HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES.

Star (Christchurch), Issue 6314, 11 August 1888, Page 4

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES.

Friday, August 10. Yesterday afternoon Mr Taipua, Mr i Taiwhanga, and Mr Pratt spoke until j 5.10 p.m., when Mr Kebvbs (Inangabua) kept the debate goiDg till the 5.30 adjournment. Mr Pbboevaii asked whether the House | musk necessarily adjourn for dinner on occasions of this kind. Me Hamlik said he was not inclined to take the responsibility on himself of alter- | ing the practice that had prevailed in the House for the last ten or fifteen years, and the usual adjournment -would, therefore, take place. EVENING SITTING. The House resumed at 7.30 p.m. ' Mr Reeves continued speaking against the Bill till 7.45. Mr Seddon said during the dinner adjournment two Native chiefs, Major Kemp and a Wairarapa chief, had expressed a desire to be heard at the bar of the House on these Bills, and he asked the Premier to consent to that which he thought would have a pood effect and would relieve Messrs Taiwhanga and Taipua of some responsibility. Sir H. Atkinson said he should be glad to hear some proposal from Mr Taiwhanga on the subject. Mr Taiwhanga asked whether tlio Premier would consent to the Native chiefs being heard at the bar of the House. If that were agreed to, he would : allow Clause 4, which they had been stone- 1 walling, to pass. Mr Taipua said they had had a long ] discuesion on this matter, and they wished i it brought to an end and to leavs it in the hands of the chiefs that were to be brought to the bar of the House. Mr Cakeoll expressed pleasure at the i remarks of his colleagues, Measr3 Tai- \ whanga and Taipua, and complimented them on the vigour with which they had carried on the debate up to this time. Ho hoped when the Native chiefs were heard that the dispute would be ended. Sir H. Atkinson asked whether Messrs Taipua and Taiwhanga would give their word to withdraw all stonewalling of the Bills, and only make reasonable commenta on them, on condition that the two chiefs were heard at the bar of the House. Mr Taipua quite agreed with what the Premier said. He should be content with moving reasonable amendments after the chiefs were heard. Sir H. Atkinson understood that the two membeis pledged their word as chiefs that they would withdraw their stonewalling tactics. If that were co he should ask the House to pass the fourth clause, and he should then move to report progress, in order to allow the Native chiefs to be heard at the bar of the House. Sir G. Grey asked why they should pass this clause first. There were several amendments to be proposed to it. Sir H. Atkinson said, in the interests o? law and order, the clause should be passed, as they had been many hours now in discussing it. If they had any amendments to propose they might submit them at once, and they could be considered. Mr Cabboiii eaid Sir G. Grey's speech suggested that he wab not sincere in his advocacy of Native interests, as he had plainly told them that he had to consider the interests of the European population. He pointed out that while Sir G. Grey was Premier he had never brought in a single Act to benefit the Native people, and yet he always posed as a friend of the Natives. He also reminded the House that the clause in the Government Bill to which Sir G. Grey so much objected, went far beyond the clause in the Bill which the Natives themselves submitted for the consideration of the Government. Mr Seddon thought he should never hear a member of the Native race ask what Sir G. Grey had done. Sir George had done more for the Native race than any other member in the House. Sir G, Grey here rose, and said they were relieved from considerable difficulty, as the chiefs had stated that they were ready to be heard at the bar of the House before Clause 4 was passed, as they thought they might do some good; but they had no wish, to be heard afterwards. He entirely repudiated the attack made on him by Mr Carroll, and solemnly asserted that he was actuated solely by a desire to benefit the Natives themselves. Mr Fbasee said he should be compelled to join the stonewallers unless some restrictive clause such as that moved by Sir G. Grey was accepted. After further discussion, The Hon T. W. Hislop said the Native members perfectly understood the con- \ dition named by the Premier, on which j the Native chiefs were to be heard at the : Bar of the House, and he deprecated the attempts made by other members to induce the Native members to break their word. He also failed to see why interference j should take place in this matter between the Government and the Natives. Mr Eebves (St Albans) protested against the stonewalling tactics that had been indulged in for the laat twenty-four hours, and ho hoped every member of the House would make a stand for the honour and dignity of the Legislature, so that such tactics should not be repeated. Dr Fitchett moved that progress be reported, in order that the Natives might be heard at the bar of the House. Sir H. Atkinson said he waa quite agreeable to report progress if Clause <t were passed. The motion for reporting progress was lost on the voices. Sir G. Grby's amendment was also lost on the voices. I Mr Seddon moved a proviso to the'

clause, that no person or Corporation be entitled to purchase more than 10,000 acres of land, but afterwards withdrew it. Claxisa 4 was passed by 55 to 10. The Hon E. MrrcnEisoN' moved to report progress, which was agreed to. The Speaker laid on the table a petition he had received from twenty Native chiefs, | praying that the Native Lands BUI should J not be passed into law till the Natives had sufficient time to consider it fully. Sir H. Atkinson then moved that Mr Speaker invite the Native chiefs, Major Kemp smd Piripi to address the House at the bar on resuming after the supper adjournment. Agreed to. I AT THE BAR OP THE HOUSE. ! Major Kemp said he desired to thank the Speaker and House for being allowed to appear before them. The Native members, he asserted, had not been speaking their own words. They had been Bpeaking on behalf of the chiefs' now in Wellington, and of the Natives in the Colony. As to the Native Bills, they had not had time to consider them fully, and they had not forgot the promises made by the Premier last year, that those Bills would bo circulated amongst the Natives. He objected to the rating and taxing clauses in the Native . Land Bill, also to the clauses which threw open Native land. He had stated to the Chief Judge that he did not approve of : these measures, and that he thought they i were introduced in the interests of friend 3 of the Government. It appeared to him that no benefit could bo conferred on the women and children of the Native people if these Bills became law. Ho had fought; on the side of the Government, but his cervices did not appear, to be remembered, { and he saw now there was some evil in i store for him. He interpreted the word j "amendment " to mean that everything should be made straight, but he thought i that was a misnomer, as the Native Lands j Bill would make everything crooked. If a fair and just law were passed, they would come out of the daTk, and everything -would be light. All . the Natives asked for was a good law, and i the Government and members of the House I would have the administration of such a law. The reason they wiched those Bills to be postponed was because they wanted the Government to meet the Natives at a great meeting which was to bo held at Waitangi next year. They asked forthi3 favour, because their pasb experience of Native legislation was unfortunate. No definite promise had been made as to the taxing clauses ; they may be made to reappear in a few days, or next year, and it was on that account he asked to appear before the House. Ho wished it to be clearly understood that the Native chiefs and himself opposed the Government Bills altogether. Hiaweba wished long life and happiness to the Speaker, the Government, and the members of the House, and ho ! felt grateful for being allowed to come j before them. He said he and other chiefs came there in support of the petition, now before the House,r e3pectin g the Native Bills. The chiefs maintained that they had not yet had an opportunity of fully considering them, and he thought it was only just to the Natives that those Bills should be postponed for the present, until they were referred to the large meeting at Waitangi. They trusted Government would act in the same way as the previous Government did with respect to the Bill brought in by Mr Ballance. The chiefs further thought that both races should have time to consider those measures, so that when they were passed they might be good law. They also should remember that both races were living together, and they should endeavour to make good laws for the benefit of both.

The Speaker thought he could say on | behalf of himself and his brother members that they had heard with very great . pleasure the frank expression of opinion j with -which the chiefs had favoured them. j He himself trusted that the sfcraiglati forward language they had used would have a beneficial effect when the measures were under discussion, and that fair and full consideration would be given to all amendments that might be moved. Tho chiefs then withdrew from the Chamber. Sir H. Atkinson moved — "That the House, at its rising, adjourn till Monday at half-past two for Government business." Agreed to. NATIVE IiAND BILL IN COMMITTEE. The House then went into Committee for further consideration of the Native Land Bill. Mr Hutchison moved — " That Clause 5 be retamed with certain provisos." Clause 5 provided that instruments under which the Natives held land, subject to restriction on alienation, shall be construed as if the words declaring restriction were omitted from those instruments. After some discussion, the clause providing for the removal of restrictions was retained in the Bill by 28 to 23. Clause 6, relating to taxing Native lands, was struck out. Mr Cadhan moved a new clause, that the Crown might resume any auriferous land sold by the Natives, upon payment of fair compensation. Agreed to. Mr Beetham moved a new clause, j enabling trustees for persons under disability to renew leases. j Agreed to. | NATIVE LAND COURT. The Native Land Court Act Amendment Bill was committed. Mr Ballance suggested that the Bill be postponed till Monday, on account of the lateness of the hour. . He felt sure there would be no organised opposition to it, and that; it would not take more than two hours. Mr Cakboll moved that progress be reported, which was agreed to on the voices. The House rose at 1.35 a.m., after sitting for thirty-five hours.