TRANSPORT CONTROL

Dominion, Volume 29, Issue 200, 21 May 1936, Page 10

TRANSPORT CONTROL

State and Private Enterprise DEBATE ON BILL Fear of Dictatorial Powers Before full galleries and microphones switched on for broadcasting members of the House of Representatives con tinned the second reading dehate on the Transport Licensing Amendment Bill last night. "The .situation creates In my mind the picture of the scaffold," said Mr. AV. J. Broadfoot (Opposition, Waitomo), who was the first speaker. “The hangman is talking to his victim. He says ’I want to do everything possible for you. lam not prepared Io discuss the principles of why you are to be hanged, but • am prepared to discuss the texture of Hie rope, the fitting of the noose and the distance of the drop.’ "The motor operators are on the scaffold,” added Mr. Broadfoot. "1 leave it to the judgment of the House who is the hangman." Attitude of Operators. The Minister of Transport. Hon. R. Semple, bad stated that the operators were favourable to tlie principles of the Bill, Mr. Broadfoot continued. Several operators who were present at the conferences with . the Minister had stated that they were told that principles in the Bill would not be discussed or altered, but that the Minister was prepared to listen to suggestions for improvements in the machinery clauses. The Minister of Finance, lion. AV. Nash, had approached a dairy conference recently in just the same spirit. Apparently principles could not be questioned. In the co-ordina-tion and control of transport, New Zealand compared more than favourably with tlie rest of the world. It was Hie Government’s function to control transport, but: not to step in and take over all services to itself. The .State could lie pushed into starting uneconomic road services just as it was forced into starting uneconomic railways in the past. Private enterprise had to achieve efficiency because it could not load its losses on to the State.

"People must not be misled by the catch-phrase that transport is a public service' and not: an industry,” Mr. Broadfoot. said, "if it. is treated as a social service the public exchequer can be pillaged to make it pay. “The -Minister will not possibly be able to attend to all the appeal work under the Bill.” Mr. Broadfoot, continued. "The job will he done b.v some departmental officer, and it is a thousand fo one that the Minister will never see the evidence in any appeal sent on to him for his decision. But he dannot be challenged. Ho is the All Highest. He is a synthetic Caesar. Even Caesar's best friend. Brutus, destroyed him. anti under the Bill the, Minister's best friend, the Minister of Railways, is given power to destroy him. The Minister of Transport can he domininated by the Minister of Railways.”

In a speech the previous night, Mr. J, Thorn (Opposition, Thames) had said that in Great Britain t.lie filial court of appeal in transport eases wtis the Minister of Transport. That applied only to passenger services; goods services were . under an independent tribunal, 'i’lie railways in Great Britain were privately owned, but in New Zealand the Minister niti-4: always have a bias toward Hie State-owned railways. That was the overthrow of the principle that anyone exercising judicial functions should lie free from bias.

"The whole Bill is it retrograde step,” said Mr. Broadfoot. "AVc are going backward and downward with the brakes out: of action. If we could create tribunals elected by Hie people to handle transport in particular areas, just as the electric power boards operate to-day, there would be some safeguard, but safeguards are to be swept overboard. It is well for the people to realise (hat they are faced b.v a Government which is putting Socialism into operation at an alarming rate, and it is well for them to wake up, be militant, and resist.” Interests of Society. "There is no question in which society is so interested as transport,” said Air. J. A. Lee (Government, Grey Lynn), the I’arliamentary Under-Sec-retary to the Prime Alinister. “Transport and civilisation go hand in Hand. No private individual lias the right tc come between the people who built the roads and railroads between our towns and cities and hold up to ransom those who have been taxed to pay for these services.” Air. Lee devoted most of his speech to a criticism of tlie speech made the previous evening by Hie Rt. Hon. J. G. Coates (Op)iositioii, Kaipara). “I can be excused if 1 neglect Hie sprat from AVaitomo, for I want, to go for tlie mackerel from Kaipara,” lie said. Mr Coates liad condemned the Bill as socialistic. No one was deterred today by the use of tlie term socialist. 'Die late King George liad said tn.it we were all socialists. Mr. Coates condemned tlie present legislation, but conveniently forgot what was done by the Government of which be was a leading member. AA'hen tlie member for Kaipara was Prime Alinister he set up an Am-kland Transport Board, giving it the sole right of transport. . Tliat board was given a monopoly in Auckland for -lie transport of tlie people, ami given tne rigid to determine. if it liked Hint no other competitor should

run against it. Tlie Minister of Transport, Hon. R. Semple, was tak- , ing that right away from a small ; group of people in Hie position of dictators and restoring it Io the people and Parliament. Mr. Coates was a socialist dictator, but Mr. Semple was a socialist democrat giving effect to a policy for which the present Goverul ment. had received a mandate from the people. The very principle for which Mi. Coates once stood was denounced by him as an invasion of the rights of the people. No one could accuse the member for Kaipara of preaching what he practised. "Can it lie said the existing Transport Co-ordination Board is non-poli-tu-al?’’ asked Mr. Lee. "I have nothing against the estimable gentlemen who I have been members of that board, but | let us see how mm-politieal they are. ; Sir Stephen Allen is an ex-anti- , Socialist candidate, and certainly he lias shown no desire to assist tlie Lai hour Party. Mr. 11. B. S. Johnstone is a squatter and Mr. Lisle Anderton is chairman of a Reform organisation, liven if tlie squatter were a Socialist, and that is not likely, tlie politicians had a majority on tlie board, if a per- ' .-.on is a member of the Reform organ- ' i tsation then he acts in the public iu- ' forest, actuated by noble motives, but if he i< socialistically inclined and only giving effect to a policy he pledged hitiisdl before Hie people to put. into operation we are told it is political control." Mr. Coates: Ho you apply that to the chairman of the Unemployment Board? National Control. Mr. Lee said that even under the Coalition 80 per cent, of our transport was socialistically governed. When there was so much that was social in our transport system why not a little socialistic control? The Bill provided for national control of transport by a responsible Minister. If there had been that years ago millions would have been saved for New Zealand —millions, that liad been dumped in harbours that silted up as quickly as they were excavated. “Surely it is necessary that the State should determine who is to run services In tlie air?” said Mr. Lee in referring to the section of the Bill dealing with air services. “Surely we are not going to allow private interests to corner the air? Under intelligent State control we can visualise tlie day when we will be able to control services across the Tasman. This is more than a trans-port-question-—it is a defence question. There is a day coming when iieople from Australia will spend the weekend in New Zealand and vice versa. If we pass this Bill and develop services in the air as we should, with proper national control of air transport, the mistakes of tlie past will be avoided and it will not be necessary to buy back from private interests tlie right to use the air overhead." Efficiency of Private Enterprise. Tlie assertion that the Slate had many times failed to operate profitably motor transport services which had later been successfully run by private enterprise was made by Mr. 11. S. S. Kyle (Opposition, Riecarton). Ho held that private enterprise wa.s quite capable of carrying on existing transport services, and suggested that ilie provisions of Hie Bill offered one of the means of tlie socialisation of distribution which Labour had spoken of. “The member for Grey Lynn lias slated during Hiis debate that if this Bill is tlie socialisation of the means of distribution, then tlie Government was given a mandate to do it at the general election in November,” Mr. Kyle said. "Bui. I doubt very much if Hie members of the present Government did tell tlie people then that they were going 1o socialise distribution. They have already socialised the monetary system and tlie dairy industry. . This new measure, I think, is undoubtedly a nol tier move toward soeialisa- , t ion.”

Air. Kyle quoted from the Almsters report 011 transport co-ordination when alleging that many State enterprises liad failed until taken over by private enterprise. He mentioned specific services covered in the report which lie claimed went to prove that, contention. On the Cliristeliurcli-Springfield-AA'hifecliffs lino, Air. Kyle said, the losses experienced while the service was under tlie State amounted to more than £3OOO in tlie two years 1929-1930. A private firm had taken Hie line up and provided the people with one of the most efficient services which could be found anywhere. Although it liad lo fight five or six years of economic depression that private firm liad been able to carry on and show a profit while giving a fine service to the public. Mr. Kyle was called to order when he mentioned lhe possibility of the Government taking over control of

shipping services. Mr. Speaker pointed out that Hie Bill made no reference to shipping.

“It looks very intioii as though the Government intends to take over tlie entire transport service of the Dominion.” Mr. Kyle said. “Some time ago the Alinister of Transport stated that he would not abolish the Alalii Highways Board. But wily leave this board when all the others are to go? The Railways Board has been abolished. The Bill now states that the Transport Co-ordination Board has to go. Yet this board lias been one of the best buffers between the motor tax-payers and the Government. It has had the added advantage of liein« immune from |iolitical influence.’’ Criticism ol tlie system of transport administration as it exists under the present law was expressed by the Rev. A. 11. Nordmeyer (Government. Oamaru). "I wish to quote one instancewhich indicates I t this Bill is not only desirable but essential." lie said. ‘A road was recently constructed along the shores of Lake AVakatipu at a cost to the State of about £70.000. Before that road was completed, there is every reason to believe, 1 am informed, that the licensing authority liad promised a license to run over the road to a private company which it was known would be in competition with the State.” Cost of Co-ordination Board. The Rt. Hon J. G. Coauxs had slated ill his speech on the Bill. Mr. Nordmeyer continued, tliat tlie members of Hie Co-ordination Board did not depend on the Governnicnl for their living. but were independent. Act tlie clmirimin liad received flititl a year mid his two associales 15(1(1 a year each In addition lo (hat, (hey had received I ravelling allowanc es of il "2 U .a <la.v each, while all travelling expenses liad been met. In the two years or less of ihi- board's existence-, the chairman. Sir Stephen Allen, had ri'eeivecl salary totalling £IIS7 ami '.ravelling allowanees amounting to falls. Another member. Mr I,isle Aiderton. liad received £!>Si) in .~al.-iry mid £51;: in travelling .-illowmiees. while tin- respective amounts received by a third member. Mr. H. B. S Johnstone, bad been £9S9 and £547. Altogether Hie board bad cost the community £4733 “Tlie member for Kaipara said rhe Government intenclocl lo take over all mieillm-y transport services." Mr N"i'(lmerer coni inued. “I think I am justified in saying that tlie Government has no intention of taking over the whole

of these services. Tlie same member expressed tlie opinion that the Minister, as a dictator, would not be in a bed of roses. Krom his past experience and his attempts at dictatorship he should certainly know what it feels like, not necessarily to be a dictator, but to try to be one."

"Although our transport licensing > legislation is of comparatively recent I origin, there have been so many amendments in the past few years that there ■ lias arisen a state of confusion a.s a re- , suit of which members of the legal profession have bad to go to the Transport Department for interpretations. I think the Government should consider bringing in a consolidating measure to clarify the law.” "Sawdust and Shavings.” "I hope this Bill will go through. In fact, 1 know it will go through. If I were as sure of being received into Abraham's bosom as I am of this Bill becoming law. I would be prepared to die to morrow morning," said Mr. I). McDougall (Independent, Mataura). He described the arguments of tlie Opposition as so much sawdust, and shavings. and said Hint if the Minister succeeded only in reducing the appalling number of road accidents lie would earn Hie gratitude of Hie whole country. More than 3(10 people were “going over tlie border" every year, and thousands were being maimed or injured. Rafferty rules had been the order of the day for years. It wa.s hardly safe for a man with grey hair to venture on to the road without running tlie risk of being knocked down by some drunken driver. "I am getting a bit grey myself, and I am afraid to cross the street in AA’ellington," said Mr. McDougall, amid laughter. Mr. Wright had complained that it was a dangerous principle to place absolute control of transport in the hands of any Minister. Mr. McDougall said Jie agreed it would be a dangerous tiling to do if the previous Government still occupied the Treasury benches. Mr. Wright apparently was speaking from experience. Things had changed now, and Mr. Wright need not worry himself about the present Minister of Transport. Mr. Semple was quite able to look after himself. Mr. McDougall said that Mr. Coates had declared that he opposed the Bill lock, stock and barrel. “Fancy anyone adopting that attitude when we are sending 300 over the border every year,” added -Mr. McDougall. "The member for Kaipara ought to be an undertaker.” (Laughter.) State Control Defended. State control of transport was detended by Mr. W. J. Lyon (Government, Waitemata). The Bill, he said, was one of the milestones along the path of progress whereby science and human ingenuity could be linked together for the benefit of the people as a whole. Now Zealand had allowed railway construction to become stultified. Nothing had been done to develop new services, and the addition of modern equipment had been neglected with the exception of a belated attempt to introduce railears. If Government services were stultified private enterprise could not but help succeed. The Bill aimed at the closest co-ordination and the most effective co-operation in order to provide the most effective service for the community as a whole. ■ Mr. Lyon said he wondered what I would have been.the rate of progress had the development of New Zealand ami its railways been left to private enterprise. The practice in the past had been for a Government to open up new areas, inaugurate a service, and immediately it was in a position to show a profit to hand it over to private enterprise to reap the advantage. Referring to transport developments a‘ Home, Air. Lyon said there were special courses for transport officers. There was a special degree in transport, which was regarded as a science. There were scores of railway crossings in New Zealand that were veritable death-traps, and surely the Opposition would agree that, it was in the interests of the country to have closer co-operation between the Minister of Railways and the Minister of 1 Transport. Members of tlie Opposition appeared bo have overlooked the fact that under the democratic system the present Government had introduced into Parliament, for tlie first time per- ' sonai jealousies and departmental parochialism would bo eliminated and . i that there would be a national outlook. : The adjournment of the debate was moved by Air. S. G. Smith (Opposition, < New Plymouth). The House rose at [ 10.20 p.m.