THE ABOLITION BILL.

Globe, Volume IV, Issue 366, 14 August 1875, Page 3

THE ABOLITION BILL.

MEETING AT KAIAPOI. A meeting, convened by his Worship the Mayor of Kaiapoi, in response to a requisition from several electors, asking him to call a meeting to consider the question of the Abolition of the Provinces, was held last evening at the Institute. There was a large attendance, the hall being filled. Mr Lowthian Wilson said in the absence of his Worship the Mayor, who had been called away to Oxford to see a lady who was ill, he would move that Mr Porter take the chair. He might say that his Worship the Mayor had asked Mr Porter to take the chair.

Mr Woodford seconded the motion, which was agreed to. Mr Porter said he would not detain the meeting very long. He would first read the notice convening the meeting. He was very sorry that the Mayor was not present, because he believed he had|paid more attention than he (the chairman) had to the Bill. He had not yet read the Bill, therefore he might be relied upon as acting impartially. He was prepared to receive resolutions for or agamst the Bill, and he hoped that attention would be paid to the remark f of all speakers whether for or against the Bill, because the views so expressed would, he believed, be the fair expression of opinion f those making them. They were met that evening to hear argument, and he hoped they would calmly listen to both sides, [Cheers.]

Mr Josiah Birch said that the chairman had told them the object of the meeting, and as one of those signing the requisition, he had been asked to bring forward a resolution on the Bill, which they hoped would result in the abolition of Provineial Institutions in New Zealand. [Hear, hear, and “ No, no.] He would endeavor to make the remarks he had to make as short as possible, and to omit figures and statistics, which were too dry for public meetings, but he would try to show that the Abolition Bill was necessary, and led up to by the history of the colony. In doing this he would have to refer to the history of the colonisation of the colony. [Mr Birch then proceeded to give a history of the events regarding the early colonisation of the colony, which hardly seemed to be relished by the audience, as they desired the speaker to confine himself to discusing the Bill, and not give them a condensed history of the colony of New Zealand.] He then proceeded to say that the Government of New Zealand had now determined that the powers of the provinces should cease. He might say that this Bill had been very generally well received throughout the colony. [“No, no,” and cheers.] Though there were differences of opinion, it could not be denied that public opinion had most decidedly spoken in favor of it. [Cheers.) No one could take exception to the Bill on the ground of surprise because it had been foreshadowed at the recent election. [A Voice — “ Yes you got £4O a week after it.” j He rather liked these interruptions, as it put him on his mettle, [A Voice —“ Give us a history of the Rakaia Bridge Commission.”] He had read the tabulated statement in the Lyttelton Times , and bethought that the figures showed, as far as they went, that the outlying districts would receive far more than any Government could give to them. The special grants to Road Boards might be looked upon as being very good as long as they lasted ; but they had no guarantee that this would be continued. [A Voice —“ Are the figures true or not.”] They were true, perhaps, so far as they went, but they did not tell the whole truth. [Cheers.] One thing this tabulated statement showed him, viz, the unfairness of these special grants. Let them look at the Ashburton Road Board, and see the amount it received, while they had not taxed themselves one penny. The new Bill proposed to give them £1 for every £1 that they might raise in the districts by taxing themselves for, and he did not see how they could have a fairer system than this. [Cheers.] So far as Kaiapoi was concerned, he was certain that they would be far better off. For the last two years the borough of Kaiapoi had received about £SOO a year from the Provincial Government, and for seven years before that they never received one penny. Taking the whole revenue, leaving out reserves and the fines at the Resident Magistrate’s Court, the actual amount was about £875 per annum, and of this only £SOO had been received for the past two years, and during the seven years past they had not received one sixpence. [lnterruption.]

The chairman said once for all he desired that this chaff should cease, as it was not fair. [ Cheers.]

Mr Birch said that he would now show what the borough would receive under the new Bill. They would get £375 in addition to their own £375 raised by rates, and they would also get the dog fees, which he had put down at £IOO. In addition to this there were fees and fines, which would amount to £4O, showing a total of £IO4O, including publicans’ licenses. The revenue they had received up to the present, and which was only an act of grace, amounted to £875, Therefore he thought that the bormlgh of Kaiapoi had all to gain from this Bill. LChcers.] But as a colonist he said that they would receive far greater advantages to them as a whole by having only one central legislature. Now they had steam communication and telegraphs there was no need of this multiplicity of laws. They might have one law throughout the colony for all their local wants, and he was almost prepared to go as far as to say that one land law would be advisable for the whole colony, having perhaps a schedule of prices for different localities. [Hear, hear.] What was wanted was the consolidation of the laws of the colony. [Cheers.] He might say that it was not intended to take away the land revenue—(cheers] —it was intended, so far as he understood the Bill, that if the land revenue of any district showed a surplus, it would be devoted to the district in which it was raised, not perhaps confining it to the narrowest limits, but for its benefit and the adjacent country. The resolution he had to propose was as follows :—“ That this meeting of the electors of the Kaiapoi district approves of the Abolition of Provinces Bill now before the General Assembly, and trusts it will shortly become law,” [Loud cheers.] He was quite prepared to see the provinces die, but still he desired to pay a graceful tribute to the work done by provincial institutions, more particularly in Canterbury—[cheers]—where it had worked well. But their time had now come, and he |thought the sooner they died

out the better it would be. [Cheers.] He deprecated the cry that the people had not had a chance of considering the Bill. The Ministry had taken every means in its power to lay the Bill before the public as soon as possible, by telegraphing it to all the leading papers of the colony, so that there could not be the cry raised that they had not had time. [Cheers.] He now begged to propose the resolution he had read. [A Voice —“ What about the Eakaia bridge.”] He would be very happy to speak about the Rakaia bridge if that gentleman would pay the cost of the room. [Laughter.]

Mr Woodford seconded the resolution with a great deal of pleasure. In no country in the world was there such a multiplicity of Governments as in New Zealand, and he had been looking for years for a change. The Bill was, be thought, a good one, and he differed greatly from the idea of leaving the matter over for the next election. The people of New Zealand were ripe for a change ; they had too much government, and the sooner they concentrated the government into one central focus the better. In England Earl Grey in introducing the Reform Bill did not appeal to the country; nor need the Government of New Zealand, because they knew the country was ripe for the change. If they were beaten, of course they might then appeal to the country. The idea of abolition had been before the country last session, when the Government intimated they would bring down abolition resolutions. [Mr Middleton —“That was not as regards the southern provinces,”] Perhaps not; but still this foreshadowed what the Government meant. He wanted to see the people of New Zealand a united people, not divided, every province set against one another, with the heads of the provinces going up to the Assembly to see who could get the most out of the scramble, and carrying out what he, as an old sawyer used to call log-rolling. [Cheers.] There was no Government which could compete with that; the greatest difficulty any General Government had to con ■ tend with was the provincial system, and until it was done away with good Governments in New Zealand was an impossibility. Therefore, he cordially agreed with the resolution. [Cheers.]

Mr W. McDonald who, on rising, was received with loud ironical cheers, said he desired to warn the meeting against being led away like the Christchurch meeting had been. [Laughter.] Christchurch wanted all the money, and Kaiapoi had to take what they could get. [Cheers and laughter.] This was his first appearance as a public speaker, and he begged their iuulgence. [Cheers and laughter.] When he entered the room there was a vacant chair. Why was that ? [A Voice: “ Our worthy Mayor 7” Another Voice; “ He’s called away to Oxford.”] Well, an excuse was“good enough for anything. With all Mr Birch’s eloquence, he had not heard any arguments as to what they had to do. [Mr McGuinness: “ Yes we have.”] Mr McDonald—Eh ? [Loud laughter.]

Mr McDonald then went into a short dissertation with Mr Woodford, which created loud laughter; after which, he said he was an abolitionist, if he could see any good to be got from it, but he only saw a lot of fair promises and place-hunters. | A Voice: “No more than we have got now.”] He thought that they ought to discuss this question calmly. He would now retire. [Cheers and laughter.] Mr J. Beswick, who was received, with cheers, said if they would listen to him for a few moments, he would put a few facts before them, which it would be well if they considered before they voted for the resolution proposed by Mr Birch, and seconded by Mr Woodford. He might tell them that he intended to move an amendment to the resolution as follows;—“ That in the opinion of this meeting, considering the very short time the Abolition of the Provinces and the Local Government Bills have been before the public, and the fact that in a few months a new Parliament will be elected, it is the wisest and most constitutional course to allow the electors to give their opinions upon questions of such vital importance affecting the interests of the colonists at large in the usual constitutional way by their votes at the approaching general election.” [Cheers.] This was a similar resolution to that passed at the seat of Government by the enlightened constituency of Wellington, which had seen the gilded pill, and had rejected it because they had discovered the delusive nature of the promises of the Government. What had Provincial Councils done for Canterbury ? They had a large sum of money at their credit at their bankers and the best 'loaded country in the world, and they could not go out into the country without seeing the energy, the vitality, and the foresight of provincial institutions. [Cheers.] But still they were now asked to hand over their magnificent estate and revenue to a power at a distance, while they had the power to send their tnirty-nine representatives to their own Council. Was this anything to be gained? On all sides, even by its enemies, it was admitted that provincial institutions had done their work well, [Mr Woodford'— “Yes, but sweep them away. They are dead.”] Well it might perhaps be like Turkey and the Czar of Russia, who thought Turkey was a sick man; let them see what they were going to put in their place. [Hear.] He now came to the table published by the Lyttelton Times, and he thought that the public owed a debt of gratitude to that paper. For onco and at last the Lyttelton Times had got on the right track, [Cheers.] He found that they had expended on Road Boards, &c, £850,000, besides £300,000 for branch railways. Taking, then, the Government extreme amount which would be received, the province was still a loser of some £112,000 ; was that a gain? [“No.”] He would endeavour to show them that the fair promises in these Bills could not be carried out. He contended that the promises held out to the Road Boards were delusive, and they did not get any better local self-government than they had now. Beyond this, they all liked to have a voice in the election of their rulers, and they had the chance of getting a nominated Superintendent sent down to them like a French prefect, without any chance of objection. Their land revenue was taken from them and used to pay certain charges of surveys, &c. Even with the Government giving the £1 per £1 to road Boards they would not receive within £IOO,OOO or £120,000 of what they now got. He contended that after the various charges had been made on the land revenue, they would have very little to get, £jnd their pecuniary position would be far worse. [Mr Beswick then read a table controverting Mr Birch’s statement as to the Ashburton Road Board ] He might point out that the principle acted upon by the province had been to expend the money in opening up the country, and when the district was settled, it

justly received what it was entitled to. He now came to Kaiapoi, and he said that it had been very fairly treated by the Provincial Council. [Cries of “oh, oh,” and “shame.”] Well, ho had not been their member ; perhaps if he had, they would have got more. [Laughter, and “ oh, oh.”] He contended that they were better off under the present system than they could be under the new one. [A Voice—“No fear.”] Mr Birch had told them that they had not received anything for seven years, but who had got the tolls on the bridge. [A voice—“ Who paid them.”] But he was prepared to say that a large sum of money was expended in Kaiapoi before it was a municipality. Besides this there were several bridges built, a morgue, the formation of the Beach road, half the cost of the fire engine, &c. He thought therefore that he had shewed them that a very large sum of money had been expended in Kaiapoi, while they were told they had not had a sixpence. Well, what would they get under the Bill? He was told that Kaiapoi had not raised £3OO in rates in any year, and if they looked at the Bill they would see that the subsidy was given only on the cash paid in as rates. They were thus entitled to £3OO for their rates, and the dog fees only reached £SO ; the publicans’ licenses reached £l6O, which was a total of £460. They would thus get this amount under the new Bill, while for two years they had had about £SOO absolutely granted by the Provincial Council ; and besides the institutions in the town, they had the large sum of £IOOO granted for clearing the river. [A voice—- “ When will we get it? We haven’t got it yet,”J This was to them a great and important question, and he urgently asked them to vote for the amendment. [“No, no.”] He spoke freely, as he was not in the Council nor a salaried officer of the Government, and he told them that before two years was over they wonld find that whatever the fair promises of the Government might be, that their land fund was gone for ever. [“ No, no,” and “Yes, yes.”] Their system of education would be upset, and those who were now clamouring for abolition would be the first to turn against their leaders. He would rather, instead of not giving the people a chance of considering the question, cut off his right hand. Me said this deliberately, feeling, as he did, that this was right. He felt sure that the loaders of popular opinion, who were now trying to force the people on to abolition would, before two years were over, be torn to pieces by their own faction. [Cheers.] A pause [intervened here, and loud cries were raised for “ Middleton ” and “ Joynt.”

Mr M. Dixon seconded the amendment and in doing so, in a very energetic speech characterised the Government measures as a delusion and a snare, and not at all calculated to work for the benefit of the colony as a whole. The Government had squandered their money right and left in the way of incurring debts. He hoped the amendment would be carried, and he felt sure that the result of deferring the consideration of the question would be the bringing out of a far better Bill than those now before them. | Cheers.] Mr Joynt said that he felt considerable diffidence in coming forward on this occasion as he was asked to sign his death warrant [Cheers.] His friend Mr Beswick came before them on a very different mission, as he seemed to say that he was the man to save the country because he wished to save Provincial institutions in all their vigour. He must say that though representing them for five years, and he hoped that they were pleased with him as he was with them, he felt that he had been doing very little good for the public or Kaiapoi. In fact for years be had been of opinion that provincial institutions were a mistake, [Cheers.] He might tell them, though they might not believe him, that he came from Ireland [loud laughter] and there they had neither Provincial Institutions or a General Assembly, and yet the country was remarkably well governed by the local bodies. [Cheers.] When he came to this country, he felt that it was remarkably over-governed, and that the resources of the country must be exceedingly elastic to bear all of them, as it- meant spending money. Therefore, if they could get rid of some of these money spending mediums it would be all the better for them. [Cheers.] He thought he was entitled to great credit in this matter, because for the first time in his life he had occupied the distinguished position of a legislator, and perhaps never would again, [Cheers and laughter.] But, besides all this, he felt that provincial institutions had been a mistake from the first [cheers], and that if they had work to do they had done it, hence ho could not weep over the departing system. The provincial system had done the work of Road Boards and municipalities while these did not exist, but so soon as these were established one of the important functions of provincialism departed. Well all that now remained to Provincial Institutions was the work of getting the land ready for immigrants, and introducing the immigrants. Butin 1870 the public works and immigration policy took this away from it, and nothing remained but a system of a very round-about, unsatisfactory nature, simply to gather and expend revenue, [Cheers.] He contended that the Immigration and Public Works Act, 1870, was the death blow to the provinces. [Cheers.] Now it might be said that they had their legislative powers, but he said that these legislative powers were the most mischievous thing that could be. Besides this, if they attempted to make laws they found that they had not scope enough for their legislative genius [Laughter]—because above all their legislation the Attorney-General sat like a Nemesis, and down came upon their efforts a wet blanket, known as ultra circs, which effectually extinguished them. They had got to such a pitch that they did not know where their powers ended. He desired to say this, that he was not condemning provincialism, but he said that when they established Road Boards they gave away a large part of their powers, and that the Immigration and Public Works Act took the remainder—[cheers] leaving them but little to do, which they did remarkably bad. [Cheers.] Mr Beswick had said that provincialism would be remembered for what it had done, but ho (Mr Joynt) desired to say that when their coffers were full of money—money which was brought in by the scheme of Immigration and Public Works—they squandered that money, and did not do half they could have done with it. [A voice: “That was the fault of the men, not the system.” | Perhaps it might bo, but the fact was the system was cumbrous, unwieldy, and unsatisfactory, and therefore the members had to do the best they could with it, There was no

doubt about this, that the last session of the Provincial Council more plainly than anything else, shewed the necessity for abolition. [Cheers ] As ho had said in the Council, the legislation of that session was disgraceful. [Cheers.] Now, as regarded the financial part of the question, he had no figures, but he might say that he believed the tabulated statement appearing in one of the public papers was not to be relied upon —[Hoar,hear] —as it was drawn up by strong partizans for their own purposes. [Cheers.] As he had said he was not a financier. [A Voice—- “ But you helped to pass the votes in the Council, Mr Joynt.”] He had, with others, and a pretty kettle of fish they had made of it. [Laughter.] The appropriations of the Council for the Road Boards could not continue. Let them look at the Bill; that said, if the land revenue was not sufficient, the revenue should be made up out of the consolidated revenue. [Cheers.] Now this was a reliable and increasing source of revenue, which would grow as the population increased, while the dependence on the land revenue would be a diminishing and unreliable one. This was what they had to consider and not to look at figures as they were now, and he might say that, in the bands of unscrupulous persons, figures might be made to prove anything. He trusted that he was not taking an ungracious leave of provincialism, but he had never loved it, and had never made a secret of his opinions on it. As regarded the effect on municipalities, it was, he contended, an improvement when they got a certain and increasing source of endowment. The votes spoken of by Mr Beswick were not of a permanent character, and, therefore, were no incentive to the ratepayers to rate themselves for the improvement of their town. What the municipalities wanted was a reliable and per manent revenue—[Cheers] —which would act as an incentive to ratepayers to rate themsefives. Now this was what the Government measures gave to them. [Cheers] As regarded the statement of Mr Beswick regarding the Road Boards there were, he asserted, a number of Road Boards actually living on the Provincial Government giants, and not rating themselves to the extent of one shilling. [A Voice —“The Waipara, for instance.”] After a slight passage of arms between Mr Joynt and Mr Beswick as regarded Road Boards, Mr Joynt went on to say that provincialism was a bad system of centralism, and the scheme introduced by the General Government was based upon far sounder and more equitable grounds than ever provincialism was. It had been cumbering the country for a long time, causing expenses and endless trouble. He would like to ask what was the use of postponing the Bill, as it was said to take the sense of the people. Was not the public voice heard now ? [Cries of “ No, no,” and “Yes, yes.”] Then what was the use of the meetings here and elsewhere —was it for nothing that the largelyattended meetings were held all over the country. He contended that the expression of opinion throughout the country was in favor of the measures of the Government, and the people were largely in favor of it. They were asked to look before they had a new Constitution ; but he contended that in reality there was nothing of the kind asked of them. They were asked to get rid of the cumbrous mode of raising and spending money known as provincialism, and let the government of the country be carried on by the General Assembly and Road Boards and municipalities. This was no new constitution, and he could say that the Government Bills contained to his mind the great essentials of economy and good government. [Cheers. | His faith that provincial institutions were not at all suited to their wants was no new idea, but one which had been in his mind since he had at all thought of their constitution. [Cheers.] Mr Blackwell rose and proceeded at some length to challenge the correctness of the tabulated statement appearing in the Lyttelton Times , as regarded the Mandeville and Rangiora and Eyreton Road Boards, quoting figures in support of his assertion tbat the table was utterly wrong, and should have been accompanied by a foot note saying that errors and omissions were excepted. Mr Blackwell read a telegram from Hon C. G. Bowen respecting the municipal endowments. He trusted all present would vote fur the motion and throw out the amendment, as he felt sure that the Government Bill would be of infinite service, alike to the Kaiapoi district and borough. As regarded the statement of Mr Birch, he found that the Provincial Council had voted over £160,000 to Road Boards which had never raised one single penny for themselves. Mr Isaac Wilson spoke at some length in favor of the amendment, and in opposition to the motion.

Mr Beswick again addressed the meeting, contending that the tabulated statementin the Lyttelton Times was absolutely corr ect as it was bas d on printed documents both of the General Government and the Provincial Auditor. Mr lies wick contended that the Hon Mr Bowen’s telegram, received at Rangiora on the previous evening as to the General Government taking over the main roads was misleading. He (Mr Beswick) had telegraphed to his Honor the Superintendent, and asked him whether there was any appropriation for main roads. The reply was that £OO,OOO only was to be appropriated for local public works in outlying districts. | Cheers. | This was for the whole of the colony, and not for one province only [lnterruption] and local public works meant branch railways and other works. [Cheers, and cries of “ Question.”] Mr Birch said that he would waive his right of reply. [Cheers.] The Chairman then put the amendment. Thereupon arose great confusion. Mr Beswick moved that the meeting divide into two parties according to their respective votes.

A great deal of confusion ensued, the two parties who had divided cheering and counter-cheering for some minutes. The chairman announced that unless some sort of order was restored very shortly he should leave the chair. He would take the voting by a show of hands. [Confusion.] After some minutes of confusion, Messrs E. Revell and E. Parnham proceeded to act as scrutineers of the show of hands. The show of hands was declared to be as follows : For the amendment 77 Against 69

Majority in favor of amendment 8 The amendment was then declared to be carried.

The chairman then left the chair, and the meeting terminated in admired disorder, Mr Eeswick protesting against the chairman leaving the chair,