MEETING OF THE AUCKLAND PRESBYTERY.

New Zealand Herald, Volume I, Issue 204, 8 July 1864, Page 3

MEETING OF THE AUCKLAND PRESBYTERY.

Ox "Wednesday last, July 6th, a meeting of. this body ivas held in St. Andrew's Church. The Rev. Sir. Norrie was elected moderator. The other members of the Presbytery present were the Kev. Mr. Brown of Ouchunga, the Kev. Air. Mackie of Uialiuhu, the Rev. Mr. Bruce, and the Rev. Mr. Hill of at. Andrews. The noise made by the wind rattling the windows of the building was so great, that it was impossible to hear the speakers with sufficient distinctness to be able to take down the whole of the different speakers' words, but the following is the . summary of the proceedings. A minute was read of the meeting held in June to sympathise with the death oi' their convenor, Dr. John Bonar. The report of the stipends was handed in, and the general feeling of the Presbytery was that the accounts should he rendered more regularly. The special business for which the Presbytery met, was next disposed of. This was a will by the congregation ol'St. James' Church to the Rev. Mr. Hill. The commissioners from St. James' congregation were Messrs. Thomas Macky, A. Clow, Peter Mackie, Greeushields, and Patterson, those from St. Andrews were Messrs. Macfarlane, Dingwall, Beveridge, Crawford, Russell, and Smart. Mr. Peter Mackie, one of the commissioners for St. James, addressed the Presbytery for the call. He remarked that it would be for the good of the church, to liaveVJMr. Hill's services, and St. Andrew's would still have their able minister, Mr. Bruce ; and should Mr. Hill be unable to come, he feared that it would cause the disruption of the church that he now represented. Mr. Clow, Mr. Thomas Macky, and Mr. Janjes Patterson supported him. Mr. Thomas Macfarlane opposed the call on behalf of the congregation of St. Andrew's, \ remarking— I appear as one of the representatives of Session of tit. Andrew's, who have been, commissioned to lay before this court a few of the reasons why they think Mr. Hill should not be taken from them. In discharging the duty so imposed upon us, we deem it unnecessary to mako a lengthened statement on the matter now under consideration. We have at least two things to satisfy you upon; Ist, that St. Andrew's requires two ministers, 2nd, that it will bo more for the good of the church at large, that Mr. Hill should remain where he is, in preference to going to St. James'. On these points, be pleased to keep iu view the peculiar position of this Uliureh, that position differs widely iroin that of any other congregation. It was this present congregation in this province, that was the means of raising almost all, if not all the several congregations over which you preside, it has exercised a fatherly care over you all, it has allowed its minister to leave his special duties here, and to devote much of his valu- » able time to attend to matters connected with the extension of the Church, and it has ever been ready with its purse to second the efforts of Mr. Bruce in carrying out his various and unwearied efforts for the spiritual welfare of the Pivsbyterians in this province, perhaps in tliis colony. So much is this congregation looked upon as a parent, that nothing is done in the province, which we are not called upon to aid, and it is not uiidulyboastiug to say that wehave on every occasion met these appeals with a kind und generous liberality, the very congregation that is now seeking to take Mr.' llill away from us can bear testimony to what I now say. In allowing Mr. Bruce to devote so much of his time to matters connected with the general welfare of the Church, this congregation knew right well the sacrifices they were making, but feeling that Mr. Bruce was devoting himself with zeal and energy to what they felt to be a great auda good work. tliey

."nnulq. $hg i«¥3i#eei. »j imow»t ttiey ; Antl Heart by: ' helping H-'m the ' good of the destitute arid neglycted/, one?, dwelling. '- around us.,'Tliey\ fstijl feel that,it would Ka 'doing incaiouluble; injury to th,6. Pre'sby,-.. .toriim eaiis'e, fa'intfeijfere With Mrl Bailee's operations; They felt, however; 'ttt&t'it'would be injurious to this congregation", and to thocauso'in Auckland, to leave St. "Andrew's : without the regu'ar attentions of at least- one minister. ' And in considering how tlie difficulty was to be met, they did not think of saying to Mr. Bruce, you must, leave the outside districts alone—to starve—to die, forthewaut of spiritual food ; nor did they say—-we hiuo given already enough of our.suhstnnce for Church extension, we will do no more of this sort of work—we will fhut our hearts, and button up our pockets, when Mp. Bruce next applies for someofhis wild schemes No. they followed quite a different course, they considered how Mr. Bruce could be allowed to devo'e more of his time to the outlaying population, without injury to tlio present congregation, and came to concl.i#ion that the proper thing for them to do, was to Set another minister to join Mr. in the pastorate e>{ St. Andrews*, one who would nfiito with Mr. Bruce in carrying' on tho work ho had on hand, and at the flame time attend to the spiritual -wants of this con■Rresration. This resolution involved a serious present and permanent pecuniary responsibility : hut this had no influence on. their deliberations. Being satisfied of the wisdom of the step to be taken, they unhesitatingly agreed to hear the consequences. There was a risk, a great risk, that after being- at the trouble of petting a minister out he might not suit, might not he acceptable—hut that risk they wore prepared to take. They felt they were doing right, and they trusted in "God to guide them to a right man. Another thing this congregation had in view, in folJov/ingnp Mr. B.'s plans for meetinc the destitution of the province, and that was to get out additional labourers; and had the ehureh at large decided that it was advisable that Mr. Bruce should go home to press tho claims of this colony on the sympathy and find assistance of the churches there, this congregation would have provided means for this purpose. Jint this part of our plan has been abandoned t'nr tho present. As soon as we had mado up our minds as i fo the proper thing to he done, wo lost no unnecessary time in sending for another minister, and Mr. Hill was sent to ns, and sinco his advent lio has given unqualified satisfaction to every member of this congregation. • Of tho most of the facts now stated, T tiolievo the members of tho Presbyterian are fully cognisant-—and I mention them, not at all in a proud Or boastful spirit, lint simply with the view of showing *'ou how it l's that there aro two ministers in St. Andrews', and why it is that we think that tho propent Kt-ate of things should be allowed to continue. We venture to think that what wo havo done as a poiigregution lias been more for tho good of the icliiirch at largo than for our own ; and if wo are prepared to allow our ministers in turn to visit tho neglected districts outside tho town, we think we have p. right to ask the Prosbvtorv that arrangements so fnade shall not he interfered with on light grounds, farther; Mr. Hill has, as already stated, come Amongst us, has laboured with marked success, lias tnore than realised our most sanguine expectation, i 3 -working most heartily and harmoniously with Mr. J}., and is ever ready to \v>rk with him, not only in congregational matters, hut in the churches' extension ; in faot, it is scarcely possible to got 'two men bettor adapted for each other than Mr. TTill and Mr. JJruce, und having succeeded so well in this matter it. ■would be a most unwise step to tear as under a pair 30 well suited to work harmoniously together. Tho two united thus in this eongrfegration will assuredly do farmore good to the oliurch than if Mr. Brnco were compelled to confine his labours to the congregation left hero, and Mr. Hill to confine his labours to the congregation t° l>c formed in Hobsnn-street; for if you shall decided upon taking from us iff. Hill, allour aspirations for the good of tho church will be blighted, our arrangements interfered with and evon stopped Altogether, our attachment to and interest in tho church of our fathers cooled, and perhaps, estranged, and 'an amount of injustice perdetrated, which no amount of success in Hobson-street could balance—and of his success there, there need be

•no doubt. His athnctivo and popular stylo of address will soon gather around him a largo congregation, and may take from this congregation some of the oldest, and steadiest friends, and most liberal contributors to its success; and it will require oil their effort® to provide for their own necessities, and prevent them doing much for the out-lying districts and weak stations. Moreover, the removal of Mr. Jlill will concentrate on Auckland the undivided attention of both ministers, and every other place will be left neglected. Such. are my reasons for thinking that the welfare of the Church requires that St. Andrews, as at present constituted, should have the services of two ministers, and that Mr. Hill should be one of these. Mr. Moderator, in pleading for ourselves, I do not consider it necessary to say one word attainst the demand how made for the translation of Mr. Hill. There is, unquestionably, a rich field of usefulness their for a devoted minister; and I shall do all I can to'help them to any body else but Mr. Hill. And as they cannot be expected to hold together without some effort' being put forth by the; presbytery in their behalf, I would suggest that Mr.* jßruce and Mr. Hill should officiate alternately, once or twice eacli Sabbath, till a suitable minister be got out from home. 1 think this suggestion should meet the difficulty so far as St. - James's is concerned, and the outlaying districts must be left unvisited for a time—l trust that time may not be long. I have only another word to add, and it is this : Mr. Hill may have come to the conclusion that duty compels Kim to leave us, and you may concur with him in this. But if this shall be the result of this day's proceedings, I am here on the part of the Commissioners to

say that though our hopes for good have boon blighted, and affections for our minister rudely torn asunder, yet, in the sajno spirit-in which we acquiesce in the arrangements of God, "for tlie welfare of liis cause and people, we shall say, —Even so Father, for bo it seemed good in thy Bight. Go in peace, and may the God of peace go with thee. Mr. Msicfailane was followed by Mr. Crawford, Commissioner for St! Andrew's, who deeply regretted the course taken by St, James's Church. Pt. Andrew's Church now did a great deal of outside wort., which, were they to lose one of their ministers, thoy . would be unable to perform. The congregation of St. James's should send home for a miuister. Mr. Beveridgo, a Commissionerof St. Andrew's, who thought that considering Mr/ Hill's health, the work ■would be more than ho v/ould be able to do. He did liot think that.the congregation of St. James's had any- claim upon them, and he strongly deprecated the . removal of Mr. Ilill, and ho hoped that the prayer.of St.. James's Church would not be granted. Mr. Jphu Russell, Mr. PeterMuckic and Mr. Clow, replied, and the'Kev. Mr. Hill then gave a very eloquent and ably-reasoned statement of his views on the matter, and his motives in acquiescing in the call made by .St., James!. Church. He felt his position ■was.a solemn one, and under a deep sense of his responsibility, lie liad considered the question of acceptance or refusal, and had come to a decision. bad .listened attentively to the pleadings on both sides,, and. nothing had been said to lead him to alter his intention. His course had been dictated by his conscientious desire to act for the best, and ho begged all parties to give him credit for thorough sincerity. The. rev. 'gentleman then weighed minutely the various considerations for and against his acceptance, observing that his coming to St- Andrew's was subject toall ..contingencies, and the principal of these is that a call to another sphere may be accepted. The St. James's congregation, wanting a minister had chosen one, and called him; in doing so, t'nev had only acted up to the rights of every "Presbyterian Church. And lie .considered it his duty to accept that call if his way was clear. There ought to be a Presbyterian Church of some influence in the locality to whichho was called. and the question which he had put to himself was, should he remain oneofthe two ministers at Andrew's, when one ought to bo sufficient, and refuse to go to the other congrega- > tion where there was no minister. The answer had ' been, and the longer ho - thought over it, the more tlecidcd it had become; that he ought not so to remain. A great consideration for a minister should bo the extension of his Church. This was the work; which , in responding to this call, he had chiefly considered. iThe extension of the Church ought to be the work of the Church. ; If there was a necessity for something being done for districts in the Province which were without ministers of religion it should be taken up by the Church;, as. a. Church, and not left to any individual . congregation. The considerations thnt thry could not supply. many places they knew of, that this will be more and more the case, that during the months he had been here almost nothing had been done in the direction contemplated, and that by those who should know the work well, there was proposed a step .which > would have involved the abandoning the work for a long period, all these had (ended in his miud t& take from the importance of

Uipworicjoi/eirtonilinii tho Churclvin the way imlien.- : ted, thought, stlmt greater. t good would'bo secured by his proseuco.. ill H o'n?on-st:!'-"' 1 !"., than by 'remaining at St. . Hci thought that the. good to tHe TPr'-nhyterinn Church by his going was. not to bo considered' more than the evil that Would arise from his refusing' the call. The only difficulty whioli had marlo him lay streps Upon the words " if his way was clear" was the state of his health, but he looked to God for strength and blessing. In concluding his long and eloquent address, tiio rev. gentleman remarked that he camo to his decision on public grounds, and public grounds alone. itr. Bruce, the minister of St. Andrew's, observed that he deeply regretted that ho was to lose the valuable aid of his beloved colbut acquiesced in his decision, as he was fully satisfied that Mr. Hill had considered the matter purely on publi; grounds. He would not stand in the wav of such a call, and ha I r'frai >ed from using any influence to indue- Mr. 1 Till to stav, and it was on pilMie grounds that he had thought it better (hat MY. Hill shoul 1 remain in his present position. Mr. Hill's health was a serious matter. Tf the Presbytery carried out the decision arrived at, yi'' tually they would have one man les". With all this, he would .be prepared at all times to assist Mr. Hill.

The Preshvterv, on the motion of tlio ■Mr. Maekie,' who observe 1 that ho was fully satisfied as to the course Mr. Hill bad decided to take, and he had the full conviction St. Andrew s wonUl be as much attended as ev-er. As to Mr. Hill's health, they knew that any amount of boddy labour was not so injurious as the feeling that one was not occupying his proper position, a'ld doing his proper worlc, decided in favor of the call and the deputation from the of St. Andrew's, having been asked whether they concurred in this decision of the Presbytery.

Mr.Maefarlane said that they cheerfully relinquished their claims to Mr. Hill, claims which they thought were paramount to every consideration, and acquiescing in the decision of Mr. Hill and tho Presbytery, the? gave another proof that they not only had no ill feeling for the church of .St. .Tames, but the very rovorse ; and Mr. Hill left them, carrying with him not only tho respect, but tho love of every member of the congregation. Prayer was then offered up hv the Tlev. Mr. Macksv, and arrangements were made for the induction of Mr. Hill into his olrir.ee. Tuesday, the 19th inst, at 7, pm , being decided upon for the induction to take plaee. the 11'".'. Mr. Morio to conduct the s?rvieeg, and the Kev. Mr. Maekey to induct, and the meeting dispersed. The "sitting commenced at 11 o'clock, and terminated at about half-past two.