Meetings.

Otago Witness, Issue 1387, 29 June 1878, Page 8

Meetings.

THE CHAMBER OP COMMERCE ON THE RAILWAY QUESTION. A , special meeting of the members of the Chamber of Commerce was held on the afternoon of the 24th, in the City Council Chambers, to consider the question of the site of the Railway Passenger and Goods Stations. The following members were present : — Messrs T. S. Graham (chairman) : Webb (secretary) ; Leary, G. Fenwick, Paterson, Wbitelaw, Sconlar, G. BpII, Mackerraa, Hogg, Davie, Ramsay, Fish, T<?WBley, J. Mills, D. Proudfoot, Geo. Turnbnll, A. Burt, H. Maclean, G. M'Lean, M.H.R., G. W. Eliott, Hodgkina, Walcott, Mudie, E. J. Spence, Matheson, and Hayes. The Chairman (MrjT. 8, Graham) said that

as he was not pre-ient at the previous meeting of the Chamber when tho officers were elected, hefdesired now, on assuming the chair, to thank the members oi the Chamber for having elected him to the office of Chairman. He hoped the attendance before him was an augury that in future members would attend better. The business for which they had gathered together was, aa advertised, to consider the question of the site ot the Railway Goods Station, and to give a reply upon this question to the Hon. R. Stout. At the invitation of the Hon. R. Stout, he, the Vice-Chairman, and the Secretary, had attended, as representing the Chamber, a conference upon this question on Saturday ; but he did not think he need occupy their time with the details of what passed there, inasmuch as it would be explained by abler hands, and bad been fairly reported in the papers. At his special request, on behalf of the Chamber, Mr W. N. Blair had kindly attended the meeting, and had brought with him the maps showing the different proposals. As Mr Blair was much better acquainted with the question than he (ihe speaker) was, he would ask Mr Blair to kindly come forward, and then any members who desired it would have an opportunity of asking him any questions on the subject they were about to discuss. Mr Tewsley said that before Mr Blair explained anything to tho Chamber, there was a matter he would like to bring forward. He thought it would be only fair and right, in order to have all sides represented, that Mr Simpson, the Engineer of the Harbour Board, should be present, so that if there was anything misstated— unintentionally, of course, for he did not suppose any intentional misstatements would be made— Mr Simpson might check it, I so that the deliberations of the Chamber might be guided right. He moved—" That Mr Simpson be invited to attend." Mr R. Wilson seconded the motion, which waa carried nem. con. Mr Webb said : Mr Chairman — In order to save time, and to render our discussion of the subject before us systematic and orderly, I ask your permission to state that there were three different proposals placed before the members of the Conference on Saturday. The first proposal is that which the Harbour Board have sketched out, as a substitution for the one which the Conference of February 20th adopted. It is very similar to that in its character, except that it confines the station to this side of Castle street, instead of placing it on the further side of Castle street. Upon that I suggested a modification which would avoid carrying the passenger and goods station through the old Supreme Court-house and the Gaol, his Worship the Mayor having said that the objection to close Castle street might, in the face of a grave public necessity, probably be waived by the Council. That was thought well of by all the members present. The adoption of that plan is, however, entirely dependent upon the interpretations Sir John Coode would place upon his own report ; or in case he adheres to what is supposed to be his recommendation, whether the Government will adhere to Sir John Coode. I think that modification of the Conference plan will meet with approval. The other proposals are those which were before the Conference, and have been debated by various bodies of citizens who felt their interests touched by the one or the other. The one is to place the goods sheds from Jetty street northwards, and the uther to place the goods sheds on the north side of the present Railway Station site. With regard to this plan the same modification for the closing of Castle street would bring the goods sheds, from being on the other side of Stuart street, to be chiefly on this side Stuart street, opposite che Supreme Courthouse and Gaol. There is a fourth proposal, which is to take the Crawford street block and the land north of Stuart street ; but that of course involves the cancelling of the leases which were sold on Wednesday lost. It would be desirable, I think, however, that these four proposals should be taken seriatim by this meeting, in order to avoid the discussion of a number of resolutions that would scarcely have that definite bearing on the proposals put to us by the Hon. Mr Stout, which it is necessary to have in order to give him a clear and decided answer. Mr Davie asked if Mr Blair was in a position to state the interpretation the Government put on Sir John Coodb's report with respect to the question of reclamation? Mr Blair : The matter came up before I left Wellington on Wednesday last, and the reading the Government put on Sir John Coodft's report was clearly and emphatically to the effect that there was to be no reclamation for any purpose whatever outside the line of the present Cross Wharf — that 13 500 ft from Crawford street. Mr Davie then asked if Mr Blair was able to state whether the Government were prepared to abide by that report, and see that it was given effect to? Mr Blair : I cannot answer for the Government, but so far as I understand the intention was to stick to Sir John Coode's recommendation. The Mayor paid there was a difference of opinion as to what Sir John Copde's report meant. He had seen a letter, during the day, from one who was with Sir John Coode m Wellington, which contained a statement to this effect— that Sir John Coode objected to the extra reclamation proposed by the Conference, and recommended that the original plan be adhered to. Now, as a matter of fact, he (the Mayor) understood that while the embankment was being carried out by cutting down Maitland street, which takes a line, something like 800 ft from Crawford street, Sir John Coode saw that work going on and made no objection to it. He thought the fact that no objection was taken to that showed that when he said the original plan, he meant the original plan sanctioned by the Government, which was something like 1500 ft. at right angles with Crawford street. Mr Davie said they had at all events a statement aa to how the Government interpreted Sir John Coode's report, and bo far as they were aware the Government meant to give effect to it. He would like to make a few n<> marks, and probably conclude with a resolution ; but he really felt great reluctance in speaking on the question of the railway station, &c,, at all, because the matter had now arrived at that stage when no one seemed to be permitted to make a remark contrary to certain views expressed and opinions held by certain gentlemen in the Harbour Board, without it being immediately set down, to personal interest or some other improper motive. He desired once for all to say in the discussion of this question he had no axe to grind, and no interest, pecuniary or otherwise, aud that his sole aim and object was to secure this, that the goods stations be placed in such a position as to ensure the greatest amount of convenience to the parties using them. That was the principle which had guided him throughout tho discussion. They did not need to go back on "the long and angry discussion winch had taken place ujjon this subject, and which finally ended in what was called the Conference plan. That Conference plan was tl\o result of a cpmpromifio arrived at between the various parties supposed to be interested iv this question, and involved a certain principle. The principle, he believed, upon which they had proceeded wag that of recognising the absolute necessity of the goods ehed being so placed as ,

to run south of Rattray street. To enable this scheme to be cairied out, as they were aware, a very large amount of reclamation was required — such an amount of reclamation ad would go far Ijeyond what Sir John Coode considers would be the safe limit to which they might reclaim in the Upper Harbour. He thought that Sir John Coode in giving expression to this opinion was simply giving the weight of his great reputation to an opinion similarly expressed by all men who were competent to judge of lurbour works when asked. Seeing this reclamation cannot be carried out, the Conference plan, he considered, became impracticable. The next plan was called the Cumberland street plan. This had emanated from the Harbour Board as a substitution for the Conference plan. If this plan were practicable, he, for one, would bewilling to accept it, because he found it recognized the principle that had guided the Conference in coming to their determination — ] viz.: that the goods sheds should continue to run in a southerly direction from Rattray street. But this plan seemed also impracticable, because to carry it out, further reclamation was necessary. Then there was a plan, which however it might have been regarded by others — he had regarded as Mr Tewsley's plan. This plan contemplated putting the goods sheds running north from Stuart street, in the direction of Pelcihet (?) Bay. He strongly objected to goods sheds being placed there, as they would be so far removed from the centre of the business portion of the city, and would be practically so inconvenient that he felt the j adoption of this plan was out of the pale of dis- | cuasion altogether.' As to what was to be done, he would revert to the principle which the conference bad arrived at— which was to place the sheds in a southerly direction from Rattray street. Here was a little difficulty, inasmuch ashewould.be met by the statement thatitmight involve encroaching on the Crawford street block if the leases had been sold. How about the position then ? Well, he thought it necessary to look somewhat into tho history of this sale, because he candidly confessed, eofar as he was able to see, there were circumstances in connection with it, which, to say the least of them, wero of a remarkably questionable character. Immediately the Harbour Board resolved on the sale of these leases, it was necessary to work up imblic opinion to ihe fact that the sale was to be made, and that was done through the medium of the Press, and so skilfully was this done, and it succeeded so well, that on the morning of the sale we had it stated that they had at length succeeded in getting the Government to forego all opposition at the very moment the very opposite, was the fact; but tho information from which the public would have been able to judge of that that fact was carefully kept back until two days after the sale. In order to bear out what he said, he referred to the newspapers of the 21st June, in which were published a telegram from the Minister of Public Works addressed to the Harbour Board, and also in the saice issue the Harbour Board's reply to that telegram. The telegram from the Minister of Public Works was dated the day before the sale, and in the first place it bore on the face of it, that such was the indecent haste of the Harbour Board to proceed with the sale, that they had not afforded the Government an opportunity of seeing the plan, or of being in a position to know what exactly was being offered. In the next place the telegram said : "I understand from your telegram that two chains have been reserved outside tbe line of Crawford street for railway purposes, and this is to be extended half a chain further so as to secure \fhat, in the opinion of the officials of the department, is very inadequate provision for railway requirements." He (the speaker) would put it to the meeting to say if that was to be interpreted on the part of the Harbour Board as an entire withdrawal of opposition on the part of the Government to the sale of the leases. Mr Tewsley : That came on the day of the sale. Mr Davie: Well, sir, that telegram was received from the Government. Supposing that 2h chains had been reserved, I auk how far that would have extended in the Crawford street block ? Mr Blair : It would have taken in half of the r.ew street. Mr Davie : And thereby have enclosed all the spctions on this side of Vogel street ? Mr Blair : Yes. Mr Davie : Well with that telegram in hand I think the least the Harbour Board could havo done would have been at all events to postpone the sale, until some specific understanding was come to on the subject. I say, speaking personally now, if we adopt this principle— the principle of the Conference — that the goods sheds shall proceed in a southerly direction from Rattray btreet, and if it should involve the necessity of the Government requiring back such a number of these sections as are necessary to carry out this work, I say it ought to be done, and the consequence be on the head of the Harbour Board ; they are the parties to blame for the haste and hurry with which they proceeded to that sale. To bring the matter back to a practical bearing, the view I take is this, that tbe railway station, the passenger station, should remain where they are, and that the goods sheds should be constructed so as to run in a southerly direction from Ratiray street, and thereby embodying tbe principle which the Conference arrived at, With the view of giving practical direction to the discussion on the subject, I shall move — "That, in the opinion of this Chamber, the railway passenger station should remain where it is, and the goods station be constructed as running in a southerly, direction from Rattray street, and thereby to carry ou* tho proposal embodied in the Conference plans." The Chairman mentioned that on the day before the sale he had telegraphed as follows to Sir George Grey :— Harbour Board still persist ia selling to-morrow Crawford ttroet block and other portions of reclaimed land, .»b3olutoly necessary for railway purposes Mr Maoandrew being outside of to'egraphic communion, tion disadvtntigc. Can Government do nothing to itop, or, at any :ato, postpone the Bile. To this ho received the following reply :—: — Land cannot bole-wed without sanction of Government. The Attorney-General, whs has been requested to 'act on part of Government, will no doubt have tali en care that no land absolutely essential for railway purposes is disposed of. Mr J. Cargill seconded Mr Davie's resolution. Mr Wilson : Am I to understand if that is carried out Crawford street will be acquired ? Mr Davie : Not necessarily so. I leave it to the parties concerned to decide how it is to be carried out. Mr EISH said that in the consideration of this question he thought it was very impolitic to attempt to hoodwink any member of the Chamber by paying the Crawford street block would be taken under the plan proposed. If tho motion before the meeting was carried out, the Government or tbe Harbour Board must pay to purchasers of the sections very laiye compensation, a : therefore, if Me Davie desired the meetiv. c-fo>c -fo> understand that tbatdid not necessarily enter liiro tLe consideration of this subject, it w^s nimply moonshine. It appeared to him, now, as in the past, that the interests f rhe whole mercantile body in this town were to be sacrificed to tho selfish interests of the few. He thought the Chamber would be wise

if, instead of debating a question which would involve them in a serious loss — because if the land was to be again acquired and the purchaser compensated, the mercantile community would have to pay for it — it would be wiser for them to &cc whether all parties could not be accommodated, and the Haibour Board allowed to retain this very valuable block of l.md. It was n moet extraordinary thing that the mercantile interests in this and other places were to be continually tossed about, like a battle-df.re, according lo tho change of Government. The Government in office previous to the present one had adopted a plan allowing the Crawford street block. Mr Davie said that the Board had acted with indecent haste, and that tho Government were not aware of the plans of the Board. Surely Mr Davie knew well that the Board were selling on the plan adopted by the previous Government and assented to by the Governor in Council. After this a change of Government took place, and really to him it appeared that a change of Government included a change of ideas in the officers of the Government. The engineering officers of the Government appeared to change their opinions with as great a facility as the Government. A conference had been held with the Government officers, and they seemed to be perfectly satisfied with certain suggestions from the Board j but it appeared to him that with a change of Government, the engineers of the Government displayed a remarkable elasticity of ideas, and a disposition to change. They knew that it was Mr Macandrewwhohad set his face determinately against the Harbour Board having the Crawford street block, and no sooner did he become a member of the Government, and was appointed Minister of Public Works, then they felt the influence, of which the result was now before them. Sir John Coode, when in Dnnedin, had told the Chairman of tho Board and the Chairman of the Works Committee that the present position of the railway line was most improper, and he gave them to understand that he would not ©bject to the line being carried out in accordance with what they suggested, and that he was prepared to recommend that course, bnt no sooner did ho reach Wellington than his opinions weie transformed. This eminent I engineer, to whom the unfortunate Hai-bour Board would have to disgorge some L4OO orLSOO for throwing them over, hardly said any thing about the harbour, that was to come afterwards, but reported upon something he was not asked to 'report upon at all, and said defiantly that tho Crawford street block would be required for railway purposes. As was said in one of the papers tho other day, he might just as well have recommended the Government to alter the cab stand, as to have given an opinion on that question. There was an objection to having tbe goods stations at the north end of the town, and another objection to having them at the south end of the town, and he thought they might suit all parties by adopting the plan suggested by the Board, and preserve the Crawford street block for the benefit of the Board and the citizens. All who were interested in commerce knew that, if meMis were given to the Harbour Board to enable it to reduce tbe harbour dues and make Otago a free part, it would be for the welfare of the whole community. Why, he asked, should they Pacri fice the opportunity of making this a free port, so that the merchants would be able to compete fairly and favourably with other places in the Colony ? It seemed to him to be absolute nonsense to say that it was absolutely necessary for the Government to seize the Crawford Btreet block for railway purposes. To do that they must stop up Jetty street, and would the City Council allow that ? They would also have to practically stop up Ratfcray street, as it would be intersected by 20 or 30 lines of railway, and it would be impossible to carry dray traffic clown that street, and it would be a monstrous proposition to ask the citizens or the mercantile community to allow that to be done. The proposition made in the Cumberland street plan was fair, and did not involve any amount of reclamation which would jeopardise the tidal flow of the harbour. They should bearin mind that the plan upon which the Harbour Board had been acting was one that had received the nssent of the former Government. The Board thought that the Government were taking too much of this block, or the leases would have been sold two years ago, and the Government then only claimed the land now reserved. The Boara mu>t protest against being tossed about by successive Governments. He had no hesitation in saying, with all duo respect for Mr Macandrew, that he looked upon the whole of this opposition as emanating from the Hon. Mr Macandrew. Mr Macandrew had, he thought, determinedly sot his face upon getting that and for some purpose or other, and the merchants of the city shouid as determinedly set their faces against him having it. The Chairman remarked that in bis opinion the reference to the Hon. Mr Macandrew should not have been made, as it was aside from the matter under discussion. Mr Fish replied that Mr Macandrew's ; name was before them in connection with the telegrams received by^ the Chairman, and added that in hiH opinion the Chairman had very far exceeded his duty in telegraphing to the Government as he had done. Such action was, he considered, without any warrant, and extremely indiscreet. The Chairman raid that the telegram was not sent on his individual authority. It had been adopted by a committee of the ChUmber. Mr Geo. M'Lean (1V1.H.R.) considered that there was no occasion to be very thin-skinned in respect of making reference to the members of the Government, for he had been rather roughly treated in this way by the Chamber. He wished to state what took place with regard to this block ef land when he waa in tho Ministry, iv order to put the Chamber right. Mr Davie had declaimed against making any insinuations, and stated that he had no personal interests to serve, and then immediately attacked rhe Harbour Board. Mr Davie : Excuse me ; I made no insinuations : but an open charge. Mr Geo. M'Lean said [he took it that there was a very strong insinuation made by Mr Davie, but perhaps his perception in that respect might te a little delicate. Mr Davie said he had no personal interests to serve, but they all knew that ho was fond of dancing to a tune, and although he had no personal interest [ it is possible he mifjht have friends who were personally interested, and who wanted it carried in a certain way. He hoped that when Mr Davie again said he was not going to attack anybody ho would not do so. In his (Mr M'Lean 's) opinion the Harbour Board deserved a great deal of credit for the manner in which they bad acted. So far from what Mr Davie had said being a fact that the Government never gave its sanction for the block beini? sold by the Harbour Board, he could say that the Harbour Boai % d had had the sanction for a long time to sell the block as it had been sold, but burl wnnted soine- | thing more. He could assure them that for many anxious days' consideration, and after talcing the Engineers into tho Conference, and trying in every way not to thwart the Board, the late Government bad given that sanction. Their great desire bad been not to deprive- the Board of its income, because he felt that upon that depended the commercial success of Dunedin. So long as the Board did not interfere

with the working of the railways the Government bad given its sanction for the sale of the land, and that was done with the concurrence of all the Government Engineers. That Mr Davie should have brought forward a resolution Fsuch aa the one before the meeting, under the impression that the Chamber would be hoodwinked, was an action he would not have credited him with. He thought the Harbour Board had been dragged into giving Sir John Coode L4OO or LSOO to give them an opinion that would thwart them respecting a matter upon which he had not been asked to report. Sir John was doubtless an eminent engineer, but they might bring out another eminent engineer from England who would give an opposite opinion, and Sir John Coodo had doubtless made mistakes. He was confident that they had engineers in the Colony quite as capable of giving a correct opinion upon these matters as Sir John Coode. Crawford street block having been sold in accordance with leave given to the Board by the Government, it was now no use going back to consider the questions, and the Chamber should consider the advisability of going on with the plan, or take the other sanctioned by the Government officers and engineers, giving them a station down by Stuart street, and give up the Crawford street block. There was no use in mincing _ matters. They knew there were outside influences at work, and no doubt they would come to something: if the Chamber passed Mr Davie's resolutiqn. He sincerely trusted that they would not allow this resolution to pass, which had a different meaning f r»ra that which appeared on the face of ifc. Mr Burt asked if Mr Tewsley could give them the names of tho different purchasers of the Crawford street block. Mr Tewsley : Of the Crawford street block all but four sections were bought by Mr Proudfoot. The Hon. Mr Reynolds asked whether by the resolution it was intended to interfere with what the Board had done in letting the Crawford street block. Mr Davie : I expressed my opinion. Personally, I conceive if it should necessitate the taking of that block, from my point of view I should be prepared to call upon the Government to cancel the leases. But there may be other ways of carrying it out, and I leave it to them to find out those ways. I want it to embody the compromise adopted, that the goods station take a southerly direction from Rattray Btreet. Mr Maokerras did not think the Chamber was likely to cqme to a satisfactory solution of the question, as there seemed to be a great deal of confusion respecting it. In order to avoid this, he thought it desirable that tho plans should be carefully considered, and moved as an amendment on Mr Davie's motion— •'' That, in order to obtain a satisfactory conclusion, i« is desirable that the various plans should be carefnlly considered, and that they be submitted to the Engineer for the Harbour Board and to the Engineer-in- Chief. That. a small committeo of this Chamber be appointed to consider this matter fully, to consult with the Engineer of the Harbour Board and the Engi-nser-in-Chief of the Middle Island, and to bring up a report at an early meeting of tha Chamber— a report giving us the necessary information as to the various plans and the advantages thereof." The Hon. Mr Reynolds said he did not see why the Conference plan should not be carried out. As to the opinion given by Sir John Coode, he considered it was a mistake altogether to call upon Sir John Coode to give an opinion upon this question, but having done so, and his opinion not tallying exactly with the views of the citizens, which he believed it did not, he thought it was their duty to refuse to recognise it at all. He could not see that the difference in the reclamation was so very great that it would damage the harbour at all. He had been here now some 28 or 29 years, and he did not believe there was the least difference in the harbour from tbe time when he arrived. If the Chamber would combine their efforts in insisting upon the Conference plan being carried out he thought the Government would give way. He thought they should endeavour to carry out this plan as soon aa possible — there might be some slight variation from it allowed, but it should be very slight indeed, He was not certain of the meaning of Mr Davie's resolutions except from the explanation given by him, but he really thought it would be to the iuterests of the citizens to stick to the Conference plan, ir.v he did not believe there would be any difficulty in it, in the long run. With regard^ to the land already let iv the Crawford street block he certainly would object to that land being touched by the Government. The Government had had ample opportunity of knowing that it waa the intention of the Harbour Board to let the land — they knew it was required for revenue, and that its sale had already been sanctioned. Why the Government should alter their minds and say we cannot do without it, and you must not lease it now, he could not understand. He felt sure the Harbour Board' were perfectly right in leasing the land, and he hoped the Chamber would do nothing and say nothing to thwart what had been done by the Board, He had been reminded by Mr Tewsley that when Sir John Coode was here, Mr Tewsley, Mr Mills, and himself were present when Sir John ' Coode stated that he did not see any difficulty in the way of what waa proposed by the Board. Of course he did not give that officially. Sir John Coode only, in a confidential way, remarked that he did not see any difficulty in the way of carrying out the Conference plan, but objected to some other proposition to reclaim from Police street to Anderson's Bay ; he said he did not think he could sanction that. He (Mr Reynolds) then walked along with Sir John as far as the Imperial Hotel, and on their way he again put the question, and received the same reply. He could not understand how it was Sir John Coode had altered bis mind so far as to send in the interim report he had done. Mr Wilson said it seemed to him Sir John Coode had altered his mind as soon as he got to Wellington. Mr Geo. Tuenbull said he was almost inclined to take Mr Mackerras's view ; but if the Chamber thought they could get the Government to set aside Sir John Coode's recommendtion it would be the better plan. His objection to the Northern plan was that it would take the goods shed away from the centre of importers' warehoused. There seemed to him to be ample room between Stuart street and the reserve to provide for the passengers and goods traffic. He thought it was a pity insinuations should be thrown out against the Minister of Public Works as though nothing could be done without some private end being sought. If the Chamber was willing to use pressure on the Government in order to get the Conference plan carried out, ho for one would be wDling to assist. Mr Ramsay moved, "That whatever plan the Chamber of Commerce adopt, this meeting rfquests the Government not to interfere with tbe granting of leases for the lots in the Crawfr.rd fttreet Raserve, sold by tho Harbour Boa^d on Wednesday, 19th June." In supporting the motion he said he considered it ought to be carried, and be was surprised 'to hear Mr Davie, in moving the re. solution, almost expressing the Trope that complications would arise, and that the Hw«

bour Board would haVeto give compensation. He thought it was th© duty of the Chamber to seek to protect the interests of the Board, which were the interests of the community at large, and to do everything to prevent the Government from interfering with the leases sold by the Board on the authority of the previous Cabinet. Mr Davie, in proposing the resolution, bad represented that it was for the purpose of haying «ff«ct given to tbe principle which had guided the Conference in coming to its decision. He somewhat admired the childlike faith of Mr Davie in attempting to get a body of gentlemen ike those composing the Chamber, to telieve that in adopting the resolution they would be carrying out the principle of the Conference plan. The matter mentioned was only one principle, and was certainly not the one upon which they were all agreed. The City Council had other interests to conserve, and the Harbour Board desired, as one of its most important principles, to obtain a revenue from the sale of tne land. Another one was that mentioned by Mr Pish— viz., the interference with the whole traffic of the city if the Crawford street block waa utilised for railway purposes. He wished to express his concurrence with what Mr Fish had said, and Mr George M'Lean had said. He also agreed with what had fallen from Mr Fiah respecting the telegrams sent by the Chamber. The Chairman said that the motion by Mr Ramsay was scercely an amendment, and would more properly form the subject of a distinct motion. ' Mr M'Lean, M.H.R., then moved-" That this Chamber is of opinion that the Conference plans should be carried out, and should it be deemed necessary for the protection of the bar, a proportionate amount of reclamatioa be abandoned elsewhere."— (Hear hear.) Mr Reynolds eeconded the motion. Mr Davie said he should not reply to the various speeches addressed in opposition to the motion, but would simply say that the Conference plan met with his approval; and he ■was also prepared, if necessary, to accept the Cumberland street plan, but would accept nothing which would place the goods-sheds on the north side of Stuartstreet. Mr Tewsley was confident that, honestly gone about, this matter would he carried without difficulty. He denied having any personal motives or interests to Berve in this matter, and defended the Board from the remarks made by Mr Davie, The sale was not, he asserted, brought about in a surreptitious manner, and would have taken place three years ago had it not been that they desired to get further concessions from the Government. The delay had been on the part of the Government, and in the meantime the Board and the mercantile communii.y had been losing the benefit of L4OOO a-ye&r, and allowing the land acquired at a cost of L 13,000 to lie idle. Mr Tewsley then referred to his visit to Wellington- for the purpose of getting this matter settled, to the negooiations there carried on, and corroborated what had fallen from Mr Reynolds with respect to the conversation with Sir John Coode re the adoption of the Conference plan. He also supported the remarks whioh had been made by Mr Fish, and Bald that he believed the reclamation necessary to the adoption of the Conference plan would not in the least injure the harbour. He eaid that he could Btate with certainty that the bar at the Heads had not suffered from the works up to, the present time, and that means had been taken to ascertain any alteration there. The lower harbour was being surveyed, and if j any change was found to take place, the Harbour Works would be stopped or altered. The Board was not so blind to the interests of the Port as to do anything that would interfere with the entrance to the harbour. He believed that Sir John Coode had been influenced by the mis-statements that had been telegraphed from Port Chalmers to him respecting tne state of the bar. If Sir John Coode was informed that there were two feet less water on the bar than formerly, no doubt it would lead Sir John Coode to say that there must be no more reclamation. The members of the Board hav6 the interests of the Port thoroughly at heart, and this had dictated their aotion. If they could not get ships up to Dunedin and keep the Port charges at a reasonable rate, they would Vive to say good-bye to the commercial supremacy of Dunedin. The motion by Mr George M'Lean was then put and carried unanimously. Mr Ramsay then moved his amendment as a distinct resolution, which was seconded by Mr Matheson. Mr Reynolds said the motion was quite unnecessary. They might depend upon it the Government would do nothing to oppose the granting of the leases which had been sold according to law, and with the sanction of the previous Government. Mr Fish : This is a liberal Government, remember. The motion was then put and carried.