THE LAND TENURE QUESTION

Mount Ida Chronicle, Volume 36, Issue 9437, 16 September 1904, Page 4

THE LAND TENURE QUESTION

. Following in Mr Herdman's speech irt the |iniise (jp Mp amfindmept : Mir, 1 dp nut on ye tn allow this debate. X»bioh prptpifes to be historic, to come t" a plose without milking some obserya ions p garding the i/ipppsition of the Uight 11 on the Premier. and the amendment moved by the leader of the Opposition. A putpber of the speephes,delivered in the pourse of the debate bu,vp been extreuiely interesting. and. punonsiy pnpugh. the dpbatp seems to bave waxed in ipterist as it proceeded. After flip first pyening it flugged, but gradually jt |ii>h Itpcfltnp Jivelipr.ftnd iu the cßursp of last Sightnpd duripg tp-day jt baa reached ip- I (fpd a Very lpyel. 1 listened with very great iptei'est to one or twp of the speeches > tnadp this pyepiug. The speech made by I hp 1 tphoprable incrpber fpp Kaiupoi appeared to j jpp to contain matter of a cdp§identblp j|,ijippn(; p|: intprpgt. jiiill. it $-as rather fliflicult fof pip, attppding fp jyhat yhe honourable gentiepiau fo'ascerf-aip pxactly what pqsitjop he toqk up, and fis I }vas lifctppjng tp tb© spppiip pf {he popour r able fflpmbpf for Auekkp4 Pit*) >t w ? 9 infinitely jpopp diffic«lf fpr pip tp asperfaip fhp pogitiop whip}) pe pcpupied. His sppech peeqnpd }p be full pf j'pp'pppjstppcies. But. first of tf.ll, Jpt jjjt! deal with tl)e jjipraber for j£%ppj. Upfefripg to the action pf the Opposition in ftip pc yppt the length of pongratulating them pp fl)p fapt f.hat, at last, tbpy had some sort pf ppljcy—a namling. bp c»11p,4 if, They had aunounced that they were in favoprpf granting to the jease-in-perpptuity liolders Their freehold. The honourable gentleman really under rates fltsjetlipr |;bp jpppftaiipe f)t tti'd fpnpndpippt. have undpi'gtpod and gathered from speeches delivered by members of the Opl'psitiop in tbig pypp Bjupp J have had fhe honour of ocpqpyiqg fi gpat ip "j't, that •vliatmembers of ; the party are striving for. f.'iat one of the principal features of the p ilicy they degip fo to the country is this : 'lhey fight for purity of administration respectable administration; and 1 Venture to say that any'pplitjca) p£,rty that jiTopounds a yqli'py containing purity of pdministration as one of it's pripst prominent plunks propoi)pt|B a policy that should command the Teppect apd tjprattention of the plep'toys'pf the country.' i'tp" toppprable gentleman also referred to the fact that a iiumber of residing in tyipdsor close to the electorate of the Miniate]: of liandn,' has qpnouneed at 'a ■! public meeting galled recent}/''that tbey had not any 'desire to have the ■ and" tniiit 'they' are pftpfept yijih their posittofti ytfirst of all -I should remark' in pppnectura'' with that op'spryi}ti(W thftt I have never yet heard any honourable gentleman sefit pn the Opposition filches fhprp is any desiip'pp the part of the leader of the Opposition or hja follpwprs t'p annihilate the The Wupcl and stropg position whiph ifjcenp js this ; theyapnounie that if a pruwii tenant desire's' to keep jnis leasehold,'py all means let him do it ;' but if he desires tp have spcprity of 1 gathered' front the honourable peii'tleman'a remarks't|)a't behplinves security of [lie c b'ief j-|iiuß wtiich'fhe Government should aim at--anil wantH the tVeehold, t'ben let pipi gentlemen 'wep');' on to remark thai-, thpse Settlers W Wipdsor werp qpife with ♦heir presept lot". No dOubt tbnt 'is' so, I tve Uepn'ied to understand^'that this,meeting was pr^c'tjQ^liy'ponyened fey'the 'Mjpist'er of Jj inds. He sug'geeted to somponp in 6e_ locality of "that it would be to call a meting of CJrowp tenants, and it is patent 'frotp fpe a uiiqipe^ 1 of fbosp persons al the meeting —it was obviops i'rom the {md.p^sß(fdl at the meeting—that some power in J the i Miniyfry' fOr very J»ordaiused, the very expressions used, Were aiffilar tpj s those which the Right Hon the Premier ma,4e vise of whefl speaking to his motion the other night in the House/ Sir; I believe that the Hon the Minister of Lands, knowing that.tli'i's on, wrote a letter to a friend : o£' 6is." •' The Hon :Mr DuNCAN, : —I never wrote to apyopft' on the subject; : Air llekdman':'—'Weil, the honourable gentleman 'probably communicated' wi th this personal'friend of bis down about Windsor or iilderslie, and the'resul'f waa the meeting and the pawfiop of" those afld so the honourable gentleman's' band was this debate, honourable inember for Kainpot also in bis speech, made this statement: He eiaid that from an examiof j;.etuv.<is he had <iiscpvered in very old settli'd districts there had not been an increase in settlement. I should have thought'that 'that' Was "natnral. People 'migrate from towns, not to old settled dis'« tr|dtß, .TOch ,as Ashburton and Ashley, buti they 'Will go .to parts of the country where they can get ,cheap rents, into the back plocks, probably, where the burdens incident to land-settlemept .are light, where the facilities for settlingfare easy, and.where they.can go on to land with only a small expenditure" Of capital. There seemed to me',' therefore, to be very little in honoui-abie gen tleman's argument. But to pass on from that to the enigmatical speech delivered Ipy thei'member for Auckland 9ity , Mr Baume. I gathered from that he was in favour of the ireeftol'd. Indeed, it is not necessary to go to the honourable gentleman's speech'Wdiscover that he is in favour of granting the freehold to the "holders of the lease in fur 'we find, in what was, I beljieve, his maidon speech', delivered last session in this House, he spoke ■vigorously in favour of granting th l e freehold to the leaseholders.' Let icxie Vead to honourable members tlie statements of tlpe b'ohouiable gentleman . was trfigic in bis'tones" and K> his advocacy 'of tjhe 1 °w Yfoiild taught' that' tio matter what proposal was 'submitted in the Mi Iffould b&ve" sacrificed 'evervthirii iA oraw thatf be o\ieht l ecord bis vote for the freehold. What did be say last session: With regard t'o freehold,,' have quite a different opinion from that held "by l 'the tpnourable for Lytlel on arid the lieve in' thfe ftedKoid. for farming land especially. I do not thinlj: i^'maijters _ so' much in the <tf. towu 'Jantls. if-the'discussion in this' House had been confined to the taking lip of tha town lands ia 'New. Zealand it would ntlt Ijiave' met with muclii opposition |rom me, a thinir had' been feasible'; And in ojpening up fresh "townships, if the Goverament were to say'we will not give the freehold oi'any place where business life'is tjo be carried.on, I would not fcel much disi posed to object to that., But in regard to i jplaces where men make their homes, and in legard to'the places'where we tope to, see in years to come families who have been located ■: for many years—aye, centuries—those per- ; sons go on the laud. fSir, anil they suffer ; hardships for the sake of getting a home An Hon M KMBEH.—yeutimelit. Mr BAUMb.—l'think I hear some of my friends'on the other side—city members—say V Sentiment." I say -the' best part of life r exists in sentiment IJiove, patriotism,truth, justice—what are they ? bent'ioieifit i">What made ifingland great? Sentiment I And I ■say, with regard to the freehold, as the ui& - utaiwls, awipg " our traditions, there'is love for the fieehofd, tiir. that. no iogUj uau overrule, uo ruLe > destroy," , , The words which I desire to call specific attention to are these, " Owing to our tradi- ; tions, thero is love for the"freehold,' Sir, that | fio logic can override, dp rijfle destroy?'. Very

well. But what a change comes oyer the ncenp 1 Only six or eight months go by and we find .the honourable mbuaber m this position in the House : He is bound 10 the Premier He is a fr}pn4 of! fjoyernment. He in n devoted Government supporter. On thp ppblip |il«ttprui he announced to his const iitieuts tbut ue was jp favour of allow? ing leaseholders to convert tbpir intp freehold. Tojday lie is confronted with this difficulty : 'lbe leader of thp Opposition has submitted a proposal which would pnable the honourable gentleman. iiF be desired 10 do so, Ui vpte strictly in favour of (riving leaseholders the opportunity whjch he advocated they should possess. Hut will fie do it ? >V"beip are tbosp dramatip peripds that we heard last session? 'J'hpy fcjjvp vftnishcjl iuto thin air—he has fqrgpttpp Jija prpfessipnft—absolutely forgotten tjipm. Thp thin pretext on which tfje honourable gent ipnian relies to pscape frpm fhe unfprtupafe (Mipuase with whjoli he is now coufrontcd is this—be ftsgeytp fbat the leader of thp oppo 7 sitipn, in submitting bis amendmpntj has not (;que jn£o details, hasnotsuggestpd what sum of mppey it shall be neceg-atv that a leaseholder should pay before hp shall be allowed to e:sphftpgp his title. This is bis pxcuse for the chnngp of attitude. At anyrate it is quite pjpar thj»t in bis prpposition the leader of the Opposition has given not only the honourablp gentlpman from Auckland, but also otbpr honourablp geptlpfpen on the Government sidp of thp ijoiise, an opportunity of deplarimr. once and for t),]], vvhpther tbey arp prepared to stic|s |p thp pfpdgpg tbey baye given to tbeir constituents. But what do we find them doing J 4'he Prejrripr'says •o them. " My Government is in jeopardy. | a fate ig at stake. My "ppljtipal existence df peuds upon what you geptlemen dp. You must not vote for tbjs prpppsitiop pf the lender of the Opposition. Yojt must oppose it 1 I command yon to do this 1 If you have stated to your constituent? thatyop are in favour (if allowing Jeagpliqldprg'tp convert their tenancies into freeholds you must nevertheless vote against that proposition. I insist upon it 1 Yop pipsp jio jt." And they do it. Let us examine this proposition. Let us 8 'e whether there is not sufficii n. bcope for the honourable gentleman to vote for this proposition pf the leader pf the Opposition. What does Mr Massey say? ■ " 1 This House, as representipg the people— Cffy iiecognises" urgent necessity fpr rptprm iu the land laws of the colony?" a ""Will these gentlemeij gay there is no urgent necepity fprit f Why the Premier hinigelf admits it. His owyi motion is an admission of tjie |apf. yet they will not vp'fe for it Secondly, tfie leader of tjip pppoaitioi} says that Uoifse. 'he trustee? pf the people, asthe_custodiiinii of their as the guard japs of tbeir prpperty—"if (i; Asserts its competency to devise remedial measures yyitbout the delay which would bp occasioned by the appointment of a Commission of Inquiry : and " (?) T? therefore of opiniop tjiat it should be ait'oidel an opportunity during the pre>eut si-ssion' of passing tbfe necessary legislation."

Is there ?iny v Injection to ibat ? Surely not. It goes further, aud here we come to the tssence o( the fimendmept. " '■ 2 1 liat, with a view of further encouraging And promoting settlement, giving more confidence to those occupying the lands, and rp uoving causes of in itaiioii. it is desirable—- " (.<?) Lat tenants occupying Crown lands under leasp-in-perpet uity wJhj have complied with reasonable conditions shall le allowed the option of converting their leaseholds into freeholds, with limitation of area, and that all moneVs so received shall be nsed for the purchase of further land under the Land for tit ttleLueuts Act.-'' '

So there ia a clear opportunity offered to any gentlemen who have said to their constituents that the time ..baa arrived in the history of this colony when the leaseholders shyuld be allowed to acquire the freehold, to Vote for that proposition. An Hon. Mkmbkk.—On what terms ? Mb Hjskdman —What is the use of all these flimsy excuses? ".On what terms?" Does the Prauiefsspect the leaner of the Opposition to incorporate in one amendment the whole of a Land Act! The Pieraier is only trifling with the Why, Mr Speaker,' all we have to do in a motion of this description js io affirm a principle, and the leader of the Opposition has given every member au opportunity of affirming the principle that, in the interest of settlers and in the interests of land settlement, leaseholders should be allowed lo acquire the freehold. Mr A. L. D,. On what terms? Mk Hekdjian.—Why, the honourable gentleman'is following-' the lead of the Premier. You want first to decide that the leaseholders shall have the right to acquire the freehold/ that is the'first position to be defined. On what terms the leaseholders should be allowed tp exchange their perpetual lesioes for freeholds should be. defined in some Bill which tLe Government ought to submit to the House. ' To ask the lea'uer of the Opposition'to'do this' is ahsurd. The honourable n.ember for Napier does not like the position. " • Ma, A 1.. P.Fbasbb.—You will bear me by-arid-bye. Silt Hkhdmak.—Well. I always listen w i b a great deal deal of pleasure and interI e*t io the elocut'ionory perfoimances of my | friend'the honourable member for Napier. The leader of'the' has r>lncp<l & simple prof osition he/ore tfye menjl eis of the House, no'matter what their opinions are'. The opinions' of the laud reformers are, of tourse, entitled io consideration—the opinions of members of both' sides of the House "■re io the greatest con«derati.in—and ijbe affords an opportunity of these opinions, ibe member for papier and the member for 1 Am Inland pi,ty were both in favour of this | proposition when talking to their 'constituents. Tbiy hate'asserted that6uch an alteiation in law must be in the interests of the country, and yet they shirk the position when it arisefe." Now, one curious feature of this debate struck me on the first evening, , aijd it was this . have always been led to understand that it was the duty of the Minister in charge of any Department of the Statje to submit to this House any proDpsitiou «ffncting the Department under his "control ; that if that Department required legislating for hj« should submit the legislation affectm? it, J? or instance, if an . alteration in land legislation is desired. I have always | believed it to be the case that it should be iutroduced by the Minister of Lands. I , understood that to be the constitutional custom. I understand that i.n the English House of Commons,' for instance, if it is nee. as ity to bring under the notice of Parliament propositions affecting, say, the "War Depart tueut. such scheme would be presented by ibe M n sier of War ; and so with every othir department of the State. In New Zealand we pursue another course. For instance, 'on this occasion, when a radical change is t suggested in the land administration, we find that the Minister of Lands is placed in the background, and that the" responsibility of submitting the resolution for the appointment of a Commission is not entrusted to" that honourable gentleman, who has the ' practical experience and knowledge of his Department, and such powerful artillery in the shape of cL-rks. Commissioners of Crown Lands, and Uuder-Secretaries at his disposal ibe is not allowed to'use that material. The ! material is all placed in the hands of the first Minister of the Crown ; he is ttie pertoci vyiio constitutes hitueelf thii champion of the ' Lands Departriient.

The HON MR Skddo.V—kept him back to poliud the leader of the Opposition. •

Mb HisßpiiiAN.—Hispoitndjng was very harmless. " That incident is not an isolated one. It frequently happens that the Premier and Minister of Railways have to do all .the fight jng ; the Premier ijeems to have no c>nlidp.ice in his othpr pqljeagqes. Every pijportant measure has tq be -moved either by t|ie Premier or by thp Mipistpf of Railways. This proposal to apppipt jj,pyal Commission to ipqiiire into ltpjd question is in my ppiniph sjrppjy a ttjek. Tbj-ppghoptthis debatp { have wp,tcbpd thp hpn. gfintlemsn. aj|d 1 always watph bini wif.b Jijferest. He is an artful dodger—be dpdgeg mqj-p ar|fillly than the immortal creatjoij of Dipkeps. Tjjis motion of bis is an excellent safftpje qf hip dodging methods. The'resplutiop io qsy piind is a complete confessiop pf Ministerial ineptitude ; it is ap admission tjiat poveriiment are incapable of dealing with this important question. When you come to analyse the resolution you discover that it means this First, it says that the timp has arrived when some alteration should bp m!}f!p jp £he existing land laws. Then,iJ effect, it asserts that the Government is iuctipq,b)p uf with this subject—it is too yast—and, lastly, it affirms the principle that thp Hpugp i§ incapable of dealing with it. I suggest that thiit is a reflection on the capapity o| |jpnouiable members. Surely to goodness we could eyojyp some scheme which would meet the requirements pf the country, j I venture tp sq.y tljat £jftpr tbe Boyal Com- j mission has reported we will be no wiser than we are at the present time. I say that there is sufficient talep); ppt pnly in the House, but also amongst Government oflicers to evolve a scheme that; will WPe l tbe requirements of tbe people who occupy the Crown lands of the colony. The Under-Sec-rptayy pf Crown' Lands is a most capable oflice'r, and be has had large experience in land administration. Thp Sprveyor-General is also a map of great ability. J hen |;bprp nre thp various Commissioners of Crown Lands—these officials arp capablp o|: framing a Land Bill that will meet the requirement? of tbe D'Oplr, and, fl, ain. in this Hopse arp many men who, coupled yvith long Parliamentary experience, have been closely associated wjtli the land settlpropnt pf colony almost from jts start. The leader pf tbe Opposition himself J b.e'| eve^°'Jet 'b oron i familiaf wjth the land questipn Idp not kpow Whether tftp Minister of Lands is or not; we do not often get an opportpnity of judging. bj|t I asqume that he would not opeppy his present position urilesg he some -prac.ticai knowledge of land. There are many faraiprs ip this wbp havp earned their livelihood living on the soil', th'py have pained a competency, and their experience eiifiblps tbem tp give authoritative expression to the hopes, aspiratjppe, and views of Crewn tenaHts 3pd others interested in latjc}. - {To be sontiayed.)i