G.—s.

BISHOP NELIGAN.]

Natives for two years ; (c) the voice.of the Crown now ; (d) the voice of the Natives now. Neither my Board nor I are seised of information that can explain these points. That they are points worthy of consideration is obvious. Turning to the scheme as submitted by Mr. St. Clair, I take the paragraphs seriatim : (1.) I deny the truth of the allegation of failure on the part of the General Trust Board of this diocese "to carry out the purposes for which the reserves .... were given." Further, " the original intention of the donors " has been as faithfully carried out as was at all possible. Mr. St. Clair's clients have never, so far as I am aware, acquainted my Board with any facts whereby " the original intention of the donors " could have either been more accurately ascertained or more faithfully discharged. The present proposal of the Natives, as submitted by Mr. St. Clair, does not throw any further light upon " the original intention of the donors." (2.) Both I myself and my Board would be glad to extend our operations in order to give " combined technical and agricultural instruction " to the Natives all over this diocese. But whether Kohanga, Hopuhopu, or Puniu afford the best sites is a matter upon which we should need considerable expert advice. With the land at Te Awamutu my Board has nothing to do. (3.) On the 20th June, before the date of this Native proposal, I informed the Commissioners that, given the money, my Board would do what is now suggested. I also informed the Commissioners that I did not think such work could be enterprised to-day on the basis of public subscription. I am still of the same opinion. The Natives appear to know of two private individuals willing to help. If those private individuals will communicate with me, I will co-operate with them in feeling the public pulse, on condition that the 1853 terms of the grants of these reserves are adhered to. lam not acquainted with the aims and objects of the American International Brotherhood League. I presume the Commissioners will be furnished with full and accurate information hereon. I venture, however, to suggest to the Commissioners that they should, for the purpose of obtaining information that may be useful, communicate with the Governor of Cape Colony and the Archbishop of Cape Town concerning what is known as the Ethiopian movement. It is possible that such information would be helpful in such a connection. (4.) (a.) I have already expressed the readiness of my Board to extend its operations on sound educational lines, had it the money, and so need not touch further on the first paragraph of this section beyond reminding the Commissioners that in the two schools, St. Stephen's and Queen Victoria, " the Maori youth of both sexes " are being educated " to become respectable settlers and citizens." The pakeha, moreover, has discharged by far the larger share of the cost of the erection of the Queen Victoria School. Thus he has shown action not inaction "in a deed of mercy " for his Maori brethren. (6.) I assert that the Waikato Maoris are receiving in St. Stephen's and Queen Victoria Schools benefits beyond those at all likely to accrue under " the proposed scheme." Further, there is no " widespread ruin to adjacent lands " through the growth of noxious weeds on the Board's property. The Board have, when the property was unlet, complied with the demands as made by the Government Inspector in this matter, (c.) The present tenants of the Board's property are taking such steps that in time " the noxious weeds will be eradicated." It is to the advantage of the tenants to do so speedily. I submit to the Commissioners these facts : (1.) A considerable amount of the Waikato property is now let to improving tenants. (2.) Any interference with those tenants would be a hardship on them. (3.) The " scheme "of the Natives is impracticable. (4.) The " scheme" provides no evidence of any breach of trust on the part of the General Trust Board. 2. The Chairman.] Have you formed any estimate about what revenue the Church grants produce at present ? I am not supposing any of these leases will be disturbed, but on the basis of the present leases have you formed an estimate of what may be looked upon as the revenue ? —I could not answer that without asking the Diocesan Secretary ; he would be able to say. 3. Some Natives say that what is right is to have a school on each grant. We may suppose that is looked upon —whatever it might have been originally —as being quite impracticable. The next suggestion made —I think by some of the Natives —was that if this cannot be done there might be a school for the combined localities in the nature of St. Stephen's ; that if there were a revenue of, say, £1,000 a year, or even something less —with a sum of money to start with to erect buildings—a school of that sort might be established ?—I think, if there were a sum of money sufficient for such a scheme, we should be only too glad to go in for it. 4. Mr. Quick.] The most practicable suggestion is this : Roka Hopere and the Maori clergyman thought there should be a central school at Hopuhopu. They thoroughly understood that it would be impracticable to have one on each reserve. It seems to me that it is a matter of £s. d. ? —Wholly. 5. No doubt the trustees would be only too glad to put a central school there if they had the money ? —I can honestly say there is no limit to the zeal for the education of the Maori people on the part of the Board if it had the money. But it has not got and years before the land was productive. 6. Is there any chance of extending the capabilities of St. Stephen's ?—I think I said before that some of the trustees at one time since I have been here contemplated the removal of St. Stephen's, and found we were unable to remove it owing to the terms of the trust, which definitely states that the school must be at Taurarua. 7. It may be admitted that St. Stephen's is doing good work, but is there any chance of its being extended in use ?—We would extend it to-morrow if we had the money to pay. We are in communication with the Government on the question of housing old St. Stephen's boys who go out as apprentices. The accommodation for this purpose is as full as it can be. It is a new departure, and has only got into form within a few months. We can only take in half a dozen apprentices, and we have done so. 8. You have plenty of land, the question is as regards buildings ?—Well, there would not be plenty of room for wooden buildings, because if they were to encroach more on the playing-field it would become dangerous to health. The boys must have a large area for playing. You might put a stone building on half the ground. It is wholly a question of money. When the old schoolroom was burnt down, the rebuilding was done by the boys under the school technical instructor on th 6 plans of Mr. Bartley,

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