GISBORNE’S TRAMS

Poverty Bay Herald, Volume LII, Issue 17132, 7 September 1926, Page 4

GISBORNE’S TRAMS

THE SCR A Pi’l NO PROPOSAL HOTTI SIDES OF (Jl'KSmiN. RATEPAYERS IN E» HIM ED. T]ie arguments ut both Midi’s in connection with the proposal to scrap Hie Gisborne tram seivue were \enillntetl at a meeting of ratepayers held in Die City Hull Inst night. The meeting w» convened for the purpose of considering whether or nut the Ordci-in-Council .should be applied for lor the discontinuau ;e of the .service, and some important information was given by the councillors. Shortly after 10.50 _p.ni. the meeting was concluded, it being agreed, at the suggestion of the Mayor, that the discussion should ho continued at. the meeting to be held (bis evening. There was an attendance of about 250 at Hie City Hall for the meeting, over which (lie Mayor, Mr. G. \\ ildinh, presided. The other 'councillors oti Hie platform were: Crs. T. I odd, D. \V. Coleman. J. Blair, C. lb. Bickford, 11. R. Maude, and L. T. Barnard. The Mayor thought the ratepayers would agree with him that there had heel! enough "ink slinging" in roimeit ion with the quest ion. lie proceeded to outline the history ot the trams since their inception. lie did not deny that the trains had lost money, hut he pledged himseli to tell the truth about, them. The present position of the trams was due to the opposition, and lie was not, in any way to blame for the fact that the. trams were losing. Past councils laid been jirojiuliced against them, and i ft he speaker had had sullieient support, the trams would he in a different position from what they were. now. Seven miles of rails were bought, and the ratepayers had to pay for them whether the trams were scrapped or not; it was not the 'case that the * liability would cease when the trams were scrapped. He issued a warning that if the trams were scrapped it would cost half a million to put the roads in order. (Applause.) He was present to advocate the continuance of the trams (renewed applause), and he urged 1 1 is hearers to analyse the position, and vote on their (hidings. If the Council would support' the trams Gisborne would not go down. Ho ventured to say that many of the shopkeepers were unable to do more than make ends meet on account of the heaviness of th rates. POSITION IN AUCKLAND.

Taking Auckland as an example, the Mayor said that the trams there had paid and the buses had not. In Palmerston North the buses had lost several thousand pounds, and there were no trams in Palmerston 'North. Despite the buses in Auckland the people had the backbone to support their trams, lie had a mission, and that was to tell the ratepayers to support'•their trams The speaker had had heaps of abuse thrown at him, because of the trams, lie had not brought them here, but he had done his best to make them pay. The people of Gisborne had, he was sure, suft’eient confidence in the trains to support them, and if they did that, the scrapping business would be done away with. If tlie burgesses of Gisborne who were not ratepayers bad the power to vote lie felt sure that the voting would he ten to one in favor of maintaining them. The supporter’s of the trains were quite satisfied to leave it to the ratepayers. The council had no right to so rap the trains without the ratepayers’ authority, but if they could have done it they would. If they wanted to run buses t hey f must have good roads, and the public could not afford to scrap the trams. There were four trains in Gisborne. running continuously, and there was not another town in New Zealand which could produce such results, when all the rolling .stock was mi the routes at one time. 'Flic Gisborne-trams were the cheapest run trams in New Zealand, and on top of t lint»by scrapping them they Mould be taking away a clear £IOO per annum profit from the Power Hoard. (Applause.) THE OTHER VIEWPOINT. Cr. Todd then rose to address the meeting. He said that the first thing they had to know was that the trams had never paid their working expenses. During the present year the trams had cost well over £OOOO. If they continued, the Gladstone road tram track would have to be renewed at a cost of £25,000. Cries of “Hot, rot,” “bunkum.”

Continuing, Cr. Todd said the trams would cost over £9OOO a year to maintain without any trams being replaced or any extensions made. It would mean a rise of .10 per cent, in the rates if the trams were to be continued. If the Te Hapara people paid about (ijd a trip on the trams they would just about be paying for what they got. With buses they would have a much better service.

A voice: At ti|d. (Laughter)

A .suggestion was that if this •trams were extended further they would have paid better, but the position was exactly the opposite since the last extension was made. The real reason was that the cost of making a train (rack was so great that they could not bo made to pay unless they had heavy traffic. I*l r. Lysnav got the wrong method of driving the cars, and the rails were doomed to fail. For twelve years the trams had a strong support on the council, and it was only within the last IS months that there had been any opposition to them. They were now making very little more off the two routes than was made before oil the one. They had been told that the Auckland buses were losing money and that the trams were making money. He would say that the Auckland trains were losing money, and the tramways had put on buses which would lose and frighten oil the private bus companies. It was true that no contract was fixed for a bus company to start a service here, but this was because the trams would lirst have to be scrapped. He had not the slightest doubt that with buses they would have a service more satisfactory in every wav. They wore getting’ the road's (Loud laughter). The buses that came here would be lirst-class vehicles, and they would be more comfortable and faster. The engineer had stated that, the present track would have to be renewed within the next two or three years, and whatever they did the trams were going to stop. SERVING SMALL AREA.

Or. Coleman said if the majority of the council had had their way this meeting would not have been held, for the majority had no idea of consulting the ratepayers. It was true that the trams were only serving a small proportion of the public, but whoso fault was that ! The last council had drawn up proposals for an extension of the trams. They had been told that the annual loss was £0000; to bo correct the annual loss for the last throe years was £oo()0, according to Mr. Clark.' Admitting that there was a loss, if the trams were scrapped would they save this amountlf not tho argument for scrapping them fell to the ground. ’Whether or not tho trams were scrapped, £OOOO annually would have lo be met in interest and sinking fund. instead of losing in depreciation over a period of years they were going to lose the whole. box and

dice in one sweep. Interest, depreciation and sinking fund swallowed up all Mr. Clark’s loss. The tram track was hearing almost the whole of the traffic, and lie thought they paid their full share of the upkeep of the road. He considered that the roads and streets department should pay 2-i per rent, to the tramways department tor! (lie damage done to the train track, lie did not think that his colleagues renllv believed that the renewal of the Gladstone road track would cost £25.0(10. It would he criminal folly to discontinue the trams at present, and if the trains were scrapped they were scrapping the best means ol transport. They were paying actual running expenses —then why scrap them (Loud applause.) Cr. Blair said the position was that whether they had to pay £20,000 or £20.000 for the repairing of Gladstone road,* they would have to pay a ver\ large sum, and also interest and sinking fund. Further heavy expenditure would he involved when the trams had to he replaced, or it extrusions we re made. He accepted the Mayor’s suggestion that if they found the' trams were no good then scrap them.

Bickford said that when Cr. Barnard pul his motion to the council he either thought he could bluff the council or he was ignorant oi the la.w —ami he was not the latter. (Loud laughter and applause). They had the trams and lie would strongly advocate that- they keep them. An extension of the systovn. could be uiudo a ‘t very little expense. The councillors who wanted to scrap the trams had not been honest to the ratepayers; had they been honest they would have come to the ratepayers before the elections and told them their intentions.

Cr. Burmird asked the meeting to examine the arguments more closely. It, had been put to them that- they should disregard facts and gufires, hut the new councillors had been xery much interested in the figures in regard to the trams. The Mayor had not- been properly treated. He could not undcistand that, for the Mayor had always been supported, and the speaker had not been told in what way they had not- been properly treated. It was perfectly true that last year a proposal was made for the extesion of the service, but- it would have been wrong or the 'Council to ask the ratepayers to vote a. further £45,000. It was the dnt-v of the council to conserve the funds of the community. The result of the interest and the sinking fund on the loan for the renewal of the track would be an annual loss of £9OOO. .Flic loss involved was one that they could not afford to stand. Ther was not another tram service in the world run on similar conditions with storage batten- cars. ’Flic svstem was difficult to work and expensive to maintain, and they said that it was not. a satisfactory one to support. ' They would find in the larger centres tha instead of extend ing the trams, ’buses weree being used. The present service was unsatisfactory in that it only served a small portion of the town. 'Flic loan of £45.000 to extend the trams would never lie voted by the ratepayers: then what wnsHlie vise of continuing with the trains, 'the ’bus had been so successful in New Zealand and Australia that they had proved that the trains could not stand un against the ’lnis competition. Tl was only because the ’buses "-eve emunoting with the trams that legislation and Orders-in-Counri! had been brought forward, and the object of those regulations was to protect the money invested in the trams. The investigation showed that the actual running less was £6OOO per annum. Tt was the duty of the council, and pre-eminentlv the' dutv pf the Mavor. to as-ertnin whatthe loss was. and they would not have been servin' 1 ’ the public if thov had not. done so. Tf on Ihe figures thev found them to he correct, then the rate pavers would have lo ask themselves what was the good of continuing ihc trams. (Applause.)

Cr. Maude said lie was honest and sincere in advising the ratepayers to scran the tramse.' All the reference to the six who had been in favor of scrapping the trams bad been in the nature of recriminateion. If the maiority ot oast councils bad heen against the trams, as the Mavor had said, then there must have been some great feeling behind it. Owing to the manner in which municipal accounts were arranged, the true position was not revealed. Depreciation had to be faced and at the maturity of the present Joan &35.0C0 would have to be found. It was alt very well to ask posterity 1 to bear the burden, but he said, “give the bovs a chance.” Thev ought to hand down something in the wav of assets. He fullv believed that the reason thev had heen taunted regarding the legal opinion was because the supporters were robbed of a cb«nre to taunt them f or not getting it. Tf it could he proved that the trams would nav running expenses he would vote for their retention. So long a« the trams were retained, so long would the other parts •*f the town remain unserved.