63

G.—2

he told me he had seen Lewis, and that it was settled. I remember Kahui Kararehe's Court. Don't know date it opened, but it was about a week after the first opening. I was present when it opened. The Eaumatangi section was the first section of 1,200 acres brought before it. Lewis sent for us to come and arrange about the boundaries of No. 9. I don't remember whether this was in the morning or afternoon, or on the second day. I think it was after No. 11 was dealt with. It was after the Muaupoko business was over for the day. There was nothing said in Court about the Ohau section, but I heard Wirihana say outside the Court that it could go back to the people, as we had selected the Eaumatangi section. Wirihana was the only person I heard say this, but there were others present. I don't remember who they were. I think either Eu Eeweti or Eparaima acted as clerk for Major Kemp at that time ; probably Eparaima, as he was sent with Wiki and myself to Horowhenua to take the Muaupoko to Palmerston. I can't say whether Eparaima was present when Wirihana told me that the Ohau section should go back to the people, fie may have been. The statement was made outside the Court. I can't say that Eu Eeweti joined in my application for land at Eaumatangi. He was always on Kemp's side; besides, he knew nothing about the land. Heni Kipa and Hare Pomare were present when I asked to have the land at Eaumatangi, and did not object. They did not speak then or when No. 9 was cut off for us in the Court. I did not think then that they were interested in the matter. It is for the law to decide whether the lineal descendants of Whatanui or the descendants of Hitau are to have No. 9. I don't know what the effect of the Horowhenua Block Act may be. I have only seen the report of the Eoyal Commission. Waretini, Te Waihaki, Ema, and, I think, Eere, sent in a list of names of those it was considered were entitled to the 1,200 acres. I told them to do so, and returned to Wanganui. This was after the Court of 1886. Some of the lineal descendants of Whatanui were, I heard, included in the list —viz., Heni Kipa, Eu Eeweti, and Hare Pomare. Ema said that only those of the lineal descendants of Whatanui who were living here should go in. Eu Eeweti insisted that all his lineal descendants should be put in. They quarrelled, and Kemp then wrote to Lewis asking that the list should not be accepted as final until Wiremu Pomare arrived. Lewis sent me a copy of Kemp's letter. I did not see the list or a copy of it. Henare Apatari: No questions. Hamuera Karaitiana : No questions. Cross-examined by Mr. Baldwin. Witness: I was in Palmerston before the Court of 1886 in connection with the land for the descendants of Whatanui. [Appellate Book, page 36, Nicholson's evidence: "An endeavour was made to locate the 1,200 acres at Papaitonga," &c] I may have said that I was acting for Whatanui ; there was no Hitau then. I was acting for all who were present at Palmerston, including Heni Kipa and Pomare. I consented to their being put in. I was not acting for Wiremu Pomare. I acted for those whom I considered the 1,200 acres were for. [Appellate Book, page 36 :" An endeavour was made to locate the 1,200 acres. I objected," read out again.] It was before the Court that I sent the wire to Lewis. [Appellate Book, page 36, "We discussed the location of the 1,200 acres before the Court sat. I was deputed to appear in Court," &c, read.] It was at our meeting that I objected. I also objected in the Court. The meeting took place before the Court sat. I mean the meeting that Kemp attended and refused our request to have the land located at Eaumatangi. Kemp did not agree until after the agreement arrived. We had another meeting after Mangakahia's Court sat. [Vol. 7, page 185 : " During the time that Sir Donald McLean was Native Minister," &c. (Lewis's evidence), read.] I remember Lewis giving evidence about the township, and the block at Ohau, but I cannot remember whether he said all you have read. My purpose in objecting was that I wanted to see where the 1,200 acres was located. I had heard that it was to be at Ohau. I heard this out of Court, and I saw it delineated on the tracing in the Court. When I saw the tracing in the Court the Eaumatangi section was not shown on it. lam quite sure of this. We settled the question of the boundaries of Eaumatangi section when Kahui's Court sat. They were discussed with us by Kemp and the whole of Muaupoko. I never saw a section at Eaumatangi as shown on map signed by Kemp. The whole dispute in Kahui's Court was as to whether the line should follow the stream, or be 2 chains from it and the Ohenga Cemetery. When No. 9 was dealt with by Kaihui's Court: McDonald and Kemp were acting together. I understood that McDonald was acting for Kemp. I cannot remember whether McDonald was present at the discussion over the boundaries. There was a considerable amount of business done in the Court before No. 9 was dealt with. No. 11 was one of the parcels disposed of. No. 3 was, I think, dealt with before No. 9, but I will not be certain. I remember the sections for Ngatiapa and Eangitane being placed on the hills. I think they were dealt with before No. 9. I remember the section for the rerewaho. I cannot say whether it was ordered before or after No. 9. I remember that there was a dispute about boundaries of No. 9. It was settled that the boundary should be 2 chains from the stream. When the section was surveyed it was found not to accord with the arrangement. I remember an order being made to Kemp for No. 9 for descendants of Whatanui. It was made after the boundaries had been discussed between Kemp and ourselves. All I remember is that there was a lot of work done by the Court before No. 9 was dealt with at all by Kahui's Court. My recollection is that No, 9 was not awarded until the boundaries had been fixed. The first thing Kahui's Court did was to re-enact the orders made by Mangakahia's Court. I understood that this was for the information of the Assessor. I thought it was settled that No. 9 was for us when the order was made. The boundaries were described and objectors called for, none appearing. I think I told the Court we agreed to accept the Eaumatangi section because I was the person who had asked to have it placed there. I considered that, being spokesman of those present, if I agreed the matter was settled. I have always thought so since, and have given evidence to that effect. I was in and about the Court of 1886 until it adjourned sine die. I remember the square foot for Wiremu Matakatea. Ido not remember Kemp asking at that time