PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

Otago Witness, Issue 1177, 20 June 1874, Page 9

PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

* . Tuesday, 9th June. The Hon. the Speaker took the chair at 2 p.m. THE RAILWAY RESOLUTIONS. The House went into Committee to consider the remaining railway resolutions proposed by the Government. Mr REID moved— 4th. That surveys and estimates in detail of the following lines be prepared during the recess ; and that in the event of a loan being sanctioned, the Government be authorised to invite tenders, and to accept contracts for their construction, provided the tenders are within the estimated cost : — Length in Amt. Remarks ' . Miles. Main lino through Seaward > Bush 10 £20,000 Waipahi to Tapanui 18J 32,000 Main Line to Kaitangata and extension to Coal Total cost Point 10 27,750 >■ ready for Main Line to Outram.... 4 12,000 Rolling Stock Tokomairiro Branch Rail- approximately way...' 6 14,000 Palmerston to Waihemo 10 25,000 Edendaleto Wyndham.. 8 10,500,/ In doing so he said he did not think much need be said in support of it. He would propose each of the lines mentioned seriatim, so that every line might be fully discussed if necessary. With the exoeption of three lines of railway all the lines mentioned in the resolution were agreed to by the Council. An estimate of cost was obtained from the Provincial Engineer, but there were no reliable data on which to form an exact estimate. The Government would therefore ask that if a loan were obtained, they should have the power to enter into contracts for the construction of those lines before the end of the year, provided the tenders were within the estimates of costs. Mr KINROSS moved, as an amendment on resolution No. 4 -.—"That in the event of a loan being sanctioned, the Government be authorised to have surveys and estimates in detail of the cost of construction, and probable revenue, of the following lines pregared during the recess, in order that this louncil may, at its next session, be in. a position definitely to decide what railways are most urgently required to promote settlement, and are most likely to prove reproductive." — [lines as printed in resolution, No. 4.] Mr GILLIES proposed that the following words should be added to the fourth resolu-tion:--"And in the event of a loan not being sanctioned, the Government be authorised to enter into arrangements with either public companies or private individuals Willingtorisk their own capital in constructing any or all of the proposed railways." His reason for proposing the amendment was that in the event of the loan not being obtained many important lines would have to stand over. One line particularly would be constructed at once by the residents in the vicinity, if they were permitted to do so. He did not propose that any guarantee what ever should be granted by the Government. One arrangement he might instance was that on a short line an agreement might be come to between the constructors of a line and the Government that the rolling stock of the latter shoxild be used on the new line.

Mr BASTINGS supported the amendment proposed by the honourable member, Mr Kinross. He did not wish it to be understood that he waß opposed to those branch lines, but he maintained that they were not in a position to undertake those works during the ensuing year. Their staff was not i equal to the work, and they were not likely i to obtain a more efficient staff. Then, again, with the increase of population, the labour market might be much more favourable for carrying on the works. There was no great urgency in pushing on those branch lines, because the main trunk lines would not be finished for some time to come. He was altogether opposed to the construction of those lines by private individuals or companies. He thought it would be quite sufficient for the necessities of the case if the Government merely took power to themBelves to survey those lines during the year. Mr GILLIES did not agree with the honourable member, Mr Bastings, as to the desirability of delay in carrying out those branch lines. Some of the lines might be delayed, but it would be a great loss if the construction of some of the lines were postponed. Take the Tokomairiro Branch Railway. That line would open up a valuable coalfield, coal from which had been used with great success on the Clutha Railway. The coal was found to answer much better than any other coal yet used in the locomotives, and was much cheaper even at present. If that branch were made, the whole Province could be supplied with excellent coal for about the same price as Green Island coal was at present supplied to Dunedin. It was also desirable that several other lines should be constructed at once. After some further discussion, MrGlLLlESsaidhefoundthatmanyhonourable members were afraid that his proposed addition was so vague that it would allow the Government to do all sorts of bad things. His experience in the Council had been that from time to time Provincial Councillors were afflicted with certain epidemics. At one time, it was a fit of economy ; at another, a fit of progress ; and next time — at present for instance— the cry was, "Too much power should not be left in the hands of the Government." He did not sympathise much with this cry, and was in favour of leaving some little power in the hands of the Government. But to meet the views of some honourable members who Beemed to be afraid

that something more will be introduced under this addition than he had any intention of introducing, or what he thought would be at all likely to be introduced under his proposed addition, he was quite prepared to ask the Committee to add the following words to those he had already proposed :— " Provided such arrangements shall not include any guarantee, and shall provide for the purchase of the line or lines on equitable terms at any time."

Mr Kinross's amendment was negatived on a division by 19 votes against 10. The motion as amended by the addition proposed by the honourable member, Mr Gillies, was then agreed to on the voices. All the lines in the schedule were agreed to with the exception of " Waipahi to Tapanui," which was withdrawn with the view of placing it in the schedule of .railways to be surveyed only during the year. Progress was then reported, and the House adjourned at 0.30 a.m. until 2 p.m. this day.

Wednesday, 10th June. FIRST READINGS.

The Invercargill Reserves Management Ordinance Amendment Bill and the Naseby Recreation Reserve Management Bill were read a first time.

THE RAILWAY RESOLUTIONS.

The House went into Committee to consider the railway resolutions. Mr REID moved that the line " Kaitangata Station to Inch Clutha" should be transferred from the fifth to the fourth resolution. The length of the line was three and a half miles, and the estimated cost was £9500.

The motion was agreed to.

Mr EEID moved resolution No. 5, as follows :— That surveys of the following lines be undertaken as soon as practicable, with a view to the sanction of the Council being obtained to their construction : —

Length in Miles.

Otautau to Night Cap Coalfields .. ..15 Lawrence to Teviot .. .. .. '• 4 9 Orepuki to Waiau 1* Wafhemo to Clyde — The honourable member said that those lines were merely mentioned for the purpose of enquiry during the year. He hoped, however, that members would not insert any lines that they did not wish to have surveyed. The lines mentioned in the above schedule were agreed to. On the motion of Mr REID, the line " Waipahi to Tapanui, 13J miles,' 1 was added to the schedule. Mr M'KENZIE moved the following line as an addition to the schedule :—": — " From main line of railway to Shag Point Coalfields, 2 miles."

The addition was agreed to. Mr WILSON proposed, as another addition—"Line from Winton to Night Cap Coalfield."

Agreed to. Mr KINROSS moved as an amendment, that the following words should be inserted in the first line of the resolution, after the word undertaken :—": — " And estimates of probable traffic obtained." The amendment was agreed to. The whole of the resolutions were then reported to the House with amendments. Mr HAZLETT then moved that the fourth resolution should be re- committed, for the purpose of inserting the line, "Lawrence to Teviot," in the schedule of resolution 4. The amendment was withdrawn, the Government opposing the proposal. The resolutions as a whole, were then adopted by the House.

THE MINING CONFERENCE.

The Goldfields Committee reported, recommending that copies of the reports of the Mining Conferences of 1872 and 1874 should be forwarded to the Colonial Government for its consideration in re Goldfields Bill

CONDITION" OF THE COUNCIL CHAMBER.

The House Committee reported that their attention had been drawn to the dangerous state of the Council Hall, and recommended that such alterations and improvements as may be found necessary should be carried out during the recess. REPORTS BY PRIVATE PETITIONS COMMITTEE.

The Private Petitions Committee reported as follows :— (1.) On the petition of George Bailey and Christopher Rea, the latter of whom prayed for redress for losses alleged to have been sustained in conseqaence of the sale by the Waste Lands Board of petitioner's residence area, Wendon district, and forcible possession of said area being made without compensation for improvement being first paid ; and the first named for redress for losses alleged to have been sustained by him as holder of a mortgage over a gold mining claim at Acton's Flat, Switzers, in consequence of the land upon which the claim was situated having been sold to one Allan M 'Donald— that the petitioners have a good claim for consideration, and recommends that the Government be requested to remit these claims to be adjudicated upon in equity by the Warden of the district. (2.) On the petition of Mary Rutherford, widow, which set forth the circumstances under which her late husband lost his life, and prayed for favourable consideration for her case—that the Committee was fully impressed with the fact that the awkward oha racter of the bridge at Manuka Creek may render the liability to accidents of a similar character to that by which the petitioner's husband lost his life great, but could not agree that on that account there wa3 any ground for claiming compensation. The Committee was of opinion that in Bimilar caseß to the petitioners the Exeoutive alone were in a position to deal competently with

them in giving assistance or relief. (3.) On the petition of George Hepburn, chairman of the Half-way Bush Road Board, praying that any action in reference to constituting the Wakari sub-division of the Half-way Bush road district an independent district be postponed — recommending the Government, before taking any steps to alter the boundaries of the Wakari sub-division of the Half-way Bush road district, should hear the Road Boards of the districts affected by such proposed alterations.

THE OTAGO RESERVES.

The following Message (No. 14) was received from His Honour:— "The Superintendent solicits the attention of the Provincial Council to the various reserves, as per annexed statement, which have been proclaimed or recommended by the Council, but for which Crown grants have been withheld. After much negotiation on the subject, the Colonial Government introduced a Bill into the General Assembly at its last session, having for its object the cancellation of the proclamations under which the reserves in question have been made, and autholising the issue of Crown grants to the extent of not exceeding 500,000 acres for such purposes, and in such localities, aB the Provincial Legislature might see fit. This Bill, however, did not become law. Ab there se«ms to be no hope of the Crown grants being obtained, it is essential that some action should be taken in this matter, with a view to which it is desirable that the Provincial Council should express its opinion on the subject. The Superintendent would be disposed to agree to the Bill of last session, rather than allow the reserves to remain in their present exceedingly unsatisfactory position; or perhaps, were we to abandon the whole of the reserves now in question, with the exception of those for educational purposes, the General Government might be induced to issue grants for the latter." [The following is the statement of reserves made by the Superintendent and Provincial Council for which Crown grants have been withheld :— Reserves for High, Grammar, and District Schools, 1,106,580 acres ; Benevolent Institutions, 353,300 acres; Clutha River Trust, 50,000 acres ; endowments for Hospitals, 487,750 acres.]

GRANTS TO VOLUNTEERS. The adjourned debate on the question — " That a respectful Address be presented to Hiß Honour the Superintendent, requesting that he will be pleased to issue to Volunteers who have become entitled thereto, certificates of remission of purchase money for land, in accordance with the 'Volunteers' Land Act, 1865," and the 'Volunteers' Land Act Amendment Act, 1873," were resumed." The SPEAKER suggested that Mr Reeves should withdraw his motion, as notice had already been given of a reply to His Honour's message on the same subject. Mr REEVES saw no reason to withdraw, and the debate was therefore resumed on his motion.

Mr LUMSDEN moved as an amendment the following, which appeared on the Order Paper in the name of the Provincial Secretary, who, having spoken on the original question, was unable to move it— "That this Council, having had under consideration His Honour's Message No. 17, agrees to the recommendation therein contained, and respectfully requests that His Honour will take the necessary steps to give effect thereto."

After some discussion, Mr HAGGITT suggested that the amount of £2000 should be increased to £6000, when it could be reduced by the House if thought necessary. After some further remarks from honourable members, the amendment proposed by Mr Lumsden was carried.

OTAGO HARBOUR BOARD BILL.

On the motion of Mr REID, the second reading of the Otago Harbour Board Bill was made an order of the day for next day. CALEDONIAN SOCIETY INCORPORATION BILL.

The Caledonian Society of Otago Incorporation Bill was read a second time, and its committal made an order for next day. LICENSING ORDINANCE, 1865, AMENDMENT

This Bill was read a third time and passed.

POSTPONEMENTS.

The following matters were postponed until next day : — The second reading of the Riverton Harbour Board Bill, Dunedin Presbyterian Church Lands Ordinance Amendment Bill, Roads Diversion Bill (No. 2), Palmerston School Glebe Exchange Bill, Hospitals Bill, Port Chalmers School Reserve Bill, and the Oainaru Harbour Board Bill. The consideration of His Honour the Superintendent's Message No. 18, was also postponed.

ROADS DIVERSION BILL.

Mr REID moved— "That the amendment made by His Honour the Superintendent in the Roads Diversion Bill be agreed to." Message No. 19. — The Superintendent returns herewith the Roads Diversion Bill, 1874, with the following amendment, viz :—: — For the description of road No. 3 Aparima district, substitute 'all that area in the Province of Otago containing by admeasurement 4a 2r 32poles more or less, being a road line situate in Block VI., Jacobs River Hundred district, bsunded. towards the north-east by parts of sections numbered 25 and 26, four thousand seven hundred links more or less, and towards the south-west by other parts of said section No. 25 four thousand seven hundred links more or less.' " This is rendered necessary owing to the load which is to be given in exchange having been described in error. J. Maoandrkw, Superintendent. . Agreed to,

COMMITTEE OP SUPPLY. Tie SPEAKER then left the chair, and the Council went into Committee of Supply.

OAMARU MECHANICS' INSTITUTE.

Mr SUMPTER moved—" That a respectful Address be presented to His Honor the Superintendent^ requesting that the sum of £500 be placed on the Supplementary Estimates for the purpose of supplementing the funds of the Oamaru Mechanics' Institute, to be paid by the Government provided that the 500 acres granted last session as an endowment cannot be given effect to." Ifche motion was lost on a division. ft was then decided to report progress, and the Speaker having resumed the Chair, Mr FISH objected, and stated that he and other members did not hear the motion for reporting progress put. He then moved the adjournment of the Houße, in consequence of the manner in which the motion for reporting progress was put. The honourable member then announced his intention of speaking until half-past five o'clock, but in about ten minutes withdrew hia motion.

THE RAILWAY TENDERS.

The adjourned debate on the following question was resumed :—: — " That, in the opinion of thia Counoil, the conduct of the late Government in accepting tenders for the Light Railways in Souiiplana and the Waiareka Valley so much in exceaa of the sum voted by this Council, and after the expiration of the financial year, is de» serving of great censure, and that such conduct is entirely subversive of the prinoiple of Responsible Government." This resolution was moved by Mr FISH } and to it an amendment had been moved by Mr REID, as follows :— " That the question be amended by the omission of all the words after the firet word ' that,' with the view of inserting the following in lieu thereof :— (1) 'This Council re« cords its regret that, owing to various causes, the contracts for light railways were not let before the close of the financial year, and also that the prices for which the contracts have been let are in excess of the sums appropriated by the Council ; but this Coun» cil hereby records its approval of} the action of the late Executive in letting the works for cash payments instead of payments in land, as authorised by the Council. (2) Thia Council is strongly of opinion that no con* tract should be accepted after the close of the financial year, until new appropriations have been made, and that unless under exceptional and pressing circumstances, no contracts should be accepted in excess of the authority granted by this Council." Mr STOUT resumed the debate, stating that the matter was a constitutional one, 1 and should not have been made a party question. The motion before the Council was that a motion should be passed concerning a thing that was not in existence. He considered thatthe question could be divested of its personal character by the adoption of the amendment. Mr DE LATOUR said he could go much farther than the resolution or the amendment ; and he charged the Government not oaly with exceeding the votes of the Council bat with having appropriated themselves £73,394 without having any authority from the Council. If it was right for the Government to exceed the votes of the Council, and for the Council to afSrm their action, as the amendment asked them to do, the honourabJe member for Waihemo would be justified in bringing down a motion approving of the day after the Council adjourned agreed to sell privately certain lands in the Palmerston district, thereby causing a loss to the country of £3000. That would be quite a consistent course of action. He thought the motion was more deserving of support than the amendment, for the reason that it was a little stronger. He maintained that the motion was not a party question. The amendment was simply framed for the purpose of screening the honourable gentlemen members of the Government whose conduct waa indefensible; and for that reason he would vote for the motion. MrM'LEAN cited several instancesin which the Colonial Government had exceeded the votes of the General Assembly ; and in those cases the Assembly had never passed votes of censure. A certain amount of discretion must be given to the Government in carrying on the Government. What would the honourable member, Mr Fish, reduce the Go. vernment to ? To a mere collection of clerks who were to obey the letter only of the instructions given by the Council. While the Government carried out the spirit of the instructions of the Council, the Council were bound in honour to endorse the actions of the Government.— (No, no.) Those who said "No " spoke like women. He quite sympathised with the honourable member, Mr Fish, who looked longingly towards the Treasurership. But he thought they might provide for the honourable gentleman without displacing the present Treasurer. The honourable member for Tuapeka— a far Beeing and sagacious man — suggested the other day that they should provide a HarbourMaster for the Goldfields. Now, he thought that would suit his honourable friend, Mr Fish. They were sending up the submarine boat the Platypus ; and it would be necessary to have somebody to see that she was moored properly. He thought the honourable member might perform that duty, and cam a vote of confidence from the Council. He did not think such a motion as that before the Houro should be passed, because no possible good could come of it. Mr M'GLASHAN Baid he intended to move another amendment, in order to throw oil on the troubled waters. l He altogether opposed the doctrine laid down by the

honourable membeW'Mr M'Lean, that they should H be "guided in this matter by prece** dents- instead of sound principles. He could not agree with the amendment moved by the Provincial Secretary, as it proposed that the Council should censure themselves for voting, that those works should be paid for inland." The amendment he had to propose was as follows :— " That in the opinion of this Council, it is to be'regretted that the tenders for light railways in Southland and the Waiareka .Valley should have been accepted, beings so far in excess of the sum voted by this Council, and after the expiration of the, financial year. Further, that the principle ,is wrong, and such a practice being subversive of responsible Government, should be avoided in the future by any Executive •who may, be in' power." Mr KINROSS said that he could not approve of ihe terms of the amendment, although he thought the motion went too far in some respests. Mr M'DERMID said he had not been consulted. in the drawing up' of the motion. If he had been, he would not have approved of its terms. As for the amendment, it was> a milk' and water thing ; and reminded him of Balaam blessing the Children of Israel instead of cursing them. He was convinced the Executive had done wrong, and he thought they should put something on their records to prevent the Executive from ignoring the wishes of the Council in the future. Mr LUMSDEN said that, notwithstanding the professions of the honourable member Mr Fisb, there could be no doubt that the motion was aimed at the members of the present Governmeut as much as at -the members of the late Government. That honourable member had stated, in speaking to a direct motion of want of confidence, that if I that motion were lost, he would not offer any factious opposition to the Government. Bat he would put it to ' the Council if that honourable member had not since offered factious opposition to the Government every day that the Council met. He did not think the late Government should be eenßured for not postponing the acceptance of the tenders until the Council met ; and as for the construction of the railways by paying for them in land, he thought, remembering their former experience in Southland, the lixecutive were deserving of praise for coming to the decision that the works should not be paid for in land. He thought the accepted tenders for these works were very reasonable. He thought the amendment proposed by the honourable member, Mr M'Glashan, was a very fair one. Mr HAGGITT said he would vote for the original motion. He was happy to vote for the Government when he could do so conscientiously, but he could not vote with them conscientiously on this occasion. Three principles were involved in this question. The fir3t was that the Government had expended no less than L 142.000 of Provincial revenue without any appropriation whatever by the Council. The second was that, supposing the Executive's own view of the mat- j ter was right, and that they might have constructed those works out of revenue instead of land, even then they had exceeded the votes of the Council by over £30,000. The third was that having allowed those j contracts to remain unaccepted until the expiration of the financial year, they, without waiting for the Council to mcct — without consulting it as to the change of feeling that had come over the Executive themselves — on their own responsibility altered the principle of payment brought down to the Council, and which the Council solemnly affirmed after due consideration. He thought there must be some lurking sarcasm in the amendment of the Provincial Secretary. If they were to approve the action of the late Executive in treating with contempt the resolutions of the Council, they would be degrading their own deliberations to a solemn—or rather ridiculous— farce. He did not think they would be doing their duty if they did not take this opportunity of placing on record such an expression of censure as would j deter any future Executive from acting in the same way as the late Executive. Mr FISH having replied, I

Mr SUMPTER said he coald not approve of the Provincial Secretary's amendment because that honourable gentleman had stated last year that one great object of paying for the construction of those railways in land ■was to . obtain the settlement of the land ; and his amendment now approved of the action of the Executive in not paying for the works in land. He also condemned the unconstitutional action of the late Government in exceeding the votes of the Council. Unless the Provincial Secretary's motion were altered in several particulars he would vote for the original motion. Mr WOOD said he would vote for the original motion. „,.11^ The question was then put that all the words in the original motion should stand part of the question. On a division this was lost by 14 against 11, so that all the words in the original motion except the word " That ' were struck out. The following is the division list : — Ayes, 11 : Messrs H. Clark, R. Clarke, De Lantour (teller), Fish (teller), Green, Haseitt, M'Kenzie, Oliver, Sumpter, Turton, and Wood . „ Noes, 14 : Messrs Allan, dimming, derson, l:eland, Lumsden, Mollison, M'Lean, M'Neil, Reid (teller), Stout (teller), Teechemaker, Turnbnll, Webster, and Wilson.^ Pairs : A3 f es — Reeves, Hasslett, G. F. C. Browne, M'Dermid, M'Glashan, J. C. Brown, and Bastings. Noes— Mackellar, T. Daniel, Hallenstein, Davie, Roberts, Monzies, and Shand. . Mr REID said that he had no objection to accept Mr M'Glaslian's amendment instead

•of his own.' If the 'whole question were' gone into, he believed' that much could be said in condonation of the aotion of the Government in delaying the acceptance of the tenders. Just that evening he nad received a memo, from the Provincial Engineer to the effect that the reason why the date for receiving the tenders was postponed to the 3rd April, was on account of a request made by Captain Audley Coote, representing a Tastnanian firm, to the effect that further time might be allowed him to send in a tender. He thought that if that had been brought forward at an earlier period it would have been regarded as a very good reason for the postponement. j When the question was put whether Mr Reid should have leave to withdraw his amendment, there was one di«sentent voice, I so that leave could not be given. Mr Reid's amendment was then negatived ; and Mr M'Glashan's amendment agreed to on the voices.

COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY.

The House then resolved itself into Committee of Supply, to consider the Contingent Notices of Motion.

SALARIES OF POLICE OFFICERS.

Mr FISH moved— "That a respectful Address be submitted to His Honour the Superintendent, requesting that he will be pleased to place a, sum of LIOO upon the Supplementary Estimates for the purpose of increasing the' salary of of the Commissioner of Police, and also a further sum of £164 5s for the purpose of giving an allowance for uniform to three Inspectors, two Sub-Inspec-tors, and one Sergeant-Major of Police." The motion was withdrawn, as the Government promised to place a sum on the Supplementary Estimates increasing the salaries of the officers mentioned to the extent of 10 per cent.

BONUS FOR POTTERY WORKS.

Mr G. F. C. BROWNE moved -"Tha+. a respectful address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, requesting him to place the sum of £250 on the Supplementary Estimates, to be added to a sum already passed on the Estimates, as a bonus for pottery works." The resolution was negatived.

EXPENDITURE ON ROADS IN GOLDFIELDS.

Mr R. CLARKE moved—" That the provisions made in the Estimates for the construction of roads in goldfields is inadequate to their requirements, and prejudicially disproportionate to the general and special Territorial Revenue raised therein, and that a respectful address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, requesting that the sum of £5000 be placed upon the Supplementary Estimates for the purpose of forming roads and tracks through such portions of the goldfields as are not under the operation of Road Boards, such sum to be allotted in proportion to the revenue derived from the district applying for the formation of such road, the proportion to be fixed by His Honour the Superintendent and his Executive Council upon the consideration of applications from districts praying for the formation of such roads."

The motion was lost on a division by 18 votes against 9.

VOTES FOR WAKATIP DISTRICT.

Mr R. CLARKE moved— "That a respectful Address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, requesting that he will be pleased to place on the Supplementary Estimates :— lst The sum of L 75 for the purpose of erecting snow poles along the track between the Upper Nevis aad Gibbs Town. 2nd. The sum of £50 for the purpose of improving the road fiom Gihbs Town to the Coal Pits, on the south side of the Kawarau River. 3rd. The sum of £75 as a subsidy at the rate of pound for pound, for the erection of a building as a Public Library at Moke Creefi, near Queenstown." The two first resolutions were agreed to ; and the third was withdrawn.

ADDITIONAL PIER TOR PORT CHALMERS.

Mr M'DERMID moved— "That a respect ful Address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, requesting that he will be pleased to cause a sufficient sum to be placed on the Estimates for the construction of an additional pier at Port Chalmers of at least 1000 ft. in length." The motion was negatived. BRIDGING OF OTEPIRI AND UPPER MAKAREWA

RIVERS.

Mr WILSON moved— "That a respectful Address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, requesting that the sum of £200 be placed on the Supplementary Estimates for the purpose of bridging the Otepiri and Upper Makarewa rivers." Agreed to.

Thursday, 11th June. CEMETERY AT PAPAKAIO.

Mr WEBSTER moved—" That an Address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, recommending that all that parcel of land in the Province of Otago, in the Colony of New Zealand, containing by admeasurement two acres, more or less, situate in Pakakaio district, being section numbered one hundred and twenty-eight, block three, on the map of the said district, bounded towards the north-west by section numbered seventy-one, six hundred and Bixty- three links, towards the north-east by a road line three hundred links, towards the south-east by section numbered one hundred and nineteen six hundred and sixty-nine links, and towards the south-west by section numbered one huudred and nineteen three hundred links, be set apart for & Public Cemetery." Agreed to.

UNAUTHORISED EXPBNOTnTRK.

Mr TURNBULL moved—" That an Address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, requesting' him to forward to ; this Council a recommepdation to grant a sum, of money sufficient to meet the unauthorised expenditure referred to in the letter from the Provincial Auditor laid upon the table by Mr Speaker on the 12th day of I May, 1874." The honourable member stated that the details of the expenditure were appended to the general expenditure of last year. He would be glad to give any further explanation that might be required. Mr M'DERMID said that he would not oppose the motion, but he was of opinion that the Treasury affairs were not in a satisfactory state. He would move the followiug addition to the motion before the House :—: — "At the same time expressing the regret that the Treasury department should be in such an unsatisfactory Btate as to render it necessary that the public accounts for the past, financial year should be laid on the table of the Council uncertified by the Auditor, as required by the Audit Act ; and further, that it is desirable in future that a detailed account of all unauthorised expenditure be laid on the table, instead of merely a summary of the special orders issued." Mr REID stated that such an addition as this should have been on the Order Paper for several diys. If it were carried, the Government could just take it for what it was worth, and would not delay the business of the country further. I After some discussion, the amendment was ! put to tha House, and carried on & division, the ayes being 12 and the noes 9. The division list was as follows :—: — Ayes 12 : Messrs J. C. Brown, G. F. C. Browne', H. Clark, R. Clarke, De Lautour, Fish (teller), M'Dermid (teller), M'Kenzie, Reeves, Sumpter, Turton, and Wilson. Noes, 9 : Messrs Cumming, DanieJ, Henderson, Ireland, Kinross, Lumsden, Reid (teller), Turnbull, Wood (teller). Mr REID said that the amendment was a direct cenßure upon the Government, and it would be much better for the members of the Government to consider their position. They considered that they hod fairly submitted to the House every question worthy of being taken up, and they were still prepared to fight any question. They would not, however, submit to be subjected to such a surprise as the present one. Not sixteen hours before, when there was a full meeting of the Council, such a motion had been considered and decided upon, he would now move the adjournment of the House. Mr TURNBULL quite agreed with what had fallen from the head of the Government, and would decline to occupy a seat on the Government benches if such a course were to be continued. He coald very easily give an explanation, but he would not shelter himself by attacking anyone who was not in a position to defend himself. So far as the honourable member for Dunedin was concerned, he (Mr Turnbull) was quite prepare • to submit any matter to his constituents, aa against that honourable member. He would, however, decline to submit to Buch unjustifiable and unprecedented conduct as the honourable member had- been guilty of. The honourable member knew well that he (Mr Turnbull) did not value his opinion to the extent of the smallest coin of the realm. The SPEAKER said that the honourable member referred to had not spoken on the subject before the House. Mr TURNBULL said that the honourable member had a notice on the Order Paper with reference to the subject. Mr WOOD was of opinion that the consideration of the question should be adjourned. Time should be given to allow honourable members to be in their places. Mr WILSON regretted that the Government should take the amendment aa an expression of want of confidence. Mr REEVES expressed himself to a similar effect. Mr KINROSS said that he had no objection to the adjournment of the debate, if the Government were taken by surprise. Mr M'DERMID did not consider that the Government had been taken by surprise, but at the same time he did not mind the debate being adjourned. Mr REID, in the course of his remarks, said that if there was to be a motion of want of confidence it should be put on its merits. An adjournment of the question to the evening would be of no use. Mr IRELAND hoped that the business of the Council would not be delayed. After a little discussion, it was agreed, on the suggestion of the Speaker, to adjourn the Houbo for ten minutes. On re-assembling, Mr REID moved the adjournment of the debate until 7 p.m. The motion was agreed to. WASTE LANDS AND IMMIGRATION COMMITTEE.

The Waste Lands and Immigration Committeee reported as follows : — The Committee having the return before them asked for by the honourable member for Mataura, showine the fees charged on land applications from May 1, 1872, to May 1, 1874, which appear to be grossly unjust upon the holders of small areas, are of opinion that the old sys tern now re- introduced throughout the goldfields, of Government surveyors, should be reverted to in every district of the Province, as soon as possible, as suggested by the Government. The Committee are further of opinion that the charges under the Government regulations require considerable modification, and would. suggest an enquiry into the subject.

PRIVATE PETITIONS COMMITTEE.

The Private Petitions Committee reported on the petition of George Hepburn and other

members of the Halfway Bush District Road Board, -who prayed' that steps might betaken to Becure to the inhabitants of said district the benefit contemplated by the Council in voting the sum of £500 for the opening up of ■the, Water of Leith road — that the Cdmtnit* tee iind certain arrangements have been entered into between the Government and Mr E. M'Glashan in regard to the roads referred to by the petitioners, and are of opinion that the whole matter rests in the hands of the Government to fulfil in equity the agreements entered iato.

RECREATION RESERVE FOR WYNDHAM.

Mr REID moved— "That an Address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, recommending that all that parcel of land in the Province of Otago, in the Colony of New Zealand, containing by admeasurement one huudred and fifty acres, more or less, situate in the town of Wyndham [here follow the boundaries], be set apart for purposes of public recreation for the use of the inhabitants of Wyndham." The motion was agreed to. PRICE OF LAND IN, TOWN OF GORE.

Mr LUMSDEN moved— "That an' Ad. dress be presented to Hia Honour the Superintendent, asking His Honour's concurrence in the following resolution in terms of seceion 2, Southland Waste Lands Amendment Act, 1872, viz. :— That the unsold land in the town of Gore, district of Southland, be offered for sale in sections of a quarter of an acre, three, five, seven, and ten acres reapedtively ; that the upset price of the quarter acre sections be five pounds eaoh, and of. the others at the rate of twenty pounds per acre."

Agreed to. REDUCTION OF FREIGHT CHARGES AND PASSENGERS* FARES ON PORT CHALMERS RAILWAY.

Mr M'DERMID moved - " That the freight for carrying goods on the Dunedin and Port Chalmers Railway be reduced to 2s 6d per ton, and the fareß for carrying passengers be reduced to Is for first-class and 9d for fiecond-clasß each way," The honourable member said he believed _ that if these reductions took place the receipts of the railway would be largely increased, while the cost of working the railway would remain the same, however great the traffic might be. He believed if the reduction took place, a profit of £5000 a year would be derived from the railway. Several other members having spoken—^ most of them in opposition to the proposal— the motion was negatived on the voices. PURCHASE OF RESIDENCE AREAS ON GOLD-

FIELDS.

Mr G. F. C. BROWNE moved—" That in the opinion of this Council, it is desirable that provision be made in the Goldfields regulations of this Province to enable holders of residence area certificates, that have resided five years on Buoh area, if desiring, shall become the , purchaser, subject to resumption for mining purposes, but in no instance shall a purchase be sanctioned excepting the present regulations have been complied with, and on the recommendation of the Warden. That a respectful Address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, requesting that he will cause the above resolution to be given effect to." The motion was negatived on the voices. THE FREE IMMIGRATION SYSTEM.

Mr WILSON" moved—" lsfc. That, in the opinion of this Council, the system of free emigration at present in operation from the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland to this Colony, is liable to great abuse, and in some respects very objectionable, and calculated to produce most injurious results, and that immediate action should be taken to remedy this evil. 2nd. That the selection of emigrants suitable to the requirements of this country should be a first consideration with the British Emigration Agents, and is of the most vital importance to the present and future interests of the Colony. That His Honour the Superintendent be respectfully requested to take such steps as may be deemed necessary to give effect to these resolutions." The honourable member said that this matter had been so fully discussed outside the Council, that it was unnecessary to say anything in support of the resolutions. The resolutions were agreed to on the voices without any discussion.

THE MAREWHENUA BRIDGE.

Mr SUMPTER moved—" That the petition in reference to the erection of the Marewhenua Bridge be referred to the favourable consideration of the Government."

Mr REID Baid he thought it would be time enough to decide this matter next session.

It was agreed to on the voices. FREE RAILWAY PASSES FOR MEMBERS GV THE

PROVINOIAL COUNCIL.

Mr J. C, BROWN moved— "That this Council is of opinion that the sessional railway pass given to members of the Provincial Council should also be available during recess."

The motion was lost, on a division, by 11 votes against 10. There was a tie, and the Speaker gave his casting vote with the Noes. The following is the division list : — Ayes, 10 : Messrs J. C. Brown (teller), G. F. C. Browne, H. Clark, Daniel, De Lautour, Hallenstein, M'Dermid (teller), M'Glashan, Wilson, and Wood. Noes, 10 : Messrs Driver, Ireland, Lumsden (teller), M'Kellar, M'Lean, M'Neil, Reid (teller), Rogers, Turnbull, and Web-

SUBSIDY TO MUNICIPALITY OF ARROWTOWM". Mr R. CLARKE moved— "That areapeotful Address be presented, to Ria Honour

the Superintendent, requesting that he will be pleased to place such sum on the Supple^ mentary Estimates as will enable him to ex tend to the Municipal Corporation of Arrow-, town the subsidy as accorded to other Municipalities, by virtue of sections 4 and 5 of ' Municipal Corporations Ordinance, 1865, Amendment Ordinance.'" The motion was negatived on the voices. ESTABLISHMENT O3f A SAILORS* HOME.

Mr FISH moved— "That in the opinion of this- Uouncil'it is desirable the Government should take some step 3 to establish a Sailors' Home, either at Port Chalmers or Dunedin ?" He stated that he did so in accordance with the request of some persons who took great interest hi this matter. He believed great evils existed at .present owing to the want of such an institution.

Mr TURNBULL said that this matter had been considered by the Government, and they were favourable to the proposal. They would be willing to subsidise any effort made for the establishment of such an institution either by the people of Port Chalmers or Dunedin. The motion was agreed to. THE CADDON HUNDRED.

' Mr DRIVER moved—" That a respectful address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, requesting him not to include the Caddon Hundred in his recommendation to His Excellency the Governor for the proclamation of certain Hundreds mentioned in Message No. 7." The honourable member stated that in bringing forward this motion, he had not the slightest desire to question the policy of the declaring of Hundreds, but did so simply from a sense of justice The Hundred mentioned was one recommended by the Council to be declared last year, and the Government assured the Council that they would inspect the proposed Hundred during the recess, and would not recommend it unless found to be suitable. Dr Webster and Mr Shand, who had inspected the country, assured him that it was not necessary to proclaim a Hundred there at present. He (Mr Driver) fancied the Government had no intention of putting this land in the market ; and they had already placed in the market a large quantity of land. The Hundred was out of the way, and he believed if tho land were sold, it would be forced into tho hands of the pastoral tenant. If roads were made to the Hundred they would cost tie Government more than the value of the land.

Dr WEBSTER stated that he had visited the proposed Hundred, in company with Mr Shand, and they found that it was quite unsuitable for opening at present, although it might be very desirable to open the land in course of time. He had intended to mention to the Secretary for Lands that ife would be desirable to postpone the declaration of this Hundred ; but by some accident he had forgotten to do so. Several members having supported the motion, it was agreed to on the voices. The House adjourned at 5.30 until 7 p.m. UNAUTHORISED EXPENDITURE.

When the House re-assombled at 7 o'clock,

Mr WOOD resumed the debate on the amended motion :— " That an Address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, requesting him to forward to this Council a recommendation to grant a sum of money sufficient to meet the unauthorised expenditure referred to in the letter from the Provincial Auditor laid upon the table by Mr Speaker on the 12th day of May, 1874 : At the same time expressing regret that the Treasury department should be in such an unsatisfactory state as to render it necessary that the public accounts for the past financial year should be laid on the table of the Council uncertified by the Auditor, as required by the Audit Act, and further, that it is desirable in future that a detailed account of all unauthorised expenditure be laid on the table, instead of merely a summary of the special orders issued." In doing so, he moved the previous question in order that the Government might have ar opportunity of placing their motion on the paper again. Mr STOUT said this Government was placed in a position such as no other Government had been placed. Every day a vote of ■want of confidence was brought against the Government. He was not going to sit there to be insulted day after day ; and if this sort of thing continued, he would resign his seat in the Government. The motion submitted by the Government was a btatutory one, aud by tailing on the amendment proposed by the honourable member, Mr M'Dermid, they were offering an insult to His Honour the Superintendent He did not suppose that the members who voted for the amendment intended to offer an insult to His Honour, but he thought when they reflected upon the matter they should agroe to withdraw the amendment. Mr M'GLASHAN thought that the Government were acting in a very silly manner in making this a want of confidence motion. IP anything would make him vote in favour of the motion, it was the silly action of the Government in reference to it. Mr M'DERMID Baid he was surprised to see the change in the sentiments of the Provincial Solicitor with reference to the Superintendent This session he was extremely anxious to protect the Superintendent, last session it wbb all the other way. He would certainly press the amendment. Mr WILSON supported the previous question. Mr TURNBULL said that the honourable member for Porfc Chalmers showed a gross want of sincerity. The honourable member paid he had novor read the motion until to4*y «l4^tow««tyw«vtth* wefully

prepared amendment. He did not believe the amendment was drawn up by the member for Port Chalmers. To repeat a statement made in a former debate : The Opposition, adopting the plan of the Eastern kings, had driven their heaviest animals to the front, while they remained themselves hi the rear.

Mr REID said it was remarkable that notwithstanding the professions of several honourable members, that this was not a party move, there had been a great deal of whipping up since the House rose at half- past five o'clock. The .honourable member for, North Harbour, Mr M'Glashan, had taken occasion to twit the Government with having agreed to an amendment on the previous evening that he (Mr M'Glashan) had proposed. That conduct showed a great amount of sincerity when it was remembered that in bringing forward the amendment referred to the honourable member said he wished to throw oil on the troubled waters. He 1 might say in regard to that amendment that it was not owing to any fear that the honourable member would have carried his amendment as agaiast the Government that the latter agreed to accept it. They did so because the amendment represented their own views as well as the resolution they had themselves proposed ; virtually it was no amendment whatever on the resolution proposed by the Government. The course pursued by the Opposition during the last few days was evidently adopted for the purpose of tiring out the patience of honourable members. Honourable members opposite knew well that several members who supported the Government were out of town at present. He did not say that that was a reason why the business should be interrupted ; but he did say that it was a reuson why an amendment such as this should not be placed before the House unannounced. He had had past experience of the honourable member for Port Chalmers, and be had never known that honourable member to gain a vicbory except by a surprise such as the present one — as, for instance, on the occasion when the memorable speech was made which had ojust been referred to by his col- 1 league, the Provincial Treasurer. He thought the Government could not be blamed for refusing to proceed with tho business unless they received better treatment than to be | taken by surprise in this manner. The Government felt that it was reducing responsible representative Government to a perfect farce to have the business of the country interrupted in this way. Although many of their supporters were absent, the Government preferred to have the question decided at once ; and if honourable members were determined to allow such a motion to appear on the records of the Council, the Government would make way for their opponents. He could assure those who might succeed them, that they would not meet with the same factious opposition that had been offered to the present Government — opposi tion which was not based on political principles, but upon personal motives.

Mr DE LAUTOUR said he could quote a precedent for the moving of the present amendment from the recotds of the Council itself. In 1868, when a motion with reference to unauthorised expenditure, in exactly the same terms as the motion now proposed by the Government, was before tho House, Mr Mowat moved the insertion of certain words excluding an item from the list of unauthorised expenditurer. On that occasion Mr Reid voted with the majority hi favour of the motion, and did not then appear to think that he was offering an insult to His Honour the Superintendent by so doing. Mr M'LEAN said he thought the House would draw a clear distinction between the case cited by the honourable membor Mr De Lautour and the motion now before the House. In the case quoted by the honourable member a clear issue was laid before the Council upon a particular item. He thought that if the issue now was upon any particular item in the unauthorised expenditure the gentlemen on the Executive benches Avould not make it a Government question. — (Hear, hear, from Mr Reid.) The SPEAKER then put it to the vote, " That the question be now put;" those supporting tho Government giving their voices with the "Noes." On a division, the question was negatived by 22 votes against 11. The following ia the division list : —

Ayes, 11 : Messrs Bastings, ,(. C. Brown, H. Clark, R. Clarke, De Lautour, Fish, Green, Hazlctt, M'Dermid (teller), M'Kenzie, and Sumpter (teller). Noes, 22 : Messrs Cummiug, Daniel, Davie, Driver, Haggitt, Hallenstein, Henderaon, Ireland, Kinross, Lumaden, M'Kellar, M'Lean, M'Neil, Reid (teller). Rogers, Stout, Teschemakor, Tolmie, Tnrnbull (toller), Webster, Wilson, and Wood. The motion as amended was then shelved.

Mr REID then moved the suspension of Standing Orders, to enable him to at once move the motion as originally proposed by the Government. Several members of tho Opposition walked out of the Council Chamber, and aa there was consequently less than two-thirds of the members of the House present, the Standing Orders could not be suspended. Mr TURNTBULL then gave nocice that he would bring forward the motion again at next sitting.

THE APPROPRIATION BILL.

Mr STOUT moved the first reading of the Appropriation Bill, for the year 1874-5. The Bill was rend a first time.

THE OTAGO HARBOUR BOARD BILL.

Mr STOUT moved the second reading of the Ofcago Harbour Board Bill. He explained that the Bill was introduced in pursuance of the eeriea of resolutions agreed to by tho C,onn<?il respeofcipg $he improvement Q jp q^^

Harbour. "With regard to the constitution of the Board it was proposed that there should be certain members ex officlo, and certain others elected. The ex officio members were the Superintendent of the Province, the Speaker of the Provincial Council, the Mayor of Dunedin, the Mayor of Port Chalmers, and the President, or Chairman, of the Dunedin Chamber of Commerce. In addition to thos* ex officio members, it was proposed that there should be eight elective members — two to be elected by the Provincial Council, two by the City Council of Dunedin, two by the Town Council of Port Chalmers, and two by the Dunedin Chamber of Commerce. It would thus be seen that full weight was given to every interest that could be possibly affected by the improvement and management of the Harbour, and that Port Chalmers had as large a share in the constitution of the Board as Dunedin. Port Chalmers was placed in that position for the reason that the Lower Harbour would require improvement as well as the Upper Harbour, and it was well that all ! interests should be recognised in the constitution of such a Board. • The elected members would hold office for two years, and if any_ failure took place in the election the Superintendent was empowered to appoint members.' The powers given to the Board would be for dredging, constructing training walls, quays, and so forth ; and it would also be empowered to raise the sum of money mentioned in the resolutions — namely, £250,000. In the circulated copies of the Bill the word "debenture" had been used, but it was thought that it would be a better and easier way to get the money if there was a form of mortgage used. An amendment would therefore be made providing for a form of mortgage. He would particularly direct attention to one provision in this Bill, that was, that the money borrowed was to be borrowed on the security of lands vested in the Trust, and also on the security of any tolls, dues, or rents that might be obtained. In the face of this provision, he thought that csrtain members should withdraw expressions they had used, to the effect that the Government wished to saddle the revenues of the Province with the expense of improving Otago Harbour. It would be seen that the debentures and mortgage would not create any liability against the revenue of the Colony or the Province of Otago, so that, so far as that was concerned, the revenues of the Province were not going to be injured. It would also be observed that full power was given to the Municipal Councils of Dunedin aud Port Chalmers to have sewers constructed through the land given to the Harbour Board. That section would be amended, to the effect that should any dispute or difference arise between the Board and the Town Councils, such disputes shall be referred to the Superintendent and Executive, whose decision shall be binding. MrDE LAUTOUR said that notwithstanding what had been stated by the Provincial Solicitor, he maintained that clause 31 of the Bill did contain a charge against the revenues of the Province. That clause clearly implied that any other lands besides those mentioned might be put in the schedule. He thought they should have a distinct statement from the Provincial Solicitor, that no lands but those marked on the plan before the House "would be placed in the schedule. Mr M'DERMID said that he did not intend to offer any opposition to this Bill, provided it was merely what it was represented to be by the Provincial Solicitor. Ho would move that the debate be adjourned till Monday next.

The amendment was lost on the voices after a division was called for. The Bill was then read a second time, committed, and reported with amendments.

SECOND READINGS.

On the motion of Mr STOUT, the following Bills were read a second time :— Riverton Harbour Board Bill, Duuedin Presbyterian Church Lands Ordinance Amendment Bill, Roads Diversion Bill (No. 2), Palmeraton School Glebe Exchange Bill, Hospitals Bill, Port Chalmers School Reserve Sale Bill, Oamaru Harbour Board Bill.

On the motion of Mr STOUT, the above B lls were committed, and reported to the House with and without amendments.

THIRD READINGS.

All the above Bills, with the exception of the Hospitals Bill, Dunedin Presbyterian Church Lands Ordinance Amendment Bill, and the Otago Harbour Board Bill, were read a third time and passed. MONEY PAYMENT TO VOLUNTEERS IN LIEU OF

LAND GRANTS.

The House resolved itself into Committee of Supply to considor a contingent Notice of Motion by Mr SUMPTER as follows :— "That a respeotful Address be presented to His Honour the Superiutendent, requesting that the sum of £4000 bo placed on tne Supplementary Estimates in addition to the £2000 already agreed to, to provide payment in cash to Volunteers who may be entitled to a remission certificate for land."

Mr H, CLARK moved, as amendment — "That the sum of £4000 be reduced by £3000," which wouldgive each Volunteer £15. Mr REID said he was glad such an amendment had been moved, as the Government oould be prepared to place £3000 altogether on the Supplementary Estimates for this purpose. He thought this would bo a very fair compromise After considerable discussion, the amendment was oarried on a division, by 17 votes against 10.

Fjiiday, 12th June. /SUPPLEMENTARY ESTIMATES. Hiu Honour's MwwgOf No, #i, vvfts road,

forwarding the Supplementary Estimates, aud recommending the Council to make provision for the services therein specified.

Mr REID moved that His Honour's message should be taken in Committee of plyThe motion was agreed to. OTAGO HARBOUB BOARD BILL.

■ Mr STOUT gave notice that when the motion for the third reading of the above bill came on, he would move that the members of the' Council to be elected members of the Harbour Board should be the Honourable member /or Dunedin, Mr Davie, and the honourable member for Taieri, Mr Reid.

PRIVATE PETITIONS COMMITTEE. The Private Petitions Committee reported as follows :—(1.): — (1.) On the petition of "Henry Howorth, which set. forth that Henry, Orbell and Thomas Cotton claim to be entitled to a .certificate of title for certain lands alleged to have been purchased from the .New Zealand Company — that the petition was one which should be dealt with by the General Government, it being, in the opinion! of 1 the Committee, a matter beyond the functions' of the Provincial Council to interfere mi n(2.) On the petition of J. C. Macgregor, who prayed for inquiry into the circumstances of his dismissal from the Provincial Government service, with a view to redress being granted — that from th& evidence submitted to them, the Committee were of opinion that the discipline necessary to maintain "the efficiency of the Government service justified the action taken, and therefore the petitioner had no claim for consideration. The Committee finally reported having repoi ted on twenty- seven petitions, and expressed " considerable satisfaction to find that the Government so fully concur with the finding and recommendations of your Committee as to obviate the necessity of making any special motions in regard to their recommendations."

QUESTIONS.

Mr M'NEIL asked the Provincial Secretary — "Ist. Is the Government aware that the Waste Lands Board at Invercvrgill is refusing to grant saw-mill licenses except applicants undertake (1) not to supply railway sleepers, and (2) not to export timber, even coastwise, within the Province ? 2nd, Are the Southland Timber Regulations, alleged to be of 6th December, 1872, and found in Provincial Gazettes of 9th July and 27th August, 1873, advertised in the General Government Gazette, in accordance with the Southland Waste Lands Act Amendment Act, 1867 ?"

Mr REID replied that the Government were aware that the Waste Lands Board of Southland had in certain instances refused to grant saw-mill licenses, except under the condition that the timber should not be cut for sleepers for railways or for export from the district. This was for the purpose of preserving the forest for the use of the bona fide settlers in the district. The Council was not the place to express an opinion upon the action of the Board, but it did appear to him that when settlers selected this part of the district, believing that the forest would be reserved for their use, it would be hard to allow the timber to be cut with & view to export it. With regard to the second question, he hpd not had time to look the matter up. He thought, however, that he was justinexl in assuming that the advertisements were inserted in the Provincial Government Gazette.

Mr R. CLARKE obtained leave to ask the following question, without notice — ' ' Whether the Provincial Treasurer, in reply to the mover of motion No. 10, on yesterday's Order Paper, stated that the Government would refund to the Corporation of Arrowtown, the license fees collected from December last, according to tho provisions of the Local Revenues Ordinance, and that it was understood that no municipality had any claim on the Government in future by virtuo of clauses 4 and 5 of the Municipal Act, 1865, Amendment Bill, which was quoted by the movpr ?"

Mr TURNBULL said he cauld give an answer in the affirmative on both points.

SUPPLEMENTARY ESTIMATES.

On the motion of Mr REID, the Conncil went into Committee of Supply, and proceeded to consider Estimates No. 2, 1874-5.

Under the head of "Railways," the fol. lowing items were passed as printed :—: — Otautau Line to Invercargill, and Winton Line at Makerewa Bridge, L 32.100; Branch Line to Green Island Coal Pits, L9IGO ; Waiareka Valley, L 45,000; Riverton to Orepuki, L 28,40 0; Riverton to Otautau, L 37.100 ; Survoy on New Railways, LIOOO. A discussion arose on the item of LIO,OOO, for tho Harbour Works at Kakanui.

Mr GILLIES objected to the vote appearing on the Estimates, as to come out of revenue or out of loan. The revenue was already burthened too much, and if such a work were proposed to be done out of a loan for railways, it might have the effeot of making the General Assembly refuse the 1 money. Mr REID explained that if the loan were 1 not obtained, not one shilling would bo spent on this work.

Mr GILLIES said that with the assurance they had just received from the Provincial Secretary, he would withdraw his objection. Mr FISH opposed the vote, and thought it would be much better to look to the improvement of the harbours of Oamaru and Moeraki, whioh were both far superior to that of Kakanui. He did not oare whether the amount wore spent out of revenue or out of loan j but he opposed the work on the ground that it was not necessary. Mr TESOHBMAKBR upheld the import, woe of the yot* pf £10,000 fpr the K«i*»^

Harbour, whichhe considered thebest between here and Akaroa. This also was the opinion of the Chief Harbour Master. Dr WEBSTER supported the item. Mr KINROSS opposed the grant, and thought that the money could be much better 8P Mr' GREEN was of opinion that £10,000 •would merely commence. The district would be directly benefited by the Northern Trunk Railway, and he really did not see any necessity for the work in question. The item was lost by 18 to 12. The division list is as follows :—: — Ayes, 12 : Messrs Daniel, Davie, Lumsden, M'Kellar, M'Lean (teller), Reid, Stout, Sumpter, Teschemaker (teller), Turnbull, Webster, and Wood. Noes, 18 : Messrs Allan, J. C. Brown, G. F. C. Browne, H. Clark, R. Clarke, De Lautour, Fish (teller), Green (teller), Hazlett, Henderson, Ireland, Kinross, M'Dermid, M'Kenzie, M'Neil, Rogers, Turton, and Wilson. . On the item, "Bridge over Taieri at Hyde, £2000," Mr REID explained that this sum was only to be spent in view of the loan being obtained. The item then passed. On the item, "Prbvincial Council, L 700,' Mr GREEN called attention to the fact that all the officers of tho department had their salaries raised, except the messenger.

Mr REID explained that the messenger's salary was raised last year, whereas the others were not. The item was passed as printed.

The following were passed as printed :—: — Police. — Commissioner, LSO ; 3 Sub-In-Bpectors, at L3O each, L9O ; 2 Inspectors, at L 25 each, LSO; Clerk and Accountant, 1-25; Rent of Police Stations, L300— L515. Treasury.—Junior Clerk, LlO. Harbour Department.—Pier Master, L 26 5; Night Walkman, L 8 ; Harbour Master, Kakanui, 1/25 ; Harbour Master, Molyneux, L 25 — L 323,,, Hospital.— Rations, L 250; Stores and Furniture, LIOO ; Bedding and Clothing, Llso— LSOO. Wardsman, L7O. Miscellaneoua— Messenger, Salary, L2O ; Kakamii Walker Race Co., L4OO ; Geological Survey, L 230; Oamaru Rocket Brigade, L 15 0; Bonus for Gold-Saving Apparatus, L 25 0; Athenaeums and Public Libraries, LSOO ; Expenses- of Witnesses, Switzers Enquiry, Ll2 ; Prizes for Drainage Ploughs, L 15 0; Expenses of Witnesses, Crown Prosecutions, LSO ; Premium on Guarantee Policies, L2O; Port Chalmers Athenaeum, L 56 ; Volunteers, at Lls a head, L3000— L4552. Provincial Engineer's Department. — 1 Assistant Engineer, L 350 ; rent of quarters, Invercargill, L4O ; 2 Cadets, atLSO each, LIOO — L 490. Gaol. — Bedding and Clothing, LIOO JJOO. Survey Department. — Equipment of Parties and Wages, L 2600— T.9«qo. Land Office. — Government Auctioneers, L7sO— L 750. Roads. — Arrow to Macetown, via Big Hill, L 10 0; Arrow to Crown Terrace, L 25 0; Kyeburn to Naseby, LSO ; Tinkers to Chatto Creek, L3O ; do Bendigo Gully, L6O; Mataura Bridge to Tois Tois, LSO ; Palmerston to Shag Point, LSOO ; Dalhousie to Waitahuna, Weather Creek Bridge, L 200; Havelock Lower Road, L6O ; Road to Railway Stations, Inch Clutha and Kaitangata, L 250; Waipori to Lawrence, via Bungtown, L 250 ; Port William to Halfmoon Bay and Paterson's Inlet, L 250 ; Dunedin to North Taieri, via Halfway Bush, L 20 0; Puerua Road, L10O ; Switzers to Nokomai, bridle-track, LSO ; Balclutha to Lawrence, via Mount Stewart, L 50 0; Gibbstown to Coal Pits, LSO ; Upper Shotover to Maori Point, via Pleasant Creek, L 25 0; Approaches to Arthur's Point Bridge, LSOO ; do Beaumont Bridge, L 40 0; Formation of Castle street, L7OO ; Main Road through Dunedin, Lloo— L 5200. Bridges :— Waitaki Bridge, L 250 0; Foot-bridge, Skipper's Point, L 150; do Moke Creek, L2O ; Molyneux, at Roxburgh, L 2500 ; Foot-bridge, Teviot Stream, LIOO ; Otepiri and Upper Makerewa, L2OO ; Inch Valley Bridge, L100— L5570. Works :— Provincial Council Hall Alterations, 400; Snow Poles, Upper Nevis to Gibbstown, L 75; Otago Dock (working expenses and liabilities), L 2500 ; Alteration of Gauge, Invercargill Railways, L3OOO ; Hospital, L 10 0; Government Buildings, Queenstown, L6OO ; Immigration Agent, L 70 0; Oamaru Dock, L2000— L9375. Out of Loan, if authorised by Assembly. — Railways : — Main Line through Seaward Bush, L 20.000 ; Main Line to Kaitangata, and Extension to Coal Point, L 27,75 0; Main Line to Outram, L 12.000 ; Tokomairiro Branch Railway, L 14.000 ; Paltnerston to Wayne's, L 25.000 ; Edendale to Wyndham, L 10,500 ; Kaitangata Station to Inch Clutha, L9, 500— L1 18, 750. BILLS. The Ofcago Harbour Board Bill was read a third time and passed. Mr STOUT moved that the two members to be elected by the Council be Mr Da^ie and Mr Reid. He proposed a member of the Executive as he considered it necessary one should be on the Board, and he thought that member should be the head of the Executive. . i j. j Messrs Reid and Davie were elected. The Dimedia Presbyterian Church Lands Ordinance Amendment Bill was read a third 1 The Lawrence Reserves Sales Bill was read A seoond time. The Gold Doty Repayment Bill was brought up for Becond reading. Mr STOUT explained that the amount to be repaid was not put in the Appropriation Bill, as it involved the principle of the Province dealing with the Customs revenue. Mr M'GLASHAN moved that the Bill be read that day six months. It was bo much WF*ta P»pe>> tbftt would nob be assented to.

Mr STOUT did not want that fight renewed again, seeing the motion for making the repayments was carried by a large majority. Mr M'GLASHAN withdrew his proposition, and The Bill was read a second tune. The Naseby Recreation Reserves Management Bill (giving the local Corporation power to manage a recreation reserve), Invercargul Reserves Management Ordinance Amendment Bill, and Appropriation Bill, 1874-75, were read a second time. The Appropriation Bill, 1874-75, the Invercargill Reserves Management Ordinance Amendment Bill, Naseby Reserves Recreation Reserves Management Bill, Gold Duty Repayment Bill, and Lawrence Reserves Sale Bill, were read a third time and passed.

MEETING UNAUTHORISED EXPENDITURE.

Mr EEID moved—" That an Address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, requesting him to forward to this Council a recommendation to grant a sum of money sumcient to meet the unauthorised expenditure referred to in the letter from the Provincial Auditor laid upon the Table by Mr Speaker on the 12th day of May, 1874. ' Carried.

SCHOOL GLEBE,

Mr REID moved— "That an Address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, recommending that section 8, block 11., Naseby, be set apart as a site for a school and master's residence." Carried.

RESERVES TOR EDUCATION.

Mr REID moved— "That an Address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, recommending that all that parcel of land in the Province of Otago, in the Colony of New Zealand, containing by admeasurement thirteen acres three roods and thirty poles, more or less, situate in the Waikaka District, being section numbered 14, block VIII., on the map of the said district [boundaries and linkages given] be set apart for educational purposes." Carried. Mr REID moved— "That an Address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, recommending that all parcel of land in the Province of Otago, in tlife Colony of New Zealand, containing by admeasurement thirty-three acres one rood and five poles, more or less, sittiate in Wyndham district, being section numbered fifty, block IV., on the map of the said district (boundaries and linkage given), be set apart for a Gravel Reserve." Carried.

PRECEDENCE TO GOVERNMENT BUSINESS.

Mr REID moved— "That Government business take precedence during the remainder of the session." Carried. NEW MEMBER OF THE GOVERNMENT.

Mr REID : I have much pleasure in stating that the honourable member for the Kawarau, Mr M'Kellar, has consented to joiu the Government, and to represent the goldfields. I have every confidence that that gentleman has knowledge of the wants of the miners, and that his business capacity will give confidence throughoutthe goldfields. I have much pleasure in stating that he will take his seat on the Government Benches. ABANDONMENT OF THE LARGE RESERVES.

Mr REID moved — "That this Council having had under its consideration His Honour's Message No. 20, relative to the reserves set aside as endowments for High, Grammar, and District Schools, Hospitals, Benevolent Institutions, and for the Clutha Eiver Trust, concurs in the recommendations therein contained, and in order to secure that Crown grants of the Educational Endowments be issued without further delay, respectfully requests that His Honour the Superintendent will take such steps as he may consider necessary to induce the General Government to issue Crown grants for the reserves made for High, Grammar, and District Schools, and that so soon as the grants are issued, the reserves for Hospitals, Benevolent Institutions, and Ciutha River Trust be abandoned." In moving the motion, he stated thiß step had been proposed on account of the Colonial Government not having up to this time consented to issue Crown grants for the whole of the reserves, and, there was reason to believe, the Colonial Government would not. The 1 mds were now tied up. They could not be used for mining or agriculture — he believed only a very small portion was suitable for either of these purposes — and were in such a position that it was better to have them placed under the management of the Wasto Lands Board. That course would be a very fair solution of the difficulty. At the last session of the Assembly the General Government introduced a Bill for doing away with these reserves, and leaving it to the Province to create reserves to the extent of 500,000 acres. Many members for the Province did not see their way to this. The measure was carried in the House of Representatives, but was thrown out in the Upper House. The Upper House, he believed, threw it out in order to get an expression of opinion from this Council. He believed that the abandonment of the reserves proposed to be abandoned vould lead to Crown grants being issued for the others. Besides, the reserving of these lends prevented pastoral tenants from getting their pre-emptive rights, and he believed that had something to do with the opposition shown j and, as a matter of justice, they should, if they desired, be allowed to select their pre-emptives. Mr STOUT spoke in support of the motion. In a debate whioh ensued, a number of members, spoke, Some, of them, thought jto

•would be wrong for them to vote away any apparent right they might have, for an undisputed title over a smaller extent -, also, that the time had not arrived to cease efforts for having these reserves Crown-granted. Mr M'LEAN moved— "That the Council having had under consideration His Honour's message, is of opinion that, while concurring in his opinion as to the desirability of obtaining Crown grants for the Educational Reserves, it is still of opinion that the other reserves should also be obtained.

The words in the original motion were struck out, on a division, by 21 votes against 14. The following is the division list on the question "that the words of_ the original motion stand part of the question" :—: — Ayes, 14 : Messrs Allan, Davie, Haggitt, Kinross, Lumsden, M'Dermid, M'Glashan, M'Kellar, Reid (teller), Roberts, Stout (teller), Turnbull, Webster, and Wilson. *Noes, 21 : Messrs Bastings, J. C. Brown (teller), G. F. C. Browne, H. Clark, R. Clarke, Cumming, Daniel, Fish (teller), Green, Hazlett, Henderson, Ireland, M'Kenzie, M'Lean, M'Neil, Oliver, Reeves, Rogers, Sumpter, Tolmie, and Wood. The amendment was then agreed to on the voices.

RAILWAY RESOLUTIONS.

Mr REID moved— " 1. No District Railway shall be undertaken or authorised by the Provincial Government to be constructed until the consent of not less than two-thirds of the owners of property in the district supposed to be benefited by such railway (the boundaries of such district to be defined by this Council) shall have been obtained to a rate being levied from time to time on all property within swch district to a sufficient amount to make up two-fifths of the deficiency (if any) of the interest on the cost of constructing such railway, and the whole of the deficiency (if i any) ot the cost of working the line over and above the cost of levying and collecting such rate." c "2. That for the purpose of ascertaining the consent of the owners of propeaty in any district, in terms of the preceding resolution, the votes of such owners shall be calculated in proportion to the property held by them, on a scale similar to that provided in the Otago Roads Ordinance, 1871, for the purposes of tbat Ordinance. " 3. When any District Railway has to be constructed through any district in which there are unsold lands of the Crown, such lands as shall be included in such district shall be rated to the same extent as other lands, and the rate payable in respect of such lands shall be paid out of Provincial revenues until such lands shall be sold. "4. That special provision shall be made with the owners of mines, or any works of any description, to which any such line is to be constructed, for contributing towards the payment of working expenses and lnI terest, as may be determined by the Council. ! " For the purposes of these resolutions, a ' District Railway shall mean a railway connecting with a main branch or main line of railway." The honourable member said he thought it was necessary that there should be a guarantee against losses in constructing the railways. It was intended by those resolutions that wherever railways were constructed through a district that might be considered to be specially benefited, that the persons interested, who have property, mines, or other works wbich require railway communication, should guarantee the Province a certain portion of the interest and sinking fund. This would guard the Province from undue aemands for the. construction of railways where the traffic is insufficient to justify the expenditure. , Mr M'LEAN said that of all modes of constructing railways he thought this was the clumsiest, and he trusted the Council would not agree to the resolutions. There were only , two ways of constructing railways— when the State constructed the whole of the railways without guarantee, and when Companies were allowed to construct railways on their own responsibility. To make a compound of those two modes was a thing utterly impossible to carry out. Mr GUMMING- opposed the resolutions. Mr M'KENZIE said he thought a great injustice would be done to many people in the Province if these resolutions were agreedto. The whole community paid for the construction of the main line of railway, whereas if a branch railway were run up a valley or on to a plain, the settlers in the valley or plain would have to pay for their railway besides having to pay their Bhare towards the construction of the main lines. In this respect, the settlers wonld be unjustly taxed. Mr WOOD supported the resolutions.

Mr LUMSDEN could not see that thes* resolutions were to apply to railways already undertaken. They did not apply to main lines or main branch lines. He could easily understand that in districts where there were main lines, or main branch lines, there might be people carrying on certain industries who might wish to be connected with th*» main lines, and those people might be very willing to contribute towards the payment of sink, ing fund and interest. Messrs FISH and DANIEju supported the m Mr STOUT said he thought the only dimcultyin carrying out the resolutions would be defining the districts. It would be Been that those resolutions were of a permissive character, beotfuse the demand for railways came in the first instance from the various districts themselves. The supposed unfairness referred to by the honourable member, Mr M'Kenzie, would not exist. He Blight aa well Bay that the settlers in the vioinity of the main lines of road should pay $l»a post of pwintenauoe. Thew fepolW"

tions were only extending the provisions' of the existing Roads Ordinance, and they merely said to the settlers, If you wish to make district railways instead of roads, you can do so. The Government will go even further than in the making of roads, for it will construct the railways, and only charge you, if there is a discrepancy, twofifths of the interest and working expenses.

Mr SUMPTER opposed the resolutions for three reasons : First, on the ground that they would do an injustice ; second, on account of their impracticability ; and third, because they would deter the construction of lines which would prove valuable feeders to the main lines. He thought it was unjust for the Government to come in at this stage of railway construction, and say that certain settlers should pay for their own railways when others have escaped. He thought the impracticability of defining districts would render it very injurious to give effect to the resolution.

Mr M'NEIL thought that the difficulty of defining the districts would prevent the Government from carrying out the resolutions. If those railways aimed at by the resolutions did not pay directly, they would pay indirectly in rendering the main trunk lines profitable. Mr REID, in reply, pointed out that the initiative for the construction of a railway would have to emanate from the district itself. It was not intended to , apply the resolutions to the railways agreed to by the Council last session, and now in course of construction. No doubt, had such resolutions been brought forward last session, the Green Island branch railway, would have been included. He had no doubt that if the railway were so included, the residents in the district would have gladly submitted to taxation. He had no doubt that the residents in many districts would gladly submit to taxation in order to get railways. He had that day received an offer from certain gentlemen of means for the construction of a railway to certain coal-pits ; and those gentlemen guaranteed the* working expenses and interest on the line.

The first resolution was carried on a division by 19 votes against 15. The following is the division list : —

Ayes, 19 : Messrs Allan, J. C. Brown, Daniel, Davie, Haggitt, Hallenstein, Henderson, Ireland, Kinross, Lumsden, M'Glashan, Reeves, Reid (teller), Roberts, Stout (teller), Turnbull, Webster, Wilson, and Wood.

Noes, 15 : Messrs Bastings, H. Clark, R. Clarke, Cumming, De Lautour, Green (teller), Hazlett, M'Dermid, M'Kenzie, M'Lean (teller), M'Neil, Oliver, Rogers, Sumpter, and Tolmie.

The other resolutions were then agreed to on the voices.

WATER RESERVE FOR INVERCARGILL.

Mr LUMSDEN moved—" That a respect- N ful Address be presented to His Honour the Superintendent, requesting him to reserve, in terms of section 16, Southland Waste Lands Act, 1865, as a site for the collection and supply of water for the town of Invercargill, the land consisting of one block, 600 acres, being a rectangular block of land situated near the head of the west branch of the Dunsdale Creek, in the Forest Hill Hundred, having 100 ch-uns frontage to the creek, and a depth of 30 chains on each side thereof ; and one block, 600 acres, being a rectangular block of land situated on the east branch of the Dunsdale Creek, in the Forest Hill and Waimumu Hundreds, having 100 chains frontage to the creek, and a depth of 30 chains on each side thereof." Agreed to.

COSTS OF SURVEY.

Mr J. C. BROWN moved— "That Interim Report No. 8, from Waste Lands and Immigration Committee in re Order of Reference No. 3, as to costs of survey, be approved : — ' Your Committee are of opinion that the charges under the Government Regulations require considerable modification, and would suggest an inquiry into the subject.' " Agreed to. SALE OF CERTAIN LAND AT SHAG VALLEY.

Mr J. C. BROWN moved—" That Interim Report No. 5, from the Waste Lands and Immigration Committee in re Shag Valley land sale, be approved. Report as follows : « Your Committee are of opinion that the late Government are responsible for a serious loss of revenue to the Province, and an injustice to intending competitors, by not carrying out the resolution of the Provincial Council passed on the 10th July, 1873— That this Council recommends the Government to grant the prayer of the petition of settlers in the Shag Valley District— the Superintendent having been advised by his responsible advisers on the 31st July, 1873, one day after the session closed, not to exercise his right of reservation.' " Dr WEBSTER said that he was surprised that no member of the late Executive had been called before the Committee referred to. It was proposed to put up this land at 10s an acre, but it was withdrawn from sale because there was an objection against the land being put up at 10s an acre. The Government said they could not sell the land at 10s, as the Council resolved that no land should be Bold at 10s an acre. Therefore the land reverted to its original position as a Hundred. He was not aware that they could have made a commonage in a Hundred. This land had been in Hundreds for many years, and at the time the Government thought they had no power to withdraw it from the applicants. Any other resident in the district had as much right to purchase the land aa the gentleman who did apply for it. As for the price obtained, he thought i\ wa» a rery good price far th* Jand,

Mr STOUT drew attention" to the fact ihat the report referred to contained no recommendation, and he therefore submitted that the motion was out of order. The SPEAKER agreed with Mr Stout, and ruled the motion out of order.

PETITION OF R. S. SINCLAIR.

Mr J. C. BROWN moved— "That Interim Report No. 6, from the Waste Lands and Immigration Committee in re petition of Robert Sinclair Allan, be approved. Report as follows': — ' Your Committee have considered this petition, and are of opinion that, seeing strong inducements were held out to parties to proceed to Martin's Bay Settlement, and that the petitioner proceeded there, at considerable expense, with the full intention of settling, evidenced by his making a considerable outlay ; and that, owing to that encouragement that was expected to be given by the Government not being fulfilled, he was compelled to abandon his enterprise. In the opinion of your Committee, the Government ought to take whatever steps may be found necessary to secure the petitioner a Crown grant for his 50-acre section."

Some discussion took place, in the course of which the members of the Government urged that it would be a very bad precedent to remit the conditions laid down for the acquiring of sections at Martin's Bay. The motion was agreed to. PETITION OF ROXBURGH LAND COMMITTEE.

Mr J. C. BROWN moved— "That Interim Report No. 7, from the Waste Lands and Immigration Committee, In re Petition of the Roxburgh Land Committee, be approved. Report as follows: — 'Your Committee have carefully considered this petition, and have to report that the evidence of eight known practical men is so completely contradictory to that of Warden Simpson, in regard to the character of the two blocks of land on Henderson's Run, Mount Benger, that the Committee are of opinion that if the arrangements regarding these blocks have not been completed, the Government should not do so until the matter is more fully investigated.' " Agreed to. VOUCHERS FOR WORK DONE.

Mr J. O. BROWN moved— "That in the opinion of this Council, the Government should make arrangements so as to ensure to their employes the full amount of the voucherß given them for work done." The honourable member explained that workmen up-country had to pay exchange when they cashed their vouchers at the Bank.

Mr KEID promised that full enquiry would be made into the matter, with a view to remedying the hardship referred to. The motion was then agreed to. The House adjourned at midnight, until 2 p.m. on Monday.