HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES.

New Zealand Herald, Volume XXI, Issue 7160, 28 October 1884, Page 5

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES.

i-iuuuxu Ul' iii li V TJ3. Monday. The House met at half-past two p.m. WAIIANOI. Sir G. Grky gave notice to move, " That Wahanui be heard at the bar of the Bouse in reference to native matters generally." TRUNK RAILWAY. Dr. Newman gave notice to ask the Minister for Public Works to-tnorrow it the Government would proceed at once with the construction of the North Island Trunk Kailway, beginning at the Marton end. UNION OF CITY ELECTORATE S. Mr. Stout introduced a Bill to unite certain city electorates. BUSINESS. Mr. Stout moved, " That Government business take precedence on Thursdays for the remainder of the session." Agreed to. MR. STOUT'S STATEMENT. Sir G. Gaky moved the adjournment of the House in order to bring up the subject of the Ministerial statement made by the Premier on Friday night. He said that statement was totally uncalled for, and vtas calculated to interfere with the freedom of debate in the House. He had merely moved in the matter to elicit some expression of opinion on it. Mr. Stout said he could not understand why the matter had been referred to. The Government wera not going to remain on the benches merely for the sako of passing the Appropriation Act, and if their policy Bills were to be interrupted in the other House, the Government must take a defiuite course in the matter. There was a large preponderance of North Island members in the Legislative Council. The Government did not iutend to carry measures merely for the benefit of one portion of the colony, and if they could not pass their measures, they would not remain on the Benches. He thought other Governments would have put the matter far more strongly than the present one had done. He did not think aiiy other explanation as to the statement he had made on Friday was necessary. Mr. Bryce said the explanation given by the Premier was not very satisfactory. He thought that if Government had such strong objections to the Legislative Council expressing their undoubted right in regard to their Bills, they should have given some explanation of the course they intended to pureue, and he should have been glad to have heard what measures the Government intended to adopt. For his part he would always uphold the privileges of the House. If Government were going to interfere with the privileges of another place, he (Mr. Bryce) would like to know how they were going to do it. Surely they did not intend to punish members of the House who had passed their Bills by a large majority by holding out a threat of a dissolution.

Mr. Levestam said he did not understand the meaning of the Ministerial statement, and he thought the idea of asking for a dissolution in order to puoish the other House was a curious way out of the difficulty. He said an early prorogation and another short session would be a wise and statesmanlike action to pursue in the present instance.

Sir J. Vogkl said the remarks made by the Premier on Friday were so easily to be understood that he could not see how they were liable to misconstruction. The Government found that the session might end, and it would be found that nothing was being done for the Middle Island, and everything for the North Island. That was a Btate of things which should not be allowed. The Government did not take office without intending to do justice to themselves and to all parts of the country. They would not consider this a satisfactory session if one Island could say they had everything done for them whilst the other one had nothiDg. Th«y felt it would be necessary to pursue the policy they had brought down this session, even if it entailed the cost of another session or of another dissolution. He failed to see how the statement made by the Premier wonld interfero with the freedom of debate. He said the Government deemed it their duty to show to the House that they were mindful of the wants of nil parts of the colony. Seeing, as the Government did, how dangerous the position was in which they were drifting, the statement rr-ade by the Premier was a necessary one. Much as the House and the Government might desire a short session, they should first consider ( their duty to the country. They would be neglecting their duty if they did not show they were anxious for the welfare of the whole colony. They should not favour one part of the colony at the expense of the other.

Mr. Babrqn did not consider the District Railways Bill would confer any great benefit on the Middle Island. It was brought on merely for the purpose of relieving certain shareholders in the companies mertiooed, and not for the benefit of the Middle Island. He protested in the interests of the ratepayers of the colony against that measure, aud he sympathised with the Legislative Council in the action they had taken iii regard to such a very objectionable Bill. . Mr. Grigg had been much startled at the Premier's statement on Friday night. He thought the explanations made by the Premier aud Treasurer made the matter far worse. He thought it was extremely objectionable to bring such pressure to bear on the House as was intended to be done. It was perfectly unjustifiable that the Ministry should tell the House that unless they passed their measures they would dissolve Parlia- I ment. Mr. Smith supported the action of the Government. Mr. Wakefield said the North Island Trunk Railway had practically been decided in 188*2, and had little to do with the present Government. He said the gloomy depression that had been felt in certain parts of the colony was much heavier in districts which had obtained the largest amount of railway expenditure, which generally led to reckleas ■speculation. He did sot agree at all that

the gloomy depression was to be connected with the withholding of loan expenditure, or that prosperity was to be obtained by loan expenditure. Nobody conld say that such measures as the District Railways Bill were calculated to promote the prosperity of the country. He thought the Government had made a mistake making a stand upon a Bill of that character. If it had been an i important policy Bill, it would have been a different matter. He thought the Legislative Council had an undoubted right to reject a measure if they disapproved its provisions. The Council had not acted with any particular precipitancy, but had well considered the Bill before throwing it out. If the Premier had had more consideration for the members of the House when that Bill was in committee, he believed it might bave been amended so that the Council would have passed it. He considered that it was a most unusual course to inform the House that they must accept the whole of the Government Bills without any discrimination whatever.

Mr. Tttrsbultj defended the action of the Government. He thought the Legislative: Council had shown a great want of consideration in rejecting the District Railways Bill. That Bill was a matter of necessity. Although he had resisted the Bill in 1579, he thought there was no other coarse bat a dissolution if the policy Bills of the Government were rejected by the Council. Mr. Rollkston thought the older members of the House should. enter their emphatic protest against the coarse taken by the Premier on Friday night. The words used on that occasion were the words of the Premier, but the hand was undoubtedly that of the Colonial Treasurer. Be thonght the explanation made on the present occasion had made matters far worse than before. The Government had introduced a very objectionable feature by pitting the North Island against the South, and he thought the rejection of the District Railways Bill had nothing at all to do with the North Island Trunk Railway. That railway had been settled in ISS2. The present Government were entitled to no credit at all with reference to that railway. That was a question of the past. The present Government had not even decided on the route. He held that anything, that was done to promote settlement in any part of the colony was of the utmost interest to the House. The Premier had told them that in consequence of the action of the Council they were to have a dissolution, and that was a very improper threat to make. The District Railways Bill had been forced on the House without giving the information which members sought for. That Bill was brought in fn the interests of the Agricultural Company in which the Coloniol Tieasurer was largely interested. It was absurd for the Government to say they would go to the country on such a measure as the District Railways Bill. _ Mr. Seddon thought the word " dissolution " had had an extraordinary effect on the member for Geraldine. He defended the course pursued by the Government, and said the opponents of the District Railways Bill were in the Council, several of whom had been rejected-by the people, and were called to the Council by the late Government.

Mr. Shrihski thought the Government should have fair play in the action they had taken, although he had been opposed to the District Railways Bill. i Captain Sutter thought the discussion that had ensued was altogether out of place, and he hoped the debate would not be further prolonged. Mr. J. W. Thomson said the obscurity of the Ministerial statement had been greatly intensified by the explanation from the Government benches. He disapproved altogether of the action of the Government. Sir G. Grey said he regretted the statement made by the Premier on Friday. He considered the tremier's remarks were a plain threat to tho House, and' he considered it his duty to bring it forward. The Colonial Treasurer had said that in opposing the District Railways Bill a startling element of selfishness had been disclosed, but he thought those whojlhad brought forward the measure were guilty of much greater selfishness. He thought it was very improper that interested people should bring forward a Bill of this , character, and force it through the House ' without any information on it. He said the explanation of the Government waa unsatisfactory. The Premier said the threat made was not made to apply to the House, but to the Council. His remarks on Friday, however, could bear no other construction. He asserted that the Bill was brought in to relieve the Agricultural Csmpany. He denied that the North Island had obtained any undue advantage over the South. He thought the course he (Sir G. Grey) had taken would recommend itself to the whole population of the colony. The motion for the adjournment oS the House was then put and negatived. BANKRUPTCY BILL. The Bankruptcy Bill was reported with amendments, read a third time, and passed. POLICE OFFENCES BILL. Mr, Seddon moved the recommittal of the Police Offences Bill, with a view to reconsider. clause 13, providing penalties for Sunday trading. 1 The discussion was interrupted by the halfpast fire adjournment. The House resumed at half-pa3t seven. POLICE OFFENCES BILL. Mr. Seddon continued speaking in favour of the recommittal of the Bill. Mr. Dowmie Stewart thought it was nota very liberal act to take away the privilege of the Sunday from the working man. He hoped the House would stand to the clause. Mr. Stout hoped the House would not agree to the recommittal. He pointed ont that the Bill only prevented people from working in view of tho public, or to the annoyance of others. Another recommendation of the Bill was that under its provisions no bar would be open on Sunday, and there would no more ' 1 bona fide " travellers.

The recommital was negatived on a division - ayes 59, noes 16. The Bill was then read a third time, and passed. ItOAD BOARDS BILL. Mr. Tole moved the second reading of the Road Boards Act Amendment Bill. The object of the Bill was to appoint a receiver for certain Road Boards on application to the Judge of the Supreme Court: Agreed to WEST COAST BBSEBVEB. The House went into committee on the West Coast Settlement Reserves Act Amendment Bill, a few additional clauses being added, which elicited no discussion. LAND ACT. The Land Act, 1577, Amendment Bill was committed. Mr. Pearson hoped the committee would not consent to the pastoral land of the colonybeing alienated. He objected to the repeal of the section. ' Mr. J. C. Bdckland also objected to its repeal. Mr. Pyre opposed the prcp-sal- to eliminate the sectioo. He hoped the Honse would not consent to part with, another acre of pastoral land. ! Mr. H. McKenzib, Captain Sotter, and I Mr. Gbigg hoped the clause wonld be retained. Mr. D. McKenzib opposed the retention of the clause, tie said if it were retained he would oppose the Bill at every stage. Mr. Stout, said that one-third of the land brought nnder this system had been properly settled. He thought the experience of the past showed that the clause under discussion worked badly. A long discussion ensued on the proposal, in clause 4, to repeal clause 75 to 85 of tbe Land Act 1577, with the following addition : —" Provided that as regards any pastoral lands sold on deferred payments prior to the passing of this Act, or the purchasers thereof, such repeal shall cot in any way affect or invalidate the operation of such repealed section." The clause and proviso were finally carried on division. Ayes 51, noes 19.

Mr. J. Meliuszie moved that the. Chairman leave the chair. He thought the committee did not know what they 'were voting on by repealing these clauses. The motion was negatived on the voices. In section 5. to repeal section 9 of the Land Act, 1577, Amendment Act, a lengthy discussion ensued. The section to be repealed had the effect of preventing a deferred payment settler from obtaining a Crown grant of his land at the expiration of three years upon paying the balance of his purchase money, and compels him to -wait till the expiration of six years from the granting of Ilis license. Mr. J. C. Bucklrnd objected that this would cauße great inconvenience. : : Mr. Wallace said the clause was intended to prevent speculation and to prevent selectors from going to a money lender who in time would get tho land into hia own possession to the ruin of the former. Mr. Rolleston supported the clause. - After a long debate, daring which the clause was atropgly opposed by a large num-

ber of the members in the inters at of thrf deferred payment settlers, the clause wai carried on division. Ayes 30, noes 21". _ The discussion on the clauses was cob» tinned up to two o'clock. (Left sitting.)