USE IN SCHOOLS

Evening Post, Volume CXXX, Issue 93, 16 October 1940, Page 11

USE IN SCHOOLS

BAN IMPOSED

CONTRARY TO LAW

BOARD OBJECTS

1 A direction from the Education [ Department that the decision of the [\ Wellington Education Board to per- ' | mit the recital of the Lord's Prayer |in the schools under its jurisdiction was contrary to the law and must not be proceeded with met with opposition when the board met today. | ! The majority of the board members j [ argued that there should be no bar! Ito the voluntary recital of the prayer and a resolution was carried stating that'the decision reached was a mat-j ' ter for the board and the school com-1 mittees and not the Department. j , The secretary (Mr. W. I. Deavoll) | , reported that two letters had been received' from the Director of Educa- [ tion (Dr. C. E. Beeby). In the first he ; stated that the matter was very con-j L troversial and asked for the board's ■ legal authority for the step it had taken. He also asked the board to defer action 'on the resolution until the legal posi-' ', tion was made clear. ! The second letter stated: "It must :be clear to your board that it has not in law the authority to give the direc- : tion proposed to be given. Reference to Section 56 of the Education Act, i 1914, shows that every public school shall be organised and conducted in accordance with regulations, and regulations are defined as being regulations made under the Act. The provisions which follow and which refer to i the authority of the board, which do ! not operate in the present instance, j ' serve but to emphasise that the board is purporting to enter a sphere in which the Department alone has autho- j ■ rity. . i "The proposed instruction, therefore, can be of no effect, and I should be glad if your board would see that it !is not proceeded with." Colonel T. W. McDonald moved:— i That the letters from the Director of Education be received and that he be informed (a) that in reply to i his first letter the board sees no reason why it should obtain a legal ■■ j opinion in this particular instance !! any more than in the several other ■ i instances where it has previously ' dealt with the same subject; (b) that 'in reply to the second letter, the dcci- '; sion of the board to have the schools i opened daily with the Lord's Prayer is a matter for the. board and the school committees and not for the Department. The opening referred to concludes immediately before the start of the secular school work; (c) ! that the resolution of the board has already been put into operation. UNANIMOUSLY APPROVED, Although he had been a member of the board off and on for 35 years, said Colonel McDonald, he had never before known of a case of such importance that had received such unanimous approval from one end of the country to the other. Correspondence had been received from practically every denomination and they indicated full and striking support for the board's action. The Roman Catholic Educational Trust Board, in its annual report, had stated that the only true education was a combination of religious and secular instruction. "This thing so speaks for itself that I have the greatest possible pleasure in moving the motion," he concluded. Mr. T. K. Moody seconded the motion and said that he was surprised the question of legality had been raised. Mr. S. C. Hyndman said there should be some way of getting around the Act so that the move towards spiritual values, which was so much in evidence today, should not be impeded. The legality of the matter would have to be left to the lawyers, Mr. G. M. Henderson said. The introduction of the Lord's Prayer into the socalled secular schools was a matter of policy, and policy was laid down by Parliament. The board had passed a resolution saying it would start board meetings with prayer. They could do that; but in the case of the schools they had left the decision to the committees and teachers. He doubted if they were right to go that far because by doing so they were introducing an element that had been left out by the founders of the education system. Mr. C. H. W. Nicholls said that the board by its resolution did not wish to make the opening of the day by prayer a compulsory matter. He could not see how they were doing any harm, but if the Department could convince him that they were he was prepared to reconsider the matter. The Department should show them in what way they had erred. The chairman (Mr. W. V. Dyer) said he had read the letters received, and they all commended the board for its action. However, he thought they had taken upon themselves to do something that should be a job for the Legislature. PEOPLE THE LEGISLATORS. The people were the legislators, Mr. W. R. Nicol said, and it should be quite easy to alter the law. If that could not be done there was nothing to pre-i vent the prayer being taken a few I minutes before opening time, and he was sure all the children would attend. If one thing was needed more than anything else today, it was more opj portunity for prayer. |To support the motion would be to | encourage the board to flout the | authority of the Government of the! Dominion, Mr. L. J. McDonald said. He was in entire sympathy with the worthy sentiments expressed and was pleased to be associated with a group of men who showed such appreciation of spiritual and ethical values, but that did not get them away from the fact that the law of the country prohibited them from giving the direction they' had given and if they persisted they would be challenging the right of. constitutional government in New Zealand. Mr. A. Donald: Subversion. Mr. McDonald: It is subversion. A member: Nonsense. Anyone could express the opinion that the law was opposed by 90 per cent, of the people, Mr. McDonald said, ; and claim that a matter was so important that there was no need to respect the law. Some people had adopted that principle and had suffered . for it. There were organisations that ' had announced their intention to resist . the Government's right to govern anc^ . the Prime Minister had replied that ; the Government would govern. The resolution in effect said, "You will not ; govern in this matter. We will." If : the board did not adopt a reasonable attitude he felt sure it would be compelled to do what it had the opportunity to do decently and quietly. . Mr. D. Macaskill said he could not agree to the motion because they were dealing with a matter which the De-i1

partment said was a breach of the law. He pointed out that if they adopted the Nelson system the Lord's Prayer could be included in the religious instruction allowed by their bylaws.

Mr. J. J. Clark expressed the opinion that the Department should have realised that there was a real desire for the prayer. It might have been helpful instead of critical. The real opposition did not come from the Department, but from the Teachers' Institute.

Mr. Nicholls: You've said a mouthful.

"We say the day is to start with the Lord's Prayer," said Mr. Clark, "the Teachers' Institute says it shall not. Now who is going to govern? Are we or are the teachers?"

Mr. H. Duckworth said there were many aspects of the law that' were not observed, but when the board tried to introduce something good for the morals of the country the Department "got up on its hind legs and objected." Colonel McDonald said that he would challenge any Minister or member of Parliament who was prepared to stand up against their decision to come out for election and he would stand against him.

"We are fighting a war allegedly for the defence of Christianity," he said, "yet we say to Christ, 'Keep out of the primary schools of New Zealand. You can go into the other schools, but keep out of our primary schools while we beg You on our bended knees to come and help us.' " The motion was carried by 9 votes to 3. Messrs. L. J. McDonald, G. M. Henderson, and W. V. Dyer voted against it. Mr. Macaskill was out of the board room when the vote was taken.