19

G.—7

The Commissioner: We will begin with Matara Ihaka. I notice that there are eight of these claimants who were not in any grants or awards —namely, Nos. 1 to B—though they died before the Commission sat in 1880. Has Matara any descendants? . Tuhata: Yes—Taraikamo, Taitoko Tiopiro, Pana Taiopero, and Riu Tiopero. The Commissioner: What relation are they to Matara? Tuhata: Rawinia is in the whakapapa and was married to Paramena, and their child is Taraikamo. 'The Commissioner: These are then the descendants of Matara? Tuhata: Yes. There are four of them, and they are all dead. The Commissioner: Did Matara leave any children? Tuhata: No. The Commissioner: Did Koeti leave any children? Tuhata: No. The Commissioner: Did iiipeka ? Tuhata: No. The Commissioner: Did Rawinia? Tuhata: Yes. The Commissioner: Who are her children 1 Tuhata: Taraikamo. The Commissioner: You say that Taraikamo is the proper person to succeed to these four interests— i.e., Nos. 1 to 4 inclusive? Tuhata: Yes. The Commissioner: Who succeeds Paramena? Tuhata: Taraikamo. The Commissioner: Who succeeds W iremu Ropiha ? Tuhata: He is dead, and he is shown in the whakapapa, as successor to Heru, and also Kepa te Peka. Tangotaugo (No. 18) and Maraea (No. 17) were shown in the whakapapa as descendants of Heru. The Commissioner: Well, Tangotaugo is in the Ngatirahiri Reserve, and the proper course is for the parties who consider that they have a right to succeed to him to apply to the Native Land Court. Who, in your opinion, Mr. Tuhata, are the persons who ought to succeed to Wiremu Ropiha 1 Mr. Tuhata: Taitoko, Te Pana, Te Riu, and Maraea Tamate. These are the children of Tangotango. The Commissioner: Do you consider that the three Taitokos should have one half of the interest of Wiremu, and that Ropiha and Maraea should have the other half? Tuhata: Yes. The Commissioner: The next on the list is Keepa te Poki. Do you consider that some person should succeed to him? Tuhata: He has no children, and the successors of Tangotango, together with Maraea, therefore succeed to his interests. The Commissioner: Tangotango must be struck out because he received interest in the Urenui and the Ngatirahiri Reserves, and Maraea Tamate is alive, and can only come in as a successor, because she is also included in these reserves. The Commissioner: With regard to No. 8, Kahe? Mrs. Brown: This is my mother; she, of course, received no land. She is one of those who petitioned. The Commissioner: Y T ou have received reserves. 1 do not think that her case should be considered. Mrs. Brown: 1 think the interests of my mother's grandchildren should certainly be considered. Ido not wish to be considered myself. These claimants are not in the reserve, although the setting-apart of the 3,000 acres was the result of my mother's influence and petitioning. 1 explained on the opening day that the 500 acres had nothing to do with this reserve, and it was found that it was compensation for 500 acres taken, and sold to Major Wood; but I petitioned Parliament on this matter, and the result of this petition was that the 500 acres was given back, but the position of it was not able to be located, and so the 500 acres in question was granted. 1 do not think my mother's grandchildren should be debarred for that reason. The Commissioner: Do I understand that Kahe was alive when Mr. Richmond made his promise of the 16 acres? Mrs. Brown: Yes, Kahe was alive then. Mr. Skinner: According to the evidence here —I am not traversing Mrs. Brown's evidence, but it states distinctly that a recommendation has been made upon the distinct understanding that the land is accepted in satisfaction of all outstanding claims against the Government. I would ask you, sir, to consider this, and to decide whether my objection is a valid one. The Commissioner: Before I can give a decision upon this matter I shall have to give it some consideration. Will you please state, Mrs. Brown, who are the grandchildren in question? Mrs. Brown: Hone Tuhata, Rangihanu Tuhata, Makere Tuhata, Te Matoha Tuhata, and Ngaropi Tuhata. The Commissioner: Well, Mrs. Brown, if all these children are going to have a share in the 1 6 acres Mrs. Brown: I only want to show the position in which we are placed. I am not thinking about the 1 6 acres. The Commissioner: Your mother can only be limited to 16 acres? Mrs. Brown: I should like to know how a pakeha would like that. The Commissioner: I have nothing to do with the political side of the question.