MR ORMOND'S MEETINGS.

Hawke's Bay Herald, Volume XXI, Issue 5005, 11 February 1878, Page 2

MR ORMOND'S MEETINGS.

AT WAIPAWA. On Friday evening Mr Ormond addressed a meeting of his constituents in the Oddfellows' Hall, Waipawa. The meeting was largely attended, the hall being quite filled. Mr Ormond's reception was very cordial, and almost throughout his address he had the sympathy of his audience entirely with him. Mr W. White having been voted to the chair, opened the proceedings with a few remarks having reference to his position being probably more due to his being a middle man in political leanings than to his personal merit. After expressing his conviction that he need not ask a Waipawa audience to give a fair hearing to a speaker addressing them, he introduced Mr Ormond to the meeting. Mr Ormond on rising was received with general applause. He thanked those present for coming at his invitation to meet him in numbers much larger than he had expected in a country place. He then referred to the last occasion of his addressing them, having been when he was seeking election to the House of Representatives. He explained why he had not addressed them after the close of the session before last. It was, in the i first place, because there had not been ; much to communicate. Parliament in ■ ! that session had done little beyond passing the measure giving effect to abolition. The time of the session had been wasted, he was sorry to say, in talk for the sake of obstruction by the party who were then the Opposition, and the measures to give due and proper effect to the system of local government to be established on the abolition of provincial government had in consequence been very incomplete. Another reason why he had not then addressed his constituents then was because of his acceptance of a position in the government of the country, and he therefore had much to do. He would now refer to the events of last session ; but before doing so he would like to Btate the circumstances under which he had taken the position he had occupied in the Government, because he had been accused by the party who had then been the I Opposition of a desire to stick to office, which was after all not so desirable as to offer an inducement for his pursuing such a course. The Government, as they knew, had been headed by Sir Julius Yogel. He went to England, engaged on loan business for the colony, and did very good Service to the country. While doing so his health suffered very considerably, and he became apprehensive that he would not be able to return to New Zealand. He did, however, return, and resumed his position at the head of the i Government. But his health was little better than it had been, and he announced to his colleagues that he would not be able to continue to hold his position in the Government. His family affairs also were urged as a reason that induced his retirement. He was not a rich man, and he felt it to be his duty to his family to make some provision for them, and he therefore intimated his desire to be relieved from his office. Just then Dr Featherston died, and Sir Julius Yogel intimated to his colleagues his desire to be appointed to the Agent-Generalship, | and his colleagues felt that he had a claim upon them in the matter. He (Mr Ormond) was not there as an apologist for Sir Julius Yogel leaving at the time when the new constitution was being brought into effect. To pursue such a course a man must -have very strong reasons, and probably he had them ; his tenure of life was very precarious, and he was much moved by the conviction that it was his duty to his family to endeavor to make some provision for them. Well, Sir Julius Yogel retired. This was when abolition had been fully determined and would come into force in a few months. The party to which he (Mr Ormond) belonged looked about them for a successor to Sir Julius ' Yogel. For a considerable time they made endeavors to induce Mr Stafford to accept the position. He was, however, not willing to accept it. Himself (Mr Ormond) and others pressed it upon Mr Stafford, but he w.as firm in his refusal. He did not exactly know what were his reasons, but he believed that, among them, one was that he was going to take his family to England, and he was also influenced by the course of personal invective that was being taken by the Opposition. He (Mr Ormond) thought that it was much to be regretted that Mr Stafford had not consented to take office. He would have brought with him a name for honest, faithful administration, and he would have had the full confidence of the country. When it was definitely known that Mr Stafford would not accept the position of Premier, the party to which he (Mr Ormond) belonged fixed upon Major Atkinson. He hesitated, but at last consented on condition that he should get aid from among his party. He (Mr Ormond) was one of those who then consented to assist Major Atkinson. It was with very great unwillingness that he did so. For four years previously there had been a seat in the Government at his disposal, but he had preferred not being in office, and when he did take it he had to overcome a strong feeling of reluctance. The duties he knew were very onerous, and there was also much that was unpleasant in connection with it. He knew that he should have to apply himself to the work of retrenchment, and that carried with it the most unpleasant duty of having to dispense with the service of a number of public servants — a most painful duty to the man who had to carry it out. Another thing was that he would have to assist in bringing into operation the now form of government. He meant the present system of local government. Anyone who had at all made himself acquainted with the history of governments must have noticed that those who launched a new system, however successful the system might prove, were never" those who carried it out. In any great change, it was never the Government which introduced it that eventually brought it into full effect. History proved that that had always been so. He knew that that contingency attached to his taking office, and it might well be asked why, after he had refrained for years from accepting it, ho should go in to undertake work, which, as he had said, was in some respects unpleasant and painful, and in others was liable to the contingency he had mentioned. But he belonged to a party, and he knew that his services were required by his party, that local gvoermnent was what the country had to get, and that measures were to be framed and passed to carry it into effect. But, nevertheless, it was with great reluctance that he joined the Government, and yet he had been subjected to taunts, by the late Opposition and their friends, about his taking office. Among those taunts the large emoluments of office were mentioned, and there was also talk in Wellington about the palaces Ministers lived in. As to the emoluments, any one who knew him would know that leaving his own affairs involved more than the emoluments of office would compensate for ; and as to tho palaces, ho could only say that he had left a very comfortable residence to go to a very uncomfortable one. The Government ho joined did not mako many promises. They merely said they would prudently administer the affairs of the country, set going tho new system of local government, and make proposals for retrenchment. The session ended in November and Parliament should have met in the following June. It did not, however, meet until July, and even then there had been very little time to prepare the measures for bringing into full effect the nuw form of local government and for carrying out an extensive system, of- retrenchment. The Government found that endless omissions had occurred in matters that were necessary for properly carrying the new form of government into effect. I This arose from the minority in the iHoa^e— -axninoz'itv which was only one-

fourth of the whole number — having [in the session of 1876J set themselves determinedly to obstruct the passing of any measures that would give effect to abolition, instead of yielding to the majority. When it was considered that in a House of 88 members the Opposition only numbered 22, and thia after the voice of the people had been heard at a general election, it would be seen how small was the minority that obstructed legislation. As Englishmen it was their duty, when they found they were in such a minority, to give way. However, that was not the course the Opposition, with Sir George Grey at their head, chose to pursue, but applied themselves instead to the use of every means for preventing measures passing which had the support of a large majority in the House. It was a principle always admitted among Englishmen that the minority should bow to the will of the majority. It was a principle from which he for one would never depart. It was through that principle not being acted upon that the omisssons he had referred to had occurred, and to remedy them was part of the work the late Government had to do. They had also to carry out the retrenchment they had promised. They devoted themselves, to it, and with the effect that they made proposals for reductions amounting to £83,000, and they saw their way to still further reductions which they could make lin a little time. There was one difficulty ! in making reductions in the civil service, that it was so much fenced in by Acts of Parliament, and that made retrenchment in the service no easy matter. He was not one to undervalue the civil service as a whole, though he could not but say that it was not all that it ought to be — it required reorganisation. There were men in the service who could not be replaced with advantage — men whose value to the country was very great. But, on the other hand, there were men — aye, and in first positions too — who were only drags upon the State. Nevertheless, as he had already stated, the service was so fenced by Acts of the Legislature that to deal with these men would entail enormous cost in compensation allowances. Still, it wotild have to be done, and whatever Government came into office would have to face the question. However, notwithstanding this difficulty the. Government had, as he had said,, proposed reductions amounting to £83,000, and further retrenchment was contemplated. Those were the promises they had made, and which they were resolved to carry out. They met in Parliament, and had all their bills drawn out, so that it might not be said that the session was protracted because their measures were not ready. His friend, Major Atkinson, too, was ready with his Financial Statement, and delivered it within a fortnight of Parliament meeting — a most unprecedented thing. He did not, however, think they were wise tactics thus to show their hands at once. They did it, though, because they looked more to what was required of them by the country than to the course the Opposition might take. They found the House a very difficult one to get on with. It was difficult, in that there was no great party tie. On large questions the Government had a large majority, —this waß at the beginning of the session, — but on many minor questions they were not getting the support that was necessary. They therefore called a meeting of members who had been supporting them, told them what the Government measures were which they desired should be carried, and the reply they got was a vote pledging the meeting— it was a large meeting — to support the Government through the session. The Government had nearly passed the Education Bill through the House, and several other large measures, and they thought they saw their way to having all their bills carried through. The Opposition tactics continued the same. They were the tactics of obstruction. At that time the Opposition proper did not appear prominently on the scene, and the party was very small, numbering not more than fourteen. There had then sprung up a Middle Party. It was a larger party than Sir George Grey's, and numbered about twenty-two. Among, them there were men of high reputation and inflaence. He might mention as one of them his friend Mr Rolleston. Some of them had left Sir George Grey, refusing to continue with him the course of obstruction that Sir George Grey's party were pursuing ; others had left the Government .party because the Government would not reward their political services in the way they desired. The Opposition were not strong enough to remove the Government, and they came to an understanding to join with this Middle Party for that purpose. Sir George Grey, as he had already told the meeting, did not appear in it. The condition of the Middle Party joining had been made public recently by Mr Curtis and Mr Rolleston in their addresses to their constituents. It was that Sir George Grey was not to be Premier. Even then they were not strong enough to turn the Government out, and the next thing done was to set afloat a report that Sir William Fitzherbert would leave the chair and take the leadership of any new Government that might be formed after the one then in office was turned out. What foundation there was for this statement he could not tell the meeting. That, however, was the report in Wellington, and upon it two or three left the Government party. They differed with the Government on some points, and, expecting that Sir William Fifczherbert would take the lead, they left the Government party. At the first meeting of the Opposition after the Government had resigned, it was proposed that Sir William Fitzherbert should take up the position of Premier, but some of the friends of Sir George Grey said that he claimed the right to be at the head of the Government, and it was found that Sir William Fitzherbert did not possess a sufficient number of supporters at that meeting to carry the proposal in regard to him. That went on for about a week, and at last Sir Geoi-ge Grey took office as Premier. Thereupon a large section of those 'who had joined the Opposition to turn out the Ministry came and offered to join their party. That gave them a majority of about ten. Under ordinary circumstances they would have waited to see what were Sir George Grey's measures before attempting to turn him out. But they held that he had not got his position in such a way as to entitle him to that consideration. He had not proposed the motion for removing the Government — if he had proposed it there would not have been the ghost of a chance of its being carried — and he never appeared upon the scene while it was being proceeded with, and it was thought that the Opposition were entitled to turn him out when they could. As of course they knew, a vote of want of confidence was proposed. By a catch vote taken in the afternoon, together with bad tactics on the part of the Opposition, the motion was not carried. The Opposition were of opinion that the vote should not have been taken at that moment, and that the Speaker was wrong in ruling that it should. However, it was taken, and the votes being equal the Speaker gave his casting vote for the Government. Afterwards three members got up, and publicly stated they had intended to vote for the motion had they been present. Looking at it that the vote as taken was unfair, the Opposition immediately tabled another motion of noconfidence. This was met, on the part; of the Government, with a statement that they would not fight the motion, and that the Opposition must be content with the vote that had been taken. This went on for about three weeks. The Government, who possess great advantages in having the power of regulating the order paper, contrived to keep the motion low down, and, with the aid of the forma of the House and the ruling of the Speaker, they managed so that the motion did not come on, He (Mr Ormond) thought that

it was not a proper state of things that tc +I\e majority should be prevented from ii giving effect to their opinions by the forma of the House. At all events, that n was the state of the matter ; the Opposi- ti tion had a majority, but were not able to h use it in consequence of the forms of the o House being utilised to prevent it. The v Government played their trump card, c Sir Georg6 Grey announced that the n Government proposed to take the land o fund and make it general. That very v much altered the state of things. He v (Mr Ormond) for one could not under- r value the importance of the proposal. He d could not but admit that the land fund t was necessary to the colony, and he gave a Sir George Grey credit for proposing that n it should be taken. This altered the I state of parties. Among the Opposition t there were many, who, although disin- c olined to Sir George Grey remaining in € office, yet could not, loyally to the s interests of the colony, oppose him in s that proposal. He (Mr Ormond) was one 1 of them, and he took occasion to declare ] that he would support Sir George Grey 1 until the land fund was made general, ( and when that was done he should feel i himself at liberty to oppose him again, i but he pledged himself to give Sir George 1 .his support until then. (Applause.) 1 Among the men who felt themselves ] bound to support Sir George Grey in this i matter was Mr Whitaker. He had ] pledged himself that the first opportunity 1 that offered to take the land fund he i would take it. It might be asked why ' the late Government, having among them 1 those who were convinced of the necessity \ of taking the land fund, did not take it i themselves. It must, however, be re- j membored that the late Government had '. as opponents men who were bent upon the disruption of the colony — men, such < as Sir George Grey and Mr Macandrew, ■ who were determined to bring about, if i they could, the separation of the colony. ; He (Mr Ormond) therefore thought that, " although the land fund was necessary to ' the colony, separation was a question of i greater importance — to uphold the unity '. of the colony was a matter of much more : moment than making the land fund i general. Had the late Government ■ brought forward the land fund question, they would have played into the hands of ■ the separationists. It could not be sup- : posed that Mr Macandrew, for instance, would have supported the late Government if the proposal had come from them. Mr Macandrew had been desiring separation through the whole of his carder ; it had been his one aim all along, and it was still, he (Mr Ormond) believed. Moreover, they had in the Government three men — Mr Bowen, Mr M'Lean, and. Mr Donald Reid — who could not have supported taking the land fund without having reference to their constituents, and therefore they would not have agreed to the proposal being made. He believed, however, that if reference had been made to the whole of New Zealand, it would have been brought about in a different way. However, Sir George Grey proposed it, and he (Mr Ormond) stepped forward and gave his support, considering that in doing so he was assuring the unity of the colony. After considering , the position of affairs, the Opposition I came to the conclusion that quite half of their party would see that the land fund proposal was carried through, and in the end they decided not to oppose the Government. Immediately afterwards Sir George Grey announced that the- session would close within a fortnight. Then the Government took their predecessors' measures in toto, and adopted their estimates. In no one thing did they depart from them, and all the Opposition had to do was to. sit and see that these measures were carried through ; that they did to the end of the session. When the late Government were in office, the bills they introduced were spoken of by the Opposition, and more particularly by Sir George Grey, in the very worst of terms, and yet these bills were taken up by those who had reviled them. One of them was the Inscription of Stock Bill. It was a bill of great importance, carrying out for the colony the measure on that subject which, through the instrumentality of Sir Julius Yogel, had been passed by the British Parliament. It was much thought of in the Australian colonies, where it was looked upon as a very statesmanlike measure, and they all proposed to adopt it. Of that bill Sir George Grey had said, when it was introduced by the late Government, that a more impudent proposal was never put before any Legislature. After that they might imagine what his surprise was when he (Mr Ormond) found in his pigeon-hole the very same bill brought in by Sir George Grey's Government. The title was slightly altered > but the bill was the same. And that was how the present Government did it throughout. The measures of the late Government, they said, were corrupt and bad and their estimates extravagant, yet they adopted them all, and, as respected the latter, without a single alteration, except some additions. He would now refer to the measures that were introduced by the late Government, and he thought the meeting would allow that by those measures the people of New Zealand had gained a good deal. He mentioned this because the measures of the Government to which he had belonged had been continuously held up by Sir George Grey as opposed to the interests of New Zealand. They would find that the policy of the measures of the late Government was directed to the endeavor to follow out the system of self-govern-ment devolving upon the people by the passing of abolition. The measures he referred to were the Education Bill, the District Railways Bill, the Native Land Bill, and the Waste Lands Bill. He would also refer to the incidence of taxation, though that was not a measure brought in. The Education Bill was brought in by his friend Mr Bowen, a gentleman of great culture, of consider- \ able experience in the subject of education, and admirably fitted for the task of i framing such a bill. If they had searched throughout New Zealand they could not have found a gentleman more fitted. Mr Bowen devoted himself for months to preparing the bill, and when it was brought in it was received with marked approval. __ To properly appreciate the difference in educational matters which the bill effected they should consider what was the state of things before. Those coming from the South must have perceived what a great difference there was in the North. He himself had been struck with it when he was in Otago and saw the splendid schools they had there. Besides this difference there was a variety in the means of maintaining schools. In some districts there was a special tax, in some fees were charged. The whole thing was unequal. The bill Mr Bowen brought in put all districts on one footing ; education was made perfectly free, its support being derived from the State, and the whole of the management was on the elective principle. First, the money for school buildings had to be voted by Parliament, and then, as they could see, they had the elective principle at the start. Then in the bill itself the same principle i'an through. They had already had some little experience of it in having had to elect school committees. Those committees would have to elect the Edution Board, and in those two bodies would rest the entire control of educational matters. They could not have had those matters more completely vested in the people. In that the late Government had shown their desire to put in the people themselves the control and | management of their educational affairs. This was in every way provided by the Education Bill. While speaking on the subject lie would take the opportunity of recommending that in electing the Education Board they should take care to select men who would roalljwork. Anyone who had afc all studied the Education Act would know that the Education Boards would have much to do ; for some months to come they would have

> meet once a we ok, and even oftener, i order to do what was necessary to bo one. He did not knew exactly how M uray coinmi! ices there were in the dis-rictr-perhaps twenty. These would each aye to nominate two persons, and out f the whole of the nominations they * rould afterwards have to elect the Eduatiou Board. He would Btrongly recomlend them to elect men who had not nly the time at their disposal, but who irotild attend to the duties that would deolve upon them, and, if possible, to get nen who would take an interest in those Lutiea. He would also recommend them 0 elect men who could without difficulty *ttend the meetings of the board, it vould be no use electing men, merely >ecause they represented the district; if hey had not such reasonable means of sommunication with Napier as would mable them to reach it at shorter notice, md would give them time to apply themlelves properly to the work that would lave to be done. Since he had beeiriri STapier, having a seat at the existing Board of Education, he had given a good leal of his- time in assisting to put the machinery of the new system into working order. If he were put on the new ooard he would do his best to see thkt the oill was made of practical use to' the people. There was one point in connection with . the Education bill which he particularly, wished to refer to before Leaving the subject. It was in Regard to what was known as the Curtis clauses. Fhe point involved in the question raised by Mr Curtis was whether the denominational schools should continue to. receive lid from the State. The Goverrimenty as 1 whole, and a large majority of -the House ; were opposed to it, while bie as well as others were in favor of aid being jontinued. His opinion on the point was. very strong, and. he took that opportunity of stating that if he could have given expression to his opinion by his vote it would have been given in favor of tfie continuation of aid to' denominational schools. (Applause.) But, as they knew, he was not free to vote when the j&oyernment as a whole had decided against the clauses, so he refrained from voting, and they were lost by a large majority. , If the question were to come on again lie would vote for the Curtis clauses. (Re- "-• newed applause.) He would tell them why. Denominational schools had been of great assistance to the community. When the State furnished no means for the education of the people, the denominations provided what the State would not provide. That was quite sufficient to give them a claim upon the State. Whether the question would be re-opened he could not say. As he had already told them, he did not vote upon it at all. He kept from the House when the question came on because his position as a member of the Government did not permit his giving his vote as he wished to give it. Some bf his friends would be glad to hear this, while others would perhaps regret it. That, however, was the view he took of. the matter, and he considered he ought to state it. There was one defect, he must remark, in the Education Bill, and that was that the powers of the school committees, if anything, were not sufficient. If they looked into the Act they would see that although in some things the committees had power conferred upom them, yet in most they could not act withdutreference to the Education Board. If the Act came to be amended, he would relegate most of those powers to the committees. Any amendment, of the Act should, he thought, take that direction. On the whole, however, he considered that a good deal had been done to remove a state of things which they wo aid never see again — such, for instance, as the collection of the education tax in Auckland, which caused almost a rebellion there. The next measure to which he would draw their attention was the District Railways Bill. It was in his department Minister of Public Works, and had been introduced by him. It had struck him when travelling on the main trunk line in the Middle Island that until it had feeders the country would never have the full benefit of the expenditure upon it. On his return to Wellington he discussed the matter with his colleagues, and his views, he found, met with their concurrence. The Government was, however, pledged to prudence in administration, and that included that they should not run headlong into obligations. There was an idea abroad that they had already been running too fast, and if they did not hold their hands they would get too deeply into debt. It was found that, on a rough estimate, these feeders for Otago and Canterbury would involve the expenditure of some five millions, and that was more than they would be justified in expending. Under these circumstances he thought another way could be found of providing what was required without the need of the colony getting into debt for it. He saw no earthly reason why the people, with some assistance from the ■ Government, should not get for themselves the feeders they wanted, and he found, on speaking to them, that they I were perfectly willing to do so. It was with that view, that the , District Railways Bill was drafted. As passed through ' the House by him I (Mr Ormond), the bill was entirely elec- I tive in principle. Any district that I required a branch railway could have it if I they raised the capital, the total interest 1 to be guaranteed being 7 per cent. — 2 per I cent, by the consolidated revenue and 5 I per cent, on the security of local rates. I He found that any amount of money I could be had on those terms, and in I Canterbury the system was now in oper- I ation. He had already mention^ that as I passed through the House vte prin- I ciple of the bill was of an elective I character — that was, that the majority of I ratepayers in a district where it was I desired to have a district . railway , could I have it on compliance with the terms of I the bill. The power was thus placed ■ directly in the hands of the people.' That fl was the form in which the bill' passed ■ through the House. He wished now to H point out a material alteration that was I afterwards made in it by the Government ■ of Sir George Grey., The bill was amongst H those taken over by that Government, H and when he (Mr Ormond) saw it after it H was passed, and the alteration he referred ■ to was made, it was not in Wellington, Bj and until then he was not aware of the H alteration that had been made. The fact H was that at the time that bill came back H from the Upper House everything wasH rushed with indecent haste, and .this billH was amongst those so dealt with. It cameH back with amendments, and as now passed ßß the majority in a district may have their jH railway provided that they owned morefß than one half the ratable property. was perfectly fair for him to point out that J while Sir George Grey was seeking popu-H| larity on the cry of making all persons^H equal, here was a practical illustration of^H the way he carried out anything of^H that kind. To show them how the^H alteration would work lie might men-^H tion that in the two districts, Porangahau^M and Hampdea, it would have been P er-^H fectly practicable under the bill of the lat^H Government to have had branch railwayt^H constructed, while under the bill aspasse^H by the present Government, the majoritiflM must own more than half the ratable pro^H porfcy in order tr> bring the Act into oper^H ation there. This would show the con^H tradiction between the promises Si^H George Grey was making now, and hi^H performances in legislation. He woul^H now come to the Native Lands Bill. -Hfl^H referred to it. though it was not a measur^H that had been passed, because the I.^^h| Government had been charged with havin^H introduced it in the interest of land spect^H lators. This was not at all thdTcase, anflH when he explained to them the nature the measure he believed that, he woulHH remove any impression of that kind,T^H any one there entertained it. The fawoj^H the subject, as it stood at present, W^^B notoriously bad, and gaye rise to endlej^H litigation, and it was with the view applying a remedy to this state of thin^^J

that the "- »ill was drafted. Mosi; of the _^lan^ in the "North Island — two-thirds of it, i' a might Bay- -was still in the hands of native owners, und the sooner it passed into the hands of Europeans — reserving amply for the natives — the better it would be for themselves and for the colony at

large. The instructions the late Govern- .. ment gave to the Attorney-General were to make the bill as simple as possible, the principal object being to individualise titles, so that each individual might be be able to subdivide his piece. That carried with it a refutation of the charge that the bill was intended for the benefit of the speculator because he would have to deal with each individual owner. The course the late Government pursued with respect to that bill was to circulate it before the session. At first it was well received, particularly among the natives. ' Then the cry was raised by the Opposition about the speculator. He did not quarrel with them for it, but he still thought that with some modifications the bill could have been made to answer very well. Some modifications were, in fact, proposed. One was by Captain Morris. He thought that the natives could individualise their. titles better for themselves, and a large number in the House went with him. Another suggestion was made by Mr Bryce ; it was that the native title should pass through the Land Court, and that then the native should have nothing to do with the land, but that it should goto the Waste Lands Board to be sold. That, it was thought, would get rid of the - speculator. Major Atkinson was much taken up with the plan, and so would any one, had it been feasible. But the question, was whether it was feasible. Several j persons were asked whether it was, and among them Tawiti was asked. He said it was not feasible, as ■ the natives would insist on their right j to sell their land themselves. Major Atkinson then said that the bill would be \ withdrawn, and during the recess the opinion of the tribes would be taken on the matter. The Government had been ; accused of withdrawing a bill upon which -.-' .they should have stood or fallen. He ■ .considered that they would not have been justified in making a party question of a bill that, it was not saying too much, might have jeopardised their peaceful relations with the natives. If he were a

member of a Government and the same --'were again to occur he would take the same course. (Applause.). The next was , the Waste Lands Bill. This was a

measure of great importance to all. Mr *" Donald Reid had charge of it. Mr " Donald Reid was what might be called a representative of the small-farm interest. ,If anyone in the House were asked who .', represented that interest, they would say Mr Donald Reid. Mr Reid was a small farmer himself, and had battled strongly for that interest. Had he (Mr Reid) remained what he had been [an Opposi- ; tionist] he would have been deemed everything that could be desired by the Opposition, but of course the case was very different when he joined the Government. The bill was a very popular one in Otago as the small fanners in that province had great advantages under it. The Government thought at first of having a general Land Bill for the whole colony, but they found that this was impracticable. Canterbury had the system of free selec--1 , tion, and they were proud of it. Otago was different. There the land was thrown open as it was thought to be required. It would have been a cruel act to alter the system in either of those districts. The Government therefore devoted themselves to consolidating the existing laws on the subject, leaving the regulations much as they were. The system of deferred payment, however, was now extended throughout the colony. One feature of the bill that had been

made much of was the Canterbury leases.

He had not the time to go into the whole of those leases, nor did he think it was a matter in which the meeting ' would take much interest. He might, however, say that it was an entirely mis- '■■ taken idea, as had been promulgated by Sir George Grey, that the bill vested in the Canterbury leaseholders their runs for a term of years. What it did was to give the leaseholders the occupation of their runs until the land was required for settlement. The question before the House was, whether the holders of the licenses should be allowed to take them up at a valuation, or whether they should go to auction. The whole of the Canterbury members were in favor of valuation, because they thought that auction would favor the speculator. He found such men as Mr Rolleston and Mr Stevens, who had no interest in runs, in favor of valuation. Both these men had been questioned upon the subject by their constituents, and moreover, they knew all the circumstances, and he thought that if they desired that system it could not be wrong. The rent was fixed at from 9d to 2s per sheep. Sir George Grey had made a reference to the subject as showing that the late Government were favoring the runholders, but it really was only a question as to rental. To talk of that feature of the bill as anything at all equal in importance to the deferred payment system, which it introduced for the whole colony, was merely misleading the public. The bill had for its object the settlement of the people on the lands ot the colony, but though that was its object when the late Government went out of office, there was some hesitation on the part of the Government of Sir George Grey to go on with it. But they were forced to take it up. Those members who represented Otago insisted that the bill should be gone on with, and it was carried through. Parliament separated, and a very curious circumstance occurred. It was the practice to send up the bills for the Governor's assent before Parliament rising, to afford

an opportunity of seeing that the - i measures passed were assented to. Sir George Grey sent up a schedule of the bills that had been passed, and most Governors would have signed without question. But Lord Normanby had had some experience of Sir George Grey, and he went through the bills. Then he found that the Waste Lands Bill was omitted, and it came out that it had been intentionally omitted. It was an entirely unconstitutional course for one man thus to set himself up against the deliberately expressed will of the whole Parliament. One of the first things when the House met would be to have the matter thoroughly sifted, and, if Sir George Grey had done that thing, to take care that he should not do it again. (Applause.) The Governor would not sign. It was represented to him that the matter was urgent, but the Governor had his duty in view, and he still refused. It was said that the Governor threatened to have Parliament called together and to place the matter before the House, and then Sir George Grey had to knuckle down. Throughout New Zealand the matter had been commented upon by the Press,and in anything but favorable terms to Sir George Grey. He would read to them what a Wellington paper said on the subject. He did not know whether it was the Post or the Argus, but both of them supported the present Government, and yet "they would; find that the comments, were very severe. [Mr Ormond then read an article which had appeared in the Post on the matter referred to.] In his (Mr Ormond's) opinion such a thing as setting aside the deliberate act of the Assembly, as had been done in that matter by Sir George Grey, should never be tolerated, and he, for one, would not tolerate it. (Applause,) Sir George

Grey's Government introduced the Waste Lands Sales Bill, which in a mea-~*--sure nullified the benefits conferred by the Waste Lancia Bill. He had no idea why it was introduced. It was said that it could not make much difference as it would be repealed next session. It altered the Waste Lands Bill which had left the price of land much as it was, — a price, which he might say, was high enough — and raised it to £2 an acre for free selection, and £1 an acre for auction.

The effect would be that no land at all would be sold until Parliament met again, He did not know why the bill was passed. The only explanation h " had heard about it was that some membnre whose votes were necessary to Sir George Grey's Government desired that the land in the Worth should be put on the same footing as in the South. He could only say that it was a cruel wrong to the North. Anyone that went into Canterbury and saw the land there that was open for sale afc £2 an acre, and compared it with the land in the North, would see that there was a vast difference in value between the two, and that it was ridiculous to fix an uniform price for them. In Auckland there was some land that would be dear at a gift. He would like to have defended himself from some anonymous attacks that had been made upon him in the local pi'ess, and if he had time he would do so, otherwise he would have to defer it until the next evening when he would meet his constituents at Olive. But he wished first to say something about the incidence of taxation. The question was raised first by Mr Woolcock, a very earnest, good man. He raised it in good faith — he was one of the supporters of the late Government — on the ground that the present system of taxation was unfair to the laboring classes in the colony, and particularly to those he represented — the mining class. It was met by Major Atkinson by stating that the matter had occupied the attention of the Government, but that in the seven months that had intervened since the previous session there had not been time to prepare a measure pn the subject, but the Governi ment would introduce one next session. The fact was that the late Government had given the subject their attention dur-' ing the recess, but they found it. to be so big a question that rather than meet it in a" half sort of way they considered it should not be dealt with until the following session. Major Atkinson pledged himself that a measure should be brought in, admitting at the same time that property ought to bear a larger share of taxation than it did at the present time, but he deprecated hasty action in dealing with so large a question. Sir George Grey said that Major Atkinson was insincere in his promise, and that if he had to deal with the matter he would go in another room and in half an hour he would draw out a scheme of taxation that would meet what was desired. Of course everyone could see that such an assertion was thoroughly senseless and utterly insincere, and when Sir George Grey got into office he was asked why he did not then do what he had said could have been so quickly arranged. Well, it was one of Sir George Grey's promises, and >hey would find that others that he had been making would be as insincere as his boast of what he would do in half-an-hour. He would now try to put before the meeting his views respecting taxation. Th* Customs revenue was about £1,230,000. Half was contributed by the duties upon wines, spirits, bottled beer, &c. Then, among the other items, there were the duties upon tea and sugar, the one about £72,000 and the other about £126,000. Those were two of the items which were said to press very heavily upon the laboring classes. Then there was about £400,000 upon clothing, &c. There were besides some items, such as bags, expensive drapery, &c, which did not affect the laboring classes. With regard to tea and sugar, it must be borne in mind that the native people, who numbered about 40,000, contributed largely to the revenue by their consumption of those articles, and as they did not pay taxes that was the only way of reaching them, except by their consumption of spirits and clothing, for which they also contributed to the revenue. With regard to clothing there was another matter to be considered. He had been spoken to by persons in the Middle Island respecting the interests that would be affected by the removal of the duties on clothing. He would not for a moment advocate protection, which he considered one of the greatest curses with which a country could be afflicted. What was said by those persons was this — " You will annihilate those interests. They are only barely existing now, and if you remove the duties on clothing they will entirely fall to the ground." The matter required careful thought. He noticed that Mr Rolleston, in his speech to his constituents, said the same. The question should be looked into very carefully, and care must be taken that they did not press unduly on any interest which they desired to foster. The question after all was, what were the requirements of the country 1 The land fund he saw was falling off, and it was impossible to say whether they would not come out with a deficiency. If so, it would be a matter for grave consideration how far it would be possible to sacrifice any part of the Customs revenue. If they could ease those articles that were most in use it would be desirable to do so, but that was a small matter. The fact was that they would have to see their way to raise a large revenue. They were borrowing 2J millions, and that meant more interest to be paid, and if more railways were con str acted there would be more borrowing and more interest to be paid. He ad mitted that property was not bearing its fair share of taxation in New Zealand(Applause.) But that was a question which depended much upon the use of capital. Last session when he was in Wellington he happened to see the cor respond ence of an agent of some capitalists at home who had some half-million of money invested in the colony. Their money was invested in Canterbury, none at more than 7 per cent , and some at 6 per cent. Out of that there were the expenses and other incidentals to b< deducted. The letters said that the capitalists saw that it was intended to impose taxation on the property of per eons who were out of New Zealand. If so it would not be worth their while to continue to invest their money in the colony, and they would have to withdraw their capital. There were many such cases, and it was a question for consideration, whether — although they desired to get absentees to contribute a fair share to the revenue — if in doing so they would, not be driving away what was necessary for the advancement of the colony. It seemed to him that it would be necessary to increase the taxation of the country, and that taxation must take the direction of property and income. (Applause.) But they must take care so to proportion it that they did not drive away the capital they would want to make use of. With that reservation he was certain that those owning property in New Zealand would be quite willing to contribute their fair share to the revenue. If the public works were continued, and the trunk lines of railway were carried through, they would be sure to need more money. Now, as he had said, they were paying a million a year for interest, and before those trunk lines were finished they would certainly have to pay another half million a year for interest. That meant a great increase in taxation. A great amount was paid in subsidies to local bodies. Those subsidies were all paid out of revenue, and it was worth considering whether it would not be better to give up those subsidies and throw upon the different districts the absolute providing for everything, instead of taking it out of the general revenue. He did not say that that was his own view, but it was worth considering. He now wished to refer to the main points in. the platform of the present Government. Those were manhood suffrage, representation according to numbers, and equal voting for taxation. With regard to manhood suffrage, he took it that in New Zealand they h^d as nearly as possible what might be understood by that term Every man who owned or leased land had a vote; every householder, every lodger, and every miner also had a vote. Any man who had been in -N"ew Zealand a year could

secure a vote un "".er those different qunlifications. Manhood suffrage, with<u.t resfcp tion in the term, meant that every man, wherever he wenf , could give his vote. That he did nut think was desirable. The late Government had gone into the matter, and they thought that a certain amount of residence was necessary as a qualification — that they should take away all those qualifications he had mentioned, and provide, instead, a residence qualification of a year. Of course they would have to register. That, he thought, would be infinitely safer than the manhood suffrage of Sir George Grey. The next point was representation according to numbers. That he considered was a system that was altogether wrong. Let them take England as an illustration, and see what representation according to numbers would do there. Why, the large towns, such as London and Liverpool, would rule the whole country. In New Zealand they had 88 members in the House of Representatives, and, if they had representation according to numbers, Dunedin and Auckland, with their suburbs, would command one-fourth of the representation. At present those places had eight members ; they would then have twenty-two. He did not say that the representation did not require revision, but representation according to numbers was not what was required. If it were carried out the district of Hawke's Bay would lose a large proportion of its representation. He did not think they would like that the country should be subordinated and handed over to the towns. That was what he, as their representative, would never agree to. (Applause.) Fair revision of the representation he would agree to, but not according to numbers. The next point was equal voting for taxation. By that was meant equal voting in matters of local taxation. At present the voting was regulated by the amount of the ratable value of the property of the individual. Sir George Grey held that in that all men should be equal — that the man who arrived in the colony that day, and paid no rates, should be equal in the power of voting to impose rates as the man who paid largely. He could see no fairness in that proposal. (Great applause.) He was glad to see that the meeting held the same opinions in that matter as himself. Those were the points in the platform of the present Government, and, if carried out, it would come to a fight between the large centres and the small places. Practically, if Sir George Grey was enabled to influence the large centres, he would command the Parliament of the country, and they would revert to an infinitely worse system of centralisation than that from which they had recently been relieved. (Hear, hear.) He did not believe that it would become law, for the simple reason that it was contrary to reason and common sense. They had been told that shortly after Parliament met again there would be a dissolution. Very likely there would be. The party to which he belonged had a majority at their back, but they saw that Sir George Grey was sowing promises broadcast, and they thought it would be better to let the people see what sincerity there was in these promises. Although when Parliament rose Sir George Grey had a large following throughout tbe country, there had been a great revulsion of feeling. Letters he had received from the South spoke of tbe wonderful change there. In Otago the Proudfoot case had created a great stir. A drunken ruffian had violated a girl. He was the brother of a rich contractor and very powerful man in the constituency. The fellow was tried by a jury, but they could not agree. The girl was got out of the couutry, and it was said that a very large sum bad been paid to her parents. If the giil was got out of the country it was the duty of the Government to endeavor to have her brought back again. But the Government had ordered the prosecution to cease, and there was great excitement in Otago because of that interference with the course of justice That wa9 the first time in the history of the colony that the Government had interfered with the course of justice, and if the people allowed it to be tampered with there would be an end of justice in New Zealand. They might depeud upon it that the matter would be thoroughly enquired into. If there was one thing more than another which they shnuld jealously guard, it was the purity of justice. Another indication of change had reference to Mr Reynolds. They had seen, no doubt, that he had declared his intention of resigning his seat in the House of Representatives, and that he was to be called to the Upper House. Advices rthich he (Mr Orrnoud) had received from Otago stated that if Mr Rtynolds did resign he would be succeeded in the representation of Port Chalmers by one who was opposed to Sir George Grey's Government. At all events, though Mr Reynolds talked of resigning he had not not done so, and that was very signicant. In Wellington there were chances of there being two elections shortly, and in that case both seats would be filled by opponents of the Government. They would admit, he thought, that the Opposition had taken a wise course in leaving Sir George G-rey in office, so that the people might see what his promises might come to. Sir George Grey, he might tell them, never made direct charges. He was always very general. But the chirge he (MrOrmond) had now made of tampering with justice was a direct charge. Theie was another mattor which he might mention. A bill had beeji passed by the Legislature which provided for the puaty >>f members. It was entitled the Disqualification Bill. By some means a clause was got into it which enabled those who had held provincial positions to accept places of emolument, though other members could not. Last session there arose special reasons why that should not be eliminated. There were certain persons who would have voted with the late Government had that Government been willing to reward them as tbey wished, but, not being willing, those persons went over to the other si<ie. The bill eliminating the clause was passed in the House of Representatives, and went to the Upper li"Use. And what came oi it there 1 ? The bll went down and down, until it got to the bottom of tbe order paptr. The Government had the power to regulate the order paper, and they regulated it so that it became apparent they intended to burk the bill. A member of the Upper House was spoken to on the subject, and he tried to put the bill higher up on the order paper, but the Speaker ruled that unless the Government consented it could not be done. Well, the bill was burked, and it would be seen next session whether the rewards of which be had spoken had been given. There might be some other matters than h'j would like to talk about, but be had occupied so much time already that he would now bring bis remarks to a conclusion. He would ask the meeting whether he had not shown that the Government to which be had belonged had done all they could for the interests of the people of Now Zealand, and whether they were not indebted to that Government for the large measure ol local government which they possessed. (Applause.) He thanked thi-m lor the patient hearing they bad given him, and would assure them that they mi^ht rely that so long as he continued to be their representative he would continue to do his duty to the constituency as he done in the past. (Mr Ormoud resumed his seat amid great and general applause.)

Mr Phillips asked what had been done with the petition for dividing 1 the county.

Mr Ormond said thai the petition came with others of a like nature, and he as representing their interests, tried lo fur ward it as much as he cou d ; hut the Government were averse to splitting up any counties until the Countj Act Amendment Bill was passed. That bill never

cat' ; furward, and therefore t]:-3 subject of the petition waß not dealt witt . Mr Phillips asked if it would be D p ces n iry to send up anoiher petition. ?,;> Ormond said that he took it that it would be better.

Mr Phillips asked if Mr Ormond did not think that the county was too large.

Mr Ormond said that his opinion was that they would eventually come to an amalgamation of road boards, and, if so, the districts would become smaller. At present there was a waste of power. Ke thought they would ultimately get to a system of ridings instead of road boards as the governing bodies. . Mr M'G-reevy asked if Mr Ormond would explain about the Ppurerere estate. Mr Ormond said he had intended to have gone fully into the question, but the time was now so late that he would have to defer that matter until his next meeting. He might, however, tell them that originally the estate consisted of 53,000 acres, and was one of the early runs taken up in the district. The purchasing was ia the first instance dono under the system of spotting, under which 30,000 acres were spotted. Reference to tbe map showed that all the frontage, the flat land, the ranges, and nearly all the water had been thus monopolised. That was the position of the matter when Mr Nairn put in his application to purchase the land. The only power he Ormond) had was to withdraw the land from sale, if he thought it fit for agricultural purposes. He had gone over it, and he ascertained, and he said now that the land was wholly unfit to settle people upon as small settlers. The cost of getting, roads into it would have been more than they could have got out of the land. He would say again that ifc was not. fit for the purpose? mentioned, and it was entire! v misleading the public to say that it was fit for settlement. (Hear, hear-) It had been said that £1 an acre had been offered for it. He believed that was a misstatement — that it was entirely untrue. The offer could not have been made. Mr Nairn made an offer to purchase the land at 10s an acre, and the Commissioner came to him (Mr Ormond.) and asked what he should do. '1 hat was not his (Mr Ormond's) business. As he had said, all he could do was to withdraw the land from sale. He got all the members of the Provincial Council who were in town to meet him, and the advice they gave him was that it would be improper to accept the offer made or to withdraw the land from sale. They had the impression that there would be competion at auction for the land. In fact that was his feeling too. The land was accordingly put up for sale at auction.

Mr Phillips asked if Mr Carlile, the member for Mohaka, was one of those who were consulted.

Mr Ormond did not know ; he could not say.

Mr Harwood said that Mr Mackersey had told him that he had not made any offer of £1 an acre for the land.

Mr Phillips moved a vote of confidence in Mr Ormond.

The motion was seconded by Mr M'Greevy arid carried unanimously, amid very general applause.

Mr Ormond expressed his very sincere thanks. To one who bad been assailed as he had been, it was very pleasing to come back to the centre of the district he represented and receive so warm an expression of their approval. He would assure them that be would always do his best, not only for that district, but for the whole of New Zealand.

A vote of thanks to the chairman terminated the proceedings. AT CLIVE.

On Saturday eeeniug Mr Ormond addressed a meeting of his constituents in the school-room at West Clivt. The meeting was very well attended, and Mr Ormond was listened to throughout his address with marked attention.

Mr John Bennett was voted to the chair.

Mr Ormond spoke on the same subjects lie had touched upon at the Waipawa meeting, without, however, entering upon them at such great length, remark, ing that it was unnecessary to do so, as he had been well reported in the evening paper, and which they no doubt had read. When speaking on the Waste Lands Bill, he took occasion to refer to his administration of the waste lands of Hawke's Bay, but want of space precludes our giving his remarks in full. He said that he had been subjected to attacks in a portion of the local Press which were very unfair, and which he would show the meeting were incorrect. He was prepared to prove that no blame attached to him, and that the attacks made upon him were entirely undeserved and ■without foundation. Ho had been charged that it was his fault that Crown lands in the district which were fitted for settlement had been allowed to pass into the hands of big owners, and that he was responsible for it. He would have, he went on to say, to go back to a far date beyond separation. They would recollect that separation was mainly pressed for because the money derived from the waste lands in the district was spent in Wellington. Prior to separation there had been 105,400 acres sold. That was the pick of the land then in the hands of the Government. He was a very young man then, hard at work at Wallingford, and took no part in public affairs. Mr Fitzgerald was Superintendent after sepat on, and he did as much as was in his power to get peeple settled upon the land. He was sorry to say that that was a time when there was not much desire to settle upon the land, and it drifted into the hands of one or two. After some further remarks, Mr Ormond referred to Mr Tollemache, to the assistance he gave to persons needing it, and to much of the land passing away in that way out of the hands of the Government. He then r.eferred to the action he had taken in 1860 in the matter in question. He was then a young man with very little experience, but he saw what he considered a bad state of things. He did not foresee the rise in the value of land in the district that afterwards took place, but he saw that a certain class were forced to buy it or clear out. It was like a millstone round their necks. There was then much land that could have been saved, and he moved the Council that the system prevailing was not a desirable one. [Mr Ormoud read from a blue book, containing the proceedings of the Provincial Council, to show the course he had taken.] He moved for a committee, and that committee recommended that the pastoral lands should be leased, and that the rents which were nominal should be increased, and that agricultural lands should be sold to those that required them. There was no deferred payment system then ; Parliament would not have heard of it. But the Provincial Council decided to purchase 50,000 acres and to sell the land on deferred payments by way of experiment. Tbe blue book would show that he look steps to preserve the public estate, and if it had been followed up it. might h*ve been accomplished. Nothing was, however, done. Mr Fitzgerald was at the time their representative in the House. The Crown land sales were proceeded with, and he would tell them how the thing went. They must bear in mind that this was all done by Mr Fitzgerald before 1861, and Mr Fitzgerald was certainly very earnest in his desire to promote settlement. The first return he held in his hand showed that of land surveyed into sections for auction to the end of 1861, at Hampden and Toko-Kino 10,500 acres, most of the open land passed into the hands of one owner ; Porangahau, Blackhead, and Wallingford, 10,400 acres, a few settlers; Kereru and i\orangi, 800 and 1600 acres, two owners ; South Clive, 4100 acres, settled ; Havelock, 3500 acres, settled ; Meanee, 4200 acres, nettled ; Petane, 2500 acres, settled ;

O-:awa, 3500 acres, ono owner ; Pokiaka, 3100 acres, two or three aettlers ; Pohni, 5000 acres, very few settlers. ■ The next rcJ-ivn was of UiA surveyed since 1861, and laid out in sections for sale. Some of it was sold in the time of the late Sir Donald McLean, and some while he (Mr Ormond) was Superintendent. Wairoa district, OMnepaka-Waihua (1867), 10,000 acres, nearly all one owner ; Nuhaka and Mahia (1867), 2600 acres, nearly all one owner; Wangawhei, (1869), 1000 acres, nearly all one owner; Pnkahu (1869), 1000 acres, settled; West, Clive and Hikutoto (1870), 900 acres, settted ; Papakura, (1870), 3500 acres in a few hands; Danevirk, (1874), 1200 acres, settled; Woodville, (1874), 9000 acres, settled ; Whakoruatapu, 600 acres, settled } Mahia, (1875-6) 11,000 acres, nearly all one owner; Puketitiri, (1875-6) 9000 acres, nearly all one owner. That made 1 up 51,800 acres since 1862. He took office in 1869, and that was when his responsibility commenced, and he would read them a statement of the dates when a number of the blocks were sold. Ituatasiwha, mostly sold by the end of 1861, on the Ist of January, 1869, 1150 acres remained unsold; Captain Newmans land, mostly sold in 1862, none lef ein 1.869 ; Henry Russell's, the same ; Purvis, the same 3 Abbotsford. G-uavas, Stokes, the same j H. P. Smith's, bulk sold in 1863, only 2600 acres left in 1869; Tamumu, all sold prior to 1869 ; Hunter's run, nothing left in 1869 ; Mangakuri, nothing left in 1869 ; Oero district, bulk sold prior to 1869, 15,000 acres left in 1869 ; Maraekakaho, bulk sold, 15,000 acres left in 1869. And so with the other runs. Reference to the map showed that all were spotted over and over again. The unpurchased land was in isolated blocks, mostly without wood, and generally without water. That was the position of the Crown lands, and it showed that the blame did not reat on his shoulders. There was the Pourerere block, which he would specially refer to because his conduct with regard to it had been assailed, and, as he thought, very unfairly. The land was sold at 5s an acre, aud it was said that he ought to have stopped the sale, so that the land mighr be used for small farm settlements. [Mr Ormond then made a similar statement to the one he made at Waipawa.] He would say that the statement made about it in the local press wa9 grossly exaggerated, and that the land was perfectly unfit for settlement. Mr Nairn applied that the land should be put up to auction at 5s an acre. Before it was put up, Mr Nairn went to the Commissioner and asked whether he could not buy it at 10s an acre as agricultural land, believing that it would be better to do so than to let it go to auction. Mr Scaly came to him (Mr Ormond) to ask what he should do, but his power did not lie in that action. [Mr (Jrmond then related what he did — iv consulting members of the Provincial Council — as already reported.] His (Mr Ormond's) opinion, was that there were a good many persons who would bid for the land, and evidently Mr Nairn thought so too. Ultimately the land went to auction ; there was very little opposition, and Mr Nairn got the bulk of the land at the upset price of 5s an acre. Another statement that had been made in the newspaper was that an offer of £1 an acre had been made for the land. Until the previous day he had not been in a position to give the statement a denial, although it carried with it its own refutation, and was perfectly preposterous ; but at the Waipawameeting on the previous evening, Mr Harwood stated that he had been told by Mr Mackersey that he had never made such an offer. He could only say that a public journal should be careful to ascertain the facts correctly before it advanced a statement of the kind. [Mr Ormond then proceeded to speak upon the incidence of taxation and other matters to which he had referred at his Waipawa meeting. He concluded by thanking the meeting for their patience, and expressing a hope that they would continue to repose their confidence in him.] Mr Tucker wished to know something about the Taupo afiair, and about the difference that had arisen between Mr Ormond and Sir George Grey. Mr Orraond said that he had made charges against Sir George Grey which in some respects he afterwards found were incorrectly founded, and those he took tbe first opportunity of retracting. The charges were of a twofold nature. Sir George Grey had said that it was inconsistent with the position of a public man to take up large properties,, and that it was against the public interest to do so. He (Mr Ormond) had shown that Sir George Grey had bsen the person to induce others to take up large properties in the way mentioned. That was the part h.e did not retract. The other part was that Sir George Grey had used his power as a Governor to enter into partnership in the transaction. That part he did retract. Mr J. B. HolJis moved, "That tbe meeting thanks Mr Ormond for his address, also for his valuable services during the many years he has represented Clive, and assures him that he enjoys the confidence of the electors." The motion was seconded by Mr Chambers and carried unanimously. Mr Ormond expressed his thanks, and the meeting terminated with the usual complimentary vote to the chairman.