L— 4c

2

MINUTES OF EVIDENCE.

Thursday, 6th August, 1903. Thomas Scott examined. (No. 1.) 1. The Chairman.] What is your name?— Thomas Scott. 2. What are you ?—Mayor of Dunedin. 3. Mr. Millar.] You desire to give evidence in connection with the Bill now before the Committee ?—Yes. 4. Does the Corporation desire to get any greater powers than those conferred by the Mining Act ? —None whatever. 5. The object of the Bill is simply to declare that the City Corporation is a mining authority under the Act?— That is so. 6. The next clause is for the purpose of validating titles which have already been granted by the Warden, but which the lawyers advise were not legally granted owing to there not being a local authority?— That is right. 7. Now, with regard to the clause in connection with forfeiture; you apply for very wide powers in connection with forfeiture. Is your object in inserting that clause to tie the water —to prevent private individuals getting it until such time as the Crown or yourselves are in a position to deal with it ? —Yes. 8. You have reason to believe that if you are not granted the right to this water, private individuals may obtain it, exactly the same as was done in the Waipori case ?—That is so. 9. What was the highest price asked for the Waipori rights ?—£2,500 for the whole thing. 10. After the rights had been granted to a private company ?—Yes. 11. You anticipate that the same thing would take place in connection with the Taieri?—Yes, in this way: all the private syndicates which have snapped up water-rights in various ways —in connection with the Waipori and Deep Stream —have done so with the full intention of exploiting the City Council. There is no doubt about that. 12. Your object is to protect this water for the people of the district ?—Yes. The Taieri Eiver rights will lapse in the Warden's Court in about six months. We are not prepared in the meantime to spend some £100,000, which would be required to be spent to bring in the Taieri, until we see what demand will arise after the Lee Stream works are completed. If we are not able to secure the Taieri Biver rights in some way such as this Bill provides they will lapse at the end of six months and be lost to us. The Bill is principally to secure to us an option over the Taieri rights until we see where we are. 13. The Lee Stream, which you are at present bringing in, will generate only sufficient power for your tramways and the lighting of the roads over which the tramway will run ?—Yes. 14. There will be no surplus power from the Lee Stream beyond that required for the tramways?— There may be about 400-horse power; no more. 15. The total power generated ?—The total delivered in the city will be about 1,000-horse power. 16. From the Lee Stream? —600-horse power of that will be required for the trams and lighting the roads along which the trams run. 17. You want the Taieri brought in for additional power purposes in the city and suburban districts at a later date ?—I might point out that the Taieri is the only suitable stream that we could use to augment the power. The power-station for the Lee Stream will be on the banks of the Taieri, and the transmission-line will run from the power-house on the Taieri to the city, so that in the event of our requiring more power, by bringing in the Taieri we will bring it in to the same generating-station, and the same transmission-line will do for both powers. It is only by such a method that the power from the Taieri can be made payable. 18. You have no objection, I presume, to a clause being put in the Bill providing that if the Council does not commence this work within five years the Warden should, upon the application of the Government, cancel the rights ?—Not the slightest. 19. That would give the Government time to formulate some scheme whereby they could deal with the whole of the waters of the colony, and at the same time protect the people of that particular district from being charged by private individuals for the use of the water?— Yes. We have no objection at the present moment even to the Government securing those rights as long as they keep out private syndicates. We do not want another Waipori case. That is the whole thing in a nutshell. We are advised that under the present mining law our title, even to the Lee Stream, is defective. 20. Your power-station rights likewise have been granted outside of the Mining Act, so that you must have them validated if you are to retain them ?—Yes. 21. Mr. Herries.] Would you object to leaving the matter in the hands of the Warden for him to impose conditions on any application ?—We have no objection whatever to the Warden deciding. Of course, though, he has no power to grant us an extension. 22. By the Bill you are taken from under the provisions of the Mining Act as regards forfeiture and abandonment. The Bill will give you a perpetual lease of the water-rights ?—For the five years suggested.