Parliamentary Intelligence.

New Zealand Herald and Auckland Gazette, Volume I, Issue 53, 19 February 1842, Page 1 (Supplement)

Parliamentary Intelligence.

STATE OF THE NATION. House os? Commons, September 17th. Sir R. Peel having moved the order of the day, that the House go into a committee of supply, Lord John Russell rose and said, I shall now, with the permission of the House, proceed to make the observations which I yesteiday said I should feel it my duty to make, on the course which the Right Hon. Baronet proposes to pursue, and on the general aspect of affairs, with reference to foreign affairs, it appears to be quite unnecessary that Parliament should continue assembled. (Hear, hear.) The state of Europe, happily for all parties, affords every probability ot peace. (Hear, hear.) With regard to the dispute with the United States, aiisßg out of the case ofMr.M‘Leod, the Noble Lord expressed his conviction that there was no danger of a war, and that a strong desire prevailed amongst the people of America to preserve peace with this country. With respect to Ireland, Lord John Russell had witnessed the appointments of Sir R. Peel with great satisfaction ; and he hoped that Lord Elliott, the new Irish Secretary, would carry on the conciliatory policy of his predecessors. Turning to the state of the country, Lord John Russell referred to the passage in Her Maje-ty’s speech which recommended to the House to take into consideration the Corn Laws, and the distressed condition of the people. The answer of the Housa to that speech was, thatitwas essential to the due consideration of these questions, that a ministry should be in power possessing the confidence of the House- The time was now come for the consideration of these questions—a new ministry had been formed ; and as the matter had already been before the country for four months, no cause for delay could be pleaded, far less that it should be postponed for five months longer. It was upon the last day of April that the measures relating to the budget were announced, and that I gave notice of moving for a committee of the whole House on the laws relating to the trade in corn. Now when I gave notice that I would introduce the subject in a month from that time, strong expressions of surprise were uttered, and it was immediately urged tliat though it might be right to consider the laws relating to cqrn, and though it was right that the Government of the country should originate such a measure, yet the delay of a month—the uncertainty of a month, was an intolerable evil, for which the Government of that day was justly censurable, (Hear, hear.) It was thought proper shortly after to bring forward a motion declaring that the then ministers ought not to retain office, and that the decision upon that motion prevented my proceeding with the question relating to corn. But from that time to the meeting of the new Parliament and the formation of a new ministry, the Right Honorable Gentleman has had four months to consider what course he might think it desirable to pursue, and he proposes now to add to those four months five additional months of delay, before he will communicate to the House of Commons the measures which the Government thiuk proper to submit on this subject (hear, hear.) He does not say as he might, “We stand upon the present Corn Law, we think no alteration necessary on the contrary, he said he would not accept office on the condition of being bound not to make any alteration in the Corn Law, (Hear, hear.) It cannot be inferred from this expression that he thinks an alteration necessary, and yet the Right Honourable Gentleman, who certainly went far, with others in the expression of indignation at what he called a delay, and who said I ought to be obliged, in some manner, to bring forward the question in less than a month, adds eight months to that period, and says he is justified in asking for this long delay. (Hear, hear.) He had strong doubts that the construction of the ministry held out a prospect of taking the Corn Laws into consideration; and, though a member of the ministry, Sir George Murray, had expressed himself favourable to an eight shilling duty, or even less, he was not a member of the cabinet which had been constructed on the principle of selection, as containing those alone who were patrons *f the existing system. The nomination of His Giace the Duke of Buckingham to a place in Her Majssty’s councils, and to a seat in the cabinet, is to me a symptom that no considerable alteration in the Corn Laws is intended by the present Government. (Hear, hear.) I have been told that when a sort of threat was uttered, that the late ministry should no longer hold office, because they had proposed an eight shilling fixed duty on corn, and that any other ministry which took a similar course would meet with a similar fate—l have begn told that there were none who more demonstrated their approbation and acquiesence in that sentiment than the Duke of Buckingham. (Hear, hear, hear.) Did Sir Robert Peel intend to correct the Corn Lews or notl If no such intention is entertained by you, why then, 1 say—why twit me with the delay of a month, when it tells with tenfold force against yourselves. (Loud cheers.) It would be much better to proclaim—for the sake of trade, that it may nut be false ex-

pectaiions—it would be much better for the sake of agriculture, in order that it may be not depressed with unfounded tears ; it would be much belter to proclaim it, if such be your intention—that you mean to adhere substantially to the present law, and that you will not make any alteration in it. (Hear, hear.) Of course you may attempt a correction of the law of the averages, and in so doing yon make the law 'more stringent; and perhaps you may, on the other hand, lower the pivot some four or five shillings,and make the law less stringent; but, in doing these things, you will only leave the matter much as it is at present. (Hear, hear;) I have stated what I consider to be the effect likely to be produced by the cnaracler of the administration, as well as the promise which the Right Honorable Gentleman held out. He is himself not mtidecin malgvt lui on that question. His patient is now suffering, and it is not to be supposed, now that he is called in, that he should say that the best thing is a little rest and quiet, and nothing-further is to be done. ('Laughter.) He did not charge the landed interest with being actuated by mere selfishness; but they were biassed by their interest iu the matter. When the silk duty was under consideration' the silk manufacturer called out for protection as essential to the interests of the country ; and it was the same with all protected interests. Referring to the state of the manufacturing distrfets, he did not say that the House could make laws to meet every possible contingency, but it was bound to pass laws which would not interfere with the industry of the country. Was the present law of such a character? I ask, then, of the House of Commons to bear this in mind what is it you propose by tire delay? It would be a convenience to ttie administration;' while I admit that, and while it is obvious that it-would be a convenience to gentlemen who have other pursuits, and who do not like to be in London during the autumn ; and while, it is clear that it would be for the advan'age of those who tfirnk that rents would be affected by a change in the Corn Laws—( Hear, hear) while all these things are obvious, and that you have decided on taking such a course, then you cannot escape imputations ot this kind. It wid not fail to be imputed to you, that the views which have influenced your decision have been not altogether for the public interest. Rut what l think of the duly of Pailiameut is this —to he able to'say that we, at least, have no part in causing or eon'inuing this distress; and for the purpose, I think it necessary that you should be able to show that your duties and your restrictions are for some necessary object in the state (Hear, hear) —that they are necessary for tlie purposes of revenue, or for the purpose of placing a ceitain part of the communitv, which is overtaxed, upon a condition of equality in that respect with other classes; or that they are necessary in order to make the transition more gradual, and not to bring a sudden state of emnarrassment on any interest or class of subjects who- have been undulv piotected. 1 here has been an address agreed lo at Manchester, at a meeting called in compliance with a requisition, bearing one thousand and eighteen signatures of the merchants, manufacturers, and respectable inhabitants of all classes. [After reading the address, the Nolde Lord proceeded] praying that Her Majesty will take measures to continnue the deliberation of Parliament without inteimission, until these laws shall be so settled as to assure to the people the most plentiful supply of food at toe cheapest rate, and thus to conduce to the genera! interest of the community. Now, this is not the opinion of the people of Manchester only, put the sentiments expressed by those in other towns suffering likewise under a sevete distress, ll you separate without adapting any measures to meet the exigencies of the country, die only remedy which there can be applied is one already hinted, namely, by the interposition of rtlief given out of the rates raised for the support of the poor. Now, Sir, if there were occasional privations and occasional distress, that might be a reasonable proposition : but if not—if it is connected generally with the state of free trade—l beg leave to say that such a remedy j will be quite ineffieacous. (Cheers.) Twoyeatsago lexpressed myself of opinion that the Coin Laws should be changed. We were losing our foreign markets, and our trade and commerce were declining rapidly. I am afraid that, with respect to one branch of our manufactures—l mean our cotton trade—if it he not relieved by some alteration in our laws, ami by a greater freedom of t r ade, it will be outdone by foreign competitions—that our manufacturing establishments will be broken up, and that a large portion of the population, which cannot be relieved from the poor rate, will then be left without any resource. (Hear, hear.) If there is any justice in thr-se apprehensions, it is at least a matter for the consideration of Parliament. The Noble Lord concluded as follows: 1 deeply regret the course that is about to be pursued. (Hear, hear.) I am afraid it will not satisfy the country at large, (Hear, hear.) I am afraid it will not give satisfaction to that part of the manufacturing community, which is suffering distress', I am thoroughly persuaded, I never was more thoroughly persuaded than I am at this moment, that if instead of pursuing the course you have followed, you had adopted those measures that were proposed to you on the 3oth April, you would have produced a revival of trade—you would have caused an increase to the revenue —and you would have secured a far more important, object, an increase of the comforts and happiness of the people. (Cheers). But you have done more than this, by declaring to the whole world that you meant to conduct your trade with them by an interchange of vour productions with theirs on tire fairest, and most liberal principles—and you would, in doing this, have greatly contiibuted to the tuture peace of the world. (Cheers ) Convinced I am that there is no security for peace equal to the feeltng that nations derive benefits from each other—that their intercourse will continue to shed additional blessings upon each other every additional year it is so continued; and that if interrupted, far greater calamities mint arise than in an ordinary war between two hostile na. lions. (Cheers.) Therefore it is because the measures we proposed would have relieved the revenue, improved trade, and contributed not only to the welfare of the country, but tlre peace of the world, that 1 deeply regret their rejection, lo adjourning the consideration until next year, you postpone the benefit you might have derived fr»,m them. In adjourning the consideration of such measures, you allow the distress to continue, which it is now in vour power to mitigate. 1 conclude now by stating, that it is certainly not my intention upon this question to propose any motion, or ask for any division as to the course which the Right Hon. Gentleman is about to adopt ; but as a Member of this House, 1 beg to say, that Tam not responsible in any way for that course (Cheers.) Sir R. Peel immediately rose. He said—Mr. Speaker, the course which I took yesterday, in announcing to the House of Commons the proceedtpg which I propose to adopt with respect to the public business of the country, will have been a sufficient indication that I have no wish, at the commencement of the harrasstng and arduous task committed to me, to commence it by any controversy of a parly nature. I am perfectly ready to admit that the course which I propose to pursue constitutes no rule for the noble lord—that our respective positions are diffeient, and that he is entirely at liberty to invite me to the discussion which he has announced ; and though I-had no wish to originate that discussion, I assuiethe noble lord I am little disposed to depreciate it, and I am thankful to him for the opportunity he has given me of commenting on his observations. (Hear.) 1 refer in the first instance to those points on which there can be do material disagreement between us. I concur with the noble lord in theearnest desire that amicable relations may be maintained

between this country and France ; and, if possible, still more cordially do 1 concur in the prayer that he expressed, that it may please Almighty God to continue his protection from the hand of the assassin, to that great man to whom tt is given to rule the destinies of that great empire. It is impossible to hear of these attempts at assassination without feeling abhor, rence at their character; but it appears as if Providence bad provided some over-ruling protection against them, for the only result of these attempts is to provoke one general feeling -of disgust at the abettors of them, and sympathy with the intended victims. (Hear, hear.) I do not anticipate that the change in the governmeat which has taken place is likely to interrupt our amicable relations. ( Loud cries of hear, hear.) I have received no intimation from France of tion towards the present Government, or any allusion ot our amicable relations being altered. I should be surprised if it were so ; for I recollect, that upon the occurrence of those events which shook to its foundation the throne of the elder branch of the Bourbons, I was one of those who,with my illustrious friend the Duke of Wellington, and many of those now joined with me, seeing that it appeared to be the will of the authorities and cf the people of i ranee that their government should be committed to other hands, did, notwithstanding the reluctance of other powers with whom we were onthe most cordial relations, at once advise tie Crown of this country to recognize that Sovereign on whom the choice’of the people af France appeared to be fixed, (Loud cries of hear.) And, Sir, with respect to the character of that man, of whom future ages in trance will be justly proud—l mean of him who now presides over the government of France—with respect to the desire ot maintaining a cordial understanding with the nation,-consistent at the same time with the maintenance of British honour —with respect to the conviction that intimate relationsof amity (without the necessity of exclusive diplomatic relations) between Lngland and France, are most essential to the maintenance of general amity, that they must conduce to the advance ot social improvement and civilization —with respect to ad these matters, I am not now on the accession ot offife holding language which may facilitate my course as a minister, lor, for tire last ten years, in office and out of office, my language has invariably been the same. (Hear, hear.) I have taken every opportunity of doing justice to the character of the King of France, of expressing an earnest wish lor the continued prosperity of That country, of desiring that past hostile collisions between England and France may be forgotten—that each may repose under the laurels which each has gained—that these two great countries, each so distinguished for its military character and achievements, may feel that they can maintain relations of amity with each other without the slightest reflection upon them, and that they ought to feel that those relations are essential to the welfare of the world. (Cheers.) With rospect to our relations with the United States, I view the existing state of them as the noble lord, with great anxiety. It appears to be so mamTestly the inteiest of these two great couutiies, united together by so many ties, by the community ot ianguage, and the communitv of interest, to maintain peace- that so little can be gained by war, that the wound which one inflicts on the other, is (effected back on the hand which makes it, that I -cannot but hope that the prevailing good sense of each community will influence the Government ol each (if the government of each wants such adventitious aid), and that, upon the whole, the result will be the maintenance of amicable relations. I say no more ; that is ruy sincere desire. Yet, at the same time, I feel also the obligation of making no concession affecting the independence or the honour ot this country for the purpose of purchasing temporary tranquility, (Loud cheering)- Now 1 approach .the consideration of those questions in respect to which the controversy arises between the noble lord and me. i lie part of the speech of the noble loid which 1 most regret, was that in which he declared his intention not to require from the House of Commons a decision onthe course he has taken. (Hear, hear). I do wish that the noble lord had taken the sense of this House of Commons elected under his advice, and under his auspices—(hear, hear, and laughter)—with respect lo the reasonableness and demand which I make upon its confidence, and have enabled me to judge whether the House of Commons approves or disapproves ot the course which 1 mean to pursue—(Hear, hear, from tlie Ministerial members). I should have thought it .so reasonable, that after a lapse of ten years, for which I, with the exception of some three or four months, have held the situation of a private individual, l should have thought, that on returning to power after the lapse often years, Utete would have been an universal impression that it was but reasonable that l should not be called upon, within a month, to ptopose an alteration ol the law in respect to the trade in com. I should have Thought that it would have been felt that there might beadvantage in the access to official information, that it might be desirable toavail oneself of the.information that exists, to ascertain the opinions of those who receive emoluments trout the public, for the purpose of collecting information, and that it was but reasonable to permit me to have an interval, in conjunction with my colleagues, for ttie purpose of deliberately considering the proposition we should make. But, if I am responsible for not proposing a measure on the corn laws, withm one month of my accession to office, what must be tnought of that government (tremendous cheering interrupted the Right Hon, Baronet) —that has held office <or five years, and which neve r , until the month of May, 1841 intimated, on the part of the government, an united opinion, which they would prefer? (Hear, and laughter). i he Chancellor of the Exchequer took credit lor a deficit of £2,500,000, and although I have certainly had very little opportunity of considering these things, I have devoted some time to the inquiry whether or nor that deficit 0f£2,500,000, supposing the present amount of the revenue, is in point of tact, the whole deficit on which we may calculate. And i am bound to say to the noble lord, the prospects of future years are far from satisfactory. The Chancellor of the Exchequer struck out from the expenditure of the present year £400,000, lor the operations in China ; estimating for the future, he said, he did not tiiiuk we should be called on to provide anything like that sum in any future year. Are these expectations likely to be realized? I say nothing whatever of the operations in Ch'na, but I do ask if it is not probable that the demands made on us in future years for the expenses of these operations will far exceed £400,000? Here is the estimate of " the sum required to be voted in the year 1841, on account of the expense of the expedition to China —£400,000.” The expense alrea y incurred appears, by the last return presented to Parliament (No. 274), (o have amounted, so lar as it can be at present estimated, £925,263. This paper is dated the 10th May, 1341, and I venture to say, the greater portion of the sum stated, had been incurred in October, 1840, Now, you have to provide tor the expendituie which has accrued since October, 1840, and what means have you ot judging ol its amount? Lius is all the information the estimate gives —“ NB —No accounts have been received from which an accurate estimate can be framed.” (Hear, and laughter.) 1 have read in the public papeis, some information on this point, which appears to have come from tolerably good auhority. With respect to the Chinese expedition, H. L. Fleming Senhouse, Captain of Her Malesty s ship Blenheim, writing from Anunghoy, March, 1841, states that, " Vie had been exer-

cising for eight months, the most extreme and unparalleled forbearance C and kindness to the Chinese, thereby incurring an expense of probably the full amounnt of the remuneration we are seeking. (Loud cties of Hear, hear, hear.) Depend upon it great additional expense will be incurred I am not implying an opinion favorable or unfavorable on the political question; I refer now merely to its financial aspect, and I say no prudent Chancellor of the Exchequer, calculating thefuture expenditure of the country, will omit from his estimate the probable demands of the Chinese expeditiowT ( Hear, hear.) The noble lord wishes, or at least he makes a speech calculated to make unfavorable impressions, and add to the difficulties which encompass me on my introduction to office. (Hear hear.) Ido not hesitate to say to the noble lord I look with alarm to the growing tendency to expense in our Colonial dependencies. Here is a paper which wa9 presented the other day, for the expenses of the civil establishment of Hongkong—£9oo,ooo ; so it is stated for the present, but I cannot say how much further next year the absolute necessity which all colonial governors see more strongly than the Treasury at home may possibly carry it. This is the position in which 1 am called upon to estimate tne probable expenditure of the Country, and make adequate provision to meet it. I come now to New South Wales. I have read a despatch dated3lst January, 1841, from Sir George Gipps to Lord John Russell, in which he states that he has issued a gteat number of bounty warrants, the total number of persons emigrating being 71,315, ami the estimated amount of bounties payable on them £979 562, The noble lord contemplates this demand with great alarm, and he rebukes the Governor for incurring it. The noble lord most justly says, —“ The same mail which has brought to me a report of the commercial embarrassments of New South Wales, and the over-tiading and ill-advised system of qr edit to which you ascribe them, has also brought me your despatch of the 3lst of Jan. 1841, (No. 29), on the subject of bounties on emigration. From that despatch I learn that you have given orders for bounty, payable within two years, for no less a sum than £979,562, 'This is a fact which has arrested my most serious attention, and which I cannot regard without deep anxiety. It will form the subject of a separate communication, which I shall address to you as soon as I am in possession of the results of certain inquiries, which I have thought it right to institute. For the present 1 can only express my hope that the commercial embarrassments which you have depicted, will have suggested to you the absolute necessity of abstaining from the multiplication of such orders. On the part of her Majesty’s Government, I must disclaim any responsibility for this proceeding, and any obligation to ratify your engagements to the enormous extent to which vou hsve entered into them. Un the other hand, as to the colony, it appears that, at the moment of the commercial embarrassments to which you have re'erred, there were afloat in the market bounty orders amounting to nearly £1,000,000 sterling, the whole of which, it is but 100 probable, the colonial treasury may be called upon to redeem, It is difficult to measure the effect which such an operation may have had in stimulating that reckless spirit of commercial enterprise to which you ascribe the disasters of the colony; but it is clear that the effect must have beeu very considerable. It is imposssbleto regard a financial operation of this kind as one in which the British Treasury are not deeply interested ; if proof of this were wanting, it would be abutnlantly supplied by the experience of the present year, in the case of South Australia.” —Here we are, says the noble lord, in the greatest commercial embarrassments, and if it be lawful for an humble official instrument to imitate his superior, the Governor acts upon the principle that the greater the financial embarrassment, the more liberal should be the expenses of the colony. ( Hear, hear, and cheers.) The noble lord checks that profuse expenditure, and insists upon tlie governor taking immediate means to recall the bounties; but, do what he can, he will not leave less than £500,000 to be provided for son.e way or another. The colony is wholly unable to make the necessary piovision, and the door at which ihe colony will knock, does not require any specific indication. Government are responsible for the appointment of those instruments who have made engagements to the amount of nearly £1.000,000 (hear, hear,) but there are some of the items which I must consider, and I demand that the house will in justice to the interests at slake give me the opportunity of doing so, (Hear, hear.) I have taken you from Hongkong to New South Wales; let us uow come to South Australia. Last year we were called on to provide £150.000 to meet the expenses which had been incurred there. Since then 14,000 has been incurred, for which no provision has been made. The bills have been protested on the British Treasury, and I only fear we shall be obliged ultimately to pay the bills ami the expenses of protest too. I now come to New Zealand, and I find that bills to the amount of £33.000 have been drawn from New Zealand upon the bankrupt treasury of New South Wales. (Hear ) Do not flatter yourself that it is half the demand ; there are indications that £54,000 more such bills are on their way. A sum of between £BO,OOO and £90,000 will be required to meet them. The estimate taken was, I believe, only £6,000. (Hear, hear.) Now with respect to Canada, Since the budget was brought forward, what has taken place ? There was a distinct intimation that the credit of this country was to be guaranteed tor a loan 0f£1,500,000. I didn't question this policy; 1 am questioning the propriety of adhering to engagements entered into under the circumstances in which Canada is now placed. But you have also guaranteed the application of £IOO,OOO annually for the fortification ot Canada, for which no provision has been made. (Yes.) The noble lord has done me justice, in a frank and handsome manner, with respect to the course I have pursued in advising the Crown as to the constitution of the government; but if already I have attained some degree of confidence on that ground, let me remind the noble lord of the predictions he made relative to the course which I should be obliged to take on succeeding to office. Was I not told, night alter night, that I did not dare to form a government which would attract general confidence? Was I not told that 1 must be the instrument, the reluctant and degraded instrument, of men who were ready to offer every insult to their Roman. Catholic fellow-countrymen—to hoist the standaid of ascendency, and to demand fiom me complete and serviie acquiescence in their views? (Hear, hear.) That was said to be the inevitable consequence of my accession to power. Not a month has been passed, when the noble lord admits that over that difficulty at least I have triumphed, and that 1 have constituted the Government of Ireland in a manner to give a guarantee that the universal people of thatcountry wilt betrea'ed with impartiality and justice (Cheers.) The noble lord, after having, not reluctantly, but at once admitted that I had triumphed over the difficulty which threatened my course with respect to Ireland, says, that on account of the composition of the government, and the menaces which have been held out in Parliament, it will be impossible fpr me to perform my public duty on other questions, which concern the domestic policy of the empite. I can assure the noble lord that it is my intention to act upon a sense of public duty, and to propose tiiose measures to Parliament which my own conviction of public duty shall lead me to think desirable. Sir, it is right that there should be a distinct understanding as to the terms on which a public man holds office. (Hear, hear.) That

force of circumstances, and a sense of duty to the country have compelled me to undertake the harrassing and laborious task, in the performance of which I now stand before What can be my inducement to undertake that task, apiijMo make the sacrifices which it entails 1 What but the hope of tendering service to the country, and of acquiring an honourable fame ! Is it creditable that I would go through the labours which are daily imposed upon me if I did not claim for myself the liberty of proposing to Parliament those measure 9 which I shall believe conducive to the public welfare? Sir, I will claim that liberty, I will propose those measures, and I do with confidence assure this house that no consideration of mere political support shall induce me to alter them. I will not hold office by the servile tenuere which would compel me lo be the instrument of carrying other men’s opinions into effect. Ido not estimate highly the distinction which office confers. To any man who is fit to hold it, the only value must be, not the pattonage which the possesser is enabled to confer, but the opportunity which is afforded him of doing good to his country. And the momont I shall be convinced that that power is denied me, to be exercised in accordance with my own views of duty, I tell every one who hears me, that he confers on me no personal obligation in having placed me in this office. Free as the winds, I shall reseive to myserf the power of retiring from the discharge of its enormous and harrassing functions, the moment I feel that I cannot d schaige them with satisfaction to the public and my own conscience. (Great cheeting.) Mr. V. Smith would not animadvert on that silence respecting future measures which the right hon. baronet persevered in, and which he could not help considering as a slight contempt to the house and the country. He (Mr. S.) woulvl confine his remarks to an error the right honourable baronet had made in his remarks of that evening, a thing that seldom happened in his case. The right honourable baronet, iu entering upon the future financial probabilities of the country, dwelt upon, what he considered, the difficulties Of the colonies. Now, as that was the department with which he (Mr. S.) was so lately connected, he begged permission to draw the attention of the house to what the right hononrable baronet had said, who, though complaining thatthefoimation ol his ministry had left him, as yet, no leisure to consult those documents which would enable him to state what measures he meant to propose, had yet found an opportunity lo look into certain papers which be (Mr. S.) had lately laid before the house, viz ,a despatch from the Governor of New South Wales, and the answer to it from the noble lord the late Secretary for the Colonies. From that correspondence the right honourable baionet would infer that New South Wales, South Australia, and New Zealand were in something like a state of approaching bankruptcy, thus throwing a reproach upon the late administration of the colonial depaitment. The despatch of the Govetnor ol New South Wales, Sir George Gipps, showed that that functionary had issued oiders for emigration bounties to an enrrmous extent. This bounty meant a certain premium to every person who brought lo the colony a sound and valuable emigrant, and as the system had been found very beneficial to the colony, it was reasonable that Sir George Gipps should pursue the course adopted by former Governors. But in issuing those orders, even to the eno mous extent alluded to, the Governor thought that as those would have two years to tun, their payment would not bring distress on the colony. The principle upon which the Governor reasoned was unsound, hut the immediate notice which the noble lord, the late Secretary, took of the proceeding, would prevent it from bringing distitss on the colony, for it was to the effect, that all bounty ordeis should be sent in to the colonial land-commissioners before the Ist of September, and that no emigrants proceed out upon those bounty orders alter the Ist ol November, or it so, that such bounty would not be paid. It was clear, then, that after that time there would be a cessation of emigration upon that system—at least until the right honourable baronet, or the Secretaiy for the Colonies, should have had an opportunity of further correspondence with Sir George Gipps ; therefore, that mischief, that was apprehended, would not accrue to the colony, though some distress would be felt by bounty order-holdersun Jnis country. Tlietefore the right hon. baronet was wrong in apprehending that this country would be greatly injured by the operation of those bounties, or that there was danger of a national bankruptcy happening in New South Wales, which was, in fact, one of the most prosperous of Her Majesty’s colonies. Then for New Zealand, it was separated from New South Wales by a bill, therefore the contusion apprehended from its bills falling upon the former settlement could not take place. But it certainly was the case that all governors of colonies gradually took an interest in the latter, and weie soon inclined to forget the treasury at home, and this tendency had caused much amicable quarrelling between governors and the treasury ever since colonies began. However, it wat not right the country should be led to believe that New Zealand or New South Wales was approaching a state of distress. He was, therefore, most anxious, for the sake ot the thousands who were flocking to those colonies, that they should be relieved from any apprehension of meeting bankruptcy when thev °ot there, and that no additional impediment should be thrown in the way of those poor people who, perhaps, despairing of measures from the government here that would relieve them, were determined on settling in those new countries. Sir R. Peel would refer to the despatch of the noble lord in answer to Sir George Gipps, to justify the remarks he (Sir R. Peel) had mad«. The despatch was dated the 16th July, 1841. It said—"l have received your despatch of the Ist February, 1841, marked confidential, in which you report to me the commercial embarrassment which had existed for the three preceding months, and was still in existence, in New South Wales.” It then proceeded, " I cannot, however, receive your report of occurrences so disastrous a 9 those you • have announced to me, without adverting to the question whether your government may not be in some sense responsible lor these evils, however far beyond your power the correction of them may be.” Referring to the Governor’s despatch of the 31st January, 1841, the noble lord observed, “ From that despatch I learn, that you have given orders for bounty, payable within two years, for no less a sum than £979,563.’' «« On the part of Her Majesty’s Government I must disclaim any responsibility for this proceeding, and any obligation to ratify your engagements to the enormous extent to which you have entered into them.” He (Sir R. Peel) gave credit to the noble lord for the prompt measures he took to stop those proceedings; but the mere expressions in the despatch would show the anxiety the noble lord felt respecting New South Wales He (Sir R. Peel) however, did not use the word bankruptcy at all, and (as we understood the right hon. baronet in reference to its stability) he had no doubt it would be found able to meet any charges that might be brought against it. Lord J. Russell explained by stating that he did certainly feel very great anxiety on account ot the conduct of Sir Geo, Gipps, and had ordered emigration on those bounty orders to be stopped; but he (the noble lord) understood that the sale of land revenues in that colony produced about £l5B-f)o© a-year, which would ultimately meet all demands from thia source.