No Advance Made.

Stratford Evening Post, Volume XXXIX, Issue 29, 26 May 1914, Page 5

No Advance Made.

that in a separate issue the matters did not have the same chance as if they had been grouped, and lie believed that had this boon done the loan would have been carried. Mr Hancock referred to the Electric Light Company's undertaking, but was informed that the subject was not before the meeting and that he was out of order. THE MAYOR AND MR PORRITT. Mr S. M. Porritt, while careful to explain that he did not want to take up a dog-in-the-manger policy, ,said it was not fair that the whole town should pay for improvements affecting only a portion of the residents. Proposals such as those should bo paid for by the people interested. He explained that in county matters when a road was to be metalled the people using that road paid for the metal and work. He did not know whether the Council had the power to declare a special area. The Mayor said they could make a special area in response to a petition, but he did not think that was desirable.

Mr Porritt said he would support a scheme that was absolutely selfsupporting. The Mayor: It would be partly selfsupporting. Mr Porritt: That is a long way off self-supporting. The MayOr: Mr Porritt cannot have been present when I explained my proposal. His Worship then explained his reference to the 500 houses paying £1 each. Mr Porritt said the number of houses would not cover half the area of the borough. The Mayor then reiterated the area proposed by him and stated that it covered the biggest half of the borough. In reply to an interjection by Mr Porritt that those benefitting should pay for the improvements His Worship said the outside places would be gaining a step towards the complete drainage of the borough. Further, the Mayor said he did not want to force his scheme upon the ratepayers, but he suggested to them that they should show some feeling of reciprocity to those who for years had paid rates but had not received the benefits, and they should now vote to let them get those benefits. (Applause).

;Cß. RICHARDS' VIEWS. Cr. Richards said he took it that the objects of the Mayor was to ascertain the wishes of the ratepayers on ' the matter of the loan proposals, and he had made it abundantly clear tlifit those had not been before the Council much less approved by them. Referring to Mr Rorritt's remarks regarding drainage, Cr. Richards pointed out that of the £16,000 for water and I drainage £ISOO was for the purpose of lending to the ratepayers for coimec- ; tions and that this sum would be,i«etnrned to the Council. The area of the ' Borough was about 2000 acres, and • that portion which would benefit by the scheme was approximately from 350 to 360. It would be somewhat equitable to meet the cost by a sanitation rate over the portion, but it would not be. strictly businesslike, as ' the whole of the borough would be liable for the interest. This rate could | be imposed or lifted at the wish of this or any other council. The people would be absolutely liable for the interest, but it would be at the wish or caprice of any subsequent Council . to refrain from imposing that sanitation rate. Hawera had a scheme for cleaning the water mains, and at present they had an apparatus costing £3OO on trial. With regard to Mr , Wilson's amendment, he considered that as the ratepayers had turned it / down the Council could hardly be justified in going to the expense of again putting them to a vote. (Applause). He considered the ratepayers ; would not adopt a big loan again. It would be much more desirable to raise a moderate amount and spend that and then at a future date raise another loan if found necessary. The action taken by the meeting over the bridge was to him extremely regrettable. Mr Wilson: Is that in order? The Mayor: Cr. Richards' name was specially mentioned at that meeting, and he is quite in order. (Applause). Mr Wilson: I apologise. Mr Richards: I accept Mr Wilson's apology and also the one he tendered to me the day after the meeting over tlie bridge. Continuing, Cr. Richards said it was regrettable That one section of the community should attempt to stir up strife against another portion. There'was mention of forming a separate rating area. Well, they were entitled to do so. In conclusion, Cr. Richards said lie thought he had shown that a loan of £12,000 was too big. | ■ | ! ANOTHER SOUTHERN VIEWMr H. W. Kerr said the Mayor's ! proposal was for water and drainage, and Cr. Richards had introduced the further matter of kerbing and channelling. The southern people j thought the widening of the bridge should be included in the loan proposals. Cr. Richards challenged them to show how the south had been negloctI eel, but it was only necessary for one to'look around to find out. There were line sections in the south •which could be built on, but which were not built on because of the difficulty of getting across the bridge. Personally lie held the view that the northern end of the town was being improved to the detriment of the southern end. The expenditure in the two sections seemed out of proportion. The southern people were in need of roads to their gates. In some instances it was necessary for .tradesmen to wade through mud to ' get to the gates. There was very heavy traffic on the bridge, and

public safety was thereby endangered. The south should not be handicapped. No doubt they could manage to exist, but things should he improved.. If the bridge could not bo renewed to the full width of the street he would suggest that footpaths be erected outside the present decking as at the present time life was endangered. Mr P. Skoglund. Town Clerk, occupied a seat on the stage with the Mayor. The Mayor at this .stage stated that Mr Skoglund desired to speak, and that be bad advised him that although'he was Town Clerk and was acting as clerk of the meeting, be bad a right to speak as a rate-

payer. Mr Skoglund said that from the arguments he had heard he was sure that some of the speakers did not know the correct position of affairs. It was argued that those who got drainage under the proposed scheme should pay for it, but there were portions of the Borough which had no water and which might not get water in their lifetime who had been paying the water rate. The; estimated cost of laying the proposed sewers was £9OOO, and the Mayor had proposed a scheme whereby the service would pay for itself. .At present 200 houses paid about £1 a year for nightsoil removal, and by the payment of a similar, sum water drainage pould be secured. He was a south-sider and would dearly like to see the bridge widened, but the widening was unnecessary at present. When the necessity arose for widening the bridge he thought there would be. no difficulty in raising the necessary loan. As a ratepayer' lie could safely recommend to bis fel-low-ratepayers the scheme put forward by the Mayor.

STREET IMPROVEMENTS FIRST. Cr. J. Masters said he thought that the proper loan to raise was one for street improvements and for kerbing and channelling. This year the Council had £SOO on the estimates for kerbing and channelling. • Last year there was £3OO, and of this £l7O had been actually spent. While this money (which the Borough could not afford) was being spent, the Borough workmen were put on the work, and the streets were let, go to tile: dogs. It '■ was" •■ impossible for the Borough to do permanent work'"out of revenue. Whenever one went ono could .see the roads going to pieces. The' roads would continue to deteriorate so 'ong as they tried to do permanent woru out of revenue. It'would pay the ratepayers' to raise a' loan for kerbing and channelling. He ! could point out' spots' i where kerbing had been done ten years ago, and all the footpath required since was one coat of gravel, whereas in xtnkerbed places new gravel was required every two years and in some eases every year. Whan they compared their town with others of the same size they must admit that Stratford did not shjw up creditably. As to the £42,000 proposal, it would be a waste of time to bring it forward again—the ratepayers, .w,«J\dcl., not-^taud-.it-.. He, wonld like" to see fridge. widened, but it could not be done at present. There was not iJ sp much congestion as'southern people thought - personally he had seen very little. If there was danger in crossing'the bridge, why... did the people of the south not stay on the south side and do their shopping Southern business men would get more business if they ■erected better buildings, but they were apparently waiting till the bridge was widened and business : n~ creased before doing so. Any loan raised should bo for street improvements and purification of the water. As to drainage, it was not siuh' an important matter as the' .May )"r thought. There was no part of Stratford which could be considered .congested as far as drainage was concerned. The north-eastern sction was the worst, but in the northwestern portion there were two a- , cant sections for every section Imirfc on. He did not think the maj vity of the people were anxious to have. drainage. When the Borough became congested there would be no difficulty in raising a loan for drainage. - . THE MAYOR IN REPLY. In reply to the various speakers the Mayor said he recognised „tbat.. street improvements were necessary, but water and drainage should be t first attended to. A ioan for stieet improvements and water could not be carried, but drainage ai.d water could because they were corollary. At present the streets were being improved as much as possible out ci revenue. Stratford was a your-g borough and was growing, and it was necessary to go carefully rrA to do the most necessary works. There was no chance of carrying the £42,000 loan. He was opposed to widening the bridge at present. The widening must come in time, and then the whole of the borough must share in the burden. At present the bridge was being scraped ard cleaned, and Mr Robinson said that with an expenditure of £l5O from time to time the bridge could be made to last for another twenty

years. Therefore, why should the present, structure he pulled down? Even ii' it were, widened to the full width of the road there would still bo times when traffic would be congested; but lie crossed the bridge on an average once a day, and he never sum- much evidence of congestion. The time would come when they would go in for a larger loan, but it was not yet ripe for that, in his opinion. As to a smaller area the cost would he less when extendod over the large

area Ha strongly realised that kerbing and channelling was very necessary, but they could carry out a lot out of revenue for many years. As to the bridge, the opinion oi Robinson and Christophers was that it would be quite impracticable to place a footpath on one or both sid«s of the bridge, or even to put swing bridges on to it and would not be worth the money. Mr Wilson: Why not throw two arches over for footpaths ?—Even that would be impracticable considering the cost. The amendment was then put te the meeting, and the voting was: For, 10 votes; against, 26, and it was declared lost. Mr Morison then moyed that the matter of the loan proposals be referred to the Council for consideration, and that this meeting stand adjourned for a term not exceeding two months, by which time the Council " be asked to formulate a scheme acceptable to a majority of the councillors. Seconded by Mr Wilson. The Mayor said he hoped the amendment' would not be carried. They had a meeting of ratepayers, and whether the amendment was carried or not it would be only a waste of time to have another meeting. If the meeting was not prepared to support the proposals, it was open for the .'Council to move in any direction with regard to same. Mr' W. V. Wilson agreed with the Mayor, but pointed out*that the notice of the meeting was short and perhaps sufficient notice had not been given. He questioned the reliability of some of the Mayor'* statements. The Mayor: I am not in the habit of making statements that are not reliable. (Applause.) Cr. Morison said the resolution, if carried, might be futile as he believed the majority oi the councillors were against the proposal';. The Mayor: You cannot speak for the majority of the Council. Cr. Morison: Well, that is my opinion. . The Mayor said he would oppose a greater amount for a loan than £16,000. Cr. Morison: So would I. Cr. • Masters considered Cr. Morison's amendment was a proper, one, for the reason that the proposals had not been placed before the Council at all. They had been mentioned at the Works Committee meeting, and four out of the five members were agahrst them. The meeting that evening was not a representative one, and it would be a ridiculous thing for them to, parry the resolution. 'Hear, hear.); ~; On the voting fon the amendment, only two votes were; cast against it* and it was carried. ,• :■■>-., On the motion of Messrs Sole'and Masters, a vote of thanks was accorded the Mayor for his address, and the meeting ended.

IU THE PROPOSED LOANS. AN UNSATISFACTORY MEETING, There were under a hundred persons present at the Town Hall last night at the meeting of ratepayers called by the Mayor to consider loan proposals. THE MAYOR'S PROPOSAL. Mi- Kirkwood said he was sorry to see so few present. There were five 'hundred ratepayers in the Borough, and he thought there would have been sufficient interest to have gathered a larger audience. He was also sorry to see so few ladies—there were lady ratepayers, and they had been invited to attend. During the Mayoral election ho had said he favored a loan of about £15.000 for water and drainage, land he called the present meeting before the Council discussed the matter. Tf the meeting gave an indication it might save some expense. The resolutions passed would be a guide to the ICouncil as to whether or not the proposals should he put to the ratepayers. The last loan proposals, which were too [large, had been thrown out individually in no uncertain, manner. Perhaps all the items were turned down because the sum total was too large. Last year's experience made him chary about putting forward loan proposals without a clear indication from the ratepayers. He had been asked to bring forward proposals for loans to a much greater amount than he personally could approve of. What he would propose that nieht would not be very ambitious, and if his proposal was accepted he felt sure that Inter on other loans could be raised without overburdening the ratepayers. He would propose a loan totalling £16,000 for water and drainage. The land in the Boroueh was valued at £500.000, but only £42.000 had been borrowed, so that it could not be contended that the Borough had over-borrowed or that it was over-rated. Further, the valuation given was the Government valuation, which was only for purposes of taxation, and was well under the real value. Tt was desirable to give residents all possible convenience, and the first essentials were water and drainage. He felt strongly that these were the most important matters, but* if ratepayers could prove other things to be more important, well and good. As to the recent . meeting of southern ratepayers, any number of ratepayers had a right to hold a meeting, but it was deplorable if such a meeting should lead to strife. He sincerely hoped it would not. But statements were made at the meeting which would have been'better left-unsaid. Statements were made regarding the speaker and other Councillors which wore unfair and uncalled for. A meeting like the one in question was very liable to lead to strife. That meeting had pledged itself to vote for no loan which did not include the widening. of the bridge. He hoped they would not continue in that spirit, which would not bo desirable. Personally, he did not think that the southern ratepayers would be strong enough to carry a loan against the rest of the Borough. He would move that the Borough Council be recommended to raise a loan of £16,000 SI 2,000 for drainage and £4OOO for water. In the past the custom had been not to charge for putting drains from the sewers to boundaries, but he thought that the time had come to do so. In one Borough the chargo was £3, and even if Stratford did not make so large a charge they could borrow more than otherwise. It was proposed to acquiro more land at the headworks of the water supply and either to make a settling-tank there or instal mechanical filters along the mains. The mechanical filters were said to be' capable of dealing with water containing much sediment and not to interfere with the pressure. The area proposed to be served with drainage was bounded on the east by Swansea Road, on the west by Hamlet Street, on the north by Pembroke Road, and on the south by Celia Street. This meant covering the whole of that part of the Borough which could be called closely settled. The proposal dealt with 500 of the COO houses in the Borough. There would only be 43 houses outside the scheme, and the rest were in the extended area, where the land was held in larger sections. If a sanitation fee of £1 per annum were levied over the area the amount raised would almost pay the interest on the loan. It would bo necessary to make connection with the sewer compulsory. At present the by-laws allowed for this, but it was not insisted on, as the Council felt that it would be a hardship to make householders connect. The Council would borrow sufficient to enable them to lend to householders the money required for making connections, ar.d through the Borough itself making all these connections it could be done cheaper than otherwise. He had been told a loan for street improvement would.be more readily carried than one for water and drainage, but that would be merely because ratepayers were not fully aware of the true position. Water and drainage must bo extended at some time, and if previously the roads and footpaths were improved they would have to lie torn up again when the water and drainage connections were made. That would not bo businesslike. I\' the suggested loan was carried he thought that there would be no difficulty in carrying a loan for streets later on. The amount sugjajfcsted for water allowed for complete 'reticulation throughout the Borough and it might be necessary to cut off 'some extraordinary supplies to keep 'up the pressure. Recently lie had suggested thai il might bo necessary to c,ut off some extraordinary supplies to

[keep up the pressure. Recently he jbad suggested that it might be necessary to lay down an extra main from (the headworks. The Works Committee had recently visited the headworks in company with Mr E. C. Robinson and Mr Sullivan. They went up to consult Mr Marehant on the question of acquiring further land in order to enable the Borough to have complete control of the headworks and they at the same time considered the question of a second main. This was a big question, and would have to be gone into carefully. Another main would cost in the vicinity of £7OOO, and he thought there should be a special loan for the work. Matters to be considered were whether the second main should be brought from the present headworks, and by what route it should be brought down. If a new main was put in it should be made sufficient to serve the town for the next twenty years. At present the Hawera Borough Council was experimenting with an apparatus, which was not costly, which ite was claimed would clean out mains at small expense. If the present main could be cleaned out it would suffice for some time to come. The Stratford Council was therefore awaiting the result of the Hawera experiment with great interest. SECONDEB PRO FORMA. Or. R. McK. Morison said he had waited for some one else to second the motion, but. seeing that no seconder had come forward ho would do so pro forma. He was not altogether in favor of it. 'He agreed with the proposal for water, but in his opinion there were other matters of more urgent importance. He would rather favor a loan for street improvements. (Applause). Mr Morison referred to Cr. R.ichards' suggestion published in the "Evening Post" for a loan of £OOOO or £7OOO for kerhing and channelling, which in itself was very good, but there were even more important works. The time was coming soon for the people to go in for a loan of £6OOO or £7OOO for those works, but while there were ratepayers in the borough with no road and living where no grocer's cart could get to, these should receive first attention.—(ApplnuseV He would like to see water and drainage, kerhing and channelling, but when that was carried he would still stick out for a loan for £OOOO or £7OOO for street improvements.—(Applause). If the borough was prepared to go in for something of that kind it would be good business. Later ho would move that it be a recommendation to the Council to take this matter -in hand and bring down a scheme that at least a majority of the Council are in favor of. Then they would havo some very solid and definite scheme to put before the ratepayers. With all due respect to His Worship —and there was a lot due to him— Mr Morison said, it would bo better to consider these matters and then there would be some hope of a majority of the ratepayers supporting thorn. Drainage was an important matter, but he thought some scheme should iie brought down whereby those people not receiving the benefit should have some of the burden of the night-soil removed. The contract should be taken over by the Council, and the benefits extended to those who were now paying for same but receiving no benefits. Cr. Morison said he wished jto dissociate himself absolutely from the contentions and rivalry of the meeting of ratepayers held over the bridge.—(Applause). Personally he would like the matter to have a rest. They had had a try to get the bridge and now there were more important matters to consider. "Let the matter rest for four or five years." he said, "and then we will see where wo are. We have no time to waste on it now." (Applause).

NUMEROUS QUESTIONS. Mr H. Wilson: How long is it since the last loan for street improvements was raised, and what was the rateable value of the borough then as compared with the present time? The Mayor: T have not the information with me; if you had told me you intended to ask the question I would have brought the information here to-night. T ran give it to you later. Mr E. W. Hancock: Has the Council any power to raise a loan for water and drainage without going to tne ratepayers?—No; but if the Health Department slated to Mis Government

that it considered any portion of the borough drainage was not suitable, we would then put in a drainage system to the amount the Government would advance without going to the ratepayers. Mr Hancock further asked if the Mayor considered it fair to charge people who were going to connect with the drainage when there were people who had had the benefits and had not paid for them?—lt would not be fair, but I might point out that there is hardly a rate struck that could be called equitable in its bearing, and it does not follow that because wrong Ims been done in the past it should continue. It is practicable for other boroughs to make a charge. In making the charge in my proposals some of the money should be borrowed wiiich would cover a sufficient amount to lend to the ratepayers to instal the drainage, and which would be repaid on easy terms. It would be easier for them under these conditions than if they had not these conditions. ~Mr Hancock: Is everyone paying for the drainage' How is it unfair when others have got it for nothing?— Whether they pay or not the matter rests with the Council.' As far as paying is concerned I do not understand the question. . . It is almost impossible to strike any rate that will be perfectly equitable. The best method is to strike a rate over the whole of the borough. In connection with a rate, when the time comes to build a bridge and widen it to the full width of the street, the whole of the borough should bear the rate.

THE £42,000 PROPOSAL. Mr Wilson moved as an amendment: "That this meeting recommends the Council to place before the ratepayers the loan suggestions that were made last year and in one issue." Speaking to the amendment, Mr Wilson said last year the Council had given a great deal of thought, time, and consideration to certain proposals, and those proposals were undoubtedly sound. They were, indeed, the result of mature consideration for not loss than two years, and they appeared to be the fruition of ratepayers' hopes, but the proposals were put before the ratepayers in such a way that they were rejected. As to the reason of their rejection, he did not think there was one, but he was fully convinced of the necessity of every one 'of the proposals. But thero was the feeling of insecurity. Each one wanted something, and he felt that perhaps he might not get his but the other fellow might.—(Laughter). The consequence was that he voted for his own and against all the rest. Had these proposals, continued i?r Wilson, been put before the ratepayers in one issue, each voter would have been compelled to support, not only what he personally wanted but also the other man's. recognising that there was a certain amount of fairness in them. It was quite impossible in a borough such as theirs to get absolute fairness. Mr Wilson stated that since ho had come to the borough only a small loan of £3OOO for water had been raised, and that was twelve years ago. It was time they had another loan to push their borough along. They had heeu outstripped and left behind by their neighbors, who were proving themselves more progressive. "You arc asleep, say the visitors to our town,'' continued Mr Wilson, "Dear me, the Borough is spoilt by that shabby old bridge." (Laughter and applause). If they spent £42,000 it would be an entirely new ' Stratford. Strangers would not know it. Mr Wilson said he felt that they were lagging behimL and they must endeavor to make the place as attractive as possible. The question was—How could such be done: He moved the amendment aR outlined at the opening of his remarks. —'Applause). Mr Hancock' secoiided the amendment, stating thai he quite lecoguiMJl