SEDDON RAIL SMASH INQUIRY

Gisborne Herald, Volume LXXV, Issue 22601, 2 April 1948, Page 6

SEDDON RAIL SMASH INQUIRY

GURR’S EXPERIENCE PREVIOUS DUTIES EVIDENCE BY EXPERTS ENGINE SPEED ESTIMATES (P.A.) WELLINGTON, April. 2. Lengthy evidence by officials of the Railways Department marked the continuation yesterday of the hearing of the board of inquiry into the Seddon railway smash. Alexander Hudson Guthrie, Timaru, who retired on March 8 after being senior driver at Kaikoura. said he had the responsibility of allotting firemen and drivers. On February 6 Driver Gurr, who had been sent from the Linwood depot as a relief, arrived. Gurr said he knew the route south of Kaikcura and from Blenheim to Wharanui, and that he had been stationed at Ward for a considerable time and knew quite a iot about the locality. Said He Knew Route

After Gurr had done various runs from Kaikoura, witness asked him if he knew the route before going on to a shift which included No. 104 train. Gurr replied “yes” unhesitatingly and said that he was "right back on his old stamping ground" now that he had been* over the ground once. Witness said he was quite satisfied that as Gurr led him to believe he could do the job without any effort, Gurr had all that went towards making him appear a good man. The engine of No. 104 was in perfect order. Gurr had his second-grade driver’s ticket.

Witness said it was not customary for a second-grade driver to be on an express, but the staff shortage had to be taken into account. The department preferred to put first-grade men on expresses, but No. 104 was not looked on as an express but as a fast passenger train.

Gurr was 29$ years of age. That was not young for an express driver. Gurr had never been to Blenheim as a passenger train driver. To Mr. A. A. Tarr, general secretary of the Railway Officers’ Institute, witness said it was not unusual for acting drivers to run No. 104. The use of second-grade certificate drivers was dictated by the staff position. No Speedometer On Engine Examined by Mr. H. R. C. Wild, for the New Zealand Locomotive Engine Drivers, Firemen and Cleaners’ Association, witness said AB engines had no speedometers or speed indicators. Representations had been made by drivers from time to time for speedometers. The department had acknowledged that they would be desirable, if obtainable.

Mr. Wild: If you were still a driver Would you like a speed indicator? Witness: It would be a big assistance. “And if of big assistance to you it would be much more so to a younger and less experienced man? —That is so. “Even more so to a man strange on the run?—Yes.

“Five curves and five different gradings over a distance of 2$ miles would present difficulties to a strange driver? —I did not think he was a strange driver. He had worked on the route for 188 days when at Ward. “Assuming he was then? —No. The line was well marked with curve warning and curve radius boards. “Have you ever overrun a station yourself?—Yes, it can be done if one is running for the first time into a particular station. “It might happen to any driver? — Yes.” Witness said that when Gurr was sent up from Linwood no written record of his experience was provided. He tnought it was more recently than nine years since Gurr had been at Ward and he thought Gurr had been there as a driver. Gurr had not said what he was employed as there, and it was only now that he knew that Gurr had been a cleaner-acting fireman. Mr. Wild: If you had known that when he came, would it have made any difference? Witness: Probably. Keen and Conscientious Witness said that Gurr had informed him that he knew the route and on the impression then given he would not have thought it necessary to give him a run over the route as third man on the engine. Gurr had impressed him as keen and conscientious. Mr. Wild: Did you know that he had never driven a fast express train before.

Witness: No. I knew he had a lot of experience of goods trains. “Did you know that he had not previously been north of Blenheim except as a passenger?—No.” Cecil Charles J. Buckley, locomotive foreman, Christchurch, said that when a temporary vacancy occurred at Kaikoura six men were approached to fill it and five declined. Gurr was the best man available in the circumstances and he had experience in driving over the Springfield-Arthur’s Pass route, which was one of the toughest in New Zealand. Witness had no complaints of Gurr’s work. He knew of an instruction to drivers to inform their superiors when required to operate over a route strange to them. Under examination by Mr. Wild, witness said he had driven for 26 years. He judged speed by movements in going over raii joints on a 701 b. track. It was more difficult to judge speed on a__ down grade. A speed indicator would help a new driver, but witness preferred the rails' system. Prevented By Staff Shortage It was usual for a new man to be given a run over the route with a senior driver, and had witness been at Kaikoura he would have done so with Gyrr had it been possible. However, the circumstances at Kaikoura prevented this. To Mr. Tarr, witness said he had never had any complaints about Gurr's “enginemanship.” Mr. Tarr: Would you put an actingengine driver on the Christchurch-In-vercargili express? Witness: Not unless I was absolutely jammed. “Have you done it? —No. “But you sent Gurr to the PictonChristchurch express. Why the distinction?—Senior men would not go because of domestic problems. Gurr held the. same qualifications as some of the drivers at the Kaikoura sub-depot.” Gurr had signed a form that he knew the route up to Kaikoura, but not north of there, continued witness. With Gurr’s previous experience witness considered him capable of driving any train on the Kaikoura run. It was true he believed that in an endeavour to comply with departmental policy act-ing-drivers were taken off the Christ-church-Kaikoura expresses last year, but this was relaxed because of staff shortages. James Binstead, district mechanical engineer of Christchurch, said that up to the time No. 104 left Seddon Gurr had been 9 hours 14 minutes on duty, of which time he had been driving 6 hours 12 minutes. The average speed from Taumarina to Seddon was 25 miles an hour. Considerable Driving Experience

Gurr actually possessed a record of considerable driving experience. Witness detailed the system of training, examination and the promotion of cleaners, firemen and engine drivers and said that if appointments as engine drivers were made too freely, there would be insufficient drivjng work for all, and difficuties and disputes would arise when it became necessary to roster engine drivers as firemen. A fireman and acting-engine driver such as Gurr did not require any further qualification in order to be designated an engine driver. In fact, when Gurr was sent to Kaikoura he was better qualified in driving experience than were some on their appointment as engine drivers in April, 1947,

The term “acting 1 ” was not meant to imply an “inferior” driver. A man with a second-grade certificate whether an acting-engine driver or an engine driver, had the necessary knowledge to enable him to run any train with safety. The general practice of utilising firstgrade engine drivers for express running could not always be followed, particularly with sub-depots of which Picton and Kaikoura were examples, witness said

Witness added that Gurr had performed 148 days of what was termed “advanced capacity” work as an engine drived before his transfer to Kaikoura, and 163 days up to the day before the accident he had driven seven goods trains north of Kaikoura after his transfer there, three of which had passed during daylight hours over the curve where the accident occurred. Heavy Trains Driven

Records showed that Gurr had an all-round grounding in train operating and had driven trains of heavy tonnage with the most powerful engine "KB.” over one of the most severe testing grounds, Springfield-Arthur's Pass. Such trains were much heavier and more difficult to control than a passenger express train like No. 104. In his opinion, said witness, a satisfactory performance with such trains over that difficult section with its steep grades, sharp curves and vari-

ous speed restriction areas indicated that Gurr did not lack capacity as an engine driver. The class of train he had handled 56 times on that section would make heavier demands on his ability and knowledge than would be the case in running trains like No. 104. While stationed at Ward from April, 1938, to June, 1939. Gurr worked as a fireman for 188 days, during which time his running was over the section which included the place where the accident occurred. In this period he would have obtained an intimate knowledge of the track. “It may be said that Gurr seems young for an engine driver, but so far as using age as a criterion is concerned, if an engine man has not full possession of all the normal faculties with balanced judgment and a sense of train running responsibility at 29, I do not think he will ever have them,” said witness. , Driver’s Responsibility There was a final responsibility on a driver to observe the rule that he must report the matter if required to drive over an unfamiliar route, and he could not be forced to run a train over a section he did not know. Gurr’s 1946 certificate indicated that he was aware of his duty in that respect. Mr. Wild: There is nothing in your evidence to show that the department ascertained that Gurr knew the route. Witness: I should say that the responsibility was discharged. Mr. Guthrie, the senior locomotive driver, was satisfied. Mr. Tarr: In your opinion wasBuckley justified in sending Gurr to Kaikoura. Witness: He made the best decision he could in the circumstances and, taking those into account, he was justified. “Would he have been influenced by the staff position.—Yes.” The hearing will be continued today. •