LETTERS TO THE EDITOR.

Dominion, Volume 1, Issue 286, 27 August 1908, Page 4

LETTERS TO THE EDITOR.

DR. TUDOR JONES'S LETTER. ' Sir, —It is difficult to answer a letter liko that of Dr. Tudor Jones. No self-r<"spect-ing mail would seel; to copy his style. Ho' speaks about "Paragraph in newspapers and extracts in magazines" not doing for a teacher in religion; and about "stray quotations from'tho one-sided editor of tho 'British Weekly,' and tho wholo tono of : his letter is in keeping with this. And bo. it observed that I did not refer to the "British Weekly" nor give a singlo extract from a newspaper nor a magazine. Instead of that I gave tho names of a number of the most distinguished theologians in Britain, and stated that I named them because'' their works \yero on my shelves. Of course, as a student of tho 'Free Church of Scotland, with snch men as Bruce, Drummoikl, Douglas, etc., among my professors, tlioso critical questions about which Dr. ' Jones descants so largely have been familiar to me sinfce student days. And Dr. Jones's letter suggests the idea that ho lias but a superficial acquaintance with tlio works and the attitude of a number of the men of whom lie writes so freely. Ho speaks of Dr. Orr as a compiler. If ho had studied his "Progress of lie would know that Dr. Orr, who was for years a professor of Church history, has.a right to speak_ on this question as an authority, on the history of dogma. And if Dr. Jones, had read somo more of Dr. Dod's works,, such as his volumes on John, and his commentary on John in the Expositors Greek li'o would have known that his contribution to tho discussion of the Atonement in tho Christian world not only gavo one sido of his teaching on this great subject,; and that ho teaches the other"—tho objective; side, , when occasion, requires. But even the; articlo referred to shows that clearly enough to tho .man who is really familiar with those discussions. When Dr. Jones makes such' statements about Principals Forsyth and Garvie as that "they believe in-tho Atonemont, but thoy do not believe it on tho same grounds as Mr. Jolly believes," I must say that it i's" incorrect. I have studied their views in their books, and hold them on tho same grounds that they do. " ' But one thing in Dr. Jones's letter is positively amazing. 1 He takes it for granted that one cannot adopt free viows oii questions of Biblical criticism and also hold or-, thodbx views oil Christian doctrine. This aspect of his letter leaves the impression that his knowledge on this subject must be. rather limited. ' Tho acceptance of tho eriti-' cal position, especially in relation to the Old Testament, _ and a frank acceptance of ordinary Christian doctrine is very common. This was the position of Dr. Robertson Smith. When charged with heresy on account of his critical views lie 1 at once cluimed that ho could sign "the Confession of Faith con amoro. And'this was so well known that he was jiever libelled for heresy. A study of Driver's Genesis, and of his splendid article on Propitiation in Hastings Bible Dictionary, and the notes ho contributed to the Oxford Conference on Priesthood and Sacrifice, show that ho occupies substantially tho same position. And a study of Dr. Patcrson's splendid articlo on Sacrifice in Hastings Bible Dictionary shows that he takes the same position. This attitude was common with Scottish theological students in my timo, arid ii so, common t-o-day, that one wonders how much Dr. Jones knows of tho teaching of. many our ablest living theologians, when ho writes as if criticalviows of tho Scriptures and doctrinal orthodoxy wore incompatible. This combination, gives tho attitude of Hastings Bible Diction-', ary—a work which gives the high-water I mark in theological scholarship. Its critical. 1 articles by scholars of tho highest rank take tho critical position, and its- doctrinal articles take tho "position of liberal orthodoxy. On tho Atonement, the subject with which wo aro dealing, the articles Atonement, Propitiation, Sacrifice, Priests in tho New Testament, all by distinguished theolgians, tako ; the position that our Lord offered Himself as an expiatory sacrifice for tho sins of men, and that this sacrifice is the ground of our forgiveness and acceptance with God. Your readers will observe' that this was tho very doctrino that was'under discussion! when Dr. Jones said that "Theories which, were dead in all tho seats of learning of tho Old World seem to have come hero to flourish." Sly reply was to name nino distinguished professors in four of tho chief seats of learning in.Britain whose books I had beside me, who all teach tho expiatory doctrine of the Atonement. To that Dr. Jones rosupplies by ill-mannercd.insimiations that my knowledge of tho subject is limited to extracts'from magazines arid-newspapers, followed- by somo rambling talk about higher criticism, as if that had anything to do-with the question.

'In challenging his statements I dicl so on the ground that his words would "lead tho ordinary reader to suppose that those who hold the doctrine of through Christ's expiatory sacrifice aro ignorant of present day thought." .Ho cannot deny that was so. The names I have fjiven, and tho attitude of .Hastings Bible Dictionary, and the list of fifteen distinguished theologians from the Anglican, the Congregational, the Presbyterian, and tho Methodist Churches, Who mot in Oxford, in ,-1899, under tho presidency of Professor Sanday, to discuss this among other questions, show how for .from fact is Dr. Jones's statement that .these theories are dead in the scats of learning in the Old World. Headers of the report of this conference, edited by Dr. Sanday, can only bo amazed at Dr. Jones's assertions. If these groundless assertions are a sample of Dr. Jones's preaching one can only wonder at intelligent people listening to him.—l am, etc., ISAAC JOLLY. Palnierston North, August 25.

THE HUTt GAS QUESTION.. Sir, —Just a few lines by way of final reply to Mr. Ward. I am pleased that Mr. Ward recognises! tho "sweet reasonableness" of i'ctonq in th 6 inatter of supplying gas, should tho Hutt fail to have their gasworks completed at the termination of tho existing agreement. liutho^matter-of tho suggested agreement for seven years, Petorio has looked at the questioi) purely as a business proposition. It surely. ought to. be obvious to Mr. Ward that wo aro not at .all likely to ask our ratepayers, to sanction an £8000 loan unless wo could Show that we-' had some justification for so : doing.' It may be, as Mr. Ward suggests, that tho Hutt officers-have-'discussed the tar-ques-tion with our officers,, but if so, apparently to no purpose. :My statement under' this head is therefore true.' , Mr. Ward is "satisfied" that tho portion of mv letter condemning tho"Littlq Pedlington" spirit is "very dignified," with. sorqe qualifications. This boing so, I can scarcely quarrel further with Mr. Ward. Wishing him, and his follow councillors a happy ..issue out of all their troubles.—l am, etc., • 'J. W. M'EWAN. August 21. •

SLAUGHTERING AND CRUELTY. Sir—ln reforring to the Bill for tho Prevention of Cruelty to Animals, I fool sura that Mr. Laurenson would' not have attempted to introduce it had ho known tho circumstances connected with tho case. , No doubt exists but that the Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals aro the promoters of Mr. Lauronson'S Bill. Following tho example of their parent society in England—tlio Royal Humane—they are introducing measures and attempting to mako them law that will be oppressive to certain members of our community, without getting tho desired result of less cruelty. In 1895 tho Royal Humane Society. in England objected to tho manner or method carried cut by Jews in slaughtering their cattle. Key applied for a commission' to be appointed to inquire into tho question. "Does tho Jewish method of killing cause unnecessary pain or suffering to animals while being slaughtered?" There wore two persons appointed, who were veterinary surgeons. I will not discuss their verdict, but I think that, had' a commission been appointed "consisting of, members of the legal and. medical professions, to act in conjunction with the vcterin-1 ary surgeons, with power to call evidence and to examine ' witnesses, somo light would liavo ,bcon thrown upon a subject which is at tlio present time affecting all civilisation. Statistics from New York and London show that ; thc mortality caused by cancer and tuberculosis among tho Jews in those two

cities is very low indeed compared with records taken of tho Gentiles. "It appears that the chief objection raised by the Humane Societies is the so-called "casting," but it is rc-lly nothing but turning the beast over previous to having its throat cut. Tho animal is turned on an indiarubbcr matting, which breaks the fall. If pain was caused, the carcass would show bruises. Tho proposed Bill requires that ail animals killed) lor humanconsumption shall first bo stunned. The Jews object, and will consider tile Bill, if made law, an infringement of religious liberty. Let us bo careful what wo do, and leave the oppression of the Jews to tho. Russians. Tho Jews comply with God's, command, which has been given so often, that "the man that cateth tho. blood shall surely dio," and it is this command that the Jew is bo careful to obey. In our usual way of slaughtering, tho animal is first! stunned, then bled by the pnceSs of cutting' ono large vein only. With tho Jew, : tho animal is first turned over on-tlio ground by tying its leg, then the throat is cut, severing every artery and vein, and nearly severing the head from the body. Tho spiiial cord is not disturbed, and at tho moment the throat is cut, tho animal 1 continues to exert its muscles to tho utmost extent. Tho outcome of the struggle is that tho blood is driven towards the heart, and by it out of tho cut in the throat. If tho animal is stunned tho heart is weakened and the nerves are deadened; in fact; if the animal was not bled after being shot, it would certainly die. If tho heart is affected, it loses its power to throw out tho blood. To test as to whether blood remains in beef, soak four or five pounds in- a gallonof pure water for threo hours. ' The blood will be drawn out by tho water (tho 1 process will improve'the flavour of the beef when corned, proving that the juices are not withdrawn). Place the water in a warm placo! for a few hours, and it will emit a putrid; stench, which is caused by tho blood, whichdecays quickly._ , Blood was iiscd in ancient 1 times as a poison,, as it was discovered it' •was difficult to digest. In England, many years ago, when scurvy was prevalent there, -, the cause was attributed to the consumption' of blood.- One of tho many causes of uric: v acid—tho forerunner of gout- and rheumatism—is the consumption of blood in tho' moat wo consume, left in by tho inefficient, manner of slaughtering. The Dutch Gov-: eniment have decided. that all meat killed for preserving for uso in the Army shall be slaughtered by the Jewish method, and tho German authorities, who on:e wcro fighting against the method, havo adopted it, owing to the advantages derived from it, for the' better preservation of their meat for use in the army;.' ' The Jewish method was adopted thirty-! five years ago hero in New Zealand for sheep! and small animals, and is still carried out 1 sucpcssfully at .all the freezing works and! abattoirs in tho Dominion.— I am, etc., ! H. S. PHILPOTT, i St. Albans. (A slaughterman of 18 years' standing.)/ August 22. j

CHURCH UNION, Sir,—The first paragraph of "Phylax's" letter in yesterday's issue is' pointless. He had asked nio whether tho "simple concession" of which he had spoken would bo likely to be agreed, to, and I gave him my opinion that it would not. _ It is not. improbable that his interpretation of the suggestion of, tho Lambeth Conference, and his explanation of tho undoubted fact that tho "Scotch. Divines " of 1610 woro liot re-ordained before being consccrated bishops, aro alike erroneous. ''l^hylax' l replies ito my refercnco to tho; enjoining of prayer for tho Church of S-cot-; land (then, as now, Presbyterian) merely! ,by asserting that it is a "fiction.',' Favourite, word with him this when pressed for proof!': As to tho Reformed Churches of the Con-i tinent of Europe, ho admits my contention, but pleads ' there were " special circumstances." What does it matter even -if there*., were? . His assertion was that Presbyterian ortlihatio'n liad-iievei? .Been'accepted. Ho is silont regarding my reference to Ulster. Both Mr. Milligan and "Phylax" had disclaimed Canon Henson as an authority. I thereupon referred them to Bishop Moule, and_ pointed out that, in his "Outjines of Christian Doctrine," ho had' made great coneessiohs to Prcsbyterianis'm. In his book Dr. Moule states:—"The. title bishop (episcopus, "overseer") does not in tho New. Testament denote a minister ruling overi other ministers; this is generally admitted. Tho New Testament 'episcopus' is tho over-, .seer of- not, tlie shepherds, but tho flock. Ona local church might havo _ several such' 'bishops.' ._ There is reason to ! think that the episcopate rather grew out of; presbyterato, in the order of Providence,' than otherwise." _ "Phylax's" comment on : these and other similar statements by Bishop Moule is, "I havo read tho passages referred to, and find that they do not holp 'Presbyterian.' • Put them into their .historical setting, and tho'fiction will vanish into thin air.' Onco moro ( that word "fiction"! "Phylax" has read these and other passages of a liko kiiid in tho book, and yet in the faco of them he can assert that Presbyterianism was "the invention" of Calvin! As a matter of fact in somo respects it is older than Christianity. Before passing from Dr. Moule's work, 1 would commend the following quotation therefrom to tho serious consideration of "Phylax"-:—"In view of the sublimely spiritual character of-tho Church in its true idea, and of tho revealed immediate union of each member with tho Head, by faith, and of the rcservo of the Now Testament, we are not authorised to regard even apostolic organisation as. a. matter of the first order in such a sense as 'that' we should presume to unchurch Christian communities, holding tho apostolic faith of God in Christ, but not fully organised on what wo believo to bo the apostolic model. And wo should tako good care not to develop that model for ourselves into unlawful proportions; as in tho theory that the bishop is tho normal channel of grace to tho lower clergy, and tile peoplo." Your correspondent directs mo to study tho Prefaco to tho Ordinal. I have already dono so, and would advise him not to try j and read into it what is not there. Does it! necessarily imply the non-recognition of mini- ' storial orders of churches other than the Anglican? ' His first assertion refuted, "Phylax" en-', deavours t& defend his second by creating a diversion. Ho tries'to fasten on to Presby- : tcrianism a doctrine akin to the 0110 he holds: respecting Episcopacy, and ho wants mo to do for tho former what I feel'suro ho cannot do for tho latter. I havo a belief regarding Divine Right and Apostolic Succession which I am prepared to defend, but it is a very different 0116 from his. 'My view does not stand' in the way of the union of tho churches; his docs. He rejects our ministerial orders, and asks me to show why they should bo accepted. But. it is for him to show why they should bo rejected. .Well, then, let him address himself to what Dr. Moule, in tho quotation given above, calls "the theory that the bishop is the normal channel of .graco to the lower clergy and the peoplo," and inform us whether no believes in thin channel of grace, and how he proves its existence. Let "Phylax" show us why he differs from the Bishop of Durham, and from thousands of his fellow-churchmen. Wo want him to let us know tho grounds on which ho holds that an episcopally ordained ministry is absolutely essential to tho oxistenco of a valid church. Let "Phylax" tell us precisely what ho means b,v the "Apostolic Succession" and tho "Historic Episcopate," and especially how he justifios his belief in them. Wo require him to traco tho connection between a present-day bishop of tho Anglican Church and the Apostles, and to show conclusively that there is not one solitary break in tho chain. The task is a great one, it is greater than great. Can 110 fulfil it? Wo shall see. . I shall havo something to say later, in reply to tho kindly letter of Mr. Milligan.— I am, etc., PRESBYTERIAN. August 21.

; Sir, —■" A Genuino Catholic "■ now rushes into the fray. His wholo letter is founded 011 the assumption that .whatever the I'ope says is right, Hence as tlio Pope lias issued a Bull, condemning the orders of the Church of England 110 is perfectly satisfied. _ I liavo at present 110 intention of discussing the points in the Bull. It has been effectually replied to. Tlio Hull was an interested production, the real question being whether an approval would not encourage, the Churchmen or England in their independence.

But what is a-" Catholic " properly so called? In late years lie only was'a Liberal who said ( just what Mr. Seddoii said, so I suppose, / according; to " G.C.," a! " Catholic-" is ono who follows the Pope; Now Dr. Littledalo has shown that the succession of Popes lia3 ' icon irretrievably broken.' ' There' can then bo 110 "Genuine Catholics" in "G.C.'s" senso of the word. 1 observe ho calls us "Anglicans." I am not going to complain, though I don't Jike the word,'and he must u°t> com P' a ' n I use the - parallel word Romanist" without obnoxious intent. I ccrtainly cannot call him simply a."Catholic," nor his club the " Catholic Club," any mora than I would call a particular scct. "tho Christians," bccauso they choose to pivo themselves the name, aiid, therefore, liko our friends, win the name from the man in street. Jjost of " G.C.'s " letter is of so reckless a character that ono has hardly patience to follow him through. The historic succession was not broken in England, as lie assorts,, aiid tho ancient orders were not done with. The Church did not abandon her Catholic position, bnt retained and strengthened it, and remained the samo Church. ' "G.C." may study tho Preface to the Book of Common Prayer, and he will find that no new Church was founded. The new Church that afterwards appeared was that from Rome. As far as wo are concerned, papal decisions settlo nothing. The Pope may say with " G.C." that our bishops are no bishops. We reply that they are more so than those of Rome. Tho Popo is their only bishop. Ha has absorbed tho powers of all the Roman... bishops and they are merely his lieutenants,-. -I am, etc., PHYLAX. August 21. [Portions of this letter havo been omitted, tho writer having strayed into a branch or tho subject likely to lead to heaied controversy. with small hopo of any good resulting.]

THE NEW PARLIAMENTARY BUILDINGS. Sir,—l suppose that as the M.P.'s have rotui'ncd from Auckland and resumed work/ ono_ of tho main, subjects which will demand .their attention will be tho site and nature of .tho new premises for tho accommodation, of the. legislators. As regards the site, I have nothing to say, but I venture to express an opinion, as a- professional man, a3 to the nature of the buddings. - It seems to mo that the following joints need considera- ■ tion, viz., moderation of cost, strength, durability, safety from fire, aiid safety from earthquakes. .... Now, it so happens that Providence haa supplied New Zealand with. abundance of material in our pumice deposits, which strik--mgly fulfils all those conditions except ■ the second, which may be met by artificial means. The great skyscraper buildings in America are being constructed of steel. framings .enolosod in concrete, and though we do- not' at' .present require structures of such height, yet tho 1 same principle might be employed .with advantage heie. In,the early days of. Wanganui many chimneys' were built -of roughly-squared blocks of pumice cemented together with a mortar composed of clay and fresh cow dung, and when the great earthquako of January 23, 1855, occurred, it was 1 noticed that not one of those chimneys had sustained any damago, though, with • the single exception of a large double one, only about 4ft. high, all the brick ones, and ail tho brick buildings in tho place were shaken to pieces? The lightness of the pumice had saved it from destruction. A house of twostoreys built with similar materials was also • uninjured. Mr. G. F. Allen, an architect who resided in Wanganui for many years,-al-ways advocated the use of pumice as a building material in a -land so subject to earthquakes as Now Zealand, but people seemed afraid to be tho first to employ it 1 Pumico 'is also an almost perfect nonconductor of heat, and, therefore,' is used for insulating tho buildings of freezing works, but if alone is too soft to withstand a heavy crushing strain, and would therefore need to be reinforced ill some'way.; A concrete of pumice and lime was patented in 1905 as' "a fire-and-carthquako resisting material," and is less in weight "'by- from thirty-five to fifty per cent, than brick work of the same dimensions. Tn Germany bricks are nowr. being made of pumico on account of' their ilightness, despite the . fact that the material has to be imported, from Italy. _ It is broken ! small and then thoroughly mixed with thin mortar, as little as possible of tho latter .boing employed. Tho mixture is then cast into bricks, by hand, in the ordinary way. ■I understand, too, that ordinary gravel concrete is boing used as a building material, in Wellington, so that there would be no difficulty ill finding men capable 'of •: using pumice-concrete. . r I would suggest that the walls of the new Parliamentary Buildings should bo formed of ■studs of iron piping from one to three inches in diameter, according to their position in the building and the weight that would rest upon them. Pipes are both lighter andstiffer than rods. These pipes should be braced together diagonally with iron wire at short intervals, and the whole then encased in a casing of pumiced concrete. Such* a wall would bo extremely light, and at the' same timo strong, while it would bo quite impervious to fire. In fact, the walls might be made thinner than usual, and thus save space. All mouldings would,'of course, be. cast as parts of . tho walls themselves, and. thus be inexpensive. Tho tops and bottoms, .of tho pipes should he inserted in longitudinal shoes or troughs of an L shapo, so as to distribute the strain equally.. As ordinary reinforced concrete is now being used for - beams and .flooring joists pumice coucreta might bo employed in the same way, wir« being used as the reinforcing material, but that is a detail. How far, and in what way, it could bo used, instead of boards, foi flooring could only bo ascertained by expert encc,' but I think such floors would need tc be poyered with'linoleum, or .carpet'to protect them from wear and tear. If tho flooring joists of the upstair rooms are of timber, tho ceilings of the lower rooms should be or a plaster of fine pumice sand and lime, as being both lighter and more fire-resisting than ordinary plaster. Limo binds pumico better than cement does.' Pumice concrete takes paint readily. • . 1 have thought it worth, while to write you tho above remarks with a view to drawing tho attention of tho Public Works Department, and of our colonial architects to the subjcct. Hitherto there would have been difficulty and expense in procuring pumico inlargo quantities in Wellington as a building material; but this difficulty is now at an end, as tho Main Trunk Railway passos through, country consisting of vast mountains of it. The lightness of the material would not only facilitate transport, but also lesson exponse in handling and building.' The ir-dn frames of successive stories might be bound together with 'wire; a great object - being to mako the building [is light as possible, as a safeguard against earthquakes.— I am, etc., ' , . H. C. FIELD, C.E. Aramoho, August 13.

A MAORI MAP OF NEW ZEALAND. Sir,—ln your issuo of July 30 Mr. J. S. Ruthorford made a very valuable suggestion rogarding the compilation of a descriptive map with the Maori placc names. The compiling of such a map would not be difficult, as the original Maori place names and prominent features aro almost without excoptiou to be found upon tlio original plans of every Maori block throughout New Zealand. These plans liave in each case been used in the Native Land Courts at the original investigation of titles of tlio' Maori claimants and counter-claimants at which some of- tho_ strongest proofs of ownership in ovidente is tho. familiarity with' its rivers (awas), creeks (mangas), hills (h'iwi), mountains (maunga), burial places (urupns),. alsc tho burial boundary lines' (ngnrohe), 'with its landmarks from- point to' point:.' Each, block-of land has its main distinctive Maori name, and each internal feature also' is named. 'It would add much interest to such a map even if only tlio main Maori namo of the block was given its equivalent meaning or origin in the KnjjlisJi translation, thus preserving to- fioi .'ritv tho traditional history of a fine- nice'of people, so well worth preservation: The■'several District Survoy and-"Native Land Court"' Departments contain tho 'fullest information required to carry out Mr. Rutherfurd's sug. gestion.—l am, etc., T. W. PORTER (Colonel). , - Gisborne, August 17. ■: .. '..