maximum time of employment. The order of the subsections was the law draftsman's order. T think it is the right order. 16. What objection would there be to a Board reducing the list of six candidates to three, and then giving the Committee the power to select? —Tt would oppose a barrier against transfers. 17. Would not the School Committees be likely to exercise greatest judgment in selecting a teacher, seeing that they have children of their own to be instructed in the school? —That would be a source of strength in certain cases, and also a source of weakness. The Board has an interest in keeping the whole system under its control in good working-order, and it has means of knowing better than any Committee the teachers best suited for any particular school. Ido not see how any Committee could have that knowledge. In regard to canvassing on behalf of applicants, 1 believe it would be easier to get at Committees than it would be to get at the Board. Ido not think it would be a strange thing for candidates to get at Committees on account of the latter having an interest in the children. It would be the common experience of all parochialism. The Committee Rave not the knowledge to enable them to choose the best teachers. In nine cases out of ten fhe men who get on Committees have not the knowledge and experience to advise. They may have the ability, but not the knowledge. 18. The Board might send on four names to the Committee, stating length of service in each case and other qualifications, and then leave it to the Committee to make a selection from the four persons nominated? —That takes away from the Board the power of appointment. The Board would have only the power of an advisory committee. Mr. Hogben (in answer to Mr. Buddo): To limit the number nominated by the Board and give the Committee the power of final selection would practically make the Board nearly an advisory committee. The power to make a transfer must imply the power to control appointments. All that the Board is compelled to do is to take into consideration the recommendation of the Committee. In regard to reduction of staff, I have handed in two amending clauses, one of which safeguards the staff, and the other the salaries. (In answer to the Chairman): I have been informed on good authority that a Board in one case sent in six names to a Committee, of persons regarded as most suitable, and the Committee, for personal reasons, recommended the third person in the list for appointment. That candidate was not so suitable as the first and second in the list, but he was personally known to a good many people in the place, and in order to make sure that the first candidate in the list should not be appointed, the Committee recommended as their second candidate the sixth in the list. If it had appointed the latter the Board would have stultified itself, and yet that was the only alternative left. I think you may rely on the common-sense of Committees generally as against the feeling of one or two Committees. My own feeling in regard to appointments is to leave the power of appointment in the hands of the Boards. 19. The Chairman.~\ What is your objection to a clause compelling a register of teachers in each district to be kept on certain lines, showing special fitness and length of teaching? So many marks might be awarded to each teacher for each special feature, and every year the list might be revised, so that the Board-should be required to put on the list only the names of such teachers as were approximately equal?— All such proposals come to the same thing. The creation of a third body would not avoid, but create, friction. If it is only to give advice, it would have only the same information that the Boards and the Department have now—the Boards for the purpose of making appointments, and the Department for the purpose of giving a certificate. The only people really capable of giving information are the Inspectors. If you have a triangular method of appointment you will make great friction. 20. Is there any reason why a skeleton scheme of appointment should not be issued to guide the Boards?—ln what way? 21. On the lines T have mentioned, so that the Boards may be guided by it, and have a uniform system of appointment?— They are guided now on information given by the Inspectors. T do not see where the information can come from except from the Inspectors. You might have snch a scheme for the higher positions, but if you attempted it generally you would tie the hands of the Board.