STRAIGHT TALK.

Otago Witness, Issue 2950, 28 September 1910, Page 53

STRAIGHT TALK.

POLITICIANS HIT OUT. A FINANCIAL TRANSACTION. (From Odr Owh Correspondent.) WELLINGTON, September 23. " I'll talk to you straight shortly," remarked Sir Joseph Ward to Mr Massey ir the House of Representatives to-day. " You will get it back straight," was Mr Massey *s rejoinder. It subsequently appeared that the leaders of the respective parties had in mind their dispute as to the cost of the conversion of the half-million guaranteed debentures in 1893-4. On a recent occasion the Prime Minister stated in reply to Mr Massey that the transaction had resulted in a net increase to the liability of the Dominion of £19,629, whilst there had been a decrease in the interest by £2519. Early to-day Mr Massey read a report which he had obtained from Messrs Ban, Leary, and Williams, accountants, of Wellington. It was briefly to the effect that the increased liability to the Dominion on account of the conversion was £279,702. whilst the interest had increased by £6325. Mr Massey said he agreed that the report should be made a parliamentary paper. The Prime Minister said that it was no extraordinary thing for Mr Massey to have turned back for the third time tins session on the subject. He did not know of any more unfair fighting —he called it mean fighting; in fact, contemptible fighting. What was the object? In winding up his remarks Mr Massey had said : " If this is right, what about the sinking funds?" In the whole of it he was attacking a dead man. Mr Massey : That is absolutely incorrect. Sir Joseph Ward : I accept your statement, and I will give you proof. Continuing Sir Joseph said that this attack must be intended to apply to him. Not a thing connected witli it had been carried out by him. Mr Ballance had undertaken the conversion to save the country going on tq the market for a loan. There' was a final statement in Messrs Barr, Leary, and Co.'s letter which gave the whole show away. They said: "In considering the matter of interest the question as to whether the net amount, received from the sinking fund is or is not used for reproductive works has not been taken into consideration, as it is outside my province, and probably not ascertainable." The whole question of the advisability of the conversion hinged on the necessity for providing funds for the public works. It had achieved two objects—(l), Provided money to carry on works; (2), enabled the Dominion to keep out of the money market. As a result of the conversion there had been effected a saving of over £2OOO per annum, where as if a loan had been raised for the amount at 3A per cent, it would have cost the Dominion" over £6OOO for interestalone. Why did the firm add the paragraph which he had read? Mr T. E. Taylor: It was impertinence. Sir Joseph Ward: Yes, it was gross impertinence. Proceeding, Sir Joseph asked why the firm had ignored what New Zealand had saved over the transaction? Mr Massey, referring to the subject, said that he had a few words to say to the Prime Minister, and he hoped he-would remember them. Sir Joseph Ward had worked himself up to such a fearful and wonderful state of excitement that be would be sorry to emulate him. fn the course of his remarks the Prime Minister had made an unfair reference to himself when he had stated that he bad attacked a dead man by something which he had done. Was he »wave of the fact that he (Mr Massey) had never met th: late MiSalience, for whom he had, however, the greatest respect. " I never attack a dead man," remarked Mr Massey with warmth, "nor do I shelter myself behind a deal man." After stating that he would give Sir Joseph Ward some time to think over what he had said. Mr Massey again proceeded to deal with the transaction. He said that he had come across it. whilst looking into the question of sinking funds. In the Financial Statement for 1894, when Sir Joseph Ward was Treasurer, he stated that three conversions had taken place during the year. When he looked into the transaction he found that it had been very unsatisfactory to the Dominion. When he brought up the matter this session Sir Joseph Ward bad rudely contradicted him, and later he had slammed a paper on the table giving details of the transaction as if that were to be the last word on the matter. If Sir Joseph Ward thought that that would be the end of it he never made a bigger mistake in his life. Accompanied by a member of the House, whose word would be taken by every member, he went to Messrs Barr, Leary, and Co.. who he had been led to understand were one of the leading funis of accountants in the Dominion. He gave them no written instructions. Mr Buchanan, who went with him. would sav that all that happened was that he told Mr Leary that a dispute had arisen on the point, that some members thought a bargain had been made, whilst be thought a big loss had been made. In reply' Mr Leary had said that if he were wrong he would tell him so. His report was a very careful one, and the Prime Minister did not like it, for it would now be recorded in the journals of the House along with the other documents bearing on the subject. This report bore out his opinion, and showed that the Prime Minister, who was the Treasurer, was wrong. In his cooler moments the Prime Minister would cagiet the attitude which

he had taken up." I don't know if Sir Joseph Ward intends to attack me again," added Mr Massey, "but J might say that if anybody hits me below the belt I do my best to hit him in the eye."