PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

Wellington Independent, Volume XXVI, Issue 3231, 21 June 1871, Page 2

PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

TUESDAY, JUNE 20. The SPEAKER took the chair at 3 o'clock. PETITION. Mr ANDREWS presented a land petition from Richard Young, late of H.M. 14th Kegiment. Received, read, and ordered to bo printed. Mr THYNNE presented a petition from a number of natives at Otaki, prajing that a road be made. Received and read. NOTICES OF MOTION. Several notices of motion were given. The Council then went into Committee on the DISTBICT HIGHWAYS BILL, Commencing at Clause 17j regulating the order of business. Mr DRANSFIELD moved that all the clauses between Clauses 17 and 37 be postponed until after the latter clause was disposed of. He made the motion with the object of facilitating business, as that clause contained the whole gist of the measure. After that was disposed of, the rest would be plain sailing. Mr LUDLAM opposed, on the ground that many members, not then in Council, who would like to share in the discussion of such an important clause, would bo taken by surprise. Mr BORLASE thought it unreasonable to ask members to waste their time, and perish with cold, over subsidiary clauses, none of which nffected the principle of fche bill. Mr DRANSFIELD could not see that memders were taken by surprise, as the bill was the first item on the order paper. Considerable discussion ensued on this point, Mr Ludlam opposing the postponement of the clnusos, on the ground that the course was unusual, and unseemly. Being an old representative, he had been several times entrapped by such devices, and had become more wary. This view was combated by the Government, on the ground that the course was a porfeotly common one, and that the motion was merely made to expedite business, and spare hon. membors an unnecessary amount of discomfort. There was no desire to shirk discussion on the part of the G-ovornment, who felt themselves strong in the justice of the principle of the bill, and in the sense of the country. This passage brought from Mr Dransfield the explanation that his motion was a pure suggestion of his own, and was made without the cognisance of % tho Government. The Government intimated that they had received numerous letters from the country favorable to the bill. Mr Ludlain, on the other hand, said ho too had received lettera condemning the bill ; in fact, he had not heard one from the country speak in favor of it. Some liveliness took place between Mr Ludlam and Mr Borlase, the former making somo reflections on some extraordinary and mysterious tactics which -had been practiced to increase the supporters of the bill. Mr Borlase loudly demanded " Name, name." Mr Ludlam said he would not give any name, but said no doubt the matter would become public. Some pleasant banter then took place between Mr Watt and Mr Pharazyn respecting the absence of Mr Finnimore, the former saying he had heard a rumor that his colleague had been told not to disturb himself about attending the session, as the business of the Council would soon be over, and he would be appointed valuator for the province. Mr Pharazjn thought this just j such a cock-and-bull story as the hon. member was likely to believe. The Government urged it wa3 a waste of time to dally over the clauses as^od to be postponed, when the very head and point of the bill was contained in the 37th clauso, and denied that they wished to take any unfair advantage. Mr Hutchison then put in that the best way of showing their sincerity would be by proceeding with the clauses seriatim. \ With reference to the mysterious telegram and extraordinary tacticß emanating from a friend of the Government, Mr PH ARAZYN explained the real truth of the matter. He had received a telegram from Mr Finnirnoro, neking if thero was any occasion for him to come. To this he replied that there was no use in coming. He had, further, received a letter from Mr Pinnimore that day, in which he acknowledged the receipt of the telegram, and Baying he was glad to see that his presence was not needed, and at the end of the letter he said he " was not sure whether ho should not have voted with the Government on the bill. Mr WATT interjected : I can tell the hon member I have sent a telegram for Mr Pinnimore to come down as soon as possible. The discupßion was then taken up by other hon members, during the course of which Mr Brandon urged that the bill should be postponed. The request was replied to by the Provincial Secretary, who was not surprised at tbe opinion of the hon member for Porirua, who would, no doubt postpone to doomsday that or any other measure calculated to advance the interests of the province; and judging from the extraordinary enlightenment as to tho real wantß of the province which he seemed to possess now so suddenly, together with the long time he was in office without bringing forward a measure of any use, ho suggested that the hon tnember'B arguments wore not entitled to much consideration. Mr HUNTER said, from tho opinions expressed by people outside — and he had conversed with a great many on the matter — there seemed to be considerable misapprehension as to the real spirit of the bill ; but he was happy to say that on taking a little pains to explain tho principle thoroughly, ho had tho satisfaction of making converts of a great many people. Tho hon member said tho epoech of tho hon member for the city (Mr Anderson) put the philosophy of the bill in a nut shell. As the bill contained a principle, and that was mainly in the 37th clause, it really seemed a waste of time to defer deciding the fate of the measure at once. A division wbb then called for on Mr Drati3field's motion, that the olauses between 16 and 37 bo postponed. The result was : — For, 13 ; Messrs Taylor, Masters, Pearce, Pharazyn, Crawford, Dranßfleld, Bovlase, Hunter, Halcombo, Bunny, W. W. Taylor, Morgan, and Anderson. Against, 8. — Messrs Fapn, Ludlam, Hutchison, Brandon, Thynne, A. Milne, Watfc,|and Andrew.

The' clauses were then postponed, when Mr HUTCHISON moved the introduction of a new clause. He had no objeotion to the proposed mode of. raising a revenue, \ihen it was for the generarpurpoßes of government^ but in this case it was different — all this money was wanted for was for the -purpose of mereJy making roads within the provisions of this bill. This proposition was not accepted by the Government, who urged that they would nofc attempt to please all parties, as they felt they must fail ignominiously if they did bo. They had therefore taken their stand upon something approaching, as nearly as it was possible, to an equitable basis of taxation, feeling that no other course was calculated to bring the province out of its present difficulties. Mr WATT thought these difficulties purely imaginary. Where had the Government learned that any dissatisfaction exist edj whenwL there had not been a single petition laid be- v fore the Council that would indicate the existenoe of any of those difficulties. The discussion generally, however, was merely travelling over the same ground already gone over in the debate on the second reading, Mr LUDLAM said if the amendment was not adopted he would move that the tax be based on the natural value of the land. Mr MORGAN would like to know if clauge 37 was affirmed it would prevent him introducing several clauses providing for the mode of assessment, but which would in no way affect the principle of the bill. He confessed that he was astonished that members could say that the bill took anyone by surprise, as he had ventilated the same principles as contained in the bill twelve months ago, in a newspaper at Wanganui. He wa3 therefore, in a manner, bound to support his own opinions. The PROVINCIAL SECRETARY informed the hon. member that there was nothing to prevent him introducing the proposed clause in order to make the assessment voluntary. The Council tlwn divided on the amendment that the clause be expunged, with the following result :— For, 8 : Messrs Brandon, Hutchison, Watt, Taylor, Thynne, Milne, A. Milne, W. and Ludlam. Against, 13 : Messrs Hunter, Hnlcombe, Bunny, Crawford, Pharazyn, Morgan, Masters, W. W. Taylor, Anderson, Borlase, Dransfield, Pearce aiad Taylor. Mr LUDLAM then proposed an amendment, providing that any money raised in a particular ward, should be spent in that ward, and that only* The PROVINCIAL SECRETARY could j not accept a proposition entirely opposed to the fundamental principle of the bill, and calculated to neutralise the objects sought to be attained by the bill, which was expressely intended to put roads all over the province. Mr MASTERS thought the chief -merit of the bill was that it sought to make roads were there was now, neither roads nor road boards and those were the places ho wanted to see made accessible. Mr MILNE thought the Council would not be wise in discarding the old uniform acreage rate, until they had got rid of all the large blocks of land owned by people in the province, as the chief object of that tax was to press unequally, so that those who held large blocks uaproductively, should be made to feel its pressure. In the Rangitikei, it had the desired efieot, as it cleared out the most of the large land owners. Mr HUTCHISON referred the Council to the 27th clause to show that they had no power to make roads unle3s by consent of the rate payers in any district. That would dispel the golden visions of Mr Masters, who wanted to see roads made everywhere. After some remarks combatting the impressions of the last speaker, the amendment was put, and the Council divided, the result being: — Ate3 — 7 : — Messrs Brandon, Hutchison, Watt, A. Milne, Fagan, W. Milne, Ludlam. Noes — 13 : — Messrs Bunny, Hunter, Anderson, Crawford, Halcombe, W. W. Taylor, Mastors, Dransfield, Morgan, Pearce Pharazyn, Borlase, Taylor. The amendment having been thus rejected, the clause was then put in its original form and agreed to on the voices; On the Counoil resuming at half-past seven, an amendment was proposed to clause 38 by Mr Brandon, in order to alter the proposed mode of recovering the rate by service or by notice by post. The PROVINCIAL SECRETARY pointed out that it was a mere matter of economy. The object of the Government was to simplify as much as possible the mode of collection by the board and reduce the cost attendant upon having to send a collector to every part of the district. There were no places that could not be reached by post ; and any expense that was avoided in the collection of the rates would be so much the more funds at the disposal of the board for the legitimate purpose for which they were originally raised. The amendment was rejected and the clause passed on the voices. Clause 39 was also passed. On clause 40. Me W. Milne proposed an amendment which was rejected and the clause passed ; us also clause 41. On clause 42, enabling the. board, in the event of the oooupier leaving the property while in arrears of rates, to recover either from the occupier or the'owner, Mr BRANDON proposed as an amendment that the occupier alone should be the person to pursue. Considerable discussion took place on this clause, but ultimately the amendment was rejected, without a division. Subsequently the clause was p'ostponod in order to embody a provision, the suggestion of Mr Ludlam that the owner should not become liable unless proceedings against the occupier for the recovery of rates had failed. Olfiuae 43 was passed. On clause 44 (Crown and General Government exempt from rates), an amendment was proposed by Mr Ludlam that the Superintendent be made liable to the board. Mr W. MILNE proposed that the clause be struck out. Mr Ludlam's amendment was put, and the Council divided. The result was : — Ayes, 9 ; Noes, 12. The clause was therefore declared carried. Clause 46, (petition for special rate) with five sub-sections, was] agreed to without alteration. Clauses 47, 48, 49, 50, .were passed as read. On clause 51 (nine sub sections) providing for the discharge of the liabilities of a board, being read, Mr Hutchison proposed an amendment in sub- section one. Postponed. Clauses 52 and 53, were passed as read. In clause 54, providing for banking and withdrawing money, the blank sum which the treasurer can retain in his hands was filled up by £20 ; the orders for withdrawing money to be countersigned by two members of the board. The clause was then passed. Clause 55, providing for the keeping of the accounts was passed, the month of September being fixed as the time when a full abstract of the accounts shall be sent into the Superintendent. Clauses 56 and 57 were passed without alteration. Clause 58, imposing penalties for- offences, was postponed for further consideration on the recommendation of Mr Ludlam. Clause 59 was read and passed. On clause 60 being read, whioh provides for a contingency auoh as a board neglecting to perform its duty by enabling the Superintendent to appoint a person to supersede the board, and thus preventing the machinery of the act coming to a standstill, considerably^ discussion ensued, hon. members stating tha™ the wording of the clause was rather indefi« nite. Postponed. Clauses 61 and 62 were also postponed. Clauses 63, 64, and 65 wore passed without discussion. The committee then resumed the consideration of clause 17, which had been postponed, and passed it without comment, as they did also clauses 18 and 19. In clause 20 (board to maintain roads) Mr Hutchison moved, as an amendment, that the latter portion of fcho olause, exempting the

loads known as the Great North-eastern and Great North-western from the control of the board be struck out, in order that the boards might take over the management of these road as well a3 the district roads. Mr MORGAN also took the same view. Mr LUDLAM took an opposite view. Roads not running through valuable proporty, such as the road over the Rimutaka, thnt over the Paikakariki and Horibiwi road, the hon. member thought would fall into a very bad state of repair if entrusted to the district boards, though ho by no means thought the Government had been remarkable for any efficiency in their euro of the maiu roads hitherto. He thought a system of tender for the repair of the road.s would be advisable in proference to the present system of pottering by day labov. The PROVINCIAL TREASURER said Jphat plan had been tried and failed lamentably. V Mr MASTERS thought the most economical plan would be to let the repairs out by contract for five years. The clause as read was passed. Clause 21 (closing roads during execution of works) passed without amendment; and 22, 23, 24, and 25, without comment. On clause 26, providing for the board fixing the price at £3 per acre of any piece of road which they may have deemed it advisable to close and sell, the adjoining owner having the refusal of purchase, an amendment was proposed in order to allow competition for the piece of land. Postponed. Clauses 27, 28, 29, providing for the opening of new highways, restoring fences, &c, were passed. Clauses 30 and 31, defining what is rateable property, were passed as read. Mr BRANDON moved that progress be reported, as the next clause (32), making the valuation triennial, was a debateable one. Mr MORGAN said it wns his intention to move the substitution of new clauses instead of clauses 32 to 36, inclusive. He was anxious that the system of valuation and assessment should be similar to that in force in Nelson, riz., every man to be the valuer of his own property. In order to simplify matters, a division w<ib called for to ascertain the opinion of the Council as to whether clause 32 should be erased. The amendment was put, and the result was : — For expunging the clause, 9 ; against, 11. The clause was amended, in order to make the act come into operation in July instead of for March, 1872. A proviso to the clause was then moved by Mr Brandon. A division was at once called for. The result was : For the amendment, "■' 9 ; against, 11. The clause was then read and passed, and also the remaining clauses up to the 37th. Progress was then reported, and the Council adjourned to three o'clock that day, it being then aquarter past twelve.