H.—22

2

I told defendant on Thursday that the sheep were scabby. I went to his farm. I saw five sheep there at a distance. Mrs. Jolly said a man in the field would give me information. I declined to see him. I might have said that when dipped, that part of the sheep had not been touched there. On Thursday, Mr. Jolly told me that he had written to the Inspector (Mi. Rtinciman) to see his sheep, and that the Inspector would be at his farm on the following day (Friday). I said to Mr. Jolly if he (Inspector) can't find scab, send me a telegram at once, and I will go up next day and find it. I did not receive a telegram, but on the following Wednesday night I received a letter. Too long time had elapsed for me to go to examine them, any scabby sheep might have been removed in the interval, but scab could not have been eradicated. I have no doubt 1 might have found insects in the skin. Insects may be found in the wool. I did not see any ; some would lie embedded. I can find insects without a glass ; 1 sometimes use one. Insects would die in cold skin after death of animal. The diseased skin was hard like a thin board or tin, under the skin, it was stiff. lam sure this was not from the bite of a dog. When I looked a second time I said scab could be seen on hind leg. Mr. Short said dogs had been amongst Mr. Jolly's sheep, and tbis was an injury by a dog. I saw Mr. Short handle some sheep, but not this one. There is no disease but scab that a sheep will turn its head round and bite at you for touching. If scratched enough it might not do so. I did not see Mr. Short press it. This is not a serious, but an ordinary case. I would expset to find scab on some of the 65 or 340 running with it if folded together. There is generally a greenish look in a case of scab unlike scars. There was some wool on the old scab, but none on the new patch around it. Have seen a skin I was told was that of this sheep, on Monday. I would expect to find the insect then, but did not look for it. There is no room for doubt as to scab in this case. I never made such a mistake. Many years ago, before I had studied the disease scientifically, I mistook a discolouration in the skin for incipient scab. I can detect scab insect without a glass ; need one at times. Clayton was with me and saw the skin. I left the yards on Mr. Hunter's word that the sheep would be taken away and dipped. Mr. Jolly told me at Pokeno Railway Station, that the sheep were being carted away. The piece of old scab was as large as a crown, and when I opened it, I could see scab half an inch thick upon it; the skin underneath was diseased. Around this patch the wool had, apparently, been rubbed off by the animal, and the skin there had a stiff' feel. When I pinched the diseased part of the animal, the sheep turned round as if to bite my hand. This is an unmistakable sign of scab. I went to see Mr. Jolly's sheep, wishing to see them at once, before any one had manipulated them. When Mr. Jolly was not at home, I would not go amongst his sheep, out of my own district. I was appointed Inspector in the year 1862, and Mr. Rtinciman in 1866. lam sure there is no room for mistake in this case. Re-examined by Mr. Brookfield: —I have no feeling in this case, only in my public capacity. The young ofthe insects are very small. Female buries herself in the skin. On poor feed disease will lie dormant during the heat ofthe summer, young ones, perhaps, being burnt up. Moisture is required for the insect to develope itself. I have seen skin heal, and wool grow over diseased patch, but the disease not eradicated without dipping. I went to Hamilton oil Wednesday, and crossed Mr. Jolly on the road. The bite ofa dog would leave a bluish look and scar. William Ferguson, sworn : —I have had 40 years experience in sheep. I know scab when I see it. On the 30th ultimo, Mr. Lewis pointed out some sheep in Mr. Hunter's yard, ruddle on back. Mr. Lewis asked me to hold one while he examined it. The sheep was scabby, no doubt, on near fore shoulder. I think it had been dressed, but not perfectly done, but was coming out all around. Wool was off' a broad piece two inches square. One on hind leg on same side had been scab, but was cured. I only examined one sheep. lam satisfied, in my mind, it was scab. Re-examined by Mr. Hesketh : —Never mistook any disease for scab, it is quite different from any other disease. Hind leg had been cured by dressing. I have no doubt the shoulder had been dressed by some person ; it was of a month or six weeks' standing, dry, no wool on centre, had been scabbed. All around edges insect alive. I think dead in the centre. Living part about a month old. I think the centre had been dressed. I have known judges of scab mistaken. Not good ones. Injury by dog or instrument quite different; not being insect. I found insect round verge of wool. Mr. Lewis, I think, used his finger nail. I saw a living insect moving. I only examined that time. I would not believe that the sheep had never been dipped. A man who knows anything about sheep, knows an undipped one from a dipped one. I looked at no other sheep. Scab generally commences on the fore shoulder. This was under the shoulder. I did not search the sheep all over. I cannot say it was a bite of a dog on the hind leg. Re-examined by Mr. Brookfield : —No similarity between the bite of a dog and scab. Alexander Trotter, sworn : —I am a farmer living at Matakana. I have been amongst sheep for 15 years, at home and here. I know scab, and can detect it. On the 30th ultimo I was at Hunter & .Nolan's sale yard's. I carefully examined one sheep, Mr. Lewis pointed out to me ; I have not the least hesitation it was scab. One was on a hind-quarter, and one on fore-quarter ; on shoulder the size of my hand. Short said it was a dog tear, and I said it was not. I could not mistakebetween them. I did not see a live insect. Cross-examined by Mr. Hesketh: —Saw two patches. I believe that on hind leg was alive. That on fore-quarter was similar. I did not like to go among them, as I had sheep of my own. I saw the scab was eating in under the wool—much fresher—it looked as if carbolic acid had been put on it, it looked a pale red. I saw Mr. Lewis handle it, but did not see the wound open. There was a little short wool on some part of the scab. I cannot say whether the sheep was a wether or ewe. The scab might have been there for six months, as I think it had been patched up. It could have run among other sheep six months, without affecting the other sheep. Herman Schmiedte, sworn. —I am employed by Mr. Bnckland. I have had twenty years' experience of sheep. 1 know scab. On the 30th ult. Mr. Lewis pointed out a sheep to me. Mr. Lewis marked the ear. I saw the sheep and said it was scabby. I handled it. The sheep was scabby on lower part of near shoulder. I only looked at one sheep. Mr. Frederick Howard came iv and examined the same sheep.