W MCABLEY ]

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educating our members as to their responsible work, and not to build up a large fund to defend careless workmen. 17. As a proof that the New Zealand locomotive-engine drivers, firemen, and cleaners desire a union controlled and governed by an executive of locomotive-men only, we submit i h s n l oUO T g : Th€> P etitions were si B' n ed by about 1,110 locomotive-men out of an approximate 1,400, and 1,110 locomotive-men are members of the petitioners' union, and, lastly, about 250 locomotive-men signed a petition circulated by the Amalgamated Society of Railway Servants for signatures of those desirous of haying their grievances, &c, put through the A.S.R.S. 18 Summarized, the foregoing reasons prove conclusively that official recognition will bring about a more efficient service, harmony between officers and men, more conciliating means of redressing grievances, and will insure greater safety to the travelling public. 19 Every branch of the N.Z.L.E.D.F & C. Association (eighteen in number) has passed resolutions against the proposed departmental representation as suggested by the A.S R S , as such a scheme would only lead to a worse position for the locomotive-men in the service, class jealousy, and continual bickerings, and would not be such a useful body to the Railway Department as the E.F &C Association. 20. We have made an offer to the Amalgamated Society of Railway Servants to federate with them, and such a scheme would allow the railwaymen to speak more authoritatively than at present, it would also include the Railway Officers' Institute, thereby producing a good feeling among the railway employees. The following is the context of the federation scheme, which allows the locomotivemen's union complete entity: (I) Objects That the objects of the federation shall be—it shall exist for the purpose of ventilating, furthering, or attaining such questions or objects as are of equal or general importance to all grades of railway workers, and shall endeavour to promote and assist all efforts to improve the general conditions of the Railway service. (II) Representation That the representation on the Federal Council be on a pro rata basis—that is, for every 1,000 members or part thereof, such part to be not less than 500, each union shall have 'one representative. (Ill) Matter for discussion : That no matter be discussed by the Federal Council without the approval of the federated bodies. (IV) Expenses: That all the expenses of the representatives on the Federal Council be paid on a pro rata basis, also all incidental expenses connected with the meeting of the Federal Council.—G. Brown, President, S. Kennedy, Vice-President, W MoArley, General Secretary " We could not put the federation proposal any fairer than that, but I say that when we put the proposal before the society they treated the matter in a scandalous manner, and did not treat it as trades-unionism in any way. Considering the arguments that have been adduced to you to-day, I think they have been sufficient to cause you to recommend the House to officially recognize the Locomotive-engine Drivers, Firemen, and Cleaners' Association, and I think you will find that we should go hand in hand and work amicably together I think there is sufficient room for the two unions to work amicably together, and I hope you will bring in a report favourable to our association. Thomas Milroy examined. (No. 6.) 1 The Chairman.] What is your occupation?—An engine-driver 2. Will you make your statement to the Committee ?—Well, Mr Chairman and gentlemen, Ido not know that I can add very much to what has already been said. I think the position has been clearly set out by Mr Russell, and also by Mr Kennedy and Mr. MoArley There are, however, one or two small matters I wish to refer to. Our union has-been in existence in Duned-in for some time, and has about 175 members. Our meetings are well attended, and altogether we are a very happy family This cleavage between the society and our union took place very largely owmg_ to. the large expenses occurring through the Conferences held at Wellington and Auckland, while in many cases there was nothing gained at all by these Conferences. A great portion of our grievances have been ignored, and I dare say will be to the end We considered that the £500 or £600 could be very much better spent in some other way We got tired of handing in our contributions to the fund to be spent in that way, and we thought it would be better to have a union of our own, and consequently it was formed." What I desire to bring before the Committee is the fact that I have had the opportunity of making a trip round the world. I went through England, Scotland, and America, and in those places I found established similar societies to the one we have formed. I obtained introductions to a large number of engine-drivers and others, and naturally made inquiries and got some information in regard to their societies. They told me that their societies were working well, and laughed at the idea of the Amalgamated Society being able to represent men like engine-drivers in regard to the technicalities. I was informed that they had their schools, charts, and models, which were supplied to them by the Department, and which, of course, were of great benefit. There is one thing certain in America, and that is that the men there are pretty smart and well up. to their business, and I have no doubt that is_ due to the opportunities that have been given to them in regard to technical education. There is no great gulf between the officers and men on the railways in America, and it seems to be the policy of the directors to have confidence in their men, and at the same time they send men along to educate them. We had the feeling that when we started our union we might reduce the gulf which exists here, and at the same time have better opportunities for educating the men in our section, and making them better informed in regard to their duties. With regard to the Amalgamated Society, I have been for a long time connected with it, and I have nothing against it. It is no doubt doing its best, and at the present time doing what it considers right. However, we wanted to collect our own money and to administer it, and get some benefit out of it in some way, and now that this cleavage has taken place I do not think there is the slightest chance of ever patching it up At one time I thought it was possible, but there is not the remotest chance now The Amalgamated Society decided to delete that clause whereby we could still have been members for something like ss. a year, and then said, "If you cannot be with us the door is