PARLIAMENT.

New Zealand Herald, Volume XXXVII, Issue 11433, 25 July 1900, Page 6

PARLIAMENT.

[BX TELEGBATH.— association.]:;.;. % ■■ LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL. • ' v ... Tuesday, '„ ,', ' The' Council met' at .half-past two p.m. • The Civil Service Examination. Bill was passed through ; committee without amend; merits, read a third time, and passed. .-./ The Council rose at five minutes to three p.m. .;. , : :*;.!;»: -V '■' HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES; , - Tuesday. .The House met at half-past two p.m. DEFENCE. Mr. Seddon moved that a joint committee of both Houses be appointed, to whom shall be referred the question of defence. Carried ' LEAVE OF ABSENCE. One week's leave of absence was granted to Messrs. Napier and Witheford. FIRST READINGS. The Wellington City Leasing and New Zealand Institute of Surveyors Bills were mtroduced and read a first time. REPLIES TO QUESTIONS. Replying to questions, Ministers said: The Government could not authorise a higher rate of pay for casual labour on railways, but that a uniform rate of pay of Is per hour would be adopted throughout the colony. That a Technical Education Bill would be introduced this session. . That the Government did not approve of selling freehold land in-town and suburban sections which had been reserved for set-

tlement purposes. That the Government was aware there had been 287 native-born persons die during the year 1899 from phthisis, and suggested that the way to meet the case was to introduce an Undesirable Immigrants Bill, to prevent people suffering from such complaint entering the colony. That the Government had no formal offer from a private firm for the construction of a railway from Sentry Hill to Kawakawa. Mr, Smith moved the adjournments of the House as a mark of his disapproval of the answer to his question with respect to the construction of a line from Sentry Hill to Te Kuiti, to connect Taranaki with the Main North Island Trunk railway. He complained that the Government would not take his advice, and borrow £10,000,000 right out for railway construction. They could spend £1,000,000 alone in his district, in what would prove profitable lines. Mr. Ell said he was also dissatisfied with the answer to the question regarding consumptives. He contended that tie disease is already in the colony, and that it Is the duty of the Government to establish a sanatorium, principally for the benefit of poor people, who could not afford to go to a sanatorium outside the colony. He trusted the Government would do something to arrest the ravages of the disease amongst the young people of the colony. Mr. La wry and Mr. Jackson Palmer advocated the Stratford route for the Main North Island Trunk railway. Mr. Wilford advocated more consideration in the way of salary, and a more secure tenure of office to railway employees, temporary clerks, etc. Mr. Mafisey believed if the Awakino route had been adopted for the Main North Island Trunk railway, the line would have been | completed long ago, and at much less cost than bv any other route. Mr. "Hall-Jones, Mi Fowlds, and Mr. Symes carried on the debate, which was interrupted by the half-past five adjournment. The House resumed at half-past seven p.m. P ' m ' MINISTERS' SALARIES. On the motion of the Premier, the Ministers' Salaries and Allowances Amendment Bill was withdrawn. GOVERNOR'S SALARIES. The Premier moved the second reading of the Governor's Salary and Allowances Bill, and stated that when the Governors salary was reduced, it was done to meet a temporary emergency, at a time when the colony was in a state of depression, which had now passed away. Looking at the condition of the colony now, anil comparing its status with other colonies, be considered they should revert to the amount at which the salary stood before the reduction. Compared with the salaries paid the Governors in other colonies, on a population basis, the salary paid the Governor of New Zealand was too meagre. No doubt, under federation, the State Governor's salaries would be reduced, but on the other hand, the Go-vernor-General would, he believed, he paid not less than £12,000 or £15,000. By paying a low salary there was a limited field for the selection of a suitable man. He knew that the low salary had prevented one man well qualified from accepting the position. He trusted the motion Would be carried unanimously, and that the debate would be of such a character as would redound to the credit of the House. ' Mr. McLathlan said he would utter his protest against the proposed increase. He was surprised at the Premier, who posed as a Democrat,, proposing such a measure. If the salary was increased, volunteers and artillerymen would require an increase in pay, and how was ,the aimer to pay that at the present price of grain. Mi-. Monk considered the condition of the colony worse at the present time than when the salary was reduced. He dissented altogether from the reasons advanced by the Premier for increase in salary. He felt proud that we had a Governor as a link, binding us to the Empire, but he looked upon the position as merely automatic. The prosperity of the colony had been overrated, and was due greatly to the constant intro-' duction of borrowed money. There was absolute need of economy in public expenditure. He was not averse to expenditure so long as the money was spsnt upon purposes that tended to the development of the resources of the colony. Mr. Collins did not see in a single reason advanced by the Premier anything to convince him that the increase was necessary. He warned tho Premier that his action in this matter was calculated to destroy his influence with the party that had kept him in power. He contended that the salary at present paid was quite equal to that paid by the other Australian colonics. If it be true, as the Premier had teequently°said, that the colony could not afford to pay for more deserving objects, then it could not afford to increase anyone's salary. It was absurd to say that the loyalty of the colony was to be measured by the amount paid the representative of the Queen. Mr. G. W. Russell complained that the Premier's advocacy of the measure was one of exaltation of rank and pedigree, in defiance of what he considered to be the true democratic sentiment in the colony, The statement that the colony bad to be content with a second or third-rate Governor was absurd,, in face of the qualifications of the present occupant of the office. He contended that as a democratic colony the best way of rewarding public men,' who spent their lives in the service of the colony, was to open to them such offices as Governor of the colony. Captain Russell ridiculed the interpreta-! tion of democracy given by the two previous speakers. Taking the men, who from first to last had filled the position of Governor, they had, apart altogether from their rank or titles, proved themselves first-class men. It should be borne in mind that the duties of Governor were very exacting, from tho fact that the colony was divided into four large centres, where the Governor carried out official and social duties. It was unlike any Australian colony. The cost of moving from place to place was very large. He asserted that he knew for a fact that every Governor of the colony for the past 15 or 20 yoars had spent double the amount of his salary, and that they had left the colony poorer men than they were when they came to it. Mr. Hornsby thought tho amount by which the salary was proposed to be increased was too great, and while voting for the .second reading, he would, when the measure got into committee, move to reruce the amount. - * <>V ' ■■■■'.'■ • ■ - - Mr. Buddo said- he did not measure his loyalty by his vote for 'increase in the Governor's salary, and he would oppose the ■ second reading.' , , j - .' it Mr. Smith said .ho felt proud of the English aristocracy, and eulogised their services to; the-Empire. '} ? The time "• had ' not yet' arriVcdwhgn'the 'Governor should be elected

by the people, but when it di£, he would be found I amongst \ the supporters '± of 'such ■ a principle. In ; the ■ meantime, >he would vote for the motion. .'. . ; .';L .- ; Mr. Pirani blamed -the Premier for introducing a personal element into the discussion, Personally, Ihe ; thought £5000 a year quite enough for the Governor of this colony...lt was not in the ; interest of the ' colony that undue lavishness should ,be' observed in. connection with the Governor's establishment. He dissented from ! the .'dictum. of ; the. PreI mier, that the salary was not. sufficient to [attract the best men to take the position. The main objection to the proposal was' that the House was not in a. position to judge as. to '-, whether the colony could afford the increase, and that in any case any increase or reduction should not apply to -the present occupant of tho office. .:V. ; Mr. Fisher concurred that the reduction in'the Governor's salary was a drastic remedy 'for the depression caused by the Stout-Vogel Government, but was never intended to become a permanent reduction. Since the reduction took place, the colony had greatly advanced in wealth and population;-- He eulogised the manner in which the present occupant of Government House carried out his duties, and hoped the House would not stint itself in. regard to the proposed increase. Mr. Tanner opposed the proposal.. He said he would raise no question as to rank or wealth; or. as to the manner in which the duties of Governor were carried out by the present Governor, but he contended that the amount at present paid was sufficient. He was amazed at the amount of opposition the proposal to" make the Governor elective had met at the hands of the occupants of the Governmnet benches. : k ' Mr. Wilford supported the measure, but reserved the right in committee to alter the sum named in the Bill. Mr. Meredith was surprised at what he characterised as a cbusipracy of silence regarding the Bill shown by the Opposition. Were the increase to be of benefit to the Governor and his family he would not object, but he was of opinion it would lead to the continuance of a spurious aristocracy in Wellington. He compared the salary paid the Governor with that given to Presidents in the United States, where, without the aid of aristocracy, backed up by large salaries, the best men were available to take the highest position in the Republic. He did not think the tie to the Empire depended upon an increase in the Governor's salary. Mr. J. Hutcbeson opposed.- Had the Bill stood alone, it might have met with more support, but evidently it was only one of a series of proposals for increase of salaries. It was intended to increase Ministers' salaries, the Agent-General's salary was to be increased, and the members' honorarium 'was now also considered too small. The colony was not in a position to stand the increases. He pointed to the liability incurred in sending contingents to South Africa, as a reason for pausing in the determination to grant such increases. Mr. Hall believed the majority of the Governors who come to the colony did not do so for the salary granted, but for the honour of the position. The question was, could the colony afford more. He did not think so. Mr. E. G. Allen supported the Bill, and felt sure he could satisfy his constituents that he had done right. Mr. J. Allen moved an amendment that the debate be adjourned until the House was in possession .facts as to the true financial position of tie colony. Before deciding upon the Bill the House should know what reduction was to be made in the Customs duties and other taxes. Mr. Ward said it would.almost appear as if the mover of the amendment wished to bark a direct vote upon the question. He contended that every member should be called upon to give a direct vote upon the question. The duties of the Governor were not so light as some people stated. The present Governor, by his action during the trouble which the Empire had lately undergone, had helped to raise New Zealand to the front rank amongst British colonies. As to the financial position of the colony the Government had not gone upon the London market for the last million of the authorised loan, for the reason that the time was inopportune, but it redounded much to the administration of its affairs that the Government had been able to carry on and meet all its obligations without recourse to the London market.

Mr. Massey said that until Mr. Ward spoke bo intended to have voted for the second reading of the Bill, but after hearing that speech he would vote for the amendment, while, if it reached the committee stage he would support a moderate increase.

Mr. Fraser supported the second reading. Mr. Ell said he intended to have voted against the second reading of the Bill, but as the amendment was framed to obtain a part)' advantage, he would oppose it. Mr. Hogg supported the Bill. Mr. Pirani denied that there was any party move in the amendment, and personally ho wished a straight-out vote on the subject. Mr. R. McKeuzie supported the second reading of the Bill, and considered it derogatory to the dignity of the House the manner in which some of the members had carried on tie debate.

Mr, Barclay, while preferring the simple American system, without payment, thought so long as the colony demanded such services as the Governor had to perform he ought to be paid for them. Mr. McGnire urged tho House to a division at once on the main question, and tho amendment was lost by 48 votes to 12. On a motion that the Bill be read a second time,

Tho Premier replied that it was not right that a Governor should be called upon to draw upon his private means to support bis position, and a democracy should not be put under such an obligation. On the question being put, the second reading was carried by 43 votes to 15. Tho House rose at twenty minutes past one.