FINANCE BILL

New Zealand Times, Volume XLII, Issue 9759, 7 September 1917, Page 7

FINANCE BILL

STATEMENT BY SIB JOSEPH WABO>. REPLY TO CELTICISM. Prior to the consideration of the report on the' Finance Bill, Sir Joseph Ward said he wished to make a short statement. He appreciated the manner in which the House 'had dealt with this difficult and important measure. He was very pleased with the shape of the bill after its committee consideration. He proposed to have the bill held over for a few days after it had been dealt with by the Legislative Council, to enable a review of some of its points. If it was then necessary to deal with some matters already in the bill facility .would be given for .possible alterations, but not in the principles of the bill. Members had urged on certain matters in the bill, that they said would reduce the cost of living. If the concessions asked for by members were granted then It would kayo meant cutting out 000 revenue. It would have been abaclately impossible to make such concessions, as the legislation now before the House was for war purposes. The money was to meet abnormal conditions—-con-ditions the Government was unable to alter. Although the seat of the present difficulties was far removed from New Zealand, nevertheless the Dominion was collateral in a way with.the Motherland in assisting the equipping and supply of necessaries for war purposes. In view of this the Government had to be absolutely sure of its ground in providing finances to meet tne abnormal conditions. Members must remember these facts when considering the bill. Some members appeared to nave the idea that the Government could drop one proposal and take up another. Under the. financial proposals before the House it was. however, impossible to include a profits tax, as suggested. It was suggested that, Australia had. a profits tax. This was true, but there were many exemptions there. The present Finance Bui placed the land and income taxes at such a figure that it was impossible to impose a further bux'den in the shape of a profits tax on the shoulders of those who were to bear' the land and income taxes. If a profits tax were introduced, then the .proposed land and. income taxes would have to be reduced. The present proposals wore on a basis of great solidity. Members must remember that there was a Herculean task in front of the people. Though it appealed to one s heart to £o without some of the taxation, it was impossible to do so. In regard to soldiers' pensions, etc., the country must be prepared to face a large expenditure. They could not .allow anythin-?? in the shape of sentimentalism to come in with regard to the tea tax, and cause them to lose revenue. It had been no pleasure to him to practically say “No" to all pleas for concessions, either from members in the House or from those outside.

STRONGEST FINANCIAL POSITION. He tad had to do it from a stern sense of duty. For its size and population, this country was on a sounder and stronger financial basis than any other country—(hear, tear) —and they required to be, because their population was comparatively small and they were the most distant country from their markets, exporting their products to the other side of the world. (Hear, hear.) They were, for that reason, the country most dependent upon the continuity of shipping transport for their produce; and they would quickly feel the duhculties that would occur if any great trouble in regard to the matter of the supply of steamers to carry their produce were brought about by causes not under their control. (Hear, hear.) For that reason it was absolutely essential that this country should be able to look calmly and placidly on at any disappearance of the surplus during the progress of the financial year. He hoped that there would be no such disappearance; and if they could add to the reserve already accumulated, and so still further strengthen their position and enable them to help the internal development of the country ,it would be a very great thing for the Dominion. (Hear, hear.) The response the people had made to large internal loans was a very strong one, a very gratifying one, and went to show that at a time of severe strain they could rise to the occasion. (Hear, hear.) THE LESSON OF THE LOAN. They had done wonderfully well, and the lesson they had to take from it was that they should go in for raising their loans locally. (Hear, hear.) In fact, for a time at least after the war. they would be bound to rely upon local loans for that internal development which must go on after the war, prob-

ably more than, ever, in order to find employment for those returned soldiers who might not elect to go upon the land. (Hear, hear.) The applications for the War Loan had not yet been fully classified, but a partial examination had bien made, and ho was surprised to find what a tremendous num. bar of people had subscribed to the loan in sums of TJIOO to AIOOO. (Hoar, hear.) The widespread character of the applications was Quite remarkable as compared with last years loan, and the .£2,000,000 loan of the year before. (Hear, hear.) . Mr E. Fletcher: "A very good sign. (Hear, hear.) . Sir Joseph Ward: "Tes; it is a very good sign, and an augury oi good omen from the point of view of those of small moans in this country, of -which they aro part proprietors, or, at all events, living trustees." (Hear, hear.) In conelusion, he acknowledged very gratefully tho general courtesy extended to aim throughout the discussion of what was after all a very technical bill,. and no complimented members on having ap*. plied themselves to it in a manner which, he must say, did them very great credit. PARLIAMENT BUILDINGS.

Mr Ell said that lie understood that the 'Government had. taken for a State Department a private house on Wellington terrace, and that recently they had asked a private firm to allow them to have their now building for State departments at a rental, he believed, of some .£sooo'a year. They had been promised by the Prime Minister and the Minister for Public Works that they should be in the new Parliamentary buildings this session. Mr Massey: "Not this session/ Mr Ell: "Yes, this session.’' The way the few men employed were/ dawdling about and dodged about the building was a disgrace to the Government, to the architect in chief and to the contractors. There were several big rooms in the old Parliamentary Buildings that could be used for Public Departments, instead of paying such high rents: and there wore «) to 45 rooms which, if the labour now employed were concentrated on them, could bo handed over to the public departments in six months from now. But the wav the work was being done they would get no use out of the building till 1920. (Hear, hear, and laughter.) - MINISTERS CRITICISED.

Mr A. H. Hindmarsh (Wellington South) criticised the Government for .its failure to deal with the cost of living problem. After criticising various members of the Cabinet in this respect, he turned to the Minister for Agriculture, who, he said, had been frightened by the Tory element in the Cabinet. “Why, if the hon. Minister had any courage at all-—-,' 5 commenced'Mr'Hindmarsh. HEADINGS FOE HOUSE OF EEPS ‘'The hon. gentleman cannot make a statement like that,” interrupted Mr Speaker. ■ Mr Hindmarsh: ''Well—moral fibre — moral fibre—l will say She lacks moral fibre." (Laughter.) , Mr Hindmarsh went on to refer to the rearranging of Ministerial duties in the Cabinet, in which ho said Mr MacDonald had been thrown aside. , , Mr MacDonald. said he wished to reply to these statements. During the absence of the Prime Minister he had held many portfolios, and naturally, when Mr Massey returned, he was relieved of some of the work with which he was’ burdened. Mr Massey was President of the Boom of Trade, and ,i during Ms absence the Soaker merely carried out these duties. 9 was now controlling the portfolio allotted to him at the formation of the National Government. He was not going to be thrown aside by anyone. Mr Webb spoke at length about .the cost of living. He severely criticised the National Government in this respect. The Government had, he said, paid £H4J,OOO for the hire of ft vesse) valued at .£60,000. While there had been this and other examples of . waste by the Government it bad done .nothing to ease the burden of the working man. FINANCE MINISTER'S REPLY. Sir Joseph made a vigorous reply to criticism levelled against the tea tax. The records in the House would show that years ago h© had voted against a tea tax. Later it would h© seen he had placed tea and sugar on the free list. Now, to meet abnormal times he wished to place a tax on tea to create necessary revenue, and members complained. There was the suggestion that duty should be put on champagne. The amount imported, however, was small and would bring in a little over £2OOO, and possibly stop the liquor coming into New Zealand. He did not think the country would stand a further increase in taxation. There was ft further argument that motor-cars should be taxed, but from tbe small number of cars being imported it would give less revenue and prohibit in a way the impor. tation of cars. The tea tax was to get at everybody who was not contributing to the expenses of tbe country. A member: “How about excess pro. fits f ” Sir Joseph: “There are some members who would wish to burst up everything. There are many people wlio are quite willing to do their part. A few members in this House wish to pander .to a minority. Lord help this House if any of those members ever get into power. (Hear, hear.) They don't realise that this is an abnormal time. They merely wish to agitate for a question that they think will capture them a few votes in months to come.” (Hear, hear.) The Government had made concessions in the Finance Bill. It had considered insurance companies, married men with children..and small companies. (Hear, hear.) He wished to deny the statement that there had been , any threat to delete some of the pensions proposals if the tea or the amusement tax were defeated. Even if this revenue were lost it would have to bo made up somehow to pay for the pensions. The people, however, had as heavy a burden as they could bear. Why should not the man who was a total abstainer contribute something to the cost of the war? (Hear, hear.) The tea tax would give these people such an opportunity. It appeared to him very hard that members should cavil at a small matter that gave everyone a chance to do his and her part in the war. (Applause.) Sir Joseph added that he would make inquiries relative to a point raised by tbe member for Waikato (Mr Young) as to tbe possible escape of revenue in tbe handling of meat shipped from New Zealand and sold at profit in the Old Country. He would see if Mr Young’s suggestion in this respect could not do carried out.

The Finance Bill was read a third time lyid passed. At H.. 5 p.m. the House adjourned until 2.30 p.m. to-day.