BISMARCK IN 1867

Otago Witness, Issue 3201, 21 July 1915, Page 82

BISMARCK IN 1867

REMARKABLE INTERVIEW. HISTORICAL FORECAST AND THE EVENTS. (From our London Correspondent.) The Daily Telegraph, on January 12, scored a distinct journalistic success. _ It gave a remarkable interview which William Beatty Kingston had with Bismarck in 1867. Kingston in those days was foreign correspondent to the Daily 'Telegraph, and he went to Berlin and had a “tour hours’ palaver with the Man.’’ He sent homo two accounts of the interview —one for publication and the other for tire private information of Lord Burnham. It is this letter which Lord Burnham has discovered among his old letters and papers. It is interesting to note that Lord Burnham, in 1867, pur-, posely asked Kingston to have a talk with Count Bismarck, because “I had constantly in my mind a belief that the day was gradually approaching when France and Germany would be at war.” Bismarck believed in peace, and for many reasons. “I do not believe for a moment that France will fight us alone, for, reckoning that every Prussian is it least as good as every Frenchman, we are numerically stronger than she. The attack must come from her; wo shall never begin a war, if war there ever be, for wo have nothing to gain. Suppose France entirely conquered and a Prussian garrison in Paris, what are we to do with our victory ? We could not even decently take Alsace, for the Alsaciens are become Frenchmen, and wish to remain so. Belgium wo do not want; besides, England guarantees her integrity. Therefore, should this possib’Hty which is always being dinned into my ears as a probability ever come to pass. Franco will undoubtedly attack us. in which case, if she stand alone, she is lost. . . . Therefore they sock for allies. Will they find them? I will tell jou why I think not. “Franco, the victor, would be a danger to everybody, but Prussia to nobody. That is one strong point.” ATTITUDE OF ENGLAND. Bismarck continued: —“England wishes to see a Power in Europe strong enough to counterbalance France That is the reason she supported and sympathised with Austria as long as Austria seemed to bo strong; that is the reason why 1 told the King, when ho wished me to carry out the execution in Denmark alone, ‘We must_ have Austria with us, or England will join her against us’: and that is the reason why England is now turning towards-us- —because she sees in us the Continental counterpoise to France, which you English, in spite of your loudly-protested alliance with Napoleon, are too sensible not to understand the necessity of. Your alliance has already cost you dearly enough in the loss of Continental influence, and I should not wonder if the proud English people wore to get tired some day of playing a bad second fiddle to the old foo they have so often conquered. You will never take up arms against us in the cause of Franco, NO FEAR OF AUSTRIA. “I have as little fear of Austria. Austria is like a house built of bad bricks, which, however, are kept together by an excellent mortar. How do you call it? Cement—that cement is her German population. Whatever good has been done in her barbarous provinces has been done by the Germanising of their institutions —everywhere in Austria German is spoken—the inhabitants of the different Slav, Magyar, and Latin provinces must use Gorman to understand one another. An alliance, therefore, with France, having for its purpose the arrest of German unity in its majestic progress and the devastation of Gorman territory would bo fatal to 1 Austria whichever way the tide of victory sot. She would surely bo ruined through such an alliance, and she knows it. I am not the least apprehensive of nn Austro-Fronch alliance, I give you my word of honour. QUITE SAFE .FROM RUSSIA. “Russia will never join France against us—of that bo assured, —it is impossible 1

(Bismarck said this with great emphasis, leaning on both his arms half across the table towards mo, and looking into my eyes with the greatest earnestness.) “ Russia- is in a hom’d state, and a*big war is out of the question for her till she has set her house in order. If I were the Emperor's Prime Minister (as he very much wished me to be six years ago), 1 should begin by cutting the army down to exactly half its present number and knocking the privileges of the Tchinovnik on the head. That foul and useless Tchin causes half Russia’s misfortunes. Just now public feeling in Russia is as bad as can be against France—but, whatever happens, make your mind up that we are quite safe from Russia. NAPOLEON’S MISTAKES. “ What do I think might bring about war': Of course, an excuse would not be wanting if the French really needed one, but I think the greatest danger of all proceeds from Napoleon’s vacillating state of mind. He is become old —but he is also become younger—-that is to say, he indulges in vagaries, gives way to impulses, and allows his wife to exercise a great deal too much influence over him. The Mexico business was her doing, as I suppose you know. Ho is not tlio man he used to be, and Europe will never bo safe whilst his present state of intellect continues. Another ground of danger is the intense ignorance and mendacity of the men who represent Franco everywhere. Look round Europe for one capable or honest French agent! All are knaves, or so crassly ignorant and prejudiced that an intelligent schoolboy is worth all of them put together. • ( GERMAN AMBITIONS. “Jou would like to know something about our plans, our aggregation projects, and our amb.tious, would you not’: I will tell you exactly what they are, and only two or throe besides the King and myself know. First of all there is Austria. Now, the German provinces of Austria, except the Tyrol and Salzkammergut, both of which arc blindly Catholic and Hapsburg, may experience a strong gravitaffon towards us I do not deny it for a moment. But I assure you if I were offered Upper and Lower Austria to-morrow. I .should refuse them. They are too far off; there are Bohemia, Austrian Silesia, Moravia, w.th three-fifths Slav populations, between us. Wo don’t want any part of Austria—let her get strong and be our ally. We wish it clearly understood that if Austria must disintegrate, we don’t want any of the pieces. PEACE WITH FRANCE. “ There is nothing in our attitude to annoy or alarm France —I think, barring the accidents at which I have hinted, there is nothing to prevent the maintenance of peace for 10 or 15 years, by which time the French will have got accustomed to German unity, and will consequently have ceased to care about it. “ I told our generals this spring, when they endeavoured to prove to me by all sorts of _ arguments that we must begt the French if wo went to war with them: ‘lf you can make it as clear to me as that God be (verbatim, K.) that we can crush France and occupy Paris, I will still do all I can to prevent war; for you must remember, gentlemen, a war between such near neighbours and old enemies as France and Prussia, however it may turn out, is only the first of at least six; and supposing we gained all six, what should wo have succeeded in doing? Why, in ruining France, certainly —and most likely ourselves into the bargain; do you think a poor, bankrupt, starving, ragged neighbour is as desirable as a wealthy solvent, fat, wellclothcd one? France buys largely of us, and sells us a great many things we want—is it in our interest to ruin her completely? “I strove for peace then —and I will do so as long as may be—only, remember, Gorman susceptibilities must be respected, or I cannot answer for the people—not even for the King! The French, lam quite aware, are buying horses and provisions. That docs not frighten me. Their harvest is a bad one, and they are quite right to take precautions against distress. They cannot want provisions for a war with us, for in such a war they must be the aggressors, and if they invade Germany they will find food and provender enough for 10 French armies. Their preparations do not disquiet me in the least. We are always ready. DENMARK AND RUSSIA. “ The Danes are giving us a good deal of unnecessary trouble. I would meet them halfway, if it were not that our people ere so mixed in with them in the districts they want coded. I know what would happen to our people who have compromised themselves with us during the last year, if we abandoned them. It is not the Danish Government, but the small officials and the people who would revenge themselves—and then we should have another cry of distress rousing Germany and stirring up the whole ugly question again—besides giving a chance to Franco, which I don’t mean to do if I can help it. There are 10, 20, in some places as much as 30 per cent., of German in those parts all the fuss is being made about —I cannot and dare not abandon them ! “ One more word about Russia. Russia is like a strong and healthy man who is attacked by an illness. If he will only .ako advice and stop at home for two or three days, ho will get well immediately, and bo as strong as over. But if ho will insist upon going out, walking about and transacting business abroad as if he were well, then his malady will lay firm hold on him, and perhaps he will die. Two or three days in the life of a man mean 10, 20, or 30 years in the life of a nation. Russia must ‘ stop at homo.’ She has got a great future—her highest nobles are intelligent and honourable—her peasants are the best fellows in the world—it is in the middle that she is rotten —the official nobilitv of Tchin js a virulent ulcer eating away her bowels,” Kingston concludes: “When I left him he gave mo his portrait and autograph, saying that he wished to make quite sure I should not forgot him; and as we shook hands < he, as it were, summed up; ‘I believe in peaoo because, as I have told you. Franco dare not fight us alone, and nobody will help her. In the East, Russia would like to start a disturbance, but is impotent to support it. Poor little Charles of Ilohonzollern is a failure, and complains of the way the Russians behave to him. He is painfully homesick. Good-night! I have been glad to see you again; and when you want to know the truth about anything particular, ask me, and I will tell you.’