E.—3b

26

597 How many boys were sent up? —About forty or fifty. 598. Can you say whether it is hard work or not ?—lt was hard work with the posts when I went up, and hop-poles are about the same as posts. 599. Mr. Wardell.] How many poles did each boy bring ? —Only one ; they are 13 ft. or 14 ft. long. 600. Mr. Harley.] Is it the load they have to carry or going up the hill so often that makes it hard work?—l think it is both. 601. Can you say of your own knowledge whether it is tiring to go up and down the hill?— Yes, it is. 602. Mr. Wardell.] It was heavy work ?—Yes. 603. Mr. Harley.] It is heavier than other work on the farm ?—Yes, I think it is. 604. Were any other boys under punishment while you were there? —I do not think so. 605. Did any boys die while you were there last ? —No. 606. Mr. Fell: It will shorten matters, probably, if I state that all the boys (except one, who was buried at Eichmond) who have died at the institution have been buried there in a public cemetery. 607. Mr. Harley.] Did you have an opportunity to see what the boys had to eat ?—Yes. 608. What was it ? Irish stow on six days of the week, and potatoes with no meat on Friday. 609.' What did they have for tea? —Bread and tea. 610. Everyday?— Yes. 611. What did they have for breakfast? —Bread and tea, and porridge and treacle every second day. 612. Did they have milk in their porridge and tea?— Yes. 613. Was it new or skimmed milk?—lt was separated milk. 614. Did you feed with the boys? —No ; with the men. 615. I suppose the men are fed all right ?—Yes. 616. Were you there while Lane was doing the cooking ? —Not during the last time I was there. 617. Who did the cooking ?—One of the boys and Miller, and Brother Patrick helped. 618. Did you have an opportunity of seeing the boys' clothes ?—Yes. 619. Were there any complaints of them not being warm enough ?—I never asked when I was there the last time. 620. Did you mix with the boys?— Sometimes. . . 621. What are their clothes like? —You cannot say they are well dressed. Most of them are ragged. 622. Mr. Fell.] Do you know how many suits they have? —I only know of two. 623. Where were you when you heard the boy Miller call out ? —I was down the path away from the front of the building. The cell where the boy was overlooked the front of the building. 624. What were you doing ?—Sitting down after tea. 625. Mr. Bzish.] Did you know of the boys complaining of not having enough to eat ?—Yes ; several of them. 626. Mr. Wardell.] During these seven months ?—Yes. 627. Mr. Bush.] Did you ever give them food?— No. 628. Mr. Wardell.] In what way were the complaints put to you ? —I have seen them try to steal bread. 629. Did you assist them ? —No. 630. Did you report to anybody what they said ? —No. 631. Mr. Bush.] Did they complain of being cold too? —Not that I know of. 632. They did not complain to you? —No.

Friday, 27th July, 1900. Jesse Piper, examined on oath, 1. Mr. Harley.] You are one of the Nelson City Council representatives on the Nelson Charitable Aid Board?— Yes, and a Justice of the Peace. 2. You were one of those who paid a visit to St. Mary's School at Stoke at the end of May last ?—Yes. 3. What induced you to go upon that visit ? —I met the Chairman, Mr. Eout, in the Council office, on the Wednesday, and he said that he had very reliable information that there were boys in solitary confinement who were taken out to be whipped every day, and who were fed on bread and water ; that there was no furniture in the cells but a bowl or something of the kind for their necessities ; and that the bowl was taken away only once in two days. The Chairman asked me to go. I first asked what right we had to go. The Chairman said he had taken legal advice, and had been informed that, as Chairman of the Board, he could go there on an official visit. 4. Whom did you go with ?—The Chairman, yourself, and Mr. Heyward. 5. Were you received as detailed by Mr. Eout on arrival there?— Mr. Eout rang four or five times before we could gain admittance. 6. Then a Brother came, and you were taken into the building ?—Yes, Brother Augustine came, I believe. 7. You and Mr. Eout went upstairs with Brother Augustine?— Yes, and the other two went towards a lot of boys. 8. What were you looking for upstairs ? —For cells.