MEDICAL STUDENTS

Hawke's Bay Tribune, Volume XXIV, Issue 246, 29 September 1934, Page 8

MEDICAL STUDENTS

Suggested Limitation

DISCUSSED IN HOUSE

'Senate Will Do Right Thing”

By Telegraph —Press Association. WELLINGTON, September 28.

Considerable opposition to what they considered a move to limit the numbers of medical students to be trained at the Otago Medical School was voiced by members in the House of Representatives today when the Education vote was under discussion. The Prime Minister, the Bt. Hon. G. W. Forbes, said he thought the University Senate could be relied upon to do the right thing. If the Senate did decide to limit the number, he thought the Government could still take a hand. Following a debate the House passed the vote.

Mr W. E. Barnard (Napier, Labour) moved an amendment reducing the vote to Otago University of £11,993 by £5 as a protest against the proposal to limit the number of students at the Otago Medical School. Bo said that it a Stato medica 1 service were established there might be difficulty in securing medical men. Mr E. J. Howard (Christchurch South, Labour) considered that no university should have the right to say how many students it would train. Mr A. S. Richards (Roskill, Labour) said that if the Otago Medical School was not large enough, another school should be established at Auckland. He considered there was not a surfeit of doctors in the Dominion. Some district hospitals, such as the West Coast, could not secure bouse surgeons. He stressed the value of Auckland as a trainiiq centre, as it came in close contact witl

tropical diseases. Mr H. T. Armstrong (Christchurek East, Labour): What about Antarctic disease!

Mr Richards said it did not matter what the disease was. He thought the

excuse given for limiting students was very flimsy.. The Leader of the Opposition, Mr M. J. Savage, said that if there were a proposal for restriction it might be a very serious matter. It was quite evident that there was a move afoot. The House should be entitled to know what was happening or likely to happen. MR FORBES EXPLAINS. The Prime Minister, the Rt. Hon. 0. W. Forbes, said the Government had no jurisdiction over the University Senate or what was proposed. No-one knew what the Senate would report. He knew there was some suggestion by the B.M.A. to limit the number of students, but they did not know what the Senate would do. The department had no information. If a proposal were made it must have some reason behind it; otherwise it would not be made. If an attempt were made to restrict the number of lawyers there would be a strong clamour throughout the Dominion. If there was no stronger reason than had been mentioned in the House he did not think the Senate would agree. Mr Barnard: Is not the principle of restriction vicious! Mr Forbes said there might be cases where employment was not offering. Attempts had been made to limit the number of waterside workers. It might be in the best interests of the men themselves and the people that limits tion should be made. There was no knowledge of whether the Senate would listen to the proposal for five minutes. The Senate knew the feelings of mem bers of Parliament on it. The first he had heard of the proposal was when Air Richards bad mentioned a rumour the previous day. He thought the Senate which was not composed of doctors, should be relied on to do the right thing. Even if the Senate decided to limit the number, he thought the Government could still take a hand. UNIVERSITY COUNCILS ATTITUDE. Mr F. .Tones (Dunedin South, Lab our) said that part of the grant to the university was used to train njedical students. He had sought information from the Otago University registrar as to whether the Otago University Coun cil favoured limitation. He had received a reply stating that medical stud eats could take a flrst-ycar course at

any •university. The council suggested that the number of second-yeat students should be limited to 60, which, with failures, would bring the secondyear classes to about 70, which was the largest number the school could efficiently train, and which w’as sufficient to meet the Dominion's requirements irrespective of the number of medical practitioners from overseas, numbering <Jeven a year.

That reply, continued Mr Jones, showed that the University Council favoured restriction. He was not in favour of that, but thought that medica l students should be trained at the Otago Medical School. Dunedin might not have the number of diseases Auckland had, but it was desirable that students should be trained in a healthy city.

Mr R. A. Wright (Wellington Suburbs, Independent) asked why £ll,OOO had been granted to Otago and only £5OOO to Canterbury and other colleges

Mr J. O’Brien (Westland, Labour) opposed limitation. He said the Westland Hospital Board could not secure a doctor in New Zealand for South Westland. It had to get one from Australia. Palmerston also bad to get a doctor from Australia. Parliament should have some control over the money going to Otago to see that a sufficient number of doctors were train ed. The B.M.A. should not have the power of saying how many students should be trained. PROPER TRAINING FACILITIES. Mr H. S. S. Kyle (Riecarton, Government) said that Otago had a properlyequipped medical school and obstetrical hospital, and it was the proper place to train medical students. Mr D. W. Coleman (Gisborne, Labour) sai I that if the B.M.A. attempted to limit the number of medical students the Government should step in. Mr Barnard said his amendment had nothing to do with establishing a medical school at Auckland. He was inclined to believe that there should be only one medical school. In view of the Prime Minister’s statement ho would not press tho amendment. The debate would have served the purpose of nJ lowing the people to see the mind of Parliament on the matter. Mr Richards explained that he did not intend his remarks to be taken as suggesting the establishment of another medical school. His idea was that if the accommodation and equip-

ment at Dunedin w-ere not sufficient the claims of Auckland should be considered.

AVOIDING FLUCTUATIONS By Telegraph—Press Association. DUNEDIN, September 28. Referring this morning to the question in Parliament concerning the limitation of medical students and the desirability of a medical school at Auckland, Sir Lindo Ferguson, Dean of the Medical Faculty, stated that the matter was before the Senate in January and tho question of limitation was to-day being discussed by the Senate committee at Wellington. The steps proposed were to avoid fluctuations in numbers, which in the past had resulted either in an oversupply of graduates who could not find openings or a deficiency which made it difficult to staff hospitals. There was no intention to attempt to limit tho number in the profession. Limitation of students was forced on them by the impossibility of training classes over a certain size. The main American schools limited classes to 50. Otago could not deal efficiently with more than 60. Tho entering number here in 1923 was 94 and in 1928 only 26. This fluctuation was embarrassing. They either had more students than the teachers or equipment could deal with or insufficient to staff tho hospitals. Sir Lindo stated that the New Zealand population could not supply students for the schools and there was scope for much more expenditure to complete the Otago school. The British Government gave as much as £16,000 annually to individual schools, but the total Treasury grant to the Otago school last year was under £4OOO.