PARLIAMENT.

New Zealand Times, Volume XXIX, Issue 4174, 6 August 1874, Page 3

PARLIAMENT.

LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL. Tuesday, August 4. The Hon. the Speaker took the chair at two o’clock, REPORT. The Hon. Colonel Brett brought up the report of the Select Committee on the Canterbury Public Domains Act Amendment Bill, recommending that the Bill be not further proceeded with this session. COLONIAL BANK OF NEW ZEALAND BILL. The Hon. Mr. MILLER briefly moved the second reading of this Bill. The Hon. Mr. WATERHOUSE thought there could be no objection to the principle of the BUI. But it differed from previous Bills in the fourth clause. That clause gave the corporation security not only for advances made, but for advances agreed to be made, and not only for sums due, but also for sums to become due. The Bill went further, as regards the powers given to any Bank, not only in this Colony, but in any of the Colonies. The great objection is to the second case. The Bank having received security for certain moneys advanced and repaid, might hold the security for other moneys that might thereafter be advanced. . He thought the words ought to be erased. He had called attention to the subject at that stage, lest in Committee it might escape the notice of others not so thoroughly acquainted with the matter. He suggested that there should be one general measure applicable to all Banks to bo established hereafter. The Hon. Mr. HOLMES thought that a colonial institution such as this must bo a great advantage to all the colonists. The fact of those words to which exception had been taken not being in the other Bills did not prove that they were sufficient. The opposite had proved the case in several instances. The Bank of Otago had found it necessary to establish a loan company. All the banks had the power, directly or indirectly, of availing themselves of the provisions of the Bill. It seemed to him -that the time had arrived when the Colony saw clearly the necessity of undertaking their own financial affairs. The Hon. Dr. POLLEN thought that the best way of looking at it would be as a general measure. In so far as it benefited the promoters, it would benefit the community at large. He saw no reason why the Council shmdd depart from the ordinary course in respect of this measure. The Hon. Mr. WILLIAMSON challenged the statements of the Hon. Mr. Holmes _as regarded the Bank of New Zealand being identical with the Loan Company referred to. He thought it right that those powers should not be extended to any bank. The Hon. Mr. CAMPBELL thought the objections of the Hon. Mr. Waterhouse were not material. He did not see in the securities the banks were empowered to take, anything that they ought not to have. Every day’s delay was a serious matter to those who had invested their capital in the bank, and he did not think the Council should offer . any obstacle to the second reading of the Bill. The Hon. J. JOHNSTON said it seemed to him that the powers given with respect to collateral security were only those used every day by the different banking houses. The Hon. Mr. MILLER briefly replied. He thought the construction put on the words by the Hon. Mr. Waterhouse could scarcely be borne out. The motion was then carried, and the Bill read a second time. petition. The Hon. Mr. Menzies presented a’ petition of Mr. Crisp, M.P.C., Auckland, whose seat has been challenged in consequence of some inaccuracy in the Provincial roll. HACKNEY CARRIAGES. The Hon. Dr. POLLEN moved,—“For leave to introduce a Bill intituled ‘ An Act to enlarge the Powers of Municipal Councils, to make By-laws for the Regulation of Hackney Carriages and Borough Stage Carriages, and for other purposes.’ ” Leave was granted, the Bill read a first time, and the second reading made an Order of the Day for Thursday. RAILWAY BRIDGE AT GORE. The Hon. Mr. MEWZIES moved, —“That it is expedient that the railway bridge over the River Mataura at Gore be planked over, so as to be available for foot passengers”—and in doing so, entered at length into the reasons which had induced him to bring forward the motion. If not done, he was convinced some deplorable accident would ensue. The Hon. Mr. HOLMES, in seconding the motion, stated that the river was dangerous, and no second place for crossing existed within twenty-seven miles. The Hon. Dr. POLLEN thought it was undesirable for the Council to express an opinion on such a subject. It involved the outlay of money, and should have been brought forward in another place. On a division, the motion was lost by 22 to 8. BOROUGH OF yESTPORT VALIDATION BILL. The Hon. Dr. POLLEN moved, —“For leave to introduce a Bill intituled ‘An Act to validate the Proceedings constituting the Borough of Westport under the “Municipal Corporations Act, 1867,” and otller Acts and Proceedings consequent thereon.’ ” Leave was granted, the Bill read a first time, and the second reading made an Order of the Day for Thursday. ATMOSPHERIC RAILWAY BREAK. The Hon. Captain FRASER moved, —_ “That the proposition or offer of Mr. Wedenhouse, inventor of the Atmospheric Railway Break, which has been submitted to the Government by Mr. Thomas Russell, be laid on the table.” After explaining his connection with the subject, the hon. gentleman stated that the break had been found to work admirably in America; and had been used in Italy' and France, and recently in England. He might mention that the break brought a pressure to bear on every wheel in the train. There was no jar; and no possibility of the break-van becoming detached from the other part of the train. The Hon. Dr. PQLLEN promised that the correspondence should be laid on the table. The attention of the Government had been directed to the subject, and the material for testing this valuable invention was already on its way. Motion carried. NATIVE RESERVES. The Hon, Mr. MANTELL moved, —“ That there be laid upon the table copies of all papers connected with 'the Native Reserves, sections 80 and 90, in the City of Wellington ; the former proposal to leave them to the Board of Ordnance ; and their recent sale for £BOO, as reported by the Commissioner of Native Reserves.” The Hon. Mr. WI TAKO seconded the motion, which was agreed to. THE NATIVE LAND ACT, 1873. The Hon. Mr. MANTELL moved, —“ That there be laid upon tho table copies of all minutes, memoranda, and reports of the Chief Judge and other Judges of the Native Lands Court upon tho provisions and operation of the Native Land Act, 1873.” In doing so, he said that as there were rumors of an intention to bring in a measure to amend this Act, and knowing that such correspondence had taken place, and such reports been made on tho subject, he thought it desirable that the Council should he placed in possession of the fullest information. The Hon Dr. POLLEN, as a general rule, made no objection to tho production of papers, but in another place the Government had objected to a similar motion on this subject, and in that objection he entirely concurred. In point of fact, tho Native Lands Act of last session could scarcely he said to bo in operation. They all knew the ingenuity of the legal profession—how they could .drive a coach and four through any Act. The Judges had taken objection to the Act. They held very strong opinions, and'the Government also hold strong opinions. He trusted the Council would see that the publication of the papers was not desirable. The motion was negatived on tho voices.

VENTILATION OP THE LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL CHAMBER. The Hon. Mr. HART moved, —“ That it be an instruction to the House Committee to inquire and report upon the means in use for ventilating the Legislative Council Chamber.” He thought the ventilation of the Chamber was not in a perfect state, and that it would be satisfactory to know what the means in use were, so that hon. members, though non-profes-sionals, might offer suggestions for its being remedied. The motion elicited from many hon. members strong condemnation of the ventilation as well as of the acoustic properties of the Chamber, and was carried without opposition. WELLINGTON BURIAL GROUND BILL. The Hon. Mr. MANTELL, in moving the second reading of this Bill, said he was not aware till the other day that the Superintendent had power to cause burials to cease. That power had not been exercised for nineteen years. As a proof of the unsatisfactory sanitary condition of .Wellington, be produced a letter addressed to “ Smellington” (laughter), which had come ou without a hitch to its right address. If the second reading were assented to, he would ask that the committal of the Bill should not take place until after that of a Bill of a similar nature, introduced by the Provincial Secretary. The Hon. Mr. STOKES supported the motion, and hoped that if the Government measure were carried, in Committee they would see that the clauses in that measure did not conflict with those of the one now under consideration. The motion was carried, the BUI read a second time, and its committal made an order of the day for Wednesday. ELECTRIC TELEGRAPH ACT AMENDMENT BILL. The Hon. Dr. POLLEN, in moving the second reading of this Bill, said that circumstances had arisen which made it necessary to afford protection to officers when compelled to produce telegrams or giving evidence. It was also found necessary to give increased powers of protection to the line itself. These constituted the main features of the Bill The Hon. Mr. HOLMES drew attention to tho fact that in many telegraph offices boys employed as runners were allowed access to the place where telegrams were given in, and thus became possessed of valuable information which it was but natural for them to divulge. After some remarks from the Hon. Mr. Menzies and the Hon. G. R. Johnson, the motion was carried, and the Bill read a second time. GOVERNMENT INSURANCE AND ANNUITIES BILL. In moving the second reading of this Bill, the Hon. Dr. Pollen stated that it was a consolidation of the Government Insurance Act 1869, and Annuities Act of 1870. It provided for quinquennial distribution of profits, and he thought there could be no question as to the policy of such an arrangement. The Hon. Mr. HOLMES objected to Clause 45, providing for participation in the profits by policy-holders, on the ground that it established a partnership between insurer and insured. He was rather in favor of reducing the premium to be paid by the insurers. The Hon. Dr. GRACE bore testimony to the admirable way in which this branch of Government business had been conducted. Referring to Clause 24, he thought it was an unfair advantage to take of private companies. Government had no right to expect an unfair assistance from the State, as against private enterprise. The Hon. Mr. WATERHOUSE thought the Government had gone beyond their function in establishing this business. He thought it was right to make that business as perfect as possible. He regretted to observe a tendency to fill up vacancies, not by merit, but solely on account of political opinions. The management should be made more independent of Government, and should be associated with a Board. The fact of the power of making advances to the insured on their policies resting with the Commissioner, was another reason why that officer should be independent of tbe Government. The Hon. Dr. POLLEN briefly replied to the objection raised against the Bill. The motion was carried, and the Bill read a second time. RESIGNATION OP THE HON. MR MACLEAN. The Hon. the SPEAKER read a telegram from the Hon. Mr. Maclean, resigning his seat in the Council. BURIAL GROUND BILL. The Hon. Dr. POLLEN, in moving the second reading of this Bill, observed that of the two Bills of a similar nature before the Council he preferred the one whose second reading!he nowmoved. He thought that the time had come when intramural interments should cease in popidous cities. The Bill gave the Governor and his advisers powers to close cemeteries when for sanitary reasons it was found expedient to do so. The Hon. Mr. HART said there was a want in the Bill that would induce him to vote for its postponement—the Bill provided only for the closing of burial grounds without providing for burials after such closure. He was not sure that in the multitude of business that Government bad on its hands it would have the leisure to see that such provisions as ought to be made, were made. For purposes so extensive as those this Bill provided for, it was a dangerous measure. The Hon. Mr. WATERHOUSE thought the Bill was incapable of amendment. Though no express provision had been made, clause 2 provides that notice should be given before the closing of any burial ground, and that might be with the view of making new burial grounds. The Hon. Mr. MANTELL thought the Bill a good one, and only needed a supplementary clause providing that there should be a new cemetery before an old one was closed. The Hon. Mr. MENZIES suggested that tho clause in the Wellington Bill specifying who might be buried after closure, should be be introduced into the present measure. The Hon. Mr. EONARdntimated his intention to vote for the motion, as he thought the BUI was an evidence of the desire of the Government to legislate for the benefit of the whole Colony, and not for particular localities. The Hon. Dr. POLLEN briefly replied, and tbe motion was carried; the Bill read a second time, and its committal made an order of the day for Thursday. IN COMMITTEE. The Electric Telegraph Act Amendment Bill and the Government Insurance and Annuities Bill were considered, progress reported, and their recommittal made an order of the day for Wednesday. The Conveyancing Ordinance Amendment Bill was reported with amendments. The Council adjourned at ten o’clock to the usual hour on Wednesday. , Wednesday, August 5. The Hon. the Speaker took tho chair at* two o’clock. PRIVILEGE. The Hon. Mr. ACLAND brought under the notice of the Hon. the Speaker a telegram in the Tribune, relative to the-Ward-Chapman Committee. He thought that it was most important that some notice should bo taken of what purported to be a report of the proceedings of a Committee appointed by the Council. Tho Hon. the SPEAKER said he ooidd not help expressing his opinion that the article in question was a gross case of breach of privilege, and suggested that it be referred to tbe Privileges Committee. The Hon. Mr. ACLAND, by leave, moved, to a Select Committee to report; on Thursday, such Committee to consist of tho Hon. the Speaker, tbe Hon. Dr. PoUen, the Hon. Major Richmond, the Hon, Colonel Kenny, and the mover.” Carried. CORRESPONDENCE. I The Hon. Mr. CHAMBERLIN asked the Hon. tho Colonial Secretary,—“lf all tho correspondence relating to the making of a road from tho Waipa Rivor to Raglan has. been laid upon the table ; and why tho plan connected with Major Heaphy’s previously asked for, has not been produced.” The Hon. Dr. POLLEN had no reason to believe that all tho correspondence received had not been laid on the table. NATIVE LANDS ACT. The Hon. Mr. MANTELL moved,—" That there belaid upon tho table copies of all comma-

ideations received by-the Government from the Chief Judge and other Judges of the Native Lands Court, expressing favorable opinions upon the provisions and operation of the Native Lands Act, 1873.” He observed that he would only state that he had had ho correspondence, either directly or indirectly, with any of the gentlemen referred to. The Hon. Dr. POLLEN had no objection to the production of the correspondence moved for. Carried. ■ CANTERBURY PUBLIC DOMAIN. The Hon. Colonel BRETT moved,—“ That, in accordance with the recommendation contained in the report of the Select Committee, the Canterbury Public Domains Act Amendment Bill be hot proceeded with during the present Session.” He stated that it was only in deference to the wish expressed in the Report, the Committee had taken the opinion of the Attorney-General on the subject, which was that it was competent for the Provincial Council to deal with the five acres as they thought fit. The Hon. Mi - . CAMPBELL having had charge of the Bill, hoped the Council would not act upon the report of the Select Committee. There was nothing before the Council to show that it was not desirable to erect a College there. He wished to go on with the Bill, and suggested that a clause should be inserted to the effect that the Act should not take effect until the Provincial Council had reconsidered the matter. The Hon. Mr. ROBINSON had voted with Colonel Brett on a former occasion under a misapprehension. He thought that the site of the College was to be taken out of the public reserve, but he now found that the site was to be in the Botanical Gardens. This, he thought, was the best possible site that could be found. He was still opposed to any encroachments on the public reserves ; but he thought the course indicated by Mr. Campbell was the proper one to pursue, as, if they did not pass the measure twelve months must elapse before any steps could be taken in the erection of the College. The present gardens were on the poorest piece of laud in the reserve, and he thought at a small expense the gardens might be moved to better ground. The Hon. Captain ERASER hoped that Mr. Campbell would not press his amendment. The Hon. Mr. WATERHOUSE thought one objection to the course suggested by Mr. Campbell was, that the Provincial Council would proceed to the consideration of the subject with their hands tied. The Hon. Mi - . ACLAND was surprised to hear Mr. Campbell say that there was np unanimous desire on the part of the people of Christchurch that the College should not be erected there, when he could only bring forward a petition signed by fourteen persons. He thought an equally good site farther from the town might be procured. The Hon. Mr. PATERSON should vote in favor of the motion. They had appointed a Committee to obtain information; that Committee had called evidence and recommended that the Bill be not proceeded with. The Hon. Mr. BUCKLEY pointed out the various delays, amounting in all to more than three years: He hoped the Council would accede to the proposition of Mr. Campbell. The Hon. Mr. HART said it was perfectly well known that the Provincial Council had made up its mind -with respect to the erection of the College on the Domain. He suggested that they 1 should wait for another year. Money was in hand to purchase a site, and it would be then seen whether another site could not be purchased. The Hon. Mr. MBNZIES was understood to say that the passing of this Bill would tie the Provincial Council to that particular site. By postponing the Bill they would give the public as well as the Provincial Council an opportunity of expressing their opinion. The Hon. Mr. MANTELL said that with respect to the petition, the one with the fourteen signatures, being those of landowners in the vicinity, might be of as much weight as the one with 25,000. The greater number only proved the zeal and .industry of the canvassers." The Hon. Mr. WILLIAMSON rose in support of the recommendation of the Committee, because the people, whose the reserve was, wished that their land should not be so occupied. The Hon. Mr. MILLER moved as an amendment that the second reading be made an order of the day for to-morrow. The Hon. Captain ERASER hoped the Council would get rid of the Bill, for they had had it before them, in one shape or other, day after day, usque ad nauseam. (Hear.) The Hon. Mr. CAMPBELL would accept the vote on the amendment of the Hon. Mr. Miller as an. index of the opinion of the Council. The Hon. Colonel BRETT briefly replied. On a division, the numbers were equal—ls to 15. The Hon. the SPEAKER gave his casting vote with the recommendation of the Committee, and the motion was carried. READ ESTATE DESCENT. The. Hon Mr. WATERHOUSE moved,— “ That the Real Estate Descent Bill be committed to a Committee of the Council for Thursday next.” Carried. OYSTER FISHERIES. The Hon. Dr. POLLEN moved,—“For leave to bring in a Bill to amend the Oyster Eiaheries Act, 1866.” Carried. Bill read a first time, and second reading fixed for Thursday, , PRIVILEGE. , On the motion of the Hon. Mr. Aokland, his motion that the question of privilege Pe referred to a Select Committee was amended by adding “with power to confer with the Privileges Committee of the House of Representatives.” GOLD-FIELDS ACT. The Hon. Dr. RENWICK, in moving the second reading of the Gold-fields Act 1861 Amendment Bill, explained jts object—that the administration of the gold-fields should be by responsible government. The Hon. Mr. BONAR thought it was opening up a very wide subject. He suggested that a general measure should be introduced. It would not bo right to restrict the powers of delegation vested in the Governor. He considered it very undesirable to ask the Governor to delegate those powers to the Superintendent of Nelson, and some unknown Province. The Superintendent ought not to have sought to free himself from the responsibility of those delegated powers, but should have exercised them as a controlling power, and he therefore moved that the Bill be read a second time that day six months. • The Hon. Capt. ERASER did not think that it was wise to trust such powers to any one who carried all the interests he held in the Province imder his hat. The Hon. Dr. GRACE combated the views of Capt. Eraser. The Hon. Mr. PATERSON said that the Superintendent could not act ■without the consent of his Executive. The General Government in a former case had laid-it down as a rule that these powers should be used only with the consent of the Executive, and tills Bill only provided the same. The Hon. Mr. HART was unaware whether it was necessary that the Superintendent should consult his Executive. He considered the delegated powers wore personal and responsible duties, and wore not to be delegated to bodies of men. He should support the amendment. • The 1 Hon. Mr. MBNZIES remarked that the Bill did not introduce any new principle. The Delegation Act provided for the powers of the Governor being delegated to “ a person or persons,” and in another clause “ to the Executive of a Province.” The Hon. Dr. POLLEN considered exceptional legislation with respect to any particular Province was very undesirable. This Bill was of a very exceptional nature. The powers delegated were of almost nominal character. In the X’rovlhee of Nelson there wore exceptional conditions. He thought 1 it undesirable that an ephemeral body of men who, by a majority of one or two, were placed in position of greater power than the Superintendent should have these powers delegated to them. The' Hon. Dr. RENWICK having replied, the amendment was carried. ‘ SECOND READINGS. Presbyterian Church of Otago Lands Act Amendment Bill (the Hon. Dr. Pollen); Wellington Education Reserves Act Amendment

Bill (the Hon. Mr. Waterhouse) ; and Provincial Eencing Laws Empowering Act (the Hon. Mr. Booklet.) . , THE COMMITTEE. The Wellington Burial Grounds Bill was considered in Committee and reported without amendment. The Government Insurance and Annuities Bill was further considered and reported with amendments. CONVEYANCING ordinance AMENDMENT BILL. This Bill was read a third time and passed. The Council adjourned at nine o’clock till the usual hour next day. HOUSE OP REPRESENTATIVES. Wednesday, August 5. The Speaker took the chair at the usual hour. LYTTELTON GAS BILL. This Bill was reported, read a third time, and passed. BREACH OF PRIVILEGE. Mr. J. L. GILLIES stated that he was instructed by the Joint-Committee in the WardChapman inquiry to bring under the notice of the House a breach of the privileges of the House that had occurred in the publication in the Tribune'oi the previous evening of a telegram which purported to be an extract from the letter of a Wellington correspondent to th e. Southern Cross, giving an account of the proceedings of the Committee. He desired, at the request of the Committee, to move for a Select Committee to inquire into the matter, —and would mention names at a later hour of the evening—not so much with reference as to what had occurred as to prevent further publications of a similar nature. The motion for the appointment of a Select Committee was agreed to. NELSON WASTE LANDS BILL. . Further procedure with this measure was postponed on the motion of Mr. CURTIS, till Wednesday next. * EDUCATING NATIVE YOUTHS. Mr. W. KELLY asked,—“lf it is the intention of the Government to make provision for the education of the sons of chiefs of the Native race, as indicated by His Excellency the Governor in his address at a recent examination of the Auckland Grammar School." Mr. MoLEAN replied that it was the earnest desire of the Government to further the education of the Native youth in the fullest possible way. First, by means of village schools, as being the least expensive, from which the most promising youths, the sons of chiefs, &c., should be sent to a better class of school. They desired to see the young and rising generation sent to institutions where the best education could be'supplied. The subject was one that was receiving the fullest attention of the Government. His Excellency, when making the observations referred-to, was unaware there was already a hoarding school in Auckland, where, notably, a number of Araivas, and a good many young men of rank, were receiving a better class education. There was a similar institution in Wellington, one of the pupils at which had passed a very creditable examination by the Wellington Education Board. It would be a great boon for the Natives to be able to mix with Europeans, and their learning the English language would be the best means of bridging over the difficulties between the two races. RETURN. Mr. MURRAY moved, —“Eor a return shelving the officers of the Civil Service who during the past year have resigned ; return to state salaries, duties, and dates of appointment.” Agreed to. PORT CHALMERS RAILWAY'. Mr. MURRAY moved, —“For a return shoYving the number and amount of Port Chalmers railway debentures taken over by the Colony ; also the amount and number still outstanding, ivith the yearly charge for interest thereon.” Agreed to. NATIVE AFFAIRS COMMITTEE. Mr. W. KELLY moved,—“That the number of the Native Affairs Committee be extended to seventeen, and that the names of Mr. J. L. Gillies, Mr. Macanclrew, and Mr. J. E. Brown, be added to the Committee.” Agreed to. CLAIMS FOR COMPENSATION. Mr. T. KELLY’S motion—“ That a return be laid on the table, shoiving the number of claims for compensation for laud taken ■_ on account of theWaitara and New Plymouth Railway, taken into the Compensation Court, the sums.claimed, and the amounts aivarded to the claimants in each case”—ivas agreed to, the Minister for Public Works stating that the return ivould be laid on the table to-morrow. SESSIONAL BUSINESS. Mr. CARRINGTON moved,—“That for the remainder of the session the orders of the day take precedence of notices of motion on Wednesdays and Thursdays.” Mr. GILLIES moved as an amendment that the orders of the day should take precedence of the -notices of motion on Mondays and Thursdays, and that the House should meet on Monday evenings ; but on Mr. Vogel objecting to the House sitting on Mondays, until the Government saw the necessity for moving the House, Mr. Gillies withdrew that part of his amendment, and it was carried in the form that the orders of the day should take precedence on Wednesdays. goldfields’ revenue. Mr. MERYYN moved, —“ That a return be laid on the table 'showing the cost upon the Goldfields’ revenue of each Province, of each Warden’s Court -in the Colony; and the amount of revenue derived from each Court, for a period of three years, ending June 30th, 1874.” Agreed to. THE NATIVE LANDS ACT. The debate on the question—“ That all reports upon the provisions and workings of the Native Lands Act, 1873, by the Native Land Court Judges, be laid on the table, for the purpose of being referred to the Committee on Native Affairs”—was resumed by Mr. Gillies, Yvho, Yvith Mr. Rolleston and Mr. Williams, urged that the reports of the Judges should be laid on the table. Mr. MoLEAN observed that there was a good deal of misconception about the Native Lands Act of Inst year. The fact was that it had never been fairly tried. The Judges had never been able, on account of pressure of duties -in various parts of the country, to hold the meeting which was necessary to draiv up rules and regulations, until a very recent period. Until those rules and regulations were brought into operation, some disappointment must have been experienced on account of delay ; hut that did not in the least affect the principle of the Act. The great discontent spoken of in general terms, was not by the Natives, but almost entirely on the part of Europeans,. whose. interests were affected in respect of certain lands, under the new Native Lands Act. , The new Act required the exercise of a greater degree of responsibility on the part of the Judges than, any previous Act. It required them to satisfy themselves of the nature, of the tenure, and all the circumstances connected Yvith the tenure, before the lands passed through the Court. With reference to the reports of the Judges, he had had the opportunity of reading them since the notice Yvas put on the order paper, and he had not the least hesitation in placing them at the disposal of the,Committee without any delay. Motion' agreed to. ' MANAWATU-RANGITIKEI CLAIM. . Mr. FITZHEEBERT moved—“ That the report of Mr, Speaker on the_Manawatu-R.au-gitikei claim be taken into consideration.” He merely, invited the Government, to say Yvhether, in the event of their taking an equitable view of the case, they would be prepared to recommend His Excellency to place a sum on the supplementary estimates to give effect to the recommendation of the impartial arbitrator. , He should be glad to have an intimation from the Government on the subject, because, if adverse, he would require to amend the terms of his motion. Mr. MoLEAN suggested that the motion should ho postponed to enable him to go into the matter. . , _ ■ The motion ivaa accordingly postponed till Tuesday. LEAVE TO INTRODUCE BILLS. ; . • ' ' Leavo was given to introduce the following Bills:—Sir Cuaoeoft Wilson, a Bill to provide for the prevention of grass and forest fires;

Mr. Sheehan, Hooper and Norton Registration Bill; Mr. Bdckland, a Bill to amend the Protection of Animals Act, 1873. MR. BALL’S DEFENCE. Mr. T. B. GILLIES moved,—“ That a letter by Mr. Thomas Ball, of Mongonui, to the Minister of Justice, of 29th June last, relative to papers printed in the appendix to the journals of this House, H. 37, 1873, be laid on the table and printed.” Mr. O’RORKE, in expressing his regret that the papers referred to should have been printed, promised to at once lay Mr. Ball’s letter in defence of himself on the table. BILLS. The following Bills were read a second time : —Volunteer Land Act Amendment Bill, Dunedin Gas Bill, Dunedin Waterworks Bill, Clutha Trust Reserve Bill, Gold-fields Act 1866 Amendment Bill, Taranaki Iron Smelting Works Bill, New Plymouth Harbor Endowment Bill, Hokitika Election of Mayor Bill, Bankruptcy Act Amendment Bill. The Wellington AVaterworks Loan Bill, and the New Plymouth Exchanges Valuation Bill were passed. The following Bills were committed : —Wellington ATdunteer Land Scrip Act Amendment Bill, Cromwell AVaterworks Loan Bill. Mr. VOGEL, on the gold miningßill, observed that the second clause was one that the House could not possibly agree to. It dealt with a very important matter—one that was moreover under the consideration of the law Courts at the present time. If the member for the Dunstan would agree to drop that clause, there would be no objection on the part of the Government to the second reading. Mr. Shepherd declined to forego that clause, which was the most important pai-t of the Bill. The second reading was carried on the voices. On the New Plymouth Harbor Endowment Bill, Mr. ANDREAV remarked that it was proposed to look up one-fourth of the land of the Province as an endowment for the proposed Harbor Board. Mr. J. E. BROAVN said it was unadvisable for the Provincial Govermnent to lock up a quarter of its land I'evenue for any purpose. The Government, if necessary, should form the harbor upon some systematic plan. He objected to locking up a quarter of the land of the Province for a Harbor Board not yet formed. He hoped the Government would interfere, and prevent the practice now growing up of every little place asldng for endowments and endeavoring to lock up large quantities of land. Mr. T. KELLY supported the Bill. Mi - . VOGEL said the Government did not disapprove of the Bill. The Government were bringing in a Bill that no works of a like nature shall in future be commenced without the approval of the Governor in the Council. Major ATKINSON strongly supported the Bill, which was then read a second time. On the Clutha Trust Bill, Mr. VOGEL mentioned that there was a prospect of the question of the reservation of lands in Otago being settled this session. Hon. members would recollect that that Province had reserved some two million acres, and the Government declined to Crown grant such an extensive area, and arrangements would, he believed, be come to. by which 500,000 acres would be accepted for educational purposes instead of the two million acres that had been reserved. The 2000 acres now proposed as an endowment were amongst the reserves that would be cancelled by the proposed exchange, therefore the matter came up for separate treatment. It would not be in accordance with the spirit and intention of the law that enormous tracts should be removed from the operation of the ordinary law by reservation, ■ but it would be equally against the intention of the law to set their faces against any reasonable reservations. AVhen the adjustment was made, he hoped the Provincial authorities would respect the law, and that there should be a clear understanding as to the extent the power of reservation could be exercised by the Provinces. (Hear.) The present proposal was one that should command the approval of the House ; but he was not prepared to express any opinion as to whether the whole extent of the land proposed should be reserved. He Recommended that the second reading should be taken, and further consideration of the Bill postponed till next week; and meanwhile he would consult with the Provincial authorities, and if there was no objection the reservation might be arranged. The second reading was then agreed to. WELLINGTON LAND PAYMENTS BILL. On the committal of this Bill, Mr. VOGEL suggested there should be 'some limit placed on the quantity of land that might be given in payment of public works during any one year, and asked the member for AVairarapa to name a limit. Sir. BUNNY observed that the Bill had been brought in by the Superintendent of AA'elliugton in consequence of seeing a clause exactly similar in the Marlborough AVaste Lands Act that had passed this session, but upon which no restriction had been placed, beyond appropriation by the Provincial Council. The same form was adopted in tills Bill. AAThy should AVellihgton be restricted to 1000 acres when no objection was raised to the Marlborough Bill ? There could be no question that it would be cheaper to pay for the woyks of the Province in - cash, if they had cash. If the Colony gave the Province cash they would do so, but not being in a position to offer cash, it was better to turn their land into money than allow it to remain useless and waste. Eor example, if the Province wanted to make fifteen miles of road in the new country, it would select land alongside the work and lay it off in alternate sections. They would then call for tenders for the work, to be paid either in cash or land. The contractors would tender, and the land would be put up to auction. If it fetched its fair price, well; if not the Province would hold the contractor to his bargain to accept payment in land If the Province was to be limited to the small amount proposed by the Premier, and of course the Government could carry any question, he would have to ask that progress bo reported, and leave be obtained to sit again. Mr. VOGEL denied that he had advised placing any limit : he had invited the hon. member for AVairarapa to name a limit that he considered reasonable. There could scarcely be a doubt that to grant unlimited power, such as was here asked, would be exceedingly unwise. They did not want public works constructed at such a sacrifice as they evidently would be under this Bill. Mr. PEARCE agreed with the Premier to a great extent that certain checks should be put on indiscriminate . borrowing, but he protested against the extraordinary difference of treatment of Provinces, by the hon. gentleman at the head of the Government. Just a few hours before a Bill giving greater latitude to Taranaki—enabling that Province to set aside a quarter of the total lauds of the Province as a harbor endowment—passed without any objection. Mr. VO OKI. replied that the cases of Taranaki and Wellington were not at all analagous. There was'no desire on the part of the Government to deal unfairly with any Province, or to show favor to any particular Province. They would deal with each case on its merits. He would be sorry if the remarks he had felt himself compelled to make in reference to the Province of AVellington had created that impression ;: but ho felt no sorrow at .having stated to the House his opinions on that subject. Mr. EITZHERBERT referred to the charge the Premier had attempted to bring against the Province of AVellington, and said they were utterly repugnant to fact and truth, as the hon. member well knew. The Premier was endeavoring to make fish of one and flesh of other Provinces. Yet he paraded himself before the House and the country that ■ he held the scales of justice equally as between the Provinces. He would tell the Premier to his face why the Taranaki Bill passed without any objection: it was because the votes of that Province were safe, while those of AVellington wore not in his favor, and he (Mr. Eitzherbert) was proud to think so. (Hear, and laughter.) The Bill was exactly the same as that introduced by the Province of Maidborough, and passed by the House .without any objection. Why should AVellington be persecuted and trampled upon as it had i been. (Laughter.) Ho could not conceive why there should be any hesitation in

consenting to the Bill, seeing that dealing with the land was subject to the vote of the Provincial Council. Mr. VOGEL said if the member for the Hutt had been in his place last night he would have said more of him, and perhaps what would have seemed more distasteful to that hon. member than in his absence he had felt it consistent with his duty to the House then to state. The insinuation of the hon. member that the present objection had been raised suddenly was not the case. The Marlborough Bill went to the AVaste Lands Committee and in such cases the Government very rarely interfered : hence it failed to attract attention. * But the present Bill came up in a separate shape, and was therefore likely to attract attention ; and so it was that the matter had been discovered and brought before the House. They hoped to intercept the Marlborough Bill before it finally passed ; aud would propose an •amendment similar to what was now proposed. It appeared to be the desire of the member for the Hutt to distract attention from the real question at issue. As to the insinuation that the Government desired to secure the votes of the Taranaki members, he treated such an imputation with the scorn and contempt it deserved. If the Government had desired to purchase votes, they need not have travelled very far. (Laughter.) It was notorious that certain votes had been in the market, and on very low terms. Certainly there had been no necessity to have gone to one of the smallest Provinces for the sake of purchasing popularity. The hon. member for the Hutt was much better versed in the subject than he (Mr. Vogel) was ; he was quite accustomed to throw out imputations of the kind. But the insinuation was made with the characteristic ingenuity of that hon. member. Mr. EITZHERBERT replied, charging the Premier with having made a coarse and personal attack upon him. He predicted that the Premier’s scheme would bring ruin to the Colony, as he (Mr. Vogel) well knew ; and he told him that there was not a tittle of troth—and he knew it well —in the financial statements he had made, in regard to AVellington. Mr. observed that the House was able to judge between himself and the member for the Hutt. He had certainly not been so long in public life as the member for the Hutt; but he could safely appeal to the House to say whether he had ever made any statement with the intention or desire to deceive, hut only statements that he believed to be quite true. (Hear.) Hon. members who read the correspondence lately laid on the table with the very ingenious answer of the member for the Hutt in regard to the Provincial Auditorship of AA r ellington, could judge between them. Mr. EITZHERBERT re-asserted that the Premier’s financial statements as to the manner in which the Province of AVellington had received allowances and aid from the House, were utterly repugnant to the truth. There was no necessity to speak of the cor- • respondence about the Provincial Auditorship, beyond saying that he thought the Premier in his calmer moments should be ashamed of it. But with respect to the charges brought against the Province, he denied for the third time the troth or accuracy of any of the Premier’s figures, or of the deductions he sought to draw from them. Progress was then reported, and leave obtained to sit again. AUCKLAND WASTE LAND BILL. On this Bill being committed, the Premier proposed a new clause to the effect that nothing contained in the Bill should affect the 6th section of the Immigration and Public Works Bill. As this addition if carried would prevent the Province from dealing with some 600,000 acres of land, Mr. Sheehan moved that progress bo reported, and obtained leave to sit again. BILLS. The Regulation of Elections Act 1870 Amendment Bill was read a second time. The Invercargill Gasworks Loan Bill, Taranaki Waste Lands Act Amendment Bill, and the Otago AVaste Lands Act Amendment Bill were committed. The Otago Land Act and the New Zealand University Bill passed. The Highway Boards Empowering Act Amendment Bill and the Regulation of Births Act Amendment Bill were discharged from the paper. At midnight the House adjourned till today at the usual hour.