WARM WORDS

Evening Post, Volume CVIII, Issue 90, 12 October 1929, Page 9

WARM WORDS

P. AND T. SALARIES

XiABOTJR'S SINCERITY

AMENDMENT WITHDRAWN

As the result of the receipt of an assurance from the Prime Minister, .transmitted to the House through the Acting-Leader (the Hon. T. M. Wilford), that a statement would be made so soon as Sir Joseph Ward recovers from his illness, dealing with the general question of the salaries of Public Servants, an amendment moved by the Leader of the Labour Party in the House of Representatives yesterday relating to the salaries of Post and Telegraph employees was withdrawn. Before this course was agreed to, however, there was some warm talk between Mr.' A. M, Samuel, Reform member for Thames, and the Labour Party.

Continuing his speech after "The Post" went to press, Mr. W. D. Lysnari (Ind. Kef orm, Gisborne) said that if the Government gave way to the de»iand of the Labour Party to restore -the "cuts" made in 1922 it would be discredited throughout the country. It was the agitators—(laughter)—who ■were using the "cuts" for propaganda purposes. The "cuts" could- not be restored yet, as the-country was not leady for it. . ' Mr. P. Fraser (Labour, Wellington Central) asked Mr. Samuel, whose comments oh the Labour Leader's request to withdraw the amendment were reported in yesterday's "Post," if he would be prepared to go into-the lobby on his own—the speaker hoped Mr. Samuel would be on his own—to refuse the request of a sick man in the person of a Prime Minister. The Acting- ■ Leader of the House. had brought in a request from a sick Prime Minister, who had stated quite definitely that if he was given the opportunity he would make a full statement of the Government's attitude; ■;. A. Keform member: ."He. would get away with anything on that."j NOTHING WOULD BE LOST. .Mr. Fraser: "The Prime Minister is prepared to give it as soon as he is able to "come back to attend 'to his du-.ies and to allow a full opportunity ■to debate the whole- question of the Government's policy in regard to the restoration of the 'cuts' in the Public servants' wages.'' ' Nothings would be lost, a3 they would be able to resume : the discussion where they left it off. He asked Mr. Samuel whether he or any of his colleagues was prepared to disregard the request of the Prime Mvaistr. Mr. Fraser was sure that Mr. Coates and the front benches of the Keform Party would not take up a similar attitude. Mr. Samuel: "I always ■ speak - for myself." - Mr. Fraser: "And represents himself efficiently in this matter." (Laughter.) He again asked Mr. Samuel whether he wanted to put himself on record as the only person in the House vrUo would be so particularly mean as to deny the Prime Minister's request. The Chairman of Committees (Mr. S. G. Smith): "Order!" Mr. Fraser: "Particularly limited as to deny the request of a sick Prime Minister." •.- ■ ■ ..■■■- -: ■'-; Alt. Samuel said it was obvious to him that Mr. Fraser was extremely .afraid of the amendment which had been moved by his own party. Mr. Fraser: "Oh, no." '. ■ Mr. Samuel: "He: is afraid that that -amendment will be put to the house." The Chairman: "Ordorl I do not think that the hon. member is in order in suggesting that another hon. member lacks courage." " Mr. Samuel: "I do not know in what other way I can say it, but I will say he fears .the result, which is the same thing in other words. It is obvious that he fears the putting of the amendment which was moved in all sincerity by his own leader. He is sheltering himself now behind tho Leader of,thc House, who is ill. When this.amendment was moved the Leader of the House was ill, and a statement was made by the Postmaster-General which was exactly the same as that made by the Minister of' Defence. Now, this .matter has gone so far that the Labour • Party are afraid that members on this side-will assist them in having this amendment carried.- They can see that they are on dangerous ground, and they are making all kinds of puerilo excuses to get away from it. They have had opportunity after opportunity of moving amendments of this kind i when, there was a chance of having them carried and of being some good to the Labour Party whom they profess to represent, and they dropped every one of them. They have wasted days and days of the' country's time which has to be paid for." Mr. Holland: "What has that to do with the hon. gentleman?" ','NOT SINCERE." Mr. Samuel: "Here is an opportunity for them to do some good for the workers of this country and they will not adopt it. Here is an amendment which, if carried/ would involve the country in an expenditure of £.150,000 or £200,000 and they are afraid to go on with it becauso they fear that the consequences may be embarrassing to the Government. I say again, and I will say it on every possible occasion} and I. will not be put down by the member for Wellington Central, that they were not sincere when they moved .that amendment. They had no desire and no \ intention of carrying it to a logical and- definite conclusion." ' Mr. H. .J. Armstrong' (Labour, ■Christchurch East) 4lid not think there was any need to; get excited over tho matter. In view of tho statement which had been made an behalf'of tho Prime Minister, it would bo most cowardly for the Labour'Party'to persist in its amendment. ■ . Mr. Samuel: "Most solicitous." v Mr. Armstrong said Mr. Samuel was anxious to use the Labour Party as his tool for putting the Government out of office. Mr. J. T. Hogan (Ind., Kaugitikoi) said the Prime Minister had made a very reasonable statement, and he thought that now they might very reasonably get on with the other business. He was absolutely satisfied with the Government's statement, and if the amendment went to a division ho would vote against it. The amendment should not be treated as one of no-confidonco in the Government. "NOT A TIME FOE SYMPATHY." : Mr. H. S. 8. Kyle (Beform, Kiccarton) said the House had reached an extraordinary state of affairs. "We have the Postmaster-General acclaiming that he is not a politician but a business man," said Mr. Kyle, "but here, when a business matter is be.fore the House, he makes the excuse that he can't do anything until tho Prime Minister comes back. This is not a time to bring sympathy into tho question, and I am surprised at tho Leader of the House raising tho issue. If ■the Government is not prepared to carry on tho business of the country, then it Bhould resign and allow somebody else to take charge. Why should the Government, with the assistance of the Labour Party, be allowed to

dominate the country as it is doing at the present time? Because the Leader of the Labour Party sees he has placed the Government in an awkward position, he asks leave to withdraw the amendment. Mr. F. Lye (United, Waikato): "A very graceful act." Mr. Kyle: "It is no use bringing sympathy into it when we are handling the affairs of the country. lam not prepared to see the amendment withdrawn without a division. We have nothing to fear. It is a very bad thing for this country that such a political position has arisen. Surely the Leader of the House, with his knowledge of the Standing Orders and his thirty years' experience, could assist the Postmaster-General in giving a general outline of the Government's intentions." Mr. E. Semple (Labour, Wellington Bast): "Why didn't you do the job?" Mr. Kyle: ''I'll do the job if you'll put me there." Mr. Holland said that, as Leader of the Labour Party, he had never yet refused to meet the Leader of the House when a request had been made. He had followed out that principle when Mr. Massey was Prime Minister and had withdrawn amendments when he was sick. For that he had received Mr. Massey's personal thanks. He had also been thanked by Sir Francis Bell for meeting Mr. Massey when ,that gentleman was ill. In the present ease he had moved an amendment to stress the Labour Party's position and-to endeavour to get the Government'to carry out the Labour Party's to the electors'at the last election. No definite statement •had been made up to that time. Unfortunatelyi he had been called out of the Chamber before . the PostmasterGeneral spoke that morning and he did not' get back until Mr. Donald had nearly finished. Consequently he did not hear his statement. Mr. Samuel: "I did'not know that." WHAT WITHDRAWAL MEANS. Mr. Holland: "That was tho position. Later, when the Minister in charge of the House intimated that he had seen the Prime Minister and that he was desirous that this matter should stand over pending his recovery, so that he could make a statement to the House, I took the same attitude as I did when I had dealings with Mr. Massey, and as I would have done with Mr. Coates had he been similarly placed as Prime Minister. I, for one, will always be prepared'to live up to the ordinary courtesies and decencies in connection with these matters. • AH this means is an adjournment to meet the wishes of the Prime Minister, who is ill, and who has stated that he will make a full statement which 'we will have the opportunity of discussing. If that is not ■ satisfactory, all that will happen will be that the amendment will be moved again and the Labour Party will not recede froir the position it has taken up. If his statement is satisfactory to the Public Service, it will, of course, be satisfactory to members of the House, and if the policy of the Government is not satisfactory, well, then, the Labour Party will bo free to move its amendment again and will not hesitate to do it. I could not imagine anyone in this House voting to refuse the withdrawal of this amendment in the circumstances that exist. If. I had done that in Mr. Massoy's time every hon. gentleman on tho Kcform benches would have decried, and rightly' decried, my attitude. Tho Labour Party surrenders no right at all in acceding to the request of the Prime Minister." We reserve the right to come again. However, if these hoh. gentlemen are satisfied that tho courtesies of this kind shall be refused then it is open for them to force a division on the matter, and I for one will welcome the division if they force it. But tho decent and courteous thing to do is to meet the wishes of the Prime Minister in tho matter, seeing that we surrender no right whatever. " Mr. Coates said,he thought most of the Kef m members had been satisfied w'.th the statement made in tho morning by tho Postmaster-General with reference to- reclassification and tc tho Government's .intentions to make a statement. The Kef orm Party had certainly no intention, nor did it wish to make it .appear that it wanted to do so, of taking advantage of the Prime Minister's indisposition. They hoped he would be back in the Houso in a few days. ' ' /'• ' NO DISCOURTESY-MEANT. Mr. Samuel, said 'he had no desire to be discourteous to tho Prime .Minister during his absonco through illness. Ho sincerely regretted that Sir Joseph Ward was laid up and hoped that ho would soon be back in tho House. A*,'-labour member: "You are apologising." ( Mr. Samuel: "Pardon!" Mr. W. L. Martin (Labour, Raglan): "I .-Jn't speak, don't look at me." Mr. Samuel said ho was surprised that the amondment had heeit moved before tho Postmaster-General had had time to make a statomeut on the Government's' policy in connection -with the matter. He had also stated that he was also surprised that after the .Postmaster-General had made his statement, which was identical with that delivered by the Acting-Leader of the Houso on behalf of the Prime Minister, that the Leader of ''the Labour Party had then withdrawn his amendment. . He accepted the statement by the Leader of the Labour Party that he was absent when the PostmasterGeneral made, his statement, and as far as he was concerned that cleared the matter up. Ho wished the House to understand that ho never had any desire to be discourteous to tho Primo Minister nor to any other! incmbor of the House.

The amendment was withdrawn, tho Postmaster-General stating that tho Prime Minister's statement would bo made before roclassification was given effect to.