GAOL AT MIRAMAR

New Zealand Times, Volume L, Issue 11648, 12 October 1923, Page 5

GAOL AT MIRAMAR

CITIZENS’ STROIO PROTEST TO MINISTERS ALTERNATIVE SUGGESTIONS PUT FORWARD ARGUMENTS PROVE FUTILE A deputation- arranged by the Wellington City Council waited on the Hon. Sir Francis Bell and the Hon. C. J. Parr yesterday and protested against the proposal to erect a prison at Mt. Crawford, Miramar. The Mayor stated to the Ministers that among the bodies supporting the deputation were the Irades and Labour Council, the Rotary Club, the Industrial Association, and the Civic League. Various speakers stated the objections to the proposal, the principal being that the district in which it was proposed to erect the goal was rapidly extending, and the presence of a gaol in the immediate vicinity of a suburban area was in every way undesirable. It was suggested that instead of a prison being dumped down in such an unsuitable place the site shoulct be' reserved for a park. “I AM RESPONSIBLE.” In- his reply, the Acting-Prime Minister (Sir Francis Bell) admitted quite candidly that he was responsible for the selection of the site objected to, and he desired to release his colleagues of any responsibility more than that of following the decision he (Sir Francis) had made when Minister for Justice. He agreed that permanent prisons should be as far as possible away from centres of population, but claimed that remand prisons—such as this would be—must be within reasonable distance of the courts. He dealt with various aspects of the case presented, and said that nothing he ha'd heard that day had induced him to change his opinion that the site chosen was the best available. MINISTER STANDS FIRM.. The Hon. Mir Parr (Minister for Justice) said io effect that from utilitarian 1 and financial points of view the Miramar site was one of the most suitable. It would not, he added, be a prison—merely a half-way house. Mir Parr also said he had heard nothing from the deDutation to induce him to alter the decision arrived at. He agreed with the attitude Sir Francis Bell had taken up.

THE DEPUTATION

ARGUMENTS DETAILED NGAHAURANGA SUGGESTED BY MAYORMINISTERS NOT FAVOURABLE. In making his protest tlm Alayor said the locality in which it was proposed to build tho gaol would ho hardly -built on in the course of fifteen or twenty years, and ho suggested that the prison site should be reserved for a park. He proposed as an alternative site a piece of land at Ngahaurariiga, saying there were 70 acres of land there that could be bought at a reasonable price. Over this ground lie had secured an option without stating tho purpose for which the land would be wanted. The land was obscured from view and was in a sunny valley, and while the Alount Crawford site was 600 chains from the law courts the distance to the Ngahauranga site was only 300 chains. At Ngahauranga there was sufficient flat land in a sunny position to erect- any | prison that was wanted, and there :v. a: land there that, with prison labour, could ‘be levelled and made valuable for any purpose for which tho Government might need it. He. submitted this as an alternative. He repeated that we should not have a prison on the Miramar site, a sito fit for a Governor’s residence or the national memorial. A prison there would be- an eyesore, and it would use up a lot of land suitable for parks and reserves. If the other site lie had mentioned were taken he thought there would be very little opposition. Mr Parr: Wait and see! You don’t represent the district in Parliament 1 A PROTEST FROAI THE EAST 31r Batt, representing the Eastern Suburbs League, expressed the opinion that Mr Parr’s name would go down in history as one of the best Alinistcrs for Education New Zealand had had. All offort was being made to buijd up a civic spirit in Wellington, which was the most cosmopolitan city in the country. Air Baitt remarked on the fact that the Mount Oook and Terrace .prisons had stood on fine sites, but their presence on these eminences had aroused public sentiment and now they were .being torn down. With the growth of the city, might not there be a similar state of affairs if a prison were erected at Miramar? He appealed to Mr Pair, as Minister for Education, to save tho site lor education rather than for a monument to our criminality and bad citizenship. Already Scots College was within eight of where the prison would be, and another denomination had acquired land for a college at Aliramar. Mr A. L. Monteith, AI.P. for Wellington East, said he could well remember how, a few years ago, there was not a home on the side of the bay concerned. To-day there was a considerable population there, and that population would grow. The prison ought to be as far from the city as possible. He was surprised sit the present proposal, because during last session both he and Sir John Luke had been told, in answer to a question in the House, that a prison was not to be erected there. Sir Fr ancis Bell .* No. The answer was in regard to Seatoun Point. There was work being done there, and there was a fear expressed that the foundations were being laid for a prison. Mr Monteith: There is not much difference.

Sir Francis Bell: But you are suggesting you were given an incorrect answer.

Mr Monteith : No. Air P. Fraser, M.P.: Only a guarded answer.

Sir Francis Bell: But, at the same time, we carefully stated our intention in regard to Miramar. Mr D. McLaren, representing the Civic League, also entered a protest. Replying to an observation by Mr McLaren, Mr Parr said tho purpose of the prison would be twofold. The first purpose would he to hold remand prisoners, who had to come and go during the time they were on trial, and the second purpose would he to draft prisoners to the main gaols of the Dominion. SIR FRANCIS BELL’S REPLAY Sir Francis Bell said he personally was responsible for tho decision to

' builcl the prison at Mount Crawford, and he desired to relieve his colleague of any responsibility more than that of following the decision which Six Francis had made' when Minister for Justice. He agreed that permanent prisons should be, as iar as possible away from the centres of population. Lyttelton and Mount Eden gaols were | doomed. But the Supreme Court sat in the contres of population • for the trial of prisoners, some of •whom were dangerous, and there must bo within reasonable distance of the courts a gaol for remand prisoners and those who were to be drafted into the permanent prisons of the country. These were public considerations, and they had to be borjte in mind. The Terrace Gaol had had to be got rid of, and then came the gift of the Terrace Gaol site to the Education Department. Weakly, he thought, a school was commenced before the gaol was demolished and a result was there was now an infant school alongside a pri(son. Then pressure, was brought to at once remove the' ; gaol from beside the school and the Prisons Department set to work to meet what was then the grievance of Wellington. He 6et to work to get a site. It was no use telling him the prison at Miramar would be visible. It would not. It was visible from the harbour in the same way as Ngahauranga forts were, but in no other sense. He found that what beautification was there had been created by prison labour. A PRISON THERE ALREADY. He found also there was a prison there already—a women’s prison. He formed the opinion that the place with the least defection was this site which already held a prison, and nothing ho had hoard that day had induced him to change that opinion. However, if his colleague. Mr Parr, who now had charge of the department thought otherwise he was. of course, free to come 1o a new decision. He did not think there would not be an equally fail* protest from the people of any other place in which tne prison was to go. The land at Miramar was the property of the State and was never likely to come under civic control. He thought it fairer to erect a prison on State land than to place one in the midst of other peoples’, property. MR FARR’S OPINION. Mr Parr said he had visited the site and found the allegation that the •building would be an eyesore unfounded. In a few years trees that were now growing would completely obscure any building from the town side. The knoll of Mount Crawford would hide it from those, crossing the harbour to Day’s Bay. .From one position of the harbour an end of the building would be visible, but fast-growing trees fcould ebsoure it in five years or so. He had to consider jg.s.xL and from that aspect Miramar was one of the most suitable of sites. Even on the score of administration it had an advantage as there was a prison there already. Wherever the prison went there would be protests. For instance, one day it leaked out that he was looking over ICarori respecting a prison sit© and next day ' he had a sheaf of letters of protest. A HALFWAY HOUSE. It would not really ho a prison but a sort of halfway house. He would visit the Ngahauranga site, but he could not hold out a great deal of hope regarding it. He thought there wouid be reasonable objection to a gaol at Ngahauranga. Mr Parr read a letter from the nearest resident to the site. He described the locality as one of the lonliest and most deserted places round Wellington, and said that a prison had been at this point for 35 years, and, instead of depreciating, the value of property had risen. Mr Parr said he had heard nothing from the deputation to induce, him to alter the decision which had been arrived at He agreed with the attitude Sir 'Francis Bell had taken up.