THE FEDERATION COMMISSION.

Lyttelton Times, Volume CV, Issue 12429, 19 February 1901, Page 3

THE FEDERATION COMMISSION.

THE SITTING IN CHRISTCHURCH. THE FIRST DAY. The Commission appointed to. inquire into the question cvf New Zealand federating with Australia commenced its fitting in the Provincial Council Chambers at 10 u.m. yesterday. The Hon Colonel Pitt, M.L.C., presided, and there were also present the Eon C. G. Bowen, M.L.C., and . Messrs. J. Robert?, G.M.G., T. W. Leys, W. S. IMdy H. Beauchamp and C. M. Luke. The Hon • W. J. Steward took his seat at eleven o’clock, and the Hon Captain Russell' d'id so at 3 p.m. George G. Stead,- -a. merchant in ■ Christchurch, was the first witness. He stated that he had resided in New Zcaalnd for thirty-four years and a half, and took an' interest in the question of Federation. He had come to the conclusion that if the principal benefit looked for by the local Federalists was an increased market for New Zealand products, the result would be disappointing. There would bo very little hope of a material increase in the amount of exports to Australia, as that country would supply its own requirements to a great extent. At present New Zealand did not export any oats to Victoria. The export of wheat to New South Wales had also fallen off, and was now almost ml. Victoria could now produce oats almost ,as cheaply as New Zealand could. Freetra.de with Australia, would not meet the anticipations of many people. Generally speaking, Australia! was producing butter, cheese, hams and other articles that New Zealand formerly sent over there. No doubt Federation would facilitate trade, but not to any great extent. ' The tendency of Federation, would be to bring the rate of wages in this colony to the level of: those in Australia. Federation would 1 , he thought, probably bring about an increase in taxation in this colony. He thought that the social legislation in this colony during the past few years had been for the benefit of the workers, and Federation would not be to their advantage. Any legislation that improved the conditions of the workers was for the benefit of the community, and if Federation were brought about social legislation would be retarded. The distance would also cause New Zealand to suffer in the event of Federation. He did not think that, in the event of Federation, Australian. wheat would! come into competition with Canterbury wheat in the North Island. The flour-making quality of Australian, wheat was unquestionably better than that of New Zealand wheat. It was, however, cheaper to produce wheat in New Zealand than in Australia. The difference ini quality would counterbalance the difference in cost of production, but not to a considerable extent. The difference an price, however, would be a means of retaining for the South Island the North Island trade. There would be competition, but it would not be of such a nature as to “ wipe out ” the South Island. He did not think that the present duty was needed. The seasons in. Australia did affect our exports. The Australians were now producing what New Zealand produced, but it would be very long, before. Australia was able to do away entirely with New 1 Zealand potatoes and onions. If the Commonwealth was the chief borrower, it should borrow money for purposes in connection with our land policy and so. forth. That would be fair, though it was probable that the financial policy of a Federation including New Zealand would not be favourable to this colony. As to defence, if a broad scheme were adopted, it would probably be to the advantage of this colony, but the advantage would pot be sufficient to warrant New Zealand federating. He thought that the South African war 'had shown thao we could defend ourselves on shore, if ■ attacked, - and, of course, .even now we were associated with Australia with regard to naval defence. On the. whole, however, he thought that New Zealand would rather benefit than suffer from a defensive point of view if Federation took place. He would,’ not say that , Federation would be the cause of a reduction in wages, though that would be the tendency. Even though the position of the workers in Australia, was brought to a level of the workers in New Zealand, the latter would not benefit much by Federation, though they, would have the sentimental satisfaction of seeing the Australian workers in a better position than previously. If Federation took place, New Zea-' land, in his opinion, would continue to manufacture articles which were • being manufactured! at present. This colony would continue to supply its own market, but would, not be able to carry on its industries at such a cheap rate as to supply the Australian market. He thought that South Africa promised New Zealand l a more satisfactory market than the Australian market. The principal difficulty in this connection was the question of freight. If the freight from New Zealand was the same as that from Australia, there would be an excellent market in South Africa for New- Zealand’s products. Though, in course of time, Victoria and! New South Wales would become almost independent of New Zealand, there would' be certain years, such as those of’ droughts, when the Commonwealth would have to take this colony’s produce.' In his opinion, a reciprocal treaty would be better than Federation, and he was, on the whole, against New Zealand federating. W. Reece, ’ iron merchant, Mayor of Christchurch, stated that he had considered the. general aspect of 'Federation relationship* to commerce in New -Zealand. The financial question’alone was • sufficient ■ to deter Neat* Zealand from" joining dt present. New Zealand’s taxation, at .present was as much as she could bear.-As to defence, this colony looked mainly' to the Imperial Navy, and it ;was too far-away from a naval base to tempt any Power to attack it, and they had seen in - South Africa how difficult it would be to make such an attack with success. , The present tendency was to reduce Customs duties and make taxation more direct, and he could not help thinking that certain industries in this colony would be placed in jeopardy if it federated. He did not think that Australia could be looked; upon as a permanent market for certain articles. Under a reciprocal agreement, products could be exchanged between the colony and the Commonwealth. The financial question, however, was so much involved that, in his opinion, New Zealand should wait until grave nmtfers now being-discussed were settled. He did not think that the Commonwealth would take reprisals against this Colony if the latter did- not join. The principal benefit from Federation, he thought, would be a sentimental feeling. There would not be any chance of the iron manufactures in New Zealand competing with those in Australia, unless they took the form of special machines. On the whole, the industries of New Zealand, including the woollen industry, would suffer by the colony federating. ]rlc was afraid that it would be useless to hope that, dn the event of Federation, wages in Australia would be brought to the level of those in this colony. With regard to the raising of loans, he thought that, even if the colony federated, money-lenders at Home would consider its position individually, and not in connection with the other States 1 . He did nob think that the 1200 miles which would separate the colony from the seat of the Commonwealth Government was a very important consideration in the question of Federation, Hugo Priedlander stated that he was a grain and wool merchant, of Ashburton, which was one of the largest agricultural districts in the colony. He was notin a position to speak with regard, to details, but, speaking generally, wpuld say that it would be better to leave well alone. If New Zealand federated -the colony would lose many of her public men, a- vast sheet of water would militate against ite interests L looked

;ng power would be against it. As far as Ms own business was concerned, he doubted whether the colony would be affected if it remained out of the Federation. lit dry. seasons I,he Federal States would have to coino to New Zealand for certain articles. He had not the slightest hesitation in saying, that,, unless the people in Auckland stuck to the Canterburv people, the; latter, in the event of Federation,, would lose the whole wheat trade with the North .Island. There would be ■ no gain to compensate agriculturists for the competition that would set in. with Federation, and agricul- | turists would also,suffer from the dislocation of industries that would .take place. Even, if New Zealand did not federate, lie thought that it .would still, export oats to Fremantle and Now South -Wales. ■ If a reasonable freight could be secured it would pay New Zealand to ship oats do London. Australia was not,a good market- for .wheat. He was in favour of. reciprocity if s the colony stood out of the Federation., He had exported produce'to South Africa, anil the enterprise had been successful. He thought that it would pay the colony to subsidise a line of steamers to South Africa, even though the trade at the outset was small. It was a curious thing that, by means of freight arrangements, the Victorian people could come to this colony, pay a good price for its oats, take them to Victoria, tranship them, send them over to South Africa, -and compete there against tire New Zealand exporters of the same article. The Commission adjourned- at 1 p.m., and resumed at 2.30 p.m. David Thomas stated that he was an. auctioneer -and grain merchant of Ashburton, and had been in New Zealand for twenty- ’ six years. He had given a great deal of thought to the question of Federation, and he did not think that it was advisable for New Zealand to. join the Federation, the principal objection being in connection with the financial aspect of the question. If New Zealand joined it would be running itself into' a’ noose, from which- it untight not be able to withdraw. He had lived for about twenty years in Australia,. and was convinced that New Zealand was raising a distinct race of people, and the distinction would become greater as time went on. By Federation, New Zealand industries as a tvhole would suffer, though he thought that the woollen manufactures would be able to hold their own. A reciprocal treaty would be much more to the purpose than Federation. The proposed change in taxation would be against the interests of the colony. He did not think that if New Zealand stood out of the Federation it would lose the Sydney market. If New Zealand kept out of the .Federation, its position, with regard to defence would be -as good as if it joined. If there was Freetrade between. New Zealand! ■ and Australia, the general trade of the West Coast would revert to Victoria, except in times of drought. Federation would not make much difference to the onion trade, Edward William Roper, a merchant in Christchurch, stated that he had lived in the colony for thirty-eight years. He had studied the question of Federation-, and was very strongly opposed to New Zealand joining under the terms of the Commonwealth, Act. Ho could not* see that there was any advantage likely to come to New Zealand if it federated. He had gone fully into the question before the Canterbury Chamber of Commerce, and the remarks he had made on the subject had been published. It seemed to him that Federation should he-' considered on a very much higher ground than the mere extension or lessening of the colony’s markets. At the request of the Chairman Mr Roper then read the address he bad given, af the annual meeting of the Canterbury Chamber of Commerce, the special meeting held to discuss the subject, and! the congress of Chambers of Commerce. In reply to questions, the witness stated if the colony joined -the Commonwealth, in his opinion, its undertakings in connection with developing, the country would! be interfered! with. Australia would have to face the same difficulties as were faced by the United States?, and would overcome them. But that .was a consideration; for the Australian- States, not for New Zealand, where another class of people was growing up. If the New Zealanders- had to choose betaveen forfeiting independence and doing business with Australia, he would say let the New Zealanders stand to their independence. He was sure that it was -to Australia’s interest to trade with New Zealand, woielf was the garden, of the south. In the course of four or five generations the New Zealander, he thought, would- differentiate greatly from -the Australian. He would go as far as to say that if New Zealand joined the Federation it would, a few generations hence, be fighting for its. independence. There was a restless and ambitious people here, with little repose when they had an idea that they were being wronged. Given wrongs through ignorance, these people would rise, and he did 1 , not know what would be the cost. He did not think it was possible that white men could work like the blacks in the sugar plantations of Queensland. The colour question would certainly rise up. He had travelled to some extent, and could not mention, any tropical or semitropical country which white people could colonise, though they might occupy it. George Thomas Bopth, a manufacturer of agricultural implements in Christchurch, stated that his firm employed 100 hands, and ■ had been in existence- for eighteen years. So far -as his sentiments, were concerned, he was in fa.vour of Federation, on ( broad, general principles. He belived that Australasian Federation would be in tbe direction of Imperial Federation, and Imperial Federation in the direction of Anglo-Saxon Federation. He had read the Commonwealth Bill, and he did not think there was anything in it that would .he likely to take away this colony’s independence, .if it joined.' Even if there was a danger of the Commonwealth taking over certain functions such as this colony-did" not* desire to part with, the smaller Stqtes would he in a better position than the larger States, such as Victoria and New South Wales. There was a tendency for New Zealand to become narrow-minded and- insular, and Federation would save the colony from that danger. It would hold a very prominent ■place in the Federation. The colony would gain a great deal by trade if it joined. Tariff considerations had considerable effect on trade, but figures showed that there had been a considerable and steady increase in the volume of exports from this colony to Australia during the last few years. Many of the articles -of export were the products of the farm, and it was to the interest of the colony to encourage farming pursuits. While ho was in favour of Federation on general principles, he required further information regarding the particular Federation in, question. The colony would be in a .better position to come to a decision when the labours of the . Commission were over, and when further information on the subject was available. No Australian, goods of the nature iris firm manufactured were received here. In fact, he sent goods to Australia and beat the Australians on their own ground. If New Zealand had free ports in Australia, with a tariff against the rest of the world, the trade could be developed considerably. At present, however, the trade with Australia was not increasing Local and American competition had almost closed the market against this colony. He did not think that this colony would ever be a great manufacturing country. It would manufacture for its own use, but not, to any great extent, for export. If this colony had a right of entry into Australia that was possessed by no other country, it would probably develop a moderate export trade. If, on the other hand, Australia erected a tariff wall against New Zealand, it would do its best to supply its own wants, and would probably succeed. At 6 p.m. the Commission adjourned till 10 a.m. next day.