NATIONAL ANNUITIES.

Dominion, Volume 4, Issue 966, 5 November 1910, Page 6

NATIONAL ANNUITIES.

SCHEME DEBATED IN THE HOUSE. . "ONL7 FOR SMALL WAGEEARNERS." INTERESTING POINTS RAISED. There was an important discussion in the House of Representatives last night on the National Provident Fund Bill, which came on for consideration in Committee. Clause 8 defines who may be contributors to the fund. It provides that at the time of the first contribution the contributor must be a resident in New Zealand, be over 10 years of age, and under 15 years of age,and be in receipt of an income of not more than ,£2OO. In regard to this clause, Mr. Jas. 'Allen sought further details. Tho Premier . said that a contributor did not require to reside permanently in New Zealand. The position would be similar to that in the case of an insurance policy; all that was necessary was that the contributions should be maintained. Mr. Massey: What if a contributor never comes back? Sir Joseph Ward: I don't think people earning less than will leave, such an attractive country as New Zealand. Mr. 1 Allen: Would you agree to make the schema universal? Sir Joseph: No; it would break down before it had a fair trial. An Anomaly. Mr. Massey said he did not agree witix Mr. Allen that the scheme should bo made universal. He believed that in time joining , the scheme would be made compulsory. To his mind it would be wrong to the taxpayers to allow people who had no idea of remaining in the Dominion to have the benefits of the scheme. It had to be borne in mind tuai tho State had to pay 25 per cent, of the total contributions. Ho hoped that the proposal would be reconsidered.

' Mr. Wright (Wellington South) pointed out lliat people were disqualified in connection with the old age pension if they absented themselves from" Now Zealand for a period of four years. The Premier pointed, out at this stage that the board might by resolution declare that a non-resident had ceased to be a contributor.

Mr. Wright thought that the maximum amount of salary in respect of a contributor when he joined the scheme should be made =£208 —£i per week—instead of ,£2(10.

Mr. Stallworthy (Kaipara) argued that contributors who became non-residents should be debarred the benefits in the case of incapacity and the maternity benefits.

The Premier, replied that he was sony that he could not extend the maximum salary from' .£2oo' to .£2OB. It might be possible to make the extension in a few years after. He would ask that the Bill be amended in the direction of providing that a contributor who remained out of the country for two years or upwards should not, during his absence, receive any of the benefits under the scheme. Premier Does Not Forget! Mr. Luke (Wellington Suburbs) asked what would be the position in the case of students who went abroad for training, Ho alsd stated that in his opinion it would be only right to extend the maximum' income from <£200 to .£2OB. The Premier said that _he would. have special nrovision made in the case of students," etc. > If the maximum income were increased, the scale of contributions would have to be increased. He couiu not agree to the proposal. Had Mr. Luke forgotten that he voted in favour of doing away with the surtax the other night? Mr. Luke: I thought that you. had forgotten that. ~ Sir Joseph: Qh, no;,I have ,not. Mr. Luke: Well I don't regret my "vote; Mr. M'Laren (Wellington Bast) said it would have been desirable if the scheme could have been extended to those, earning over £i . a week. However, he wished to see the scheme commenced on safe lines, and not overburdened.

Mr. Hine (Stratford) suggested that the ratio of State contributions should be reduced in the case of contributors who were able to pay for the maximum benefits under the scheme, and that it should be increased in the case of those who could afford only the minimum benefits under the Act.

The clause passed without amendment. It was deciied, on the motion of the Premier, to insert a new clause to . the effect that any person who ceases to. be a contributor may be readmitted as a contributor on such conditions as the board determines.

Friendly Society Members. As Tegards Clause 15, which provides certain benefits during incapacity in certain cases, , Mr. Wright (Wellington South) asked if, it were intended that . intending contributors should be required. to : undergo a medical examination. The Premier said that the board had power to require such an examination. Mr. Stallworthy ' (Kaipara) referred •to tho fact that Sub-Clause 7 provided that no allowance should exceed the amount of any period of incapacity the amount, of his pecuniary less. He might ask, Would a member of friendly society who received say ,£1 per week during incapacity be debarred from payment under the scheme? If so, the scheme would handicap such societies. The Premier said that he did not believe that many would belong to both funds. . . - .

Mr. Malcolm (Clutha) said he thought Mr. Wright had pointed out a very serious point when he referred to tho medical examination of .entrants to the fund He thought- there should be an examination. Mr. Wright said that if the Prime Minister thought the scheme was safe as it stood he must be satisfied. The Prime Minister .sqid he did not propose to put restrictions on the Bill as suggested. He did not think they should discriminate as business companies did. An Important Amendment. Mr. Stallworthy (Kaipara) moved a provise that benefits accruing to a contributtor from a friendly, society should not be taken into consideration as mitigating his pecuniary loss in case of incapacity. The Prime Minister agreed to accept the proviso which was adopted. Herries (Tauranga) thought the samo argument advanced above would apply to sick or accident pay from a union.

The Prime Minister said he was prepared to protect friendly societies. Sir. Herries: A union is a sort of friendly society.

Sir Joseph AVard: I am not going to agree to do this. I am not going to smash the scheme up or turn the Bill into, a charitable institution. A clause was added (at tho instance of the Prime Minister) to the effect that there shall be appointed one member of the board to be superintendent of the fund. . Another amendment was mane to mate provision so as to bring the maternity clauscs of the Bill into operation 12 months after the passing of tho Act. Position as to Absence from New Zealand. In order to meet a difficulty raised earlier in the discussion it was resolved, on the motion of the Prime Minister,' that 110 contributor shall bo entitled to any benefit under the Act unless he satisfies the board that he has not at any time since lie became a contributor been absent from New Zealand a' longer period than two years at one time, or in tho aggregate for five years, provided that the absence of any contributor .for the purposes of education if it does not exceed five years shall not be deemed to bo absence within the meaning of the clause. Mr. .Tas. Alien (Bruce) moved as an amendment that every contributor who remains out of the Dominion for over one year or upwards shall, for the subsequent period allowed, be required to make up the quota to his contribution which would otherwise be paid by the State.

The Prime Minister declined to accept the amendment.

Mr. Malcolm (Clutha) suggested that it would be only proper to withdraw the incapacity and maternity benefits in the case of non-resident contributors

The Prime Minister said that he would prefer that contributors who remained out of the Dominion for more than two years should not be allowed any of the benefits.

The amendment was rejected by 32 votes to 18.

Air. Malcolm (Clutha) then proposed as a now clause to the effect that no contributor should draw benefits or _ medical allowances whilst living out of New Zealand. The Prime Minister contended that such a provision would not be fair to old contributors who desired to make a trip out of New Zealand. Mr. Malcolm: But how are you to tell whether a *claim would be genuine. Sir Joseph: The board must be satisfied on the point. ' • Upon a division the clause was lost by 28 votes to 15. The Bill was then reported with amendments. t