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60. Is this an estimate ? —This was a careful estimate, at least as regards the BrunnertonSpringfield section of the line. 61. Are you not aware, after you had carefully computed your values, that some of your works have cost double your estimate ?—I am not aware of that, but it may possibly be the case. 62. Take the line between Invercargill and Mataura; that line cost quite double, did it not?— I do not at the moment recollect what the estimate was ; but I know that the contract for that line was let privately to an English firm without competition. 63. That was not a reason for running into a higher cost. 64. Mr. Guinness.] I heard you say that in your opinion no financiers would take up a contract to build the line from Brunnerton to Springfield on the concessions offered at the present time ? —That is my opinion. 65. Will you tell the Committee what knowledge you have of the money-market with reference to railway construction ?—I do not claim to have any knowledge of it. 66. I see, you simply speak as one of the public ?—I am aware that a petition by the Midland Railway Company is before the House at the present time, asking for further concessions. This I take to be an evidence that the present concessions are not sufficient; and, as the persons who have floated and financed this company have a very large experience of the London money-market, I think we may go by their opinion. 67. Mr. Tanner.] With regard to the reservations on the West Coast, can you give us the date of the Proclamation when the 400,000 acres were reserved?— There were quite a number of Proclamations. I can give you the date of every one if you wish it. 68. Perhaps it would be an advantage if you could give us them all. First of all, have you any knowledge of a map known as Larnach's Map, dated 1877, showing 750,000 acres reserved?— I have. 69. Could you produce a copy of it before the Committee ?—Yes. 70. Can you tell me the date when the first reservation of about 400,000 acres of these lands marked in Larnach's Map of 1877 was first published?— The whole of the lands in that Proclamation were reserved at one time. - 71-. But that Proclamation was afterwards lifted, was it not ? —Yes, it was. 72. Then a later Proclamation was issued applying to 400,000 acres of practically the same land ? —Portions of the same land. 73. The date of that?— There were fifty-nine Proclamations altogether. The first was issued in August, 1891, and the last in February, 1895,1 think. 74. Now, was any portion of that land reserved by Proclamation at the time of about 1889 or 1890 when the Midland Railway Company made their selections on the eastern side of the ranges ? —None of it. 75. Do you mean to say that the whole of the land which has been referred to in your conversation with Mr. Mackenzie was there for the Company to make selections from at the time they made selections in the Amuri country ?—lt was all there for them to make selections from ; but as of course a large part of the West Coast was known to be auriferous, and a great deal of it was being worked, it is quite likely that selections there in certain localities would have been objected to. 76. Yes, lam not disputing that. Was it competent for the Midland Railway Company to have taken up that land reserved by Proclamation in August, 1891, at the time they made large selections in North Canterbury and the Province of Nelson?—l have no doubt some of it could have been taken up by the company. 77. Did they express any desire to take up that land previous to the Proclamation ? —None whatever. 78. Was it known that the whole of it was auriferous, and a great deal outside the limits mentioned in the Proclamation?— Yes. 79. With regard to the surveys, you tell us that a careful and accurate estimate had been made of portions of the line previous to the signing of the contract. Does that apply to the whole of the line ?—No; it only applies to the piece between Springfield and Brunnerton. 80. Is it within your knowledge that nine careful surveys were made of the section between Springfield and Brunnerton ?—Several surveys have undoubtedly been made. 81. Made with great care and cost? —That is so. 82. What kind of a survey was made of the country between Reefton and Nelson?— Only a trial survey. 83. Which occupied how long?—I could not say, but it was made by the same engineer who made a trial survey for the North Island Main Trunk Line, and whose estimate has turned out unreliable. 84. Was it not termed in 1892 a flying-survey, occupying three days?—lf so, that was not right. It certainly took much longer than that. 85. Did the company go into the contract with the full knowledge that all the information they had with regard to the country between Reefton and Nelson was based on that single flyingsurvey ? —Certainly. 86. They knew exactly that it had been made hurriedly in a short time, and at that time no such accurate estimate had been made as existed for other portions of the line ? —Certainly. 87. Mr. Montgomery.] Supposing you take the view of what the colony lost through the Midland Railway, through not having a railway to open up the whole of the West Coast, you have not estimated anything for that large loss ? —Nothing at all. 88. If you were to consider what the colony would have to give now to get somebody to make that railway under a new contract, have you any idea what the colony would have to give in concessions over and above what were given before ?—I could not say what they would have to give, but I am convinced the concessions would have to be substantial.