Untitled

Evening Post, Volume CXI, Issue 72, 26 March 1931, Page 13

FURTHER TIME WASTED

OBSTRUCTION IN THE HOUSE

When at 3.15 p.m. tho Committee reached tho point of considering the first operative clause of the Bill the Eight Hon. J. G. Coates (Leader of the Opposition) reminded the Prime Minister of the suggestion he had made on the previous evening that there should be a modification of the measure in its application to the locomotive branch of tho Railway Department, as had been provided in the retrenchment measure of 1921. The Prime Minister did not reply at this stage. Mr. P. Frascr (Labour, Wellington Central) then moved to insert words into the definition of "salary" withthe object of making the "cut" applicable to all income which is subject to taxation. The division was taken immediately, and the amendment was negatived by 53 votes to 21, Mr. G. C. Black (Independent, Motueka) voting with the Labour Party. Mr. J. M'Combs (Labour, Lyttclton), moved to make the cut applicable to Civil Service salaries in excess of ,£4OO. The Prime Minister (the Right Hon. G. W. Forbes) stated that the effect of the amendment would be that there ■would bo a saving in salary expenditure, of £200,000 instead of £1,399,000. "That means practically cutting the whole thing away," ho added. A division on Mr. M'Combs's amendment was taken at 7.30 p.m., and it was defeated by 44 votes to 21. Mr. Howard then moved that tho "cut" should be applicable to Civil servants in receipt of salaries in excess of £350. On a division the amendment was defeated by 50 votes to 21. The Acting Chairman of Committees (Mr. W. J. Broadfoot) wrongly announced the xesult of the division, and there was at once a chorus of approval from the Labour benches. Mr. Broadfoot quickly rectified his error. An amendment aimed at exempting Civil servants receiving less than £320 •was then moved by Mr. Sullivan, who said that any reduction that was made Tvould come out of money that was spent on luxuries. The amendment was defeated by 52 votes to 22, Mr. R. A. Wright (Reform, Suburbs) voting with the Labour- Party. The exemption of salaries under £300 was urged in a further amendment moved by Mr. Jordan. ■f • STOPPING-PLACE SOMEWHERE. '' Mr. Fraser said there had to be a jStopping-place somewhere as far as the !"cuts" were concerned. Labour members continued to urge that there was a strong case to be made out for the exemption of salaries Under £300. Mr. D. ...Tones (Eeform, Mid-Canter-(bury) said the amendments of the Labour Party made one wonder whether they were framed merely for electioneering purposes. It had to bo remem- ; bored that 60 per cent, of the Civil SerI vants who were going to be affected I were single. i Mr. Carr: "They want to get niar- [ lied some day." j Mr. Semple said that there had been a hardship clause in the 1922 legislai tion, but not one case had been fayI ourably considered. (Labour approval.) I "Why sit there like a tfargo of frozen i mutton," said Mr. Semple, in referring I to the silence of Government members. ■"If we could get a logical, reasonable, Sensible statement from the Govern- ■ jnent we would go home and sleep. I'll J>e glad to go, but I want to say that, I've 'worked night shift in the mines for twenty years, and I'm used to going ■without my sleep. My colleagues and I will keep this House going until we do get a sensible statement." AN INTERLUDE. Evidence that the nerves of members yrato becoming a-little frayed was proTided at 9.10 p.m., when Mr. Carr was speaking. He sought to use an illustration on a certain point, when ho was ordered by Mr. Chairman to confine his "remarks to the Bill. '. ' "May I not use an illustration?" aski ied Mr. Carr. \ Tho Chairman: "No." v Mr. Carr: "I submit I am entitled to \ V.sc the illustration." I Tho Chairman: "Order. The lion. [. jgenUcman must resume his seat." ■ Mi-. Carr: "Send for Mr. Speaker." ■ . Reform members: "Sit down." ! 'Mr. Carr (with some heat): "You 1 up." (Laughter.) "Is the hon. member reading his Speech?" asked the Acting-Chairman : Mr. Barnard was addressing the ; "Committee. "No, sir ; " replied Mr. Barnard. "I ■ ;iave nothing to read. I will look at : :jyou instead, if I may." (Laughter.) At 10 p.m. Mr. Atmore took charge j iof the Bill, relieving the Prime Minis- | ]ter, and Labour members carried on the : idebate. Mr. J. W. Munro (Labour, Dunedin JCorth) said that he wag heartily sick of the phrase "equality of sacrifice," and hoped that it would be ruled out as tedious repetition. There was no such 'thing in the Bill as equality of sacrifice. ENTER MR. COATES. At 11.45 p.m. Mr. Coates and Mr. H. 13. Holland rose simultaneously, and each offered to give way to the other. Mr. Holland: "Go ahead. We have not heard the right hon. gentleman for £i long time." Mi. Fraser: "You are as welcome as tlie flowers in May." Mi". Coates sfiid that he wished to Visit the Prime Minister whether he had considered tho Reform Party's proposal in respect to the lower paid men in the Civil Service with families. The Prime Minister had said that ho was prepared to set. up a commission for tho purpose of protecting those who ■would suffer unduly as (lie result of ithis "cut" in salaries. Mr. H. E. Holland said that if tho jßeform Party voted for the Labour amendment there would be no necessity for a, hardship commission. If the Prime Minister did not agree to the fLeader of ti%.-2BBPsition's-r;MpgpsflJ^

"I trust the time of the House will not be further wasted by wearying debate." This remark heard early this morning from the lips of one of the members of the Labour Parly who have been carrying on the "stonewall" against the Finance Bill since Monday afternoon, was heartily endorsed by United and Reform members with sleepy "hear, hears," and probably sums up the opinion of the great majority of those who have been watching or participating in, the proceedings of the House this week. When the breakfast adjournment was taken this morning the second clause of a Bill of twenty clauses was still under discussion. The discussion is being carried on in well organised relay teams by Labour Parly speakers, and occasionally a voice is heard from the other parties or the Independents. There is every appearance, if the present persistence is continued, of a record "stonewall" being put up.

would Mr. Coates move an amendment lat a later stage 1 If he did the Prime Minister would surely take it as a vote !of no-confidence, and it would certainly bo carried. This would get rid of a hopeless Government in double quick time. It was all very well for the Opposition to express their sympathy with those who would be affected by the. legislation, but sympathy was of little use if they voted with the Government. Mr. Coates said that had the advice of the Reform Party been taken the position would have been tackled long ago, but it was not now the time to go into those matters. The country had to be placed first, and action had to be taken to rectify the position. It was only right that the Civil Service and the workers should have to face the position as well as other sections of the community. Mr. W. D. Lysnar (Independent Reform, Gisborne) said that when the Leader of the Opposition had said that he would assist tho Prime Minister in getting through the Government's emergency legislation, he had congratulated Mr. C'oateSj but he had had his doubts all along. Mr. Coates's suggestion was only hindering the passage of the legislation. Mr. Lysnar said that ho was 2>reparcd to back the mature judgment of tho Government nnd its officials. Mr. Frascr: "Because you have no judgment of your own." Mr. Lysnar: "I have a judgment of my own, but I put the country first." They did not want an election. Mr. J. A. Nash (Reform, Palmerston): "Don't you want one?" Mr. Lysnar: "I say that the country does not want one." HEAVENLY JOBS. Tho Prime Minister said that ho had been attacked in most bitter terms by tho members of the Labour Party for not replying to the various points which had been raised. Ho had no objection to answering any reasonable questions which were addressed to him. There was no doubt in his mind that with a reduction in costs, brought about by a reduction in wages, they would have a reduction in the cost of living. Mr. Frascr: "How do you know?" Mr. Forbes: "I have information supplied to mo from clay to day showing that there has been a reduction in the costs of commodities. We have heard a lot of talk to-night about the poor man on the £300 mark. There are thousands of men in New Zealand today who would think they were in heaven if they were receiving anything like £300. I have already promised that there will be a tribunal to deal with cases of hardship, and the Go-vernor-General's Message dealing with the matter is ready to come down." Mr. Frascr: "It won't be any good." Mr. Forbes went on to refer to the position in Australia, and said that 23 per ecnt. of the population in New South Wales was out of work. Mr. Parry: "They are doing more than you are." Mr." Forbes: "They have 300.000 unemployed in New South "Wales simply because they have tried to keep wages ii]> to an artificial standard. We don't ■want.that sort of thing in New Zealand.'' He thought that he was entitled to some commendation from the Labour benches for what ho had done in connection with tho hardship clause. Mr. W. Nash: "Why cause hardship?" ". ' :. Mr. Lysnar: "Why do you talk all night?" The Chairman: "Order, Order." Mr. Forbes: "We are trying to keep our men in employment. The unemployment figures in New Zealand will compare more than favourably with thoso of any other country." WHAT GUARANTEE? Mr. Fraser invited the Prime Minister or the Leader of the Opposition to justify a reduction in the wages of a married man on a weekly wage of £3 10s.. The Prime Minister: "There will be no reduction in the real wages." Labour members: "Nonsense!" Mr. Fraser: "What guarantee have you that any reduction in the cost of living will follow? Bo you want the price of meat to come down or go up? If it goes up, up goes tho cost of living. Do you want the price of wool to go up or come down? Low prices are no good to anybody in any country, and we want to see the fanners receiving good prices. . . but tho way is not I)}' reducing wages." (Hear, hear.) Tho debate dragged wearily on, Labour members alone taking part. Recumbent figures adorned the Government and Reform benches at 1.45 a.m., and there were only eight Labour members in the House. "Order, order," called out the Chairman at 2.45 a.m., during a speech by Mr. O'Brien. "Don't wake the members up," rejoined a Labour member. Later, Mr. O'Brien, when referring to the unhealthiness of night work for railway cleaners, said that night sittings did not agree with members of Parliament. "However, some of them seem to bo able to make themselves comfortable,'-' ho added. "I don't think there arc more than half a dozen at present not, lying down." At this stage the six members of the Opposition in tho Chamber were lying full length on the benches and twelve followers of the Government were also enjoying a sleep. Tho Minister of Agriculture (the Hon. A. J. Murdoch) was in charge of tho Bill, and two other members of the Government were taking a desultory interest in the proceedings. Nine Labour men were holding tho fort for their sleeping colleagues. The scene, as Mr. Chapman described it, was calm and peaceful, but he dalVied too long in his description and was rung down before his time was up. PUTTING THE BRAKE ON. Whatever latitude, the Chairman had permitted since midnight, towards 3.30 a.m. he began, to make his rulings felt. Mi-. Langsloiie in tho space of five minutes several times found himself ordered to come back to the subject. "You will come to your point or resume your seat," the Chairman commanded, when Mr. Langstone again wandered into the by-ways. "yerj; TveUj I am coming, to .... tha

point," replied Mr. Langstone, but almost immediately he was again ruled out for indulging in tedious repetition. Mr. J. M'C'ombs: "A point of order. It would be of advantage to the House if we had a list of the items that you have ruled are tedious." The Chairman: "I will prepare that for the honourable gentleman." A moment later Mr. Langstone referred to the Prime Minister as a "political Mussolini, trying to browbeat the House." Mr. Chairman:' "Order! You will withdraw that." Mr. Langstono substituted tho term "bludgeon,", but again was obliged to withdraw. At 3.50 a.m. the Labour team which hnd been carrying tho talk along exhausted their "opportunities to speak, and a division was taken on the amendment. Sleeping members in and out of the Chamber were roused to wakefulness by the ringing of the bells, and I hose who had been reposing in convenient rooms entered tho Chamber yawning, some collarless, some clad in overcoats. Half awake, Mr. O'Brien caused a diversion by making for tho wrong lobby, where he found himself rubbing shoulders with Reform and United Party supporters. The amendment was lost by 23 votes to 37, Messrs. Wright, Black, and Fletcher voting with the Labour Party. A FRESH TURN—ADJOURNMENT. Mr. O'Brien then moved that the cut should affect only those Civil servants over the £275 a year mark. A hasty organised exit of Labour members at 4.10 a.m. deprived tho House of a' quorum, and slunibercrs were disturbed until the requisite number of members appeared. The Labour relay team of the previous afternoon now entered and began to carry the "stonewall" along till daylight A new turn to the argument wns introduced at 4.12 a.m. by Mr. Sullivan, who moved to report progress. "Let us knock off now and call it a day's work," remarked Mr. Fraser, in seconding. Mr. Parry suggested it was reasonable to report progress "in view of the commendable work we have done." He went on to present further reasons, and suggested that it was impossible for the country to know what was going on in tho House unless the Press reporters were in full attendance and able to report the proceedings fully. "I am very much concerned about the reporters," Mr. Parry professed, "and I suggest we should report progress to enable them to strengthen themselves and get some proper rest." Mr. Chairman: "I am afraid the honourable gentleman is not giving satisfactory reasons for reporting progress." Mr. Parry: "I thought .that was one of the best reasons wo have to submit." "Then I rule that it is not a valid reason," said the Chairman. "TIRED IN MIND." Mr. W. J. Jordan (Labour, Manukau) said he had a personal reason for agreeing with the suggestion. "I am tired," he drawled; "I am very tired." Tho Chairman: "The honourable gentleman has every right to sit down if he is tired." (Laughter.) Reform voices: "Hear, hear." Mr. Jordan: "That will rest my body, to some extent, but I am tired in my mind. (Laughter.) Some members may not be troubled with any mental tiredness, for obvious reasons. (Laughter.) .. . The Chief Government Whip, now, is trying to hold the benches for the Reform Opposition, and is sitting with the Chief Reform Whip. Perhaps he is mentally confused. His confusion will probably find expression in the legislation we pass. I suggest we repoKt progress so that we may have a rest, a wash, a shave, and generally fit ourselves for the important work we are called upon to engage in." A Reform voice: "And get our boots cleaned."' Mr. M'Combs complained about the atmosphere of the Chamber as a fitting reason for an adjournment, and suggested that some members would catch cold. "Out of consideration for tho health and proper rest of members," he said, "I think the proposal should bo agreed to." The Chairman: "I think the honourable gentleman is rather exhausting the health of members." (Laughter.) "LIKE A MENAGERIE." The appeal for an adjournment was carried on b^ Mr. Armstrong. "I did not bring a barber's shop witii me," ho said, "and when I look round I see many other members in tho same position."" Mr. Jordon: "Want a haircut?" Mr. Armstrong: "If wo go another twenty-four hours without going to a barber's shop," ho said, "this House will look more like a menagerie than anything else." He was perfectly satisfied that they were not sent to Parliament to conduct business under such conditions. Mr. A. W. Hall (Reform, Hauraki): "What about overtime?" Mr. Armstrong said that the members of the Reform Party could not be_ giving due consideration to the business before the House, as they were conspicuous by their absence. Mr. J. S. Fletcher (Independent, Grey Lynn) said that the electors of his constituency did not wish him to be in the House in the early hours of the morning. Thero wore gra\ Te issues before the House and they required a full attendance. Mr., Can- said that the. "wide awake" electors of Timaru did not desire the House to continue business in the manner it was doing. There was a danger of the House becoming' effete and open to public contempt if such a merciless drive on members wns continued by the Prime Minister. He had always stood for shorter hours of labour. A member: "And payment for overtime'?" "I trust the time of the House will not be further wasted by wearying debate," said Mr. Barnard, amidst "hear, hears" from the Reform and United benches. Mr. O'Brien complained that while Ihe motion to report progress was being discussed his motion was being ignored. He was ruled out on the ground of tedious' repetition when he commenced to discuss the health of members, and immediately shifted his argument to the state of the Chamber. "The Chamber itself is not a fit place in which to transact business at the present time," he said. "The messengers have been working since Monday, so has the Clerk of the House." A member: "They don't get overtime." Mr. O'Brien: "There is the Sergcant-at-Arms. The charwomen are waiting to clean this chamber, and I think we ought to adjourn in order that it nmy lie cleaned out. If we don't we will have another labour of Hercules. It will be a. bigger job than the cleaning of tho Augean stables." Mr. M'Combs's reason for an adjournment was to give facility for the introduction and printing of the privato Bills on the order paper. Mr. Mason had a Bill dealing with local elections. Mr. Mason: "It is most urgent." Mr. Armstrong complained that he was unable to keep pace with his correspondence, and he thought other members were in the same position. A Reform member: "No!" Mr. Armstrong: "No one would think of writing to the honourable member, but if anyone did he would only gel; 'no' for an answer." LABOUR MEMBER DISAGREES. Mr. W. Nash opposed the, motion to report progress because of the urgency, required, £05 ? bj|OEeS-t^a

House. He disagreed with the Bill, but knew that the Government wanted to got it through by Ist April." Mr. Armstrong: "April Pool's Day.'' Mr. Nash: "You know more about that than I do." Mr. Jordan: "Is it your birthday, Tim"?'' Mr. Fraser congratulated the Chairman on the liberal and orderly manner in which he had conducted the proceedings. He expressed concern for the strain put on the Press Gallery, but was ruled out of order. "If I am not allowed to express concern for the Press,'' said Mr. Fraser, '' I will leave Ihem to look after themselves. They are generally able to do that." At 6 a.m. Mr. Fraser moved that ihe House report progress "and ask leave to sit again." Mr. Armstrong welcomed the amendment as it would give some of the members opportunities to regain their memories. Some of them had so far lost their memories that they had been voting against their pledges. "1 have been out of the House for a few minutes, and when I left there was a motion before the House," said Mi-. M'Combs. "Now this has been amended and it just shows "what can be douo when I am away. I don't want to.,sit again on this Bill, and I can't congratulate the honourable member for Wellington Central on his amendment. (Laughter.) I nm sick of the Bill." Mr. Carr presented as a reason for reporting progress the fact that the messengers had not had an opportunity to ch\>,re the date calendars, which still showed "Wednesday's date. "And so," lie said feelingly, "we are living a lie." And so to breakfast. The report of the proceedings after breakfast* Apjjeais og aggfher!.gag^r^_jj