NEW ZEALAND PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES.

Daily Southern Cross, Volume XXIII, Issue 3134, 5 August 1867, Page 4

NEW ZEALAND PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES.

THURSDAY, JULY 18. , The Speaker took the chair at 2 p.m. PETITION. r - Mr. T. Maofablane presented a petition from certain merchants in Auckland praying for an alteration in the duty on coffee. Mr. Cableton presented a petition from John Jones, of Ot»go, praying for compensation in a land claim. Mr. Farmer presented a petition from the inhabitants of Raglan, in the province of Auckland, complaining that they did not get a fair share of the provincial revenue, and praying for the abolition of provincial institutions , and the formation of municipalities under the administration of the General Government. The petitions were received. ELECTION BY BALLOT. Mr. Reynolds moved, "That, with) a view to establish a more satisfactory method of recording the votes of electors for members of the House of Representatives and Provincial Councils, it is desirable that such votes should be taken by ballot, and that a bill be brought in for this purpose." The present Act was liable to be very much tampered with as the poll clerks could insert names that had not been voted for. The present Aot alio enoouraged indirect bribery through the appointment of electioneering agents, and the employment of others whose votes were thus secured . He knew that there was a strong opposition to the ballot, and he would not have brought it forward bad he known he was so much in the minority. Voting by ballot was by no meaaa a new thing, but one generally adopted in clubs and societies. He believed the ballot would prevent any undue influence on the voters through a bias of business or friendship. Mr. Haughton seconded the motion. The Speaker said that it would be more inaooordance with the practice of the House if the words, " and that a bill be brought in for this purpose," be struck oat. The mover consented to have the words struck out. The Hon. the Premier said he would cordially support the motion. They would hear the argument against it that it was un-English, but the laws of the home oountry must undergo some change in these minor matters. The proper time to consider the question would be on the second reading of the bill. He (the Premier) then spoke of the opinions > of the late Chancellor of the Exchequer on the point, and concluded by hoping that the House would give the matter their deep consideration. Mr. J. O'Neill suggested that a medium course should be taken, as the present system was most unsatisfactory, and the ballot one would be equally offensive. The Government would reoeiye suggestions in a short time, from the chief returning officer in Auckland, as to alterations in the present Act. The Hon. J. C. .Richmond said he would support the motion on the present occasion, with a view to its discussion on a future occasion. The Hon. Colonial Treasurer was opposed to the question itself, and considered it was a thing to be much regretted that the House should waste the public money by lengthened discussions at the wrong time. At home the labourer looked up to and was in the power of the employer, but in this colony it was reversed, and the same undue pressure could not be brought to bear to obtain votes. Mr. Carleton objected to discussing the bill at the then time. He held the opinions of the last speak, as to the inadvisability of the ballot system of elections. Mr. Borlase opposed the motion. Mr. Graham was in favour of allowing the bill to be introduced. Mr. W. W. Taylor considered that it was more desirable to have the law as at present, as it was not desirable that the votes of electors should be secret but open. The Hon. the Postmaster-General said that he looked on the exercise of the franchise as a public trust, and the way in which it was exercised should be known to the electors and the elected. Mr. Paterson regretted that his hon. colleague the member for Dunedin should have brought this motion forward, as his experience in tho same town, as the hon. member did not lead him to see the desirability of voting for the resolution. Mr. Wood said he would support the resolution. He had given this question very grave consideration, and had come to the decision that the ballot was the most desirable way of taking the votes. As it was found that pressure was brought bear on electors in many oases, they should set themselves to correct that defect. Mr. Reeves said that, from his experience, |the general wish of his constituents was that the ballot system should be adopted, as it would remove the pressure put on them. Mr. HoLL said this was a question annually brought up to be annually defeated. He hoped that it would meet with .a similar fate now. The people of New Zealand had never expressed a wish for such a measure as this j until they did there was no necessity for any legislation on it. Mr. Vogel deprecated tho present system, and wasinfavourof the ballot system, which hadanswered so admirably in Victoria as a convenient mode of registering rotea. He would support the resolution. Mr. Ludlam opposed the resolution. Mr. Atkinson stated his intention of opposing the resolution in its present form. Mr. Main said that he would move an amendment that the resolution be altered to ask leave to bring in a bill affirming this principle. The Speaker said that such an amendment would be so completely different from the original motion that it could hardly be allowed. Mr. Main then said that he hoped the member for Dunedin would withdraw his resolution in favour of such a one an he proposed. Major Cargill said that he was in favour of the resolution, but thought if electors were to be protected in voting they should be protected from such telegrams as he had seen in the Otago Daily Times concerning the action of the present Government. Mr. Reynolds made a few remarks in reply, after which he withdrew the resolution. HOUSI COMMITTEE. An ad interim report of this oommittee was brought up and read. PAPERS. The Hon. J. C. Richmond laid on the table correspondence between Major Richardson and Mr. Doyle. GOLD DUTY. Mr. Haughton moved, "That leave be granted to bring in a bill to amend the Gold Duty Act, 1858, with the view of lessening the amount of the duty." The object of the bill was to reduce the duty to 6d. an ounce. The Hon. the Postmaster General said the Government would not oppose the introduction of the bill, but would not pledge themselves to support it. Leave was granted, and the bill was read a firat time. HONOBABIUM TO MEMBERS. Mr. Cracroit Wilson, C.8., moved, " That[in the opinion of tnis House the total amount of honorarium to be drawn by any member shall not exceed, for the present session of 1867, the sum of £50. That no member be permitted to draw any honorarium at a higher rate thun 10s. per diem, and that no honorarium on any pretence whatever be paid, save on the day of prorogation of the Assembly. That after the present session the payment of honorarium to members shall cease." His reason in making this motion was the absolute necessity for economy at the present time. He did not wish to go into the principle as to whether members should be paid, but he thought that the House should commence by practising that economy which they were going to preach. Last session the sum of £7,000 had been expended in honorariums to members. In America it had been found that paying per diem was very pernicious, and it was much better" to give a lump sum, as he now proposed. He would move each resolution separately. The Hon. the Colonial Treasurer said that he agreed with the principle involved in the resolution, but he would not wish to see it carried into operation this session. Any alterations made should have a prospective and not a retrospective effect. If the hon. member agreed with these remarks, the Government would be prepared to brißg down a bill next session, fixing the maximum sum to be paid to members, and reducing the sum paid to Ids. a-day. He was no advocate for throwing thegoverning power into the handtof the rich alone, and he thought they should give • certain assistance to enable members to pay their expenses. If the hon. mover agreed to this he might withdraw his motion, on the assurance of the Government that the bill should be brought in. Mr. O'Neill said he would support the motion. Mr. Reynolds moved that the Speaker leave the chair. He for one would not come to Wellington and give his money as well as bis time in the service of the people. It was hardly to be expected. He must object to legislating for the country by contract, for that was what it amounted to. Mr. G. Graham was in favour of the resolution. If members were in earnest in laving let them begin with themselves, . .

Mr. Ludlam wu oppoMd to the resolution, and hoped the mover would withdraw it on the pledge of the Government. < Mr. Hull caid that if the reiolation were carried he would move as a rider that the auditors be not paid. Tha Hon. the Colonial Tbbasuber said that these payments were regulated by law, and oould not be altered by a mere resolution of the House. Mr. Reynolds said that he considered the Audit Act was a disgrace to the Statute Book, and might be amended in so far as the payment of members went. He for one would be prepared to act as Auditor for nothing, and twenty other members could be found to do the same. The Hon. the PostmasterGenbbai, urged the desirability of withdrawing the resolution. Mr. Bunnt said that if the Government would show retrenchment in their expenses, and assured the House that the money to members could not be spared, they would give it up cheerfully until better tunes jame round. It was insulting the House to talk of giving members 10s. a day. The length of the session did not depend on private members, but on how the Government pushed the business forward. Mr. Craobott WtLgoN, C.8., would leave the withdrawal or not of the resalution.in the hands of the House, The House then adjourned till seven o'olock. On resuming, the House proceeded to the |orders of the day. APPEALS FROM JUSTICES BILL. This bill was read a aeoond time, and ordered to be committed next day. MEDICAL PRACTITIONERS BILL. The Hon. the Posthastes-General moved the second reading of this bill, and in doing so said that several provisional bills of this kind had been passed. The object of the bill was to place the medical profession on a proper footing in the colony, and to constitute a medical board who should examine the diplomas of those stating themselves to be medical practitioners, and give certificates enabling those gentlemen to recover at courts of law for medical attendance. Mr. J. O'Neill said that this should have been left to the provincial institutions. He doubted also | whether, under the 19th clause of this < Act, the colony could fine a licentiate of the King's and Queen's College of Physicians of England, because he practised without a certificate from a New Zea- | land medical board. Also the country was anxious for retrenchment, and under this Act they would be creating several new paid officers. I Mr. Borlasb objected to the second reading o_ the bill. The want spoken of had already been sup* plied by provincial legislation. This he regarded a another interference with the powers of the provinces, and to oentralise the legislation where it was not necessary. This was an extravagant and unnecessary sort of legislation. He hoped the House would not have these unnecessary bills forced upon them. Mr. Maoandbew was opposed to the bill as quite unnecessary. Mr. Carleton aaid he would support the bill, as the House must draw the distinction between local self-government and centralisation. There should be absolute uniformity in bills of this kind throughout the country. He had long urged upon the House the desirability of having a Police Bill for the whole colony instead of for each separate province. Mr. G, Graham said he would oppose the bill, as there was no provision made for homceopathists, and on that ground alone. Why should he forced to take beastly medicines when he believed that a doctor who had not an English diploma would do him more good ? Mr. Hauohton said that the House might take into their consideration whether this bill met with the wishes of the medical profession, Now, he could say that they were in its favour. At present, if a member of the profesion went from one province to another, he liad to p»y a fresh fee in each province. Hon. members of provincial tendencies were always making every bill that came before them questions of provincialism versus centralism. Let members consider this bill on its merits, or let this question be done away with at once by the ultra-provincialista bringing down some question when this matter could be finally decided for the session, instead of bickering over every measure brought before the House. Mr. Williamson said he was not an ultra-pro-vincialist, and he did not believe there was suen a party in the House. There was a provincial and a colonial party, to the former of which he belonged. A question on which the two parties oould tight would come on in a few days, and the House could then proceed on one or the other basis. Until that question had been brought on, let the House postpone all these discussions on minor points. If the colonial party won the day, then he would be prepared to consider this and similar bills on their merits. But let the Government not attempt this nipping away bit by bit of provincial institutions and provincial rights, He trusted that the Government would allow the Medical Bill and the Fire Protection Bill to be postponed until Wednesday next, by which time he would promise, on the part of the provincial party, that the question on which the parties could try their Btrengfch would be brought forward. (Hear, hear.) He moved the adjournment of the debate to WedHesday next. The Hon, the Postmaster-Genebai. said that the Government would yield to the adjournment. Nothing could he more absurd than to raise the question of infringement of provincial rights on an innocent little bill like this. The provincial party were not strengthening their causa by raising these frivolous objections. As to what had been said concerning the inoreaiing the number of officers, he would say that this Government would reduce the number of officers, as they would have one instead of nine Medical Boards. Mr. Ludlam made a few remarks. Mr. Vogel said that if this bill were carried it would affect all different occupations which had to pay licenses or feeß. Auctioneers, publicans, &c, would have colonial laws made for them by the General Government, and the power of imposingjthe taxes would be taken from the provinces, The debate was then adjourned to Wednesday next. CGBONBRS BILL. The Hon. the Postmastbb-General moved the first reading of this bill, which consolidated the laws relating to coroners. — Agreed to. ' CORONERS BILL. The Coroners Bill was read a second time. BRITISH AUSTRALASIAN MAIL SEBVIOB BILL. The House went into committee to consider certain clauses of the British- Australian Mail Service Bill, which were agreed to, and the House resumed. The resolution of the committee was put and agreed to. FIRE PROTECTION BILL. The Hon, J. Hall said the Government had come to the conclusion that the provisions of this bill could best be embodied in the Municipal Corporations Bill, and moved jbhat the order be discharged from the motion paper. WATS AND JIKANS. In Committee of Ways and Means, The Colonial Treasurer moved that, in order to make good the supply to ba granted to her Majesty out of the ordinary revenue of the colony, the sum of £100,000 be appropriated. Mr. Yo&el said in the Appropriation Act which had been put in hon. member?' pigeon-holes the words " other acts" were very indefinite, and it was quite possible that by means of them the £100,000 might be made to go much further than was intended by the House. It was clear that, if the Appropriation Act were passed in iti present shape, the Government were not bound to pay the three-eighths to the provinces. He should like to see a schedule attached to the bill, showing how the money wm to be applied. He made this suggestion in no hostile spirit to the Government. The Colonial Treasurer said he was quite willing to anticipate the hon. gentleman's wishes. Th« words were usually inserted in the permanent Ap- i propriation Act?, though he regarded them as mere surplusage. The resolution was agreed to, and on the House resuming was received and read a second time. The Appropriation Act was then brought in and read a first tune. AUDITORS. The Speaker stated that, under the 10th section of the Audit Act, he appointed next Tuesday as the day for the election of the auditors of the public aocounts of the colony. • HONOBAKIUM TO lIXMBIRS. The debate on this subject was resumed. Mr. C. Wilson- stated that he was perfectly willing to accept the proposal of the Government. After some discussion, Mr. Reynolds's amendment was lost on division :— Ayes, 32 j noes, 9. The House then resumed. RESIDENT MAGISTRATES. Leave was granted to the Hod. J. Hall to bring in a bill to consolidate and amend the laws relating | to Resident Magistrates, and to the jurisdiction of Justices of the Peace in their civil jurisdiction, The bill was read a first time. BANKRUPTCY LAW COMMITTEE. The Hon. J. TT*t.t. moved that a select committee be appointed to inquire and report as to the operation of the bankruptcy law of the colony, and to make suoh recommendations as the subject may seem to require, That suoh committee oonsiit of Mr, ,

Reynolds, Mr. Reeves, M-. «. Mtofarlao, Mr. CargiU, Mr. Brandon, Mr. Ctutij, Mr. A. Atkiiuon, Mr. T. Macfrrlane, Mr. W. lay lor, and the morw; and that it have power to calf far peraom ftnd papen three to be a quorum. The motion was carried noanimoanly. The Home then adjourned at 10.10 p.m.

FRIDAY, JULY 19. The Speaker took the ohair at 2 o'clock. JAMBS. The Colonial Secretary laid anon the table th« > report of Major Edwards on the owe of H. Bauok*. The Hon, J. Hall laid upon the table farther papers relatire to the Cook's Straits telegraph. THE CONVICT GBIEVANCI. Mr. Campbell asked the Colonial Seoretary. «• Whether he is aware that the Government of Tas« mania is in the habit of granting conditional pardon* to conviots under sentence, on oondiSion of thexrimmediately leaving that oolony ; and, if so> whethe* he intendi taking anystepi to prevent their coming:- • to New Zealand." He did so because he had re* ceived information that convicts bad bsen granted conditional pardons by the Government of Tasmania, on condition that they should leave the colony j and; many^of them had come to New Zealand. Since ho had put the question on the notice paper, he had heard that a number of convicts from Western Australia, with conditional pardons, had arrived iv Otago ; and that the Government of that oolony had paid their passages. The Colonial Secretary said that, in reference to Tasmania, the Government had no recent information on vhe subject ; but they had been aware for some years that it was the practice of the Tasmanian , Government to grant conditional pardons to oonviots on condition that they should leave the oolony. Remonstrance* had been addressed to that Govern* ment without avail, as they were backed up by the <„ Imperial Government. He doubttd the correctness of the hon. member's information respecting Western , Australia, as he did not believe the Government of that colony gave conditional pardons. The Govern* ; ment would address a communication to the Govern* > ment of Western Australia on the subject. No Act . could be passed to prevent the landing of convicts, ' although one might be framed so as to fine captains , of vessels for bringing them over. Mr. Campbell remarked that conditional pardons from the Government of Western Australia h,a.& been, found on some of the convicts. 1 Mr. C. WiqsQN was astonished to hear that the British Government had connived at Buch a prq? ceeding. THE CASH OZ 1 MB. H. BAUOKI. Mr. Haughton asked the Colonial Secretary whether the Government had any objection tq lay upon the table the report of the Commissioner sent; to the Chatham Islands to investigate the case of H, Baucke. The Colonial Secretary replied that the report had been already laid upon the table. ; NEW MKMBZB. Mr. Tbavebs took the oath and his seat for- • Christohurch City. . c DELEGATION 0? POWERSMr. Campbell asked the Colonial Seoretary what . > course the Government intended to take with respect to the delegation of powers to the Superintendent 0f , . . Otago under the Diseased Cattle Act and Marine > , Board Act. » *■ The Colonial Secretary replied that the Go- r vernment were prepared to take the same action f with regard to these two Aots as they had already taken with regard to the Goldfields Lot. > SHIRE COUNCILS BILL. Mr. Caboill said he had seen in a colonial news* , , paper a minute description of the Shire Councils Bill, and he wished to know if the Government considered it was fair to withhold such information from hon. members of that House. The Colonial Secretary said the .bill was not complete at the present moment, and it had therefore been impossible for the Government to lay the bill before the House. The bill had only been seen by the members of the Government, the AttorneyGeneral, and the printers. The information in the paper must have come from the printing office, by what means he knew not, but means which must be more or less discreditable. PLBURO-PNEUMONIA. Mr. Vogil asked whether the Government would have any objection to place the inspectors of cattle at Otago provisionally under the orders of the Pro* vincial Government until the Government bill was was brought down. Pleuro-pneumonia was in the. province, and. required to be dealt with at once. The Colonial Secretary said there were existing regulations issued by the late Superintendent of Otago about'pleuro-pneumonia which seemed to meet ■ the wants of the case. (temporabt) appropriation bill. The Colonial Treasurer moved the. second reading of the (Temporary) Appropriation BUI. 1 he bill was read a seoond time and committed. On the Ist clause being read, Mn Vogel moved, that the following words be added :— c 'provided sta.| such sum [£100,000] shall include the payment tig the provinces monthly of three-eighths of tfte Customs revenue." After a lengthy discussion the motion was put and. • lost on the voices, and the clause as it original? stood put and carried. The other clause was passed, and the bill reported* APPEALS FROM JUSTICES B^LL. At the suggestion of Mr. A. S. Atkinson, the committal of this bill was postponed. CORONERa B.ILL. The House went into committee on the Coroners. Bill, and passed several clauses. POSTPONEMENT. The seoond reading of the British-Australasian Mail Service Bill, and third reading of the Steam Navigation Act Amendment Bill, were postponed. DISQUALIFICATION BILL.. Mr. Eeynolds asked for leave to introduce 4 b\\\ for better securing the freedom and independence o\ Parliament. He said the bill was intended to have the same effect as one introduced by the Colonial Secretary in 1865, respecting officers holding Govern* menfc appointments. Leave was given, and the bill read a first time* TREASURY BILLS. Mr. Campbell moved that a return be la;d on the table showing the amount of Treasury Bills issued by the Colonial Treasurer, the price realised for the same, and a list of persons to whom they have been issued. The return was ordered, GOLDFIELDS ACT AMENDMENTS ACT. The Colonial Secretary moved for leave to bring in a bill intituled ' ' An Act to amend the Gold* fields Act, 1866." The bill was to give legal effect to the intentions of the Government as expressed the -" other evening to Mr. Vogel. It would authorise the delegation of powers to the Executive of Otago. , " Leave was given. > ■ COMMITTEE OF SELECTION. On the motion of Mr. Carleton, a Committed of ' Selection was appointed, consisting of Mr. Brandon, Mr. O'Eorke, Mr. Ormond, Mr. Cox, and the mover. ' ' JOINT COMMITTEE ON STANDING ORDERS, Mr. Carleton moved that Mr. Dillon Bell, Mr. ■ Reynolds, and Mr. Wells be appointed to the Joint Committee on Standing Orders. — Carried. JOINT COMMITTEE ON PRIVATE BILLS, On the motion of Mr. Cableton, Mr. George,, Macfarlan and Mr. O'Borke were appointed to the Joiot Committee on Private Bills, ■ j ; ' '''J HOUSE COMMITTEE. ' '• On the motion of Mr. Clare, the House resolved -_' itself into committee to consider the report of the- '- House Committee. Ihe report recommended that A y \ l Speaker's gallery should be erected over the Ministerial benches, access to be obtained through the' ' reporters' gallery. The estimated cost is £60/ ' ' ■/? After some discussion the House Committee was' ' v ; instructed to confer with the Reporting Committee/' 1 , on the probability of finding other accommodation;*'^ for the reporters than that now provided, and.' '^ further, respecting the privileges to which members •"* of the Legislative Council are entitled 'as regai'ds. sitting accommodation in the House. * '" Li INSOLVENCY LAWS COMMITTEE. ' ?,-' J On the motion of the Hon. J. Hall, Mr. Trayersj and Mr. Stevens were added to the Insolvency Laws na Committee. °' •" The House then adjourned at 5.30 p ( m.