HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES.

Timaru Herald, Volume XXXIX, Issue 2770, 9 August 1883, Page 2

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES.

The Houße met at 230 p.m. PETITION. Mr Kelly brought up the report of the Publio Petitions Committee on the petition of Coyle, a surveyor, which was read, setting forth that the Committee had no recommendation to make beyond that made twice before that the claim should be referred to arbitration. Mr Fißh moved that the report be referred to the Government, with a recommendation that the claim be referred to arbitration. Mr Braoken seconded the motion. The Hon. Mr Rolleston said ho bad gone through the case carefully, and he could not see that there was any claim on the part of the petitioner. His consenting to arbitration raised an assumption of tbe existenoe of some claim. The amount of the contract under whioh the olaim was made was £2000, and the claim for compensation was m excess of that sum. He moved as an amendment that the petition be referred back to the Committee for them to sty what sum is due. Mr Sutton objected to sending the petition back to the Committee. That was not the proper tribunal. It was admitted some sort of claim existed, and he could not see why the claim was not allowed ts be taken into Court or to arbitration. The Hon. Mr Bryce did not see why the Committee should not be enabled to express an opinion as to what amount was actually due. If Parliament concurred m the recommendation of & Committee, then Government

ou'd ba bound thereby; but no such ;sponsibility wbs incumbent on the Governlent on the mere recommendation of a 'ommitlee. Mr Macandrew said tbe Commitlee could ot possibly investigate the claim. Mr Driver suggested that the Government hould waive all technical and legal objections nd allow the claim to go to a Court of law on is^ merits. The Hon. Mr Bolleston eaid he would bo [uite willing to refer tho matter to a Court if Jaw, undertaking on tie part of the 3< " e rnmeut to raise no technical objection. Mr Fieh agreed to accept that proposal. Mr Holmea said oe he understood the ar■angemrnt was that no legal defencn was to 38 raised to the claim, B ad that m fact the jueetion wan merely to be referred to the law Jourts for the purposo of asicssing damages, fany, otherwise the petitioner would be foolish to go there. The Hon. Mr Rolleston mid that the Gorernment would not raise any obje; I ion which would not be competent to a p.iv »c individual. The Goverment, however. iould reserve to itself the right to plead nil competent defence on the merits of the cl-um. Mr Fish said the petitioner would be quite satisfied. The motion was negatived, on the understanding that the matter would ba referred to a Oouit of law, as proposed. BEPLIES TO QT7E3TIOKS. Replying to Mr Prke, the Hon. Mr Dick said the Government had considered the possibility of the Irish informers landing m New Zealand. They had as great a horror of such men as anyone could have, but they recognised that if informers were to be hounded about from place to place it might ba the means ef deterriDg others from turning informer*, m which caso great criminal) might escape. The Government, however, had a stronger feeling on this point, as they considered it very far wrong of the Home Government to transport these erimina'a to the Australian colonies without first enquiring if thej were willing to receive them. I'he final determination of tbe Government m the circumstance was still under consideration. Repljing to Mr Daniel, the Hon. Mr Dick said Government would take care to have rules 13 and 54, m Barings Bank pass-book) so as to qualify rule 12 so printed m tboee bookf. Beplying to Mr WkitaVer, the Hon. Major Atkinson eaid no donbt tho Agent-General would obtain information regarding an Act recently paßsed by France called Transpsrta* tion to the Pacific Act, and when they had that information, they would be able to judge what should be done to counteract its evil effect?. At present they had no information. Replying to Captain MoKenzie, the Hon. Mr Rolleston Bsid titles to lands held under clauie 54 of tbe Land Act 1877 Amendment Act 1882, being education reserves, could not be obtained without payment of stamp duty, and it wat not the intention of tho Government to make any alteration of the law. Beplying to Mr Bracken, the Hon. Mr Conolly said contrary to the rule, the prisoner m the recent tragedy at Nelson had inadvertently been made aware of his contemplated removal. Orders had been issued against a recurrence of such information being given beforehand to prisoners. Beplying to Mr Hntchison, the Hon. Mr Dick eaid there would be no objection to a renewal of say six months of the bonus for the manufacture of starch m the colony. Beplying to Mr Bracken, the Hon. Major Atkinson Baid tho Government would not erect a temporary light at Waipapa point, ts it would only mislead and increase the danger! of navigation. The permanent light had arrived by the Timarn, and would be sent forward at once for erection. Beplying to Mr Hutchison, the Hon. Mr Dick said that it was not true that sheep icab was spreading all over the colony. It might bo so m some placeß, but that would not warrant the repeal of all special legislation on the Bubject. Beplying to Mr Petrie, the Hon. Mr Conolly said that the business at Greymouth would not warrant tbe establishment of a sitting of the Supreme Court there. Heknev of no promise of euch a thing, but would enquire farther. Hepljing to Mr Hutchison, the Hon. Mr Rolleiton said precaution!) had been taken to counteract corrosive effects of the sulphurous vapors from the Hot Springs at tbe Botorua Hospital. Hrplying ti Sir George Grey, the Hon. Mf Rolleston laid the Government was not aware of any claim made by Charlton for compensation for the purchase of the land at Kawbia by the Government at auction. Roplying to Major Harris, the Hon. Mr Brjce said that the police, m their endeavors to bricg to justice the murderer of Miss Dobie, performed nothing more than a very ordinary duly, and merited neither reward nor promotion. Eeplying to Mr Holmes, the Hon. Mr Conolly Baid there were defects m the second schedule of the code of civil procedure, which be would have remedied as soon as possible. Meantime, he invited members of the pro* fession and Law Societies to communicate to him their views on the subject. Replying to Mr Holmes, the Hon. Mr Conolly eaid that tbe Government had report* as to irregularities m Lyttelton Gaol, and they would make enquiries as soon as tbe Inspector was at liberty. He did not think A Commission enquiry would be necessary. NEW Bins. The following Bills were introduced and read a first time : — Maori Bepresentation Aot 18G7 Amendment(MrTe Wbeoro), Cateriham, South Dunedin, and St. Kilda Street Improvement (MrLarnacb). FnfAKCiAI. Replying to question! by Mr Holmes, the hon. the Colonial Treasurer tsid there was £935,000 to the credit of the Public Works Fund on 31st March, 1832, »nd the House voted that sum for publio worki ; that the House also voted £200,000 for roads «nd bridges under the Rids and Bridges Construction Act 18S2, and that the Home voted £200,000 out of the Publio Works Fund more than the credit of that funJ. He considered that tbe £250,000 that was to be raided under the New Zealand Colonial Inscribad Stock Loan Act 1882 was to be placed m the Publio Works Fund, to mako up tha deficiency m that fond. Further, that, m his opinion, the £100,000 to be paid out of the Publio Works Fund, under tha Roads and Bridges Construction Act, for main roads waa an absolute subsidy out of that fund and not t) be recouped to that fund out of tho land fund, and the £100,000 to be paid out of the Public Works Fnnd under the same Act for district roads would be sent to local bodies as fast as it was due, and tbere wat no hope of its being returned to the Publio Works Fund m our time. A FBEE " HANSARD." Mr Macandrew mored that a single copy of Mansard should be sent free by post on application to ererj householder (who is a registered elector) throughout the colony, and that it bo an instruction to the Printing Department Committee to make tbe necessary arrangements accordingly. Its cost would only be about £3000 for the session. The Hon. Mr Dick opposed the motion, reminding members that this motion was m direct oppoeition to their avowed professions of economy. Mr J. 0. Brown, and Mr Dargaville jupported tha motion, tho latter suggesting tha cost should come out of honorariums. . MrShephard spoke against tbe motion. The debate was interrupted by the 5.30 p.m. adjournment. The House resumed at 7.30 p.m. GOLD DUTIBS AEJLITION BUI. The Gold Duties Abolition BUI was considered m Committee, and on the House reBurning, was reported with amendments. On tho motion for tbe third reading a division waj called for, the result beingAyes, 41 ; Noes, 27. The division list is as follows : — Ayes — Batbgite, Bracken, J. 0. Brown, J. E. Brown, Cadman, Daniel, Dargaville, Driver, DeLautour, Duncan, Feldwick, Fergus, Fitzgerald, George, Grey, Harris, Hutohison, Ivess, Joyce, Levestam, Macandrew, F. W. McKenzie, A. McDonold, J. MoDonald, J, McKenzie, Monigomery, Moss, Munro, Petrie, Seddon, Sheehan, Shephard, Smith, Stevens, Steward, Swanson, Taiaroa, Tawhai, Te Wbeoro, Turnbull and Watt. Noes— Allwright, Atkinson, W. 0. Buchanan Oonolly, Dick, J. Green, M. W. Green, flamlin, Hursthouse, W. W. Johnston Kelly, Lee, Mollraith, MoMillan, Mitohelson, Morris, O'Oallaghan, Peacock, Pilliet, Postle. thwaite, Eolleßton, Butter, Button, H. Thorn, ton, Trimble, Whitaker, and J.Cr. Wiliofl.

PAIBS. Ayes— Pyke and Bathgate. Noes — Fulton and Beetham. WHAB* AT HOWICK. In Committea Major Harris moved an address to the Governor to request His Excellency to ciuie a sufficient sum to ba placed on the Estimates to provide for the orootion of a wharf a Howick, Frantlyn North. The Committee divided— Ayes 33, Noes 23. Mr Macandrew said that although oppOßed to votes for all sncb works, ho had voted for it v a protest against the unfair polioy of the Government m forcing certain works of a liko kind. On the motion for agreeing to the resolution, the Hon. Major Atkinson said Government could not agree to the motion. Loctl works were already provided for by law, and he wished it to be distinctly onderstood that the Government were not prepared to place any vote on the Estimates, nor would there be any inch votes brought down. Mr Hutchison said the Boads and Bridges Construction Act had proved a complete failure, and he counselled the House to adhere to their determination to have this resolution agreed to. In that case they would see whether the Government would refuge to recommend it to His Exoellenoy or not. There were votes for local works on the Estimate;. The Home divided — Ayes 34, Noes 45. CHABITABLE GIJT3 DUTIB3 EXKMPTION BILL. In Committee the Charitable Gifts Duties Exemption Bill was considered, and on the House resuming it was reported with amendments, read a third time, and pasted. BBLIGIOU3, ETC., TKUST Dili. On the motion for going into Committee on the Beligious, Charitable, and Educational Trait Boards Incorporation Bill, Mr Sheehan moved as an amendment that the Bill be referred to a Select Committee to conaider and report upon (1) the provision of the laid Bill; (2) the extent, position, management, and preient condition of the various lands affected by the Bill ; (3) the desirability or otherwiso of the reaumption by the colony of 10 much of suoh lands as have been obtained by grant or endowment from the colony. Mr Hutohison, without expressing any opinion as to the general merits of the Bill, thought it should not be disposed of as was proposed by a side issue. The Bill might pass without m any way interfering with the general objects aimed at by the resolutions. The Hon. Mr Conolly thought it would be better to allow the Bill to remain over till next session, m order that they might have an opportunity for considering more fully its effects on the varioua religious bodies. In making these remarks he was only expreiting his own views, and not those of the Government. Mr Holmes supported the Bill, saying that the amendment was simply an attempt on the part of the improvident to share m the provision made by the provident. Mr Button supported the amendment. The Bill required more consideration than it had got. Mr Smith said the Bill had been before the country since last session. Ho admitted the necessity for getting education reserves reviewed, but that should not prevent the Bill passing. Mr Montgomery hoped that whother they approved of the Bill or not they would not agree to the amendment which was simply an attempt to get at these reserves by a side wind. The Hon. Mr Dick said, while he deprecated the proposal to interfere with reserves made by Otago and Canterbury for higher education, he thought a Bill might very properly be referred to a Committee to investigate its effect upon the law a» it stood m its relations to the various;>eligiouj denominations. MrShsphard said that m putting aside the lands of the colony, and now that education had come to be recognised as a colonial question, they could not treat these lands as purely provincial. Mr Fish would not vote for the amendment, but reoogniied the anomaly of Otago and Canterbury being provided with secondary education endowments while the rest of the colony was neglected. Other provisions wquld have to be made if these reserves were referred as proposed. In Otago they kept up High Schools for the children of wraltby parent*. These were being educated at a cos( of £23 per head, while the parents only paid £8. Anything more anomalous could not be conceived. In many instances children of •even years were so taught — children who ought to be amply provided for by primary scbooli. In such circumstances as these it was absurd to suppose there shonld not oe dissatisfaction. Again, m the North they had not the land to set aside, as they had m the South. He would even go the length of laying that even if their parents were to blame m not making proper provision, that was no reason why the children should suffer. Unless they could give the North money equivalent to the Southern reserves, then he would say divide the reserves equally. The primary system was quite sufficient for all requirements of the case. Ha agreed m the opinion that the question should sot be railed m this way by a side wind. The Hon. Mr Rolleston defended the system of secondary education as it stood. There was no intention on the part of the Government to interfere with tho educational reiervts of the Soutb. At the same time, they would jealously watch the application of the trusts. The Bill suggested to bis mind the idea that it was taking away tho control from the representatives of the people and handing it over to religious bodies. If the Bill did no other good, it would call attention to the fact that they had not hitherto been doing their duty properly by the trusts. Mr Barron said if they were to have a secondary system the whole scholastic system would have- to be revised. He blamed the Government for allowing tbeysecond reading to piss without raiting the debate now raised. Mr Hursthouse said that if they did not check the enormous stops educational expenditure wai making the whole system would break down. It was making far too serious inroads upon their financial resources. They had been told that the Minister of Edaoation would not rest until he had made secondary education free. Surely he had not considered what the Treasurer told them m his Statement | as a matter of fact there were thousands m the colony whom the primary system did not reach. Mr J. Buobanan moved the adjournment of the debate. Mr Turnbull denounced the secondary education system as a gross abuse. Poor people who could not afford to educate their own families through the tecondary standards were forced to pay for those who could. Mr Wynn-Williams objected to the secondary education system, and objected to the Bill. The reserves m Canterbury were administered not for the benefit of tho poor m the matter of secondary education, but purely for the beneflt of the rich. Mr Macandrew wished to see secondary education entirely free. The reserves m the Bouth were their own property. Mr Swanson considered these reserve! had been maladminiitered. Mr Stevens urged that all those endowments should be resumed by the colony. Mr Levestam said that they were the property of the colony. Ihe debate was then adjourned, and the House rose at 1 o'clock.