INCIDENTS OF THE DEBATE.

Otago Daily Times, Issue 10418, 22 July 1895, Page 4

INCIDENTS OF THE DEBATE.

(Fhom Oub Own Cqrrespondent.) ' Z Wellington, July 20. The Premier, in fche no-confidence debate ' eaid : " The institutions that bad borrowed at ''■>' 4 per cent, could nob compete with the Colonial Treasurer, and so it was that these corporations - had traduced andslander.d the Government from the North Cape to Invercargill. The people applauded the work of the Treasurer. (Dissent.) . Yes, he had reduced tho rate of interest by 2 per cent.—(More dissent.) The success of the Treasurer' in London had created envy hatred, and malice, and all uncharitablenegs! As to what the people would do with these" securities if occasion should arise, what had the country done in the case of the-Bank of New Zealand? It had given a two! million guarantee, and so the country would pledgm these securities in the event of a crisis." Had the Bank of New Zealand: been per*, mitted to collapse, said the Miuister for Land? would it not have been proper fco use the securities in JLondon to save the credit of th<a colony■•" If there had been a run, London was the proper place foy the securities. "Not to pay oth°r people's debts," said Mr 8011. . -■"-, - ."-. ■ The Minister for Labour says the pexsonswho deposited moneys with the public departments 'have nothing to do with the securities.' Could they demand, or would they demand, them ? Their security was the credit of the Treasury •' and therefore these securities could'best he ■■-• employed' in maintaining the credit;of the' Treasury. 'rffif7.f-i., Mr Bell said he must describe ffie spesch of. the Minister for Labour as.-ay personal, malicious villifieation that outside the House no gentleman could use -.another He said deliberately aud with the fullest sense' of responsibility that rested upon him, thatthe Treasurer could hot have controlled the Jseeurities, for they are practically under the control of the. Auditor-general, as custodian, and he was the servant of the House and .not cf tho Government. He would stake bis reputation, all he was worth, when he said any judge, of the Supreme Court would, upon application, make an order to prevent the. Treasmser. pawning those securities, and he challenged ban to test fche case. The people looked to the: credit"oE the colony, it is true, for protection; but did i thafc give* the Government; the rigjifc.td play the part of a fraudulent trustee with- these ' securities ? Mr Duthie-ecornfully denied the-impataJioa that he had when in London said or done-any-thing to discredit the Treasurer'si'": work or the finances'of the colony. It was absurdto I suppose thafc the financiers of London were'edncerned about fche early collection of theJandJfcax. They had no.time to think'of any&ing bnttheir own affairs, and it was a mistake of the Treasurer to allude, to the subject!. He went out of his way to answer a charge before it was made. To say that the securities were pledgeable was untrue. They could not be reached, for the trustees would not surrender them at the de_hand of any Government. They were securities to depositors and clients-of the Government departments. - " Sir' Robert Stout said there had been'an entire change of front in the defence since-Fri-day night. The. Minister for Education had said these trust funds were at the disposal of the Government. The question was not conld not these securities be used in a crisis, butcould they be osed at a moment's notice to pay interest. i They could not be so used to pay the.infesiesfc due in October, and some hon.- members would do again as they did in the. case of the Serge3nt-at-Arms, place party above the lawabove truth and honour. The'-. Treasurer had put -his; colleagues in the wrong, for he now said that fcbeise funds could nofc *be used without the' consent of the trustees. The Minister for Education had said quite the contrary, but that was all changed and gone now. As for the securities, no trustee coukl lay a finger on them without the consent of Parliament. How, then; could they be pledgeable? That; they were held in London at all was illegal. Be knew of no law which allowed these securities to be sent fco London. Again, the law had been violated. There was no more right to take these securities than to enter into any bank and seize the gold in its vaults. The insurance funds should, above-all things, be held sacred, and the Treasurer said they could'be taken and used: that they were pledgeable. Was that true? Was thafc a statement calculated to h6lp the credit of Hie colony ?. - - -