MR. R. M'NAB.

Dominion, Volume 3, Issue 842, 14 June 1910, Page 6

MR. R. M'NAB.

RETURN FROM ENGLAND. HIS HISTORICAL RESEARCHES. DEFENCE AND POLITICS. Mr. Robert M'Nab, cx-Minister for Lands and Defence, returned yesterday by the' Arawa from a visit to the United States, Great Britain, and America, during which he carried on. researches bearing on the early history of New Zealand, and, incidentally, addressed a number of election meetings in support of Dr. Chappie's candidature for Stirling, and also other meetings in England in support of universal military training. In an interview with a Dominion representative Mr. MlNab gavo an account of his researches and the- impressions formed by him on various subjects of interest to New Zealanders. Plans for the Future. In reply to questions as to his own future plans, Mr. M'Nab stated that they were- not yet formed for any long lime ahead. He could not say whether he would re-enter politics; that depended on the opportunity,' as well as on the inclination, and during a very pleasant trip he had not been worrying himself on this score. After a few clays in Wellington Mr. M'Nab will go south to look alter business matters in Southland, and on July 1 he will commence in Invercargill a three-weeks' tour of the Dominion in which he will lecture in the; four cities and also in the principal secondary towns with a view to raising funds for the Captain Cook memorial which it is hoped to see erected in Queen Charlotte Sound, -After that Mr. M'Nab's interest in property at MakcTUK will probably keep him in the Wellington district for some time, and it is quite possible that he may decide to make his future home at Palmerston North., Mr. M'Nab's historical investigations wero carried on on the eastern seaboard ot the "United States, where he examined records in four places not visited in his former tour, in London, Liverpool, various Scottish towns, and ■ Paris. His participation in the election campaign prevented him from making desired investigations in- St. Petersburg and Madrid, but on his return journey he made careful researches at Sydney and Hobart. Among French Records. "Tho novel source of information that has been touched," said Mr. M'Nab, "is the French source. I do.not know that it has been touched by anyone before. The difficulties that stand in the way of a foreigner desirous of making such researches are fairly great, especially whero it is desired to see records in which diplomatic correspondence is included. In some cases, with regard to French visits to New Zealand, there was diplomatic correspondence which might have ended awkwardly if judgment had not been shown. * To get access to these sources I had to utilise the High Commissioner's office and the Foreign Offico in London, and then get in touch'with the British Ambassador, and moke application direct to the-French Ministry, supporting the application by the recommendations of tho Ambassador. I had a lot of trouble in waiting for tho necessary consent. It entailed three visits to Paris, but finally tho French Government took such an interest in the matter that they practically did tho searching for me, and when I arrived and presented .my card I found all the documents awaiting me. They even allowed mo to peruse memoranda that went before the Emperor for his decision, with regard to the movements of British officers. Practically nothing was withheld. All that material I am now having transcribed, and photographs will be taken of the charts and sketches of Native life, and customs. I also made arrangements •by which the present-day successors of the prominent Frenchmen connected with early New Zealand will bo sought out, and any private correspondenco they possess in reference to New Zealand perused and copied. All the French official explorations of New Zealand havo now. been unearthed, and a quantity of correspondenco concerning the French settlement at Akaroa and French whaling expeditions has been copied. Thero is, of course, plenty more to be done, but considering the.time available, I have every reason to bo satisfied. I have also brought out for my own and some of my friends' libraries a number of French works about New Zealand that are not contained in any Australasian library."

History Made Clear. Mr. M'Nab lias not completely studied the French records bearing on the settlement of Akaroa, but the impression left on,his mind by a hasty perusal of thorn bears .out , tho opinion lately formed from the study ot British "logs," that when Captain Stanley niailn his famous voyage from Auckland to Akaroa hie purpose was not to declare British sovereignty, which had been , proclaimed before for the South Island at Cloudy Bay, but simply' to hold courts of justice, whichshould be a tangible evidence to the Frenchmen that the land wns British , territory. : Another matter on which Mr. M'NabV researches will throw light is tho kidnapping of Akaroa Maoris 911 board tho brig Elizabeth by To Rauparaha,- and the share, of tho notorious Captain Stewart in that business. . In Hobart, Mr. M'Nab camo across the depositions made at the so-called trial of Captain Stewart for tho , murder of these Natives, and the evidence givon by eyewitnesses of the plot and of- the triumphant orgies-which took place at Kapiti supply all the details that were missing from this storj, , Mr. M'Nab expects to obtain valuablo information from tho diary kept for many'years by Captain George Hemplemau, at Peraki, Banks Peninsula, which is'being sent from England to the Canterbury Museum.' Hempleman settled at Peraki as long ago as 1835, and kept his famous "log" for many years. As a diary its weakness is monotony, but as a shipping gazette it promises to bo a unique source of information. Tho records which it, contains of tho arrivals of various vessels at Peraki are expected to threw important light on the movements of the old whaling and other craft.

Defence Matters. In England Mr. M'Nab met the newlyappointed Inspector-General' of tho New Zealand Defence Forces (Colonel Dayics), who, lie was informed by military officers, had been given unprecedented opportunities for obtaining a complete kiowledgo of his profession. A programme had been drawn up for the wholo of his twelvemonths' term which brought him into touch with every branch of military service and every branch of administrative work. In company with Colonel Davies, Mr. M'Nab visited Alderehot, the Staff College, Sandhurst, and tho Musketry School at Blytho, tie paid several visits to the War Office, observing its administrative system, and tho efforts for the increaso of efficiency that have been made since tho Boer war. Ho discussed the , question of Britain's preparedness for defence with men of almost all ranks in tho Army, from the Com-mander-in-Chief downwards, and with civilians of British and- colonial origin. He found the opinion wonderfully general that sufficient attention was not being given to defence, especially with regard lo Iho land force;!. Tho movement in favour of compulsory military training is not making much progress in England, so far as Mr. M'Nab could see. Mr. M'Nab heard Lord Itoberts speak on the subject, and' addressed meetings himself at several places. Tho examplo of Australia and New Zealand is largely quoted by tho loaders of tho British movement, and in somo cases lantern lectures aro given, including slides illustrative of the cadet system in this country. But compulsory military training, in England, is for the most part an aristocratic movement. "It is very popular nmong the wealthier classes," said Mr. M'Nab, ""but it has never taken hold of tho mass of the people. My opinion as to tho reason for that is that tho moss of tho people do not regard tho government of the country as their business, as they do in New Zealand. Only a section of tho people possess the franchise, and the rest, naturally, ask why they should bo compelled to defend a country that will not allow them oven to vote. I contended that manhood suffrage, if not adult suffrage, must precodo universal training, but few of those with whom I was associated would support that policy. Some

ovou said they would rather drop the policy of universal training than associate it with adult suffrage." The meetings called to advocate universal training wero attended for the most part by aristocratic enthusiasts for 1 the movement, who came in their motorcars nnd carriages with footmen, with tho result that the mass of the people who required conversion were unable to obtain admission. The subject of universal training was brought up at the recent election, but neither ■ political party would touch it, though tho Unionists were, generally speaking, associated with the movement. British and Colonial Loyalty. Mr. M'Nab was impressed with a curious difference between British and Now Zealand audiences. "You can say almost anything derogatory to Britain," he declared, "and a British audience will take it unmoved. I used to say at ray meetings there that I could say "things to them without interruption lhat I would have my head punched for saying to a New Zealand audience. 1 heard, before 1 went Home, about the disloyalty of some of the colonies, but I think now that you get the finest type of loyalty in New Zealand, and I should think next to that m Australia. I used to tell them at Home that a New Zealander's loyalty was a religion compared with an Englishman's loyalty. In London I heard a Canadian lady defending Canada from a charge of disloyalty. She said she had never been out of Canada before, and had just landed in London. She had just been to a lecture at tho Royal Colonial Institute, and it was the first lecture of the kinri she had ever heard in her life that was not brought to a close by the singing of the National Anthem."