SECOND BALLOT BILL.

Press, Volume LXIV, Issue 13234, 30 September 1908, Page 7

SECOND BALLOT BILL.

DISCUSSION tJN THE fIOIJSEV 4

(TRESS ASSOCJATIOS TEI.ECRAK.) ; ,? WELLINGTON, September "Sfc - Tn the House of Representatives this afternoon tho Prime Minister moved:

—"That the House disagrees with; the amendments made in the Second 'Ballot Bill by the Legislative Council, and appoints a committee consisting of Sir Wiiliam Steward, Mr Lethbridgey »nd the mover to draw up reasoiiv for so disagreeing." *- ,'.

Mr Massey said ho regretted the: Prime Minister had not given '.jUa'tea-"-. sons lor moving that motion. Ho bad hoped the Bill would bo dropped; b»it v apparently that would nut bo the o4se."v Members now understood this measure X much bolter than they bad when it Wμ ! previously before tho House, and xe£-;V Used that a hugo majority of the elee-/." tors were opposed to it entirely. In' ; order that the electors should have an y opportunity to express tbeir opinion* on tho question, ho would more tbit;the debate bo adjourned for iweiW I months. The Bill should be instead, it was to bo placed in all ita 5/ hideousuess on the Statute BookJ -K^. 1 • was reminded of the old saying "WhqiaU the gods wish to destroy they first"; make mad." The effect of tho ' pie—or want cf principle—of the BilP ■.vuiild be most injurious, and wouldS lead to all kinds or. political engineer-? ing. Air Massoy went on to niako numerous quotations, and submittedstatistics froai ixarl Blind u> show the second ballot had worked badly in - Germany. He was glad tho Press*• throughout die length and breadth of - the country had protested against tho * "gag clause. Newspapers tiid goou work m pleading tno public cattsS' and helping to form pubßo opinion* £ Liberty of speech and tho fn^tUHß : ia&' the, i'ress were constitutional tives of the people. Neither' Sir 'I*? quith nor Sir Wilfrid Laurierinor' -U&i Jeafcm would dream of gagging thoTS iress. Ltcrnal yigilanoo was the price > ot liberty, and the worst tyranny wasl 5 meft * mo ? ra % ■.Gov^rn-.^ Sir Joseph Ward said Aβ had ea the usual constitutional «?oursd, md iur Massey had adopted an one It tno • motion of; the teadefeof s ti»o Opposition wero aureed to* the - -m° US A would stultifying thcraseircT ? ihe Opposition had ibeep againiii th«% second oallot from the star!; the Opposition relied oa a vokc ■■• on the ; other their, man in.;.:;* His object bnngmg tho Bill; down y" to ensuremaiority rjile,provaamg.Oln| 'f J he; cla ««»"" raised ':z-svp£<sfrip tim, he had au orer the Dominion -tl»i v the-nßMi!tfs approved of the mea9tire.<:M forF^l gag clause, the tation had appeared in tlie:JPjeM"iu ; gard thereto, 'llie clause Aelp the-..p00r.■ in^n.: v for many men engaged • ift::Pre«| "iSpl m tins country; but iia wok m>fc nfy|Ah of them. ' tion . on- ;thejpatt ; ;'of 'the :: the Bill. Tlie Opposition tho Bill tniey •' be..agamst v their' for the' : policy,:. but ; ;,waa : . cisiug candidates , betwem lots. Ho thought, ■ dicated in. the motionfo.u^r,^WS S*a :.v-;. air:AVitford :eaid I|w : .i*|| ! .■p^e4:to,the'3ill;"4;: : ■po^;^^©^ . first ,: pla<?e^> ef ■which,-, even "if \'itiw4re/. : g ono of theJDf3Jst:Mective^fo^^Si »ent ,^Mr., '-powerful appeal: to tain tiat liberty whic> f I - fought for/in; tlio dAys-pf ... r Mr" Fraser rfbe>BiU^;itid« : «fi%ifc^o^j^p|M| ■ ■ -'»■ ■ ■tftpl fcatnro of the BiU was.th*t;-it t fW ■ teen :.yfta'«|.vV, -the :; ;V : :R^rnnffi^|?ti«lM claueo; he e»»4-'j lll ® i l a % ; fe?'^^^^ls .:wi|,j.;ell^u^Mg^Jffr:^flf|iigy^^H .-paper.-Press of ;..*Ke ;||«?M^^^HH mm ■ that"'-'he: ■ would hmo : ■W^ IS toar : : to;>nii n ? erilit e' olli. whicK;' it 'should - ; be 'a', piece 'of .W4«hine , . Vested '-w : as f "'dptx)sed-.^>'' :r fienting. and lying -ebo u^:tfigWiß^S^ ■ papers:'ought ;.not ■ .to, :P t ' ! t^wS^^H^^^m ■ "a^Bßsinate ,^ -nienii-y posed the sorcallcd -' JWj^#*>^ssSsgsi '■ courting- thfriavour.: : iot oiiKht to despiso:; i^jMA^^^^m Mr Hogg ; <hd. not of the Press was: If it were t that vas 0 pnbjic which eupporfeo <*l the primJiple'of .tiOy J ßiu;^pS^|'t?i?a« Mr Pool© eaid there a w tteJJominjo^^ Though many, papers, ■ workr--roanv-papery-Trftt«ed^^ga|i anything papers wer©4i» the hande of %9$ and working against the ; teoipjmi»»»g| form ;■;:,;; - : ■' Mr • amenotaen^^-^^^^pj fcated , by, •« J vot<*.i^.:if: ,^^p||ie - - (hi- the-, original;.- !^VffWSg| prindple; :;B^,j;bu^ol»d||« wouM 'lisagreo , tte;wiidej with which he- wa» ! ' ; in; disafoord. Ife thowffht lowing the pn'hlueatio'h .injrtoe •_smfyrol paipera of, >*statemejtti*'-«f• %&§£!£s&¥& the- .ianfcerval be co manipulated .; i principler::of I thought,-also-:; tha£Vtli». tho in." to Jtr PcoWi iKsmk oantroßed by J** thoproMbftioniKta w«re quite as as tli9 brtnrers. Hβ also objected to the 500 raajoxi*y proviso heme itnM«< out- it %raa an ucoometiturdonal neb for , * tlie Upper House to throw out an atnentlmsnt uhaminoueh lnaErtcd bj w the popufer House "with the mad© of it» own election. Mr Jam*? Allpn qnixzed tJ» Gow/t----mcint members who supported to© Bβ t thouah in their inmost heart* tow iver© oppoaed to it. Nobody loojert upon tho Bill as a statesmanlike, incisure. , r .-^ At tho crening sittrng, Mr Him* oon-unuing, said it wae consn»it wp*>rt in the lobbws* that tlio Tote -toJu».W - tho afternoon was the result of an tjinat.'on "sEven 1o tha sflg-_ porters that the divwion wa* w>, t»s*s treated ess a want of confiuen<» Tdt«*-** Sir Jcscph Ward gave thus statoOW*' a categoric denial. Ho aaid J» toA * not spoken to sinjrlo member -Wl the subject of tho -dnrarton >lr Allen eaid tho Prime Miuipter might deny tie statement; nono the leen it was true. ~j Mr Colrin repudiated the eegge/rfsott. - He eai4 ho had Jievor been jtoM hair vote jdnoo he- entered Padtiamoivt ■Mr liarclay otratuniued the dob»te t and said the second ballot had beoa a failnro cisewlypTe, chieily because of the'-tranidxk&us influence brought to Iwar betweon t2i9 firet and eecond ■Lots.. .., ■■ < . ;• Mr Tanner, said he nras oppoMd r and branch to the BiS, btttnotWiiifira* t to be jeained at this etolSoior fwft&*iTS oppoiitiott.' ; Hβ wae eurprifliea ME *"•/ way in: the POl W tilwwitKh. ; Hd'was satwaoot-.th»4 leveniX * in.-OW HowTTO^d7 iianro*^

\ meaning of tho Bill by Christmas time, when.they would have leisure to think over lost opportunities. Mr McGowan said the Opposition ■was against the J-ill because if was dangerous—(hear, hear)— dangerous, he • meant, to tho Opposition. It was net surprising that the Pros opposed tho Bill, because newspapers were mostly in demand at election times, when they ■were bought up by the hundred thousand and freely circulated. Newspapers were to be prosecuted for contempt of Court if they commented upon cases sub judice Ho did not understand why clause 19 should be called a "gag" clause because it proposed to establish some principle in elections. Mr Herries said the Government was afraid its own votes would bo split. Tho late Mr Seddon would nevar have dreamed of bringing such n Bill down; he would have said that if he could not manage his party, ho would cease to be Prime Minister. Mr Herries strongly opposed tho "gag" clause, and said the whole measure was ono of tho most extraordinary ever brought before Parliament. Dr. Chapplo said the Bill would bo co discredited throughout the country that very soon it would be swept off the Statute Book. The motion was agreed to on the voices.