PARLIAMENTARY.

West Coast Times, Issue 10340, 1 August 1896, Page 4

PARLI AM ENT ARY.

]Peb United Pbess Association.]

Wellington, July 31. . THE HOUSE. The House.met at 2.30. Mr M'Nab resumed the no-confidence debate. It was not fair, he urged, for the Leader of the Opposition to go back beyond the life of the present Parliament in framing his motion. Referring to the Advances to Settlers Act he said several members of the Opposition voted for it and Capt. Bussell had not palled fora division on the proposal to raise 1£ millions under this scheme. The Opposition had also supported the banking legislation which involved an addition to the public debt of two millions of money. He proceeded to show how almost the whole sum mentioned by the Leader of the Opposition was made up, pointing out that the Opposition had absented to the expenditure of most of the money and be therefore objected to Government being made responsible for increasing the public debt by the amount claimed by Capt. Eussell. He defended the policy of the Government at some length and said he would vote against the motion.

Mr Dnthie denied the Premier's assertion that the collapse of the financial debate was due to the absence of the Oppo3ition party at the Wellington races as only the Leader of the Opposition and another of the party were on the course. As for Maslin's amendment he could not see that there was any point in it at all. He congratulated the Treasurer upon having a real surplus to some extent having simplified the matter of showing the public accounts, but thought he should have gone further and swept away the misleading terms, "gross" aud "net" surplus. He complained of the very large amount of money that was now being depleted to London to pay interest and to the detriment of the settlement jf the country and urged that it would be far better to raise money in the colony. He condemned the loan conversions of Government and contended that every one of them had reunited in loss to the colony. The figures showing a profit on coo versions were either the result of gross stupidity or gross dishonesty. It would be far better for Government to go openly on the market for the million of money they required than to obtain it by the loan conversion operations. His commercial experience showed bim that the alteration in the tariff weighed heavily on the industrial classes and especially >vas this the case in the soft goods trade. He adversely criticised the land policy and administration of Government and the co-operanve system. The volume of trade under the Government had gradually fallen year by year until last year it came down to £21 11s lOd, but their banking blunders were more serious than all the • other misdeeds put together and were aufiieient to oust them from office.

Mr W. Hutchison found fault with both Oovernmentand the Opposition respecting the loan for New Zealand. He had great hope at the outset that the enquiry now going on would result in some good being effected but up to the present moment it had done nothing. The fine of £500 imposed on Watson meant nothing at all as the Colony had paid the money and it cost Watson nothing. He held that when Wateon refused to give information to the Committee Government should have depiived him of Lia appointment as president of the Bank. He complained that the Premier had not given any information respecting the Bank of New Zealand and asked how the Premier ki.jw it was theßtrougeat institution soiuii uf tin; line. Ji ; thought it was the fluty o£ liw ftgujau

to make substantial reductions in the . estimates and a start should be made with the salary of the Governor, which he con- } sidered was tar too large. Government ! should at once bring down a bill provid- 1 ing for a reduction of salary of the next ' occupant of the office of Governor. J The House rose at. 5.30 p-m. ' * \ The House resumed at 7.30. * Hon. J. Al'Kenzie congratulated the House on the good temper exhibited dur- ' ing the debate and said the only exception was Sir G. Hutchison, who, last night, indulged sonewhat in personalities. There was more than one reason .for this no-confidence motion. One was that the Opposition wished f o get pabulum for the next election and ano^er was to see how far they could depend on the left wing of the Government party. Capt. Russell f onnd, however, that he could not depend on that section of the House. He warntd tlie Left ving, however, that they stood on dangerous ground and they should remember the old adage — "between two stools you come to the ground." Russell hil not given one proof of the first part of bis motion — namely that theadminist: - bion of Government was ansatisfacfcovy h>s jhad trotted out the old stones about tl.esergeant-at-arms and the introduction cf the time limit, but the House had supported Government in the former, and Government had nothing to do with tht Latter. Then they were told members were not allowed to express their opinions on the policy of the Government but he (M'Kenzie) held there never was a time when members had more freedom in that respect. Mr Seddon had been called autocratic, but he was no more autocratic than the former Premiers. Government were qnite prepared to go to the country and ask for its continued confidence. They were charged with borrowing, whilst professing to be a non-borrowing Government, but he pointed out that members had, on every platform, advocated cheap money for farmers and they were bound to carry out that scheme, had borrowed one and a half million? for that purpose, but the scheme had beer attacked because it had not paid from the first day of its initiation, and the Opposition had done their b n stto strangle it. At *he end of the year there would be a profit on this department's working of £41,000, and a profit would be made on every future 1 >an under the Act. He was convinced there was no dangar of the colony being called on to pay any thin o under this scheme, and Government has £205 security for every £100 borrowed. The sum of £680,000 had already been advanced on mortgage, and the average to each settler was £304. None could deny that thft scheme hart been the means of reducing interest by one per cent, and there were other savings caused by it. He showed what Government had done under the Lane's for Settlements Act, and combatled the contention that this scheme was a failure. So much difficulty had been experienced in obtaining land for settlement in Hawkes Bay province that Government had decided to take over one property there under the compulsory clauses of the Act. J>. was a property belonging to an absentee named Russell, who lived in the Old Country, and spent his money on the Continent and not in Hawkes Bay. There was no brighter spot in the administration of the Liberal party or one which would do more good for the colony than obtaining land for settlement. He said the balance sheet of the Cheviot Estate showed a satisfactory state of things, and as to the improved farm system, it was on its trial, but on the whole it would work all righc In conclusion he claimed that taking the Government administration the maladimnistratiou together they were entitled to some thanks from people of the colony for what they had done, and although they were not perfect, they had unselfishly and faithfully discharged their duties in the interests of people of the colony.

Mr Thomas M'Kenzie congratulated the Minister for Lands on his lucid and good tempered speech, and went on to say that when Mr Seddon entered Parliament the public debt was £21,000,000 It was now £42,000,000, so that Mr Seddon was respansible for the debt having doubled. Since be entered Parliament he had supported Ministers that were longer in office during that time than the I other aide of tlie ouse. As to the Ad- \ vances to Settlers Department he thought j Uie time had now arrive^ l when Govern- ; ment should consider whether they would ' continue it. as plenty of money was now j available at low rates of interest, fit resented the statement that the Opposi- j tion were roaoi/nsible for the Banking j Legislation of 1894-, aa Capt. Russell had '. on that occasion to take the assurance of ' the Government, that this legislation sv.t^ necessary. Ho condemned the present system of taxation and said the whok process required alteration He adversely criticised the tax on commercial travellers and the shipping and stamen's laws, am dcclaied that under the latter legislatioi. the h.irdy British tar was being displacec and supplanted by foreigners j: nd Chinamen. He sincerely congratulated the Premier on his proposal to encourage th< Thermal Springs District, which h ventured to say would become the nensa tion of the world. He ahould t,up, m Russell's motion. j

Mr Pirani accused the last speaker o misrepresentation, and also questions the correctness of the figures quoted b; Allen. He strongly defended the Ad vances to Settlers Department, refenin; specially to the large reduction it had ci fected in legal charges. In fact lie con sidered the scheme was an unexample. success, and the Department had i^on* wonderfully well considering it had onl been a year in existance. Alluding to th< left wine he said their criticisms of th Orovernnient had been uttered in no ca{. tious spirit, but with the view to improve tho legislation of the Liberal party, aii^i

the Premier himself had stated last year that Government did not object to independent criticism which had this object, in view. He was surprised at the Opposition thinking the left wing had anything in common with them. Why even members of the Opposition had nothing in common, and the policy of each member of that party differed from almost ■ every other member as much as chalk did from cheese. There was more disagreement in the ranks of the Opposition than between the left wing and the Government benches. He thought it would be ridiculous for the left wing to vote with the Opposition party on this motion, but they were determined to have a direct voie as to whether the policy of the sei zuie of the sinking funds was to continue and with that desire Mr Maslin had brought down his amendment on behalf of the left v/ing. He criticised the land policy or Government at some length.

Mr Crowther regretted having to take part in the farce that was now going on. He thought it was time they ceased talking about the seizure of the sinking funds and passed legislation that would prevent any Government from seizing those fund? in future. There was nothing particularly offensive \n the budget and they must all admit if they were to carry on public works they must have borrowing. He saw no reason why mongy should not be acquired at 3 per cent as he had faith in the ability of tha colony to pay the interest.

Mr M'Lachlan spoke in support of the Government policy and said it was in the best interests of the Colony to keep the present ministry in office. The debate was adjourned on the motion of Mr Flatman.

Leave of absence for one week was granted to Mr Ward on account of serious illness in his family. The House rose at 1 a m.