BILL’S WIDE SCOPE.

Manawatu Standard, Volume LIX, Issue 195, 19 July 1939, Page 7

BILL’S WIDE SCOPE.

POWERS FOR MINISTER

DEREGISTRATION A UTHOiUTY

Per Press Association. WELLINGTON, July 18. Instead of proceeding as usual with the Address-iu-Reply debate, the Government created some surprise in the House of Representatives this afternoon by the introduction of the Industrial Conciliation and Arbitration Amendment Rill. This was introduced by Governor-General’s Message, and tiio Prime Minister immediately applied for urgency for its passing. Rt. Hon G. Forbes: What is the need for this urgency? Rt.. Hon. M. J. Savage: I was hoping we would get a dismission on the Bill when it came officially before the House. I think the Opposition may nest assured that the Government has good reason to ask for urgency. Urgency was accordingly granted without further dissent.

The Bill states that, if the Minister of Labour is satisfied that any discontinuance of employment has caused, or is likely to cause, serious loss or inconvenience due to the action of a union of workers or employers, he mnv by notice in the Gazette cancel the registration of the union concerned or cancel any award or industrial agreement relating to that union. This cancellation may be general or limited to any specified locality.

AY hen notice of cancellation has been issued with regard to any particular union or district no other union may be registered for That industry in. the locality, nor may the scope of any other union he extended to cover that district without the consent of the .Minister.

■‘Discontinuance of employment” is defined as the refusal by any employer to engage workers for any work for which he usually employs them; the refusal of workers to accept engagement for any work in which they arc usually employed, or any ‘‘method, act or omission in the course of employment that has, or is likely to have, the effect of interrupting or impeding work in any industry.”

The Rill was read the first time and Ab’. Forbes, on the second reading, immediately reiterated his query as to why urgency was required.

REASON FOR URGENCY. The Minister of Labour (lion. P. Cl AVebb): Urgency is required to give the Minister of Labour power to deregister any union or part of any union which, by any action on their part, cause interruptions or stoppages of industry. 1 am taking power under this Bill to cancel the registration of any ■union which docs not comply with the law as it stands. AYe can’t have the law reading both ways. At ttie present moment there is a reason why the measure should he passed immediately without waiting weeks, or perhaps months, before it is put into effect. Air. AY. J. Poison (.Stratford): The Minister is very mysterious. He hasn’t told us much.' AVhat has the Government up its sleeve that there should he this sudden demand for urgency? AVhat terrible tilings"have unions been doing? Under the Labour Government’s own legislation passed previously penalties were provided for noncompliance with awards, and unions which broke those conditions could he fined £IOO and members of the union £o each. AVhy did not the Government stick to the principles laid down in its own legislation?

Air Poison added that he could not understand why the Alinister of Labour himself had not risen and given an explanation of the Bill on moving the second reading. A Government interjection: Ho hasn’t had a chance ret. ATr Poison proceeded to criticise the Government’s industrial conciliation end arbitration legislation, and said the fact that the Government was seeking urgency for the present amendment seemed to indicate that some unions were apparently not behaving themselves. However, he could not see wliv the Government did not inflict the penalties provided for in the Act on unions which were responsible for breaches of the legislation. There might ho something behind this desire for urgenev, because he was aware that some members of the Labour Party were not in favour of compulsory unionism. Tf the Alinister assured them that urgency was necessary and showed them that this was tho case, then lie would meet with no opposition from his (All Poison’s) side of tho House. CTRIKE—AND DEREGISTER. The Alinister of Labour said it was true that there had been breaches of awards i>v unions but, referring to Mr Poison’s contention that the penalties under the existing legislation should be inflicted in such cases, the Alinister added that no Government during the past ten years had inflicted these penalties. Even the Nationalist Government had seen lit to deal with the Industrial Conciliation and Arbitration Act in a conimonsense way.

The Government was not going to lot unions have the law both ways. They either had to abide by the I.C. and A. Act or they could not expect to benefit bv its protection. If a union came out on strike, the Alinister said, he wanted power to deregister it. He knew there had been several stoppages recently, and they had one in Auckland at ‘ the present time. AVlieu the Bill passed through the House he would take steps to deregister the union concerned forthwith. If unions did not comply with the law. lie would take the first possible opportunity to deregister them. Air AVebb believed the Bill was necessary in the interests of collective security, industrial arbitration, and industrial peace. It would be helpful in dealing with manv cases that might arise, and lie wanted it put into operation as soon as he could.

DESERVING OF SUPPORT. Mr Eorl>es said the Opposition had certainly been in a log regarding the measure until the Minister had gi ven Ids explanation. However, lie would like to know how it would bring about, industrial peace by de-registering unions. Could not a union, once it had been do-rigtsered and the dispute was over, once again come back under the Act ? He agreed with the Minister that the impositions of penalties under the Act had done little to remedy tilings. The main thing, he said, was to keep industry in motion. If the Minister felt the Bill would assist- in the smoother operation of the industry, Mr Forbes felt the Minister deserved all possible support for it, but in the meantime more information was repaired about, the measure. Mr !•'. W. Schramm (Auckland East), supporting the Bill, said the

State, should have the final power fo settlo disputes, especially in cases where small sections unjustly provoked strikes and held up industry. It had been suggested that the power provided in the Bill should bo vested in the Arbitration Court, but Mr Schramm was of opinion that there would bo less delay if this power were given to the Alinister, who could act at once. RIGHT OF APPEAL? Mr S. G. Holland (Christchurch North), while assuring the House that tiie Opposition would lend a hand ia all cases where it considered that by doing' so industrial peace would be furthered, declared that the Minister would be disappointed if be was under the impression that the passing of the Bill would have any material effect on industrial disputes. Alilitant unions thought themselves already powerful enough to negotiate their own agreements without tho assistance of the Arbitration Court. The Bill, he considered, gave no right to ail employer or worker to appeal. A\ by not set up some judicial Court to consider tho question? ho asked. Air AY. J. 13 road foot (AVaitomo) contended that the penalties provided under tho existing legislation should have been imposed ’I hat would have been fair to both employers and workers. The Government had promised the country industrial peace. He wished the Minister could prove that, that promise would be implemented under the Bill. THE AUCKLAND STRIKE. Air J. G. Coates referred to the fertiliser workers’ strike in Auckland and asked if the men there were deregistered bow would the farmers get on for the supply of fertilisers? A\as the industrial condition being in ale Hall} improved, he asked, by the Alimstci being given power to cancel awards. AVhat would be the result of such action? The Alinister might find He could not bring about a settlement under the Industrial Disputes Investigation Act. Then what would happen 2 Was it contemplated that the employers could call upon other labour to carry on. or would the Government provide men ? A key industry was concerned in tho Auckland position and production had to bo maintained.

The Alinister of Housing (and former Alinister of Labour), Hon. H T. Armstrong, said it would be ridiculous in tho extreme to continue to enforce compulsory unionism if a section of the workers wore going to please themselves whether they observed the law or not. Compulsory unionism carried with it the responsibility of the unions to sec that the law was enforced and work was not disrupted from time to time as it had been recently.

He added that the dispute in the fertiliser industry in Auckland had nothing to do with the Rill. It had been talked about long before that dispute occurred. The Government wanted the present measure in the interests of good unionism and _ for the preservation of trade unionism. If the imnilv elements responsible for Die stoppages were allowed to go unchecked they would bring about the destruction of the trades union movement. Ihe Bill enable the Government to inflict penalties where it had not the pouer to do so to-day. POINT OF ORDER.

Air TL S. S. Kyle (Riccartou) prefaced liis speech with a point of order, stating that lie had an idea that while a want of confidence motion was liefore the House no other business could be brought forward.The Speaker (Hon. AY. E. Barnard) said that this was true according to tho Speaker Sir Maurice O’Rourke as far back as 1895. He pointed out. however. that the motion meant a long debate, and if the Government considered the present Bill was of an urgent nature, as apparently it did, it rlid not seem to him that intervention bv the Olmir was called for ‘Continuing. Air Kyle said he did not see how tho Bill was going to promote industrial peace. Air Wehh. replying to the second reading debate, said the Bill would make it quite permissible for him to compel the parties to a dispute to meet in conciliation. Tie did not think the new law would have to lie evoked on mnnv occasions, hut it was wise to have Die power if needed. While it might not stop all strikes, lie thought it would lieln very considerably in clearing tho industrial atmosphere. '["lie Bill then passed through the committee stages, was given a third reading and passed. THROUGH UPPER HOUSE.

In the Legislative Council to-night the Industrial Conciliation and Arbitration Amendment Bill was received from the House and accorded urgency. Speaking to Dio second reading, I-lon. T. Woodworth said it made possible the undoing of trade unions altogether. If a union was deregistered, an employer would lie Jree to carry on with free labour, and that would lead to worse trouble. 'The unscruplous employer could cause a dispute for the purpose of employing free labour. Other members supported the Bill, and it was put through all stages and passed.

teed price for wool, Air Barclay said wool would conic down again in price in the near future, and a demand would come along from the sliecpfairner for a guaranteed price just as it had come from the dairy farmer, and the Government would give it to them.

“We on this side of the House,” he said, “are lighting the tight for the farmer. Alakc no "error about that. We will give way to nobody.” Ninetylive per cent, of the dairy farmers would have been more prosperous today if we had had an ordinary producing season, but the dry season had substantially reduced production. 'lie Opposition talked about reduced production, but lie would point out that 26,000 more hales of wool were offered at the wool sales this year than last.

» SOCIALISAI DEFINED. Air C. H. Chapman (YYvlingtort North) said the Opposition had asked for a definition of toucialism from Government members. Personally liis definition of Socialism was that if a thing could ho better managed oil behalf of the people by the State or by the appropriate local body it should be so managed. That was the whole basis of Socialism as ho understood it, as advocated by the Government, and also by sonic mom hers of the Opposition. l\lr Chapman attacked tho newspapers, and said they were making bigger profits under tho Labour Government than they had done previously. In fact, he said, the newspaper industry was one of the most lucrative in uic Dominion. Ho stressed X": service the Government had given Die people as the result of its housing policy, the reduction of hours of work, and education. Ho went on to deal with A. J. Cronin’s book, “The Citadel,” citing cases quoted in" the book of heavy charges levied by medical men oil patients. New Zealand doctors, he said, were no better and no worse than those overseas, and it was to protect tho people from becoming involved in debt to the medical men that the Social Security Act had been