EVENING SITTING.

Press, Volume XLVI, Issue 7359, 11 July 1889, Page 6

EVENING SITTING.

The House resumed at 7.30 p.m. CEMETERIES ACT.. Mr Izasd moved the second reading of the Cemeteries: Act Amendment Bill. In the present Act power was given to the Governor in Council to close a cemetery, but not until another site had been provided by the local authorities. The Bill he now introduced enabled the Governor to close a cemetery without waiting for the local authorities to obtain another site. There were reasons upon which he could have introduced this as a local Bill, but he had made it general, believing it to deal with a large public question. The Bill further provided that if the local body did not obtain a site within six months of the closing of the old one, the Governor in Council might appoint a Comminsion to select a site and acquire such site. One member of the Commission was to be a member of the local body concerned, and if the owner of the site could not agree as to the price it was to be ascertained by the Compensation Court. The amount of the price could be paid out of the general Borough or Town District funds. He contended that there was great necessity for this Bill, notably in the principal cities of the colony, and he urged that the matter should be dealt with atonce. He believed matters were worse in Wellington in that respect than el3ewhere, but on the other hand that they were j tending in the same direction all over the colony, and hence the necessity for a general instead of a local BilL The condition of the Wellington cemetery (which had been in use forty years) was simply a disgrace to the city. Mr Downie Stewart said this was a complete reversal of the policy of the Act of 1832. He pointed out that the Governor had power to close cemeteries, while the local bodies had to pay. This was really a local Bill, to deal with a local question. The hon. member had not the courage to test the question fairly by a local BiuL Mr Samuel agreed with Mr Stewart, and said Mr Izard's position would have been much stronger if he were a member of the Wellington City Council. Because the hon. member said the Wellington City Council had allowed their cemetery to remain in this disgusting and unwholesome condition, it did not follow that Parliament was going to interfere with the whole of the local bodies of the colony and accuse them of the same thing. This was one of the circumstances that showed the necessity for some reform in the system of Local Government. He combatted an assertion by Mr Izard that local bodies did not care about spending money which was not likely to be remunerative. He advised thejhon. member to confine his attention to the Wellington City Council. Dr. Newman supported the Bill, remarking that there was urgent necessity!or reform in the way of a cemetery at Wellington. He contended also that the question should be dealt with by a general measure. The second reading was agreed to by 36 to 32, and the committal set down for "the Ist August. PRIVATE SCHOOLS BILL. Mr Scobie Mackenzie raised a point of order that this being a Bill providing as for sraats of capital to private schools was a money Bill, and should Tk H?** introduced in Committee, to hi! S****** said that the BiU did not, mSuS^ A ' *£"* «tensionof apSSS?^? < Sf' education at the exP*nae of the State was already provided

, for all children, and the Bill apparently ! only proposed to carry out that principle. Mr Pyke proceeded to move the second j reading of the Bill, explaining that its object was neither more nor less than to ; give justice to the Roman Catholic community. He made it a Private Schools Bill at the request of several members, made last session. He eulogised the conduct of the Roman Catholic community in building and maintaining their own schools as against the atheistical communities, and tiie altogether infidel system of the State. The Speaker called upon Mr Pyke to withdraw those words as improper to be applied to a system maintained by the State. Mr Pyke at once withdrew them, but bitterly regretted the absence of religious teaching from the present system—an altogether godless system. The proposal of the Bill was that private schools should, upon complying with the Education Act, receive a capitation allowance, the amount of which was left blank at present, but which he proposed to make half that now paid to State schools. He appealed to the House to pass this Bill in the interests of justice. Mr Dodson, while he seconded the motion, disagreed with some points of the Bill. Although he saw many faults in the education system he did not think Mr Pyke was justified in assailing it as he had done. He maintained that the Bill should only apply to the Roman Catholics, whose claims he hoped the House would recognise. Mr W. P. Reeves moved the adjournment of the debate for a month. The amendment was not seconded. Mr Goldie opposed the Bill on the ground that it was not asked for, the majority of the people being well satisfied as they were. Mr Seymour opposed the Bill as calculated to seriously injure the Educational system of the colony. Mr Turnbull supported the Bill, and said if it was thrown out he would move for an address to the Governor to bring the proposal of the Bill into law. Mr Verrall opposed the Bill. Sir John Hall supported it, as a reasonable measure of justice to the Roman Catholics. He supported it, too, as an indication that the present system was very imperfect. He maintained that the function of a State -system of education was not to cram but to develope and direct the mind. He maintained that this amendment would make the system a national one.

Mr Moss opposed the Bill on the ground that it was State aid to the Church in disguise. Dr. Hodgkinson also opposed it on the ground that it was an attempt to break up the common school system and establish sectarianism.

Mr Marchant supported the Bill. The Premier said the Ministry treated this question as an open one, but his personal view was that all our fellowsubjects must be treated alike if the National Educational system was to be maintained. What the State should demand was that every child should be educated to a certain extent, but he could not see the absolute necessity for their being educated in State schools. Sir John Hall and Mr Turnbull had advanced views, which were also his views, and he could not see why they should not give assistance to people who built their own schools.

Mr Saunders expressed regret at hearing the Premier's remarks, and waraily defended the present system, maintaining that this Bill would simply multiply the number of schools.

Messrs Perceval and Hutchison would both vote for the Bill.

Mr Hobbs opposed the Bill, and said it would be a fatal blow, to the present system of education. The Bill would not satisfy Roman Catholics either. He had been a member of an ■ Education < Board, and had seen the evil of denominationalism, and he hoped they would never return to that system.

Mr Ballance supported the second reading of the Bill, on the ground that so far from its being an attack an the present system of education it would materially assist it. One feature of the Bill in particular which met his approval was that it drew no distinction between that and other bodies. He knew of some of our State schools where there was the utmost indifference with regard to education, but with the proposed Bill there would be rivalry and competition between the different sects, which could not fail to have a good effect. Their object should be to effect a reconciliation between different religious bodies and Heal the breach that now existed between Catholics and other religious bodies. The Bill would also give relief to the large cities. Mr Fergus said if anything could make him support the Bill it would be speeches like those of Sir John Hall and Mr Dodson, but the same process of reasoning that induced those gentlemen to supfort the Bill would induce him (Mr ergus) to oppose it. He entirely denied that one-seventh of the population of the colony were dissatisfied with the present system. The member for Wanganui had now for the first time in his life, as far as he knew, advocated denominationalism. It was quite a new line for that hon. gentleman. He regretted exceedingly that his colleague, the Premier, was so far opposed to the present system as to advocate denominational education. He held there was no demand whatever for this Bill, and if any demand was made, the Government should bring down a measure. The bulk of the Government, he was glad to say, were sound on this question. He denied that the Bill would give relief to the large cities, because the Roman Catholics did not attend those schools. Mr Fisb supported the Bill,'although he was opposed to denominationalism. He held, however, that to subsidise the Roman Catholics in the same way aa the other bodies would not break down our present system; but if this were applied to all other sects that result would most decidedly follow. He had a great respect for Roman Catholics, because they had stood firm for twelve years, and that proved to him that they were sincere in their religious convictions. He should endeavor to get the Bill altered so as to apply to Roman Catholics only. Mr Hakkness regretted that Mr Ballance had departed from the line he had for so many years followed with respect to our education system. If they 'granted State aid by this Bill to one denomination, they would have to give it to every other denomination, and that would most certainly jeopardise our present system, and bring it down to the ground. Mr Fitzherbert saio. there was no doubt the Roman Catholics deserved some assistance. He had heard no solid arguments against the Bill and would support; it. Mr Tanner approved of the Bill, and intended to vote fur it. Major Steward also supported the BUL Mr Stewart Menteath said they should consult their constituents before making such a change as that proposed in the Bill. He should oppose it. Messrs Duncan and Smith supported the Bill. Messrs Ross and Taylor opposed it. Mr Jackson would vote for the second reading, but whether he should support the third reading would depend on the alterations made in Committee. The motion for the second reading was lost by 37 to 23. The following is the division list: — AYES. Ballance Kelly Samuel Brown Larnach Seymour Buxton Marchant Smith Cowaa O'Conor Steward Dodson Parata Tanner Fitzherbert Perceval TurnbuU Hall Pyke Ward. Hutchison Reeves (R.) Jackson Russell .3 NOES. Allen Hamlin Rhodes Barron H*rknes3 Richardson Blake Hodgkinson Ross Bruce Humphreys Saundera Buchanan Jones Stuarc Cadman Joyce Menteath Feldwiek Lawry Taylor Fergus Mackenzie Thompson Fisher Mitcheleon Verrall Fitchett Moat 'Walker Fulton Monk Withy Goldie Moss Guinness Newman PAIRS. For. Against. Atkinson J. McKenzie Valentine Hisloo Fsh Whyte Graham Anderson Duncan McArihur Carroll ]>ownie Stewart McGregor Ormond Wilson Scohie Mackenzie Taipua W. P. Reeves The House rose at 12.35 a.m.

Chsistchurch Draughts Ciub. — A Committee meeting of the above Club was held on Tuesday evening, when it was decided to institute weekly matches, at which only one opening shall be played. Each player is to open alternately with the opening decided upon. The first of these matches will take place on Tuesday next. It was also decided to have the simultaneous draughts match on the 18th inst., when Mr lattle will meet ten players chosen from the second class of the Club.