DOMINION DEFENCE

Wanganui Chronicle, Volume 80, Issue 256, 28 October 1937, Page 8

DOMINION DEFENCE

BILL BEFORE HOUSE LAND AND AIR FORCES OPINIONS ON RESPECTIVE VALUES L Per Press Association. J WELLINGTON, Oct. 27. The debate on the second reading ot the Army Board Bill was continued in the House ot Representatives this afternoon by Colonel J. Hargest (Opp., Awarua) who stressed the tael that in any criticism he made of the Bill he wished to be helptul to the Minister. If the Bill helped in securing the efficiency of the territorial forces then it would be successful, but if it did not, then it would be a failure. He advocated that some senior officer of the volunteer force should be added to the personnel of the board in an advisory capacity. The proof of the success of the Minister of Defence would be the effectiveness of our forces, say, at this time next year. Mr. Hargest referred to the depleted numbers of the volunteer forces and thought it would be wise to increase their strength and efficiency and also increase mechanisation. New Zealand's objective, he said, should be the provision of an adequate defence force for our own shores and also of a striking force elsewhere, il necessary. He stressed the importance of encouraging our young men to take an interest in the defence forces and said he was very sorry to see the telescoping of our defence units and he hoped that nothing would be done to take away names of the different regiments and the traditions surrounding them. He considered that volunteers should be offered higher rates of pay and stated that the pay rates in New Zealand did not compare favourably with those in Australia. He was sorry to see the abolition of specialised units in secondary schools and he advocated that there should be closer co-operation between the territorial officers and staff. The rates of pay of the permanent force N.C.O.’s and men should also be improved.

Changed Conditions Mr. H. M. Christie (Government, Waipawa) said that owing to the changed conditions there was not nearly the same chance of our requiring to send a force overseas as there had been in the past. As a result of the introduction of highpower bombers the problem of transporting troops overseas would be much more difficult than it had been. He did not believe there was as much danger of the Dominion being the subject of invasion by a hostile force as had been stated. He agreed that careful consideration would have to be given to the attraction of the right type of youth to enable us to build up efficient defence forces and said we should co-operate with Australia to the greatest extent possible to enable her to produce adequate military supplies for both countries. We must also see to it that transport services between Australia and New Zealand were maintained as well as tramport services in the Dominion. He was pleased to see that the Bill was not being discussed on party lines and said he felt sure that the build-ing-up of an efficient defence force was the desire of every member of the House. Mr. W. A. Bodkin (Opposition, Central Otago) also urged the necessity of the appointment of a territorial officer to the board and said it was necesary to raise the status of territorial officers ‘in general. He thought that if the Minister ot Defence organised a drive throughout the country to encourage the enlistment of men in the volunteer forces, at the same time seeking the co-operation c f the R.S.A. and other bodies, he would be surprised at the support he would receive. A well-equipped and efficient land force, he thought, would oe the best guarantee we could have of peace. Any air force that we could have would be so small that its effectiveness would be very doubtful and it would be a very expensive item indeed. He could not see this country Which could put up an effective resistance to the air force of any arge power which chose to attack us tnd said that any power which wished to attack us would send a .and force to occupy the country He did not believe that any enemy cour try would merely send a few ’planes to bomb our cities. Rev. Clyde Carr (Government Timaru) said he could not imagine how land forces could offer any resistance to aerial attack. Mr. Hargest: An air force cannot occupy a country. , Carr; Any c °untry which Wished to invade New Zealand would virtually be declaring war on the British Commonwealth and it would be unlikely to commence its attack an this Dominion. He did not think there was any immediate likelihood of this country being invaded for the reason stated. Share in Empire Defence .A'. Mc L’Roy (Opposition, Clutha) said it was very obvious that we must prepare ourselves for defence. It was the defence policy of the British Empire which enabled us to enjoy peace to-day and he emphasised the value of land forces in any defence scheme. We should make our voluntary system as attractive as possible to our young fellows and he suggested that better uniforms should be provided. He did not agree with the proposal for week-end camps because many people objected to spending m camp and consideration should be given to these objections. (Government, Lyttelton) said that military training m schools was to inculcate a desire for war in youthful minds and personally he would be prepared to see It eliminated altogether. One of the reasons why young men were not enlisting in the territorial forces was because the time for training clashed *-beir sports engagements. The debate was interrupted by the adjournment at 5.30 p.m. The second reading debate of the Army Board Bill was continued when the House resumed at 7.30 p.m. Mr. W. F. Endean (Opp., Parnell) said he did not agree with the contention that training received in the territorial force was of little use in practical warfare and he instanced the performance of the New Zealand troops at Gallipoli, toward whose success territorial training had played no

small part. The League of Nations had failed, he said, and the greatest force to stop war would be a collection of States sufficiently strongly armed to enforce a desire for peace. It behoved the Government to see that the mechanistion of our land forces was brought up to an efficient pitch and he considered we had been lagging behind a little in this respect up to the present. He thought there would be too many laymen on the proposed board and urged the Government to use every endeavour by means of propaganda and in other directions to foster an interest in defence. Sorry for the G.O.C. Mr. H. S. Kyle (Opp., Riccarton) said he felt sorry for the G.O.C. to-day for having to admit they could not get the young fellows of the country to come along and. train. He held the opinion that the land forces were the last line of defence and he referred to the value, despite mechanisation, of the horse to the army to-day. He suggested that the Government should encourage the breeding of suitable army-type horses by the provision of a bounty on lines similar to those adopted in England. Captain H. M. Rushworth (Country Party, Bay of Islands) considered that in a large measure reliance would have to be placed for the defence of the Dominion in the Air Force. Mr. E. P. Meachen (Government, Wairau) agreec with the previous speaker that more reliance would have to be placed in the Air Force and he thought that every effort should be made to develop the Dominion’s oil resources. As one who had enlisted in 1914 and gone through until the New Zealand troops had entered Germany, he rather agreed that territorial training was of little advantage under active service conditions.

Hon. G. W. Forbes said that defence was a matter for experts and should be left to them. He wished to assure the Government, however, that the House was unanimous in its approval of putting this country into an effective state of defence and he considered that New Zealand should do its share in preparation for the defence of the Empire. In fact, it was a duty to Britain that we should do so.

The Minister of Defence, Hon. F. Jones, in reply, thanked members generally for the reception of the Bill. He had noted there had been some dissatisfaction with the rates of pay for the permanent and volunteer forces. He was anxious to do the fair thing as far as the permanent forces were concerned but the present position was a legacy left him by the last Government, where three different rates of pay existed for men doing the same work. They had a plan for mechanisation and the general efficiency of the forces, which would be adhered to and they were endeavouring to make the land forces as efficient as possible. Concerning uniforms, he said they had agreed as far as possible that the forces should have new uniforms. Some regiments had demanded Highland uniforms. That was rather an expensive item but they would see what could be done.

With reference to specialist training for secondary school cadets, he had heard a competent opinion that this was of very little value. Reference had been made to the abolition of night training, but this was not compulsory. In conclusion, he said they were asking the heads of the departments in the Government service to co-operate in territorial training and would ask the people to do the same thing. The Bill was read a second time and the House adjourned at 10.30 p.m.