DUNEDIN CHURCH LANDS ORDINANCE, 18G1.

Otago Witness, Issue 517, 26 October 1861, Page 6

DUNEDIN CHURCH LANDS ORDINANCE, 18G1.

; We have been requested to publish the following correspondence relative to the above Bill, passed at the last Session of the Provincial Council : — Dunedin, 6lh July, 1861. His Honor the Superintendent, j Sin, — Your Honor ha\ing announced that you had reserved the " Dunedin Chinch Lands Bill, 18(51," for His Excellency the Governor's assent, and that you would tianbinit the same to His Excellency, with your observations thereou, I have to request, on behalf of the promoters of the Bill, I that you will be so good as to furnish me, on their \ behalf, with a copy of your observations before j transmission, that the promoters of the Bill may have the opportunity of also laying their \iews before His Excellency. Your Honor will, I tiust, see the piopriety as well as the justice of this course, inasmuch as the Bill is a Private, not a Public Bill, and that, therefore, the rights of the | p:u ties interested should not be prejudiced by any statement made to His Excellency, to which they have no opportunity of leplying. Your early leply will oblige, V our most obedient servant, Thomas B. Giliies. Superintendent's Office, Dunedin, July 16, 1861. Sir, — Your letter of the 7th inst. was delivered at my office on Monday the Bth, and as I was absent at Tu:i]jclca, and learned from 5011 there that jou would not be home till the 17th, no unnecessary del.iy in replying has occuned. I mention this because the mail from Auckland may shortly be expected. 1 submitted your letter for the advice of the Executive Council, who, under the peculiar circumstances of the case, considered that 1 might accede to the request you have made. I somewhat reluctantly accept this advice, because I am of opinion that such a procedure is contrary to official propriety, but in acting on it 1 shall explain the circumstances to the lion, the Colonial Secretary. I hope that a copy of my opinion will be in your possession at an early date. It is still, owing to the press of business, unprepared. The Bills aie not yet in my possession. 1 have the honour to be, &c., J. ItllUlAttDfeON, Superintendent. T. B. GUHps, E<.q., Dunedin. Superintendent's Office, Dunedin, July 17, 1861. I Silt, — Though the offifi il copy of the " Dunedin j Church Lands Bill" of 1861, which 1 have 1 evened for the bignific.ilion of His Excellency's pleasure ttu'ii'ou, has not yet come to hand but immediately expected, I take the cailiest opportunity of forwarding you a transcript of the rough draft of my letter to His Excellency thcieon, which will not diff'ei fiom tbo original in any material points. I would delay till the letter was l'aiily traiihciibed for despatch, but 1 fi'ar I s>hould lose some of the short time »t your dispobal before the departuie of the noilhein mail. 1 have the honour to be, &c, J. RIuHAttUSON, Superintendent. T. B. Gillies, Esq., Dunedin. Superintendent's Office, Dunedin, 17th July, 1861. Sir,— ln forwarding the " Dunodiu Church Lands BUI" for the signification of His Excellency's pleasure thei eon, 1 consider it my duty to lay before him my objections to its becoming law, which have arisen — Ist, from gia.vo doubts as to t!ie validity of the Crown grants, wlm-li appear to have beorx issued on misinformation ; and, second, from a strong conviction that if the titles be good the change i contemplated, from a'-jme to an endowment, is foreign to the purpose far which the grunt was obtained, and in the preSigM case is not called for by any peculiar circumstances*' As regards . the first point, I beg to forward, { marked ,A, a copy of a portion of the Garliest-miip f of the proposed town of Dunedin, in which you will '

observe that the land for which a Crown grant was obtained in 1858, as a site for a chuich, and which, comprehends an area of moie than four acres, was in 1846, as is evident by the sketch of a fort permanently delineated on the map, reserved as a foitification, for which it is einincmly adapted, commanding, as it does, both the harbour and the town, and that sections on either side, near the water, which were struck out of the map a<s interfering with the water frontage, time been united to the receive for a foi ti(le;itiuif, .md tho whole transfeired by the Crown grant from the purpose of public utility for the public service to which it was appropriated, to another purpose not embracing the intetcsts of the whole community. As regards the site foramanse.it appears that it was originally laid off in sections, and not reserved, which is shown by a lefereitce to the Plan A, and that it was subsequently erased from the map, in part on account of the necessity of reser\ing the water frontage. By Mr. Adam's evidence, as taken by the Select Committee, it would appear that it is the wish of the promoters of this Bill to let the land on building leases, which proposal, if the Kind be not bond fide requiied as a site for a church, would be inllicting an injury on the early bottlers, who would 1 have chosen it in right of priority of choice, its locality being eminently adapted for mercantile purposes, beijiar closely ;idj icent to the public jetty. i I'hercfoi c, if, nfter deducting the water frontage, it [ be not required for the site of a manse, 1 conceive j the pi npeity should revolt to the public, and the lents be appropriated to public purposes. Also, with respect to the bite for a church and school, I would observe that a portion of the bite consists of waterw ater fionta«e. Befoio lea\ins this subject, I would lemark, for His Excellences information, th.it the persons whose evidence appears in the Select Committee's report, weie interested parties, that the settlers by I the earliest vessels were not examined, and that the e\idence could notbecomplete without the testimony of the suivejor to the New Zealand Company, who is absent at Auckland ; and I would further remark that these giants weie obtained without the cognisance and sanction of the Executive or Fiovineial Councils, I As legards the second point, I would observe that, admitting for (he occasion the validity of the title which nppiopi iated the land lesened for a fortification as a site for a church, such a site having bepn already obtained under the terms of the other giant for church and school, and admitting also the validity of the title of the manse pioperty, I cannot regard the change from a site for a manse to an endowment for church pui poses as otherwise than entiiely inconsistent with the objects contemplated by the Public Reserves Act of 1804, the more especially when it is considered that the Church for whose especial behoof the endowment is contemplated is ahertdy enciowed to a large extent, by the appiopriation for its use, in conjunction with education, of one-eighth of the entire sales under the New Zealand Company. On these grounds I would submit that considerations of Imperial policy, as well as of provincial and private rights, require th.it your Excellency's assent should be withheld to the " Dunedin Chuich Lands Bill of 1861," and that immediate measures should be taken — especially regarding the present threatening aspect of European politics — for the choice | of site? for fortifications, by which the public pro- j pevty in case of attack may be effectually protected. I have the honour to bo, &c., J. RICHAUDSOX, Superintendent. Dunedin, 18th July 1861. Sir, — On behalf of the promoters of a private Bill, entitled the " Dunedin Church Lands Ordinance," which has been passed by the Provincial Council of Otago, and of which 1 had the conduct in the Council, I have respectfully to lequest that the following remarks may be submitted to his Excellency the Governor, along with the lemarks of his Honor the Superintendent of this Piovince, when that Ordinance is submitted to his Excellency for the signification of his pleasure thereon. This somewhat unusual course has been rendered necessary by the detoimined opposition lo the Bill by the Piovincinl Executive in all its stages; by the reservation of it by his Honor for his Excellency's assent, and by his lionet's intimation th.it he would transmit his remarks thereon to his Excellency. In reply to my request, his Honor has furnished me with a copy of his lemarks, so tti.il the interests of the promoters of the Bill might not be piejudiued without receiving a fair hearing in the mitter. In reply to Ilia Honor's fust objection I would remark that the doubts which seem to exist in the minds of His Honor and Ilis Executive as to the validity of the Ciown Giants, appear from the statements in support of them to be founded on a misconception of what is necessary to invalidate a Cionn grant. Meic nu's-informaiiou on the part of the Crown (even if true), is no buflicknt ground for the repeal of a Crown grant, unless theie h>is been a misrepresentation by the parlies interested under the giant by which the Crown has been de<ei\ed. In the present ease there is, and can be no allegation to this effect. These leserves wore set aside and appropriated, in 1818, to their specific puiposes by the late Captain Cargill, as the duly authorised Resident Agent at Oiago, of the New Zealand Company, with the approval of the piincip.il agent at Wellington (Colonel Wakelield or Mr. Fox), and, at Captain Cargill^ request, and on the 1 epiescntations made by him, than whom there could have been no better authority, and whose integrity is unimpeachable, the grants weie issued in 1858, without any communication with, or rcpiesent.itions fiom, the Presbyterian Church of Otago, the parties interested thereunder. The assertion that ever the Church site was ever reserved for a fortification by any competent authority, appears to be without any foundation, escept the vague circumstance of a foit being marked on the early survey map, in 1846, and the value of this circumstance will be at once seen by a reference to the fact that by the terms of purchase of the settlement of Otago reserves, weie to be made and allocated to their special purposes only t>y the New Zealand Company's agent, and not by the Surveyors, and that the Resident Agent of the Company only arrived here in 184S, and immediately reserved and allotted the reserves to the purposes for which the Crown grants have been issued. As to this site being at all suitable for a fortification, I would ventine humbly to suggest that if '• considerations of Imperial policy," " the threatening aspect of Euiopcan politics," or any other cause, requires the protection of the harbour of Dunedin, it might be as well to stop an enemy by fortifications at the Heads or at the narrow channel by Port Chalniers, where there is a te&erve for fortification, or elsewhere on the harbour, before his arrival within the range of this sits, which happens unfortunately to be commanded by all the surrounding heights. The remark of his Honor, that the [ ersons who gave evidence are interested parties, and that the bettleis by the earliest vessels weie not examined, seems to me a peculiarly unfair one. These persons have no personal or private inteiest in the matter, but simply the interest of being members of the church through whose agency the settlement of Olago was originally founded. They were among the early settlers, having arrived by the first ship which sailed from Scotland for Otago, and the second ship which arrived in Otago some three weeks after the first. As well might interested motives he imputed to a Provincial Government, who, as Englishmen and adherents of the Church of England, and all with one exception comparatively recent settlers, cannot be expected to appieciate or sympathise with the original' plan of settlement as a Scotch Presbyterian settlement, in accordance with which plan these reserves were originally made, and who now avow their desire to cause these reserves after thirteen years undisturbed occupation by the Presbyterian Church of Otago, to revert tcs tne public {i.e., the Province,) and the rents to be appropriated to public (i.e., Provincial) purposes. Ample notice was given of the Bill, time and opportunity were given for objections to be heard, or produce opposing evidence if it could be procured, and I presume the Provincial Council, who affirmed the second reading of the Bill by a majority of ten to six thereof, the minority being the Executive, are the best exponents of public opinion in such a nvitter. On this part of His Honor's objections I would only further lcm.irk, that the Crown Grants having been issued, in fulfilment of the prior engagements of the New Zealand Company, there wnb no occasion to obtain the sanction of the Executive or Provincial Council thereto. As to his Honor's second objection, I have specially to call his Excellency's attention to the Oidiliancc itself .is pulsed by the Council, which at once dispioves the assertion that the piopo^ed change is from a si'e to an endowment lor Church purposes. The Ordinance iippiopriales the funds to be derived to the buildintr, not the. endowment of Chinches ; apuiposp, which I submit, does embrace the inteiests of the whole community, and a purpose which is c!iri)ing out the original intention of the donors, the New Zealand Company. The Public Reserves Act, 18.H, evidently contemplated much greater chaigos on Public Reserve" than this Ordinance pioposes, and places the whole question of such Reserves under the control of the Provincial Council. To ihe^omtrk of his Honor, that the Presbyterian Church of Otago is already endowed to a large extent, it is unnecessary to allude further than to say, that were this correct, as it is otherwise, it could not affect the question, and if such aiemaik vveii- made by a Scotch PiesbyU;rian, in the Province of Ointcrbury, relative to the Church Endowments, there it would be justly considered ofFensive. In conclusion, I would submit lo his Excellency that the Provincial Council of Otngo having, by n large majority, passed this Ordinance in tho face of the known opposition of his Honor the Superintendent, and of the most strenuous opposition at every stage of the Provincial Executive, his Excellency would not be justified in withholding his assent on the very insufhc : ent grounds alleged in his Honor's remarks, grounds which partake more of the character of Strong private opinions and feelinga than *<

of a liberal and comprehensive view of the public benefit. — I have the honour lo be, &c. Thomas B. Gillies. Dunedin, 20th July 1861. Ilis Honrir the Superintendent. Sir— l ha\e io acknowledge receipt of your Honor's communication of 16th ;md 17th inst. relative to the " Dunedin Chuich Lands Bill," together with copy rcmaiks addressed by you to the Colonial Secretary, and have to thank your Honor for your couiteons compliance with my request. I enclose copy of my communication to the Colonial Secretaiy in this" ln.xttor, which I regret, from the veiy short time elapsing between the receipt of your letter and the closing of the mail, it was impossible for me to furnish pievious to the closing of the mail I have the honour to be, &c , Thomas B. Gillies. Supeiintendent's Office, Dunedin, 20th July, 1861. Sin, — I have the honour to acknowledge the receipt of your letter of 20th July inst., with enclosure, and thank you for the consideration evinced in forwarding the document in question. As I reluctantly acceded to the opinion of the Executive in guing you a copy of a letter to His Excellency the Governor, and as the receipt of your enclosure may lead to the establishment of a precedent injurious to the public interests, I beg to decline the copy of your communication which you addressed to His Excellency, brins; assured that, should it be of a character which makes it desirable that I should be made acquainted with it, His Excellency will direct a copy to be forwarded to me. I have the honour to be, &c, J. Richardson, Superintendent.