BIBLE-IN-SCHOOLS.

Timaru Herald, Volume XIC, Issue 13330, 6 July 1907, Page 2

BIBLE-IN-SCHOOLS.

DISCUSSION IK TIMARI'. MAIX SCHOOL COMMITTI-IK'S FINDING. The Timaru Main School Committee, at their meeting on Thursday evening, discussed at some length a circular which has been sent to all the committees in th? Colony, asking for a vote " Ves or Xo" to the question —"Are you in favour of Bible reading in public schools, subject toithexe conditions ''. (1) The Bible to be read as a classic; (2| Xo continentsallowed. exc;pt geogiaphica!. grammatical or historical: (3) The State school tea-, cher only to supervise the Bible reading; (4) Any'teailKt- or scholar having/ :i conscientious objection may be excused from the Bible lesson." Tlii- chairman said this was an important question, and he hoped the committee would give it very cateful consideration. Mr Boothroyd said the question could not be answered with a simple Yes or Xo. It. seenid to him that conditions 2 and 5 would stop a good deal of good woik now- being done, and he could not agree to that, as it would throw them back further than they were at present, r Mr Voge'.er suggested that a qualified vote could be sent. t Mr Per.we was totally against the proposal.—(The chairman: Bear. hear). —The national system was doing good woik. and Bible 'reading would spoil it. and give the Roman Catholics a good excuse for demanding a grant. Mr Vogelcr said that bogey had been' run long enough. He would rather take the whole scheme than none at all. They were asked to make suggestions as well as to vote, and they could qualify • their vot.-. The question had been a burning oik for many years; plebiscite after plebiscite had 'been taken, and the results had always given a large majority in favour of Bible reading, but in. some way these results had produced nothing, lc had b.en proposed in the House to take a Referendum, but that had never been done either. -As one interested in a Sunday school he had been struck by the lamentable ignorance of children of the pure'y historical facts of the Bible, and if .someth.ng could be done to lessen that ignot mice it should be done. The .Bible was. in a sen.-e, the groundwork of English Literature; at. all events; it had a veiy important influence upon it, and the principal Biblical facts .should be made known to the children. ■ •

Mr A. Wilson spoke of the value of the Bible reading lesson, to . -which* he had been accustomed at school in the Old Country. The children might not take much "notice of it at' the time, but in after life it cnone back to them. Young Xew Zealanders were wanting in reverence for sacred things .and he attributed that to'the ab.-ence of Bible reading in schools. He favoured the conscience clause. Mr Penrose said that the introduction of Bible reading would break up the national system.- Mr Wilson's' experience was in a* land of denominational schools. Here all denominations had to be provided for in the school. The Kev. A. E. Hunt (chairman) suppo. Ed that people were practically unanimous as to the desirability of a"knowledg« of the Bible; but d.ffet'ences of opinion came in when it came to methods. In the old country there was just now going on a tremendous war on the subject among the churches over this question, and some of the most evangelical, earnest and devoted numbers of the ministry —the thought the majority of them—had come to the conclusion that the only solution was to do away with the Bible from the schools altogether, and have a purely secular education system. It was ail very well to say " Let us read the Bible as "a classic only." It could not be done. The theological element could not be,kept out, if they were, to have " historical" comments. ' The practical difficulty had cropped up everywhere, that no committee had been ab!e to agree on what should be read and what should not, and no hope was entertained of getting an" acceptable text-book. The only thing was to have the- present system, with the present open door for. representatives of . the various churches to enter the schools and give Bible lessons, outside of school, hours; or with. the sanction of the committees, within school hours, and apart from the State school teachers. He, was strongly opposed to the conscience clause, especially as applied to teachers, for if a teacher declined for conscentious reasons to give Bible lessons he would be a: marked men, and it would militate again!-1 his getting another - appointment. Mr Boothroyd interposed : That if that were so it would show the trend of public opinion. Mr Hunt, continuing, said no teacher should be subject to a ban of that kind. He alsi> objected to it on the score of the children; those who took advantage of the cc/n>cienie clause would be marked and sneered at by the rest.—(Mr Vogeler : question.) Mr Penrose believed they would, and it would be taken .to be a reflection on the patents. Mr Hunt said he would like to know that the children were leading the Bible, but he was .vure the Wellington suggestion' would not answer. 'Mr Penrose could not see what good reading passage.? of the Bible without comment or explanation could be. The proper place for religious instruction was in the home. Mr Boothroyd inquired whether this "Citizen's' Committee" was the same as the one Dr. Gibb. was associated with, but no one could say. • Mv Boothroyd thought it was a new association, with very different ..ideas from Dr. Oribb.s' Committee. Personally, he stood between Mr Vogeler and Mr Hunt. He was quite opposed to restricting the supervision of .the Bible lessons to' the State school teachers, as* that would cut out those ministers and others who were doing good work now, and lie would rather have things remain as they were, and retain the voluntary system, with all its opportunities for expansion.-. There ought to be something more done. As a professedly Christian nation ,with prayers■ read in the Houses of Parliament, he could not understand why they should not have religious instruction in the schools. Mr McCahon .'aid he agreed entirely with Mr Vogelt-r and Mr Wilson. He'related his own experience in a national school in Ireland, wheiv the Bible was read, and Catholics a.s well as Protestants attended voluntarily an extra lesson once a week. '1 hv;e children only took advantage of a conscience clause in connection with this lesson, and they were never boycotted or persecuted for it. That was one of the bogeys. Mr McCahon spoke of the influence of Bible reading in childhood in the circumstances of after life. Mr Vogeler recalled his school days' expsrience in suppdit of Mr McG'ahon's assertion that the conscience clause caused trouble. He believed they were agreed about the ne.-d for Bible reading; the difficulty was th.-i machinery. (The chairman : Hear, hear.) Th.' chaiiniin said there was some consultation going on among fha ministers of the town ju.'t now about attending at the schools to give Bible lessons. Mr McCahon said there were not ministers enough to do the work, even in the town schools only. Mr Penrose thought the churches and Sunday schools should do the work. Mr Vogeler replied that- they could not compel the children to attend. Mr Boothroyd snid lie could not vote Xo. and he could not vote Yes, without a. inod'tication. so he would move: "That this committee agrees to the reading of the Bible in schools, but does not approve of the restriction of the teaching to members of the staff only."

Mr Penrose: Docs that mean that anyone can step in and teach religious subjects? Mr Bonthroyd : That is the law now. Anyone, with the consent of tlie committee, may do so ; and. there is a. strong tendency to <xleml that system. Mr McCahon seconded the motion, and it was put- and carried, the chaiiman and Mr Penrose dissenting.