PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

Grey River Argus, Volume XV, Issue 1831, 18 June 1874, Page 2

PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

Tuesday, June 16. the want of confidence motion, [from the hokitika papers.] Mr Woolcock moved— " That in consideration of the unsatisfactory anuwer given lasb night by the Provincial Secretary and Treasurer to the questions put to the Government, this Council begs (o state it has no confidence in the present Executive Council of this Province." He said that he had been induced to move the motion standing in his name from the very unsatisfactory answers given to his questions as to whether the Secretary and Treasurer intended to resign his seat in the House of .Representatives. He asked a plain question to which as plain an answer was given in the negative. That being the case, he considered it incompatible with the necessary and due performance of that gentleman's duties, that the Executive could retain the confidence of the Council, and he therefore considered that the Council had no confidence in the present Administration. The Provincial Secretary said that from the gravity of the motion tabled by the mover last night, he did expect that some substantial reason would have beenassigned for the course he had thought fit to pursue, but, instead of that he (Mr White) had been placed in the position that he had no charge to answer. What the hon gentleman had stated was that his (Mr White's) answer was unsatisfactory but straightforward, although he had seen it stated in a scurrilous print daily circulated that the position he had assumed in answering the hon. member's (Mr Woolcock's) question was defiant, while he had only given a firm negative to the question asked. The question was simply, — Are you prepared to resign 1 and the answer was as simply given — No. He would give his reasons why he 1 would not do so. It was to the advantage of the Province that the Government should be represented in the House of Representatives, and he believed that there were only one cr two Provinces who were not so represented. It was his earnest desire to see the Executive a success, and he felt certain hon. members would admit he had not thrust himself forward in this instance, but had shown every willingness to fall into his place as circumstances might fall out. He was not like some young members, who wished to find themselves at the top of the ladder at once, •without having previously prepared themselves for the position by necessary work. It was because he wished success to the Executive that he had given himself up tb the cares and anxiety of the position he now held, and not from any particular ambition. Every Provincial Government was represented in the House except this, or at least all except two, but all were represented by their Provincial Secretaries, and it was considered to be an advantage that it should be so. He did not wish to occupy his seat in the Government one half hour longer than possessing the confidence of the Council. It had been said that his continuing to hold his seat in the House of Representatives would be against the proper performance of his Executive duties, but he would deny that. The duties of the Government could be efficiently performed notwithstanding his absence. There were one or two others forming the Government besides him, and; during his absence there would be at all times two members here responsible to the Council, and always one member of' the Executive in Hokitika. If :it was' found advantageous elsewhere to have one member of the Government in Parlia--ment why should it not be so here. He had come prepared to meet every argument, and to prove that it was a positive' gain, but until contrary arguments were' produced it would not be necessary for; him to go into them. It was one ofj the arguments for the Executive that when the Superintendent went to Wellington the whole Government went,! but now when the Secretary went therej were still two members of the Govern-' ment left behind, and the question 1 then could only be were they worthy of: the confidence of that Council ? He had 1 frequently had larger interests on his own hands than the whole revenue of the Province, and had not failed in protecting those interests. If the aliairs of the Province were not carried out properly, then and not till then, could they complain ; but it was unfair to do so un'jil they had given them a trial. There- were one or two in that Council who were determined by any means to bring about a statu quo state of affairs, and who had from the beginning fought against the Executive system, and had not been content tb knuckle-down on their defeat. There were one or two young members who seemed to think that they ought to be on the Ministerial benches, and there were others outside whose interests were not served by the Executive being in existence, and among them there was none more active than the hon. member for Hokitika, his colleague, Mr Tabart. He remembered well, at a public meeting, when that gentleman was seeking the 1 suffrages of the electors, that he had stated his opinion in favor of an Executive and that not an ordinary one, but to consist of at least four or five persons. He also remembered that in his address at that meeting he had told the electors that although he was an auctioneer he would not sell his constituents. He would inform that hon. gentleman (Mr Tabart) that he had sold them in fighting against the Executive, just as he would so many fat cattle. The organ of which he was the head, was doing all it could to upset the present Government. He was perfectly prepared to resign, but he did not wish to sacrifice his colleagues in office, and at all hazards was determined to uphold an Executive form of Government. It was argued by that print to which he had referred, although it did not so much matter, as it was' probably not read outside this, that there was no chance of a loan, because it knew that several members had argued that there should be an Executive on the strength of getting the lean. He could count on the fingers of his hand, if they were all shot off but two, who were the parties attempting to get all the power into their own hands, and they might have temporary success, but he believed the British public would not submit to such a state of things. It would not hurt his feelings if he were deposed, and he felt no doubt that it would gratify the feelings of some who were anxiously looking forward to the time when he should be starved out of the place. He believed that when there were so many members young to public

life, many of them thought that the Executive would be mere clerks, to keep thu departments in order, but he would tell them the Executive had far higher functions, as it was their duty to frame and carry out the policy of the Government ; such a ihing as Provincial statesmanship was above the comprehension of his hon. colleague, the member for flokitika (Mr Tabart). In the West Coast Times of that day it was stated that the Nelson Provincial Secretary was" travelling round, and he (Mr White) would also travel around if he kept his seat, as it would be his duty to make himself acquainted with the wants of the Province, and also to do his best to remedy these wants. 'This opposition he believed sprab'g from one or two implacable enemies of his. He did not say that Mr Woolcbck had not moved the motion conscientiously, but there were one or two lending themselves to a thing they might probably yet regret. It appeared to him that his enemies were springing up everywhere. It was only the other day the Evening Star had asserted, on the question of Mr Guinness assuming the Treasurership, that the Secretary could not transfer his power; in answer to that he would point out how often in the General Government Gazette did they find that Mr John Brown or Mr Tom Somebody-else signed in the absence of the Executive officer. Had time been afforded him to have visited his constituents in the various centres, he would have been quite willing to have resigned his seat in the House, but he could not do so now without sacrificing the interests of hi 3 constituents. Somehow, members of that House seemed to think it was a pleasure going to Wellington, but he had found it otherwise, and the fact had been that his attendance there in the interest of his constituents had shut him out from more lucrative positions. thau he held at present ; but he had always had regard to his responsibility, and could allow no man to say he had abused his trust. He had intended to have made some brief statement in regard to the Provincial Auditor's report, but, if the vote went adversely, it would not.be necessary for him to speak on that subject, as in that case he would leave it to his successor. That report said a great deal, but he would state that there were not grounds to warrant any extent of uneasiness on that score. It was well known to the people of Westland that he had. long served their interests without fee or benefit, and in doing so had ihyariably sunk his personal interests. He would ask if the fact of having qualified himself for the work by five or six years' Parliamentary labor was to be brought against him as against his holding an office of emolument. If that argument was to be, and some person unused to public life was to step in, he could not see the justice of it. If, however, it was on account of his going to Wellington,, he thought the question should be somwhat modified. When a few days before this the same matter had cropped up, he had told his colleagues that the Solicitor would have to take the Secretary's portfolio, or he would be compelled to leave the Government. If there was no Executive, and his Honor had gone to Wellington, who would then be left behind; or there might be one who was not responsible. Now they had three members who were responsible, and two of thp.se would always be in Westland, and one always in Hokitika to do the business of the Council. If they desired to bring the Province into' contempt by the course they were pursuing, they would perhaps do bo. If : they, desired to be a Provincial success, these motions of want of confidence were bound 1 to frustrate their desire. The ■: mover had been very brief, but probably he had reserved to himself the opportunity of reply, but he (Mr White) certainly thought he ought to have given' fuller reasons!' If he (Mr White) had had an opportunity of speaking to any arguments adduced '< against it, he could have given a reply to such arguments — but it was not to be ex-, pected that he was to find ah argument. ; No Government had ever been so harrassed as that Government had beeti since they had taken office in the middle of the session. First, there was a want of confidence motion tabled ; but the mover thought fit to abandon it. Since then, there had been rumors of conspiracies, ■ undercurrents, and plots for their deposition/ and rather th,an that sort of thing should be, he would be deposed that night. He would rather they would settle their animus on 1 him, and not sacrifice his colleagues, than whom better men were not in that Council. Mr Tabart had not intended to take part in this debate, but after the remarks of the last speaker in allusion to him personally, he owed it to himself to do so. He candidly avowed that since the elections for the Council he had changed his opinions on the subject of the necessity for an Executive. He was sorry that the hon. Provincial Secretary had not to go before his constituents upon taking office, as was the practice in other colonies, as he was sure in that else he would not be again placed in the same position. Reference had been made to other Provinces, but what did we find there? That although their Provincial Secretaries might hold seats in the Assembly, all the Provincial offices were not held by one person. One reason given for the. appointment of an Executive had been the reported inefficiency of the former Secretary and Treasurer, and that his Honor had shrunk from doing the dirty work of changing them ; but, up to the present time, the Executive which had been appointed .had made no change in this respect. Westland was in quite an exceptional position as to the desirability of members of the Executive holding seats in the House of Representatives, and it was not proper that Mr White should expect his inexperienced colleagues to take charge of his departments during his absence at the session of the Assembly. Mr Todd, although in favor of an Executive, would object, to the offices of Provincial Secretary and Treasurer being in one, but was in favor of the Secretary having a seat in the House of Representatives, but not the Treasurer. He had a decided objection to the offices being in one, and would hold that there should be a responsible, member of the Government in the' Treasurer's office. There was a large amount of work to be done, and, judging, from the Provincial Auditor's report, there would be additional. wprk set out, "and the back work wquld require prompt attention. ■ The Provincial Seoretary said that he would resign the Trea'surMhipand hand

over the portfolio to the Provincial Solicitor. Mr Todd regretted that that answer had not been given last night ; but, instead of that, there had been emphatic denial to resign. The Provincial Secretary said the question then asked was simply would he resign his seat in the House of Representatives. ' ■;'.;.-■ : "./ Mr Todd did not think the handing over of one of the offices to the Provincial Solicitor would. mend the affair. He considered that in order to keep up the work an additional head would be required in these departments. Mr Seddon condemned the speech of the Provincial Secretary as one in keeping with every speech that gentleman was in the habit of making, which if deprived of its personalities had nothing left worthy of note. He spoke at some length on the circumstance of nothing having been done in respect, to the department^ and condemned the argument as fallacious that Mr White would have any more weight in the General Assembly by being Provincial Secretary and Treasurer. He, entered fully on the Public: Works. Policy as brought down, the Toll-gate Ordinance which had been promised by the Superintendent, and since neglected, also as to the withholding from the Council what salaries were to be proposed to be paid the Executive. He could compare the Provincial Secretary .to Robinson {Crusoe, whose words he aspired to make' use of, that he was monarch of all lie surveyed. He (the Provincial Secretary) was not likely to achieve that position, however, as he was blinded with an amount of egotism which would ever act as a deterrent. He thought it would be a charity of the Council to pass the resolution, and he be r lieved it would meet with the approbation of the Press; and the' majority of the public. Mr Cumirig opposed the mdtibbV Mr Robinson.was sorry to support the motion, and would rather 1 have neard an affirmative- answer from Mr'WMte in reply to Mr Woolcock V queries oa the previous day. When he supported the Executive, /he only supported a working one. He showed that the administration of the Education Bill; the Treasury Department, ; Road; Bpards, ; jtpllrgatea de s manded all the attention that the Provincil authorities could pay to: them/ and it was clear that ithe Provincial Secretary could not go away on a' tour for his health even. He , should. .su£fiL. . the motion before the Council, 1 - "'•'' y Mr Wicl?es had. f-bg6n_a slaunoh sup» porter of the ExeQuiiyjetjHe was no officeseeker, but would support Mr Woolcock, though he did" hot tiW office. He referred then to the disorganisation visible in many quarters. : ; ;L The Provincial Solicitor/took exception to some of the attacks made' on* the Government, as did also Mr Houlahan, Mr Dungan 1 expressed his indifference as to how the vote went, and gave in the course of his' remarks some hard hits at the member for Arahura, Mr Seddon, which elicited loud applause; .; The Provincial Solicitor replied at some length, and in reply to the taunt tHat lawyers were not good administrators, read out a long list of barristers and j udges who had taken leading parts in administration. •■:'••■ - 4 " Mr Woolcock replied/after, which the vote was t^keh 1 with 'the fo.llbwin ! c result, which is in fact a defeat of the iJdvernment: — . Ay.es— B,*C: , /.Noes— 6. Messrs Robinson^ 'Meslts White ••- ; Seddon ; GuinnessWickes Dungan > Woolcbck Hbulaban Tood , , Oanavan Mitchell' ' Cumins M'Gaffra -Z • . Tatyify" .. . „ ; -.. ; The motion was therefore declared to be carried,; i / - A