PARLIAMENT.

Dominion, Volume 3, Issue 677, 30 November 1909, Page 9

PARLIAMENT.

death duties discussed, shipping and seamen's bill. , government land n policy. 'opposition from leaseholders. A very busv day was spent in tho House jesterdnj. The Death' Duties Bill, Shipping and Seamen's Bill, rind Designation M District? Hill all their eecond lerdinssi ■the first two after interesting debates nnd the Lhnd Settlement Finance 3iU passed through its Committee stage witbont amendrfle c, nftor meeting nith ronwlorablo oppoeilion from the leaseholders In addition, the Pnmo Minister made an Interesting statement explaining why the death «nt«noo wee commuted m the caso of tho man Roberts, at Christchureh, and 6ome discussion took place on tho proposal that the House should held, day sittings instead of doing most of its nork at night. Tho House roso at 2.30 a.m.

THE ndksE.

DEATH DUTIES BILL.

H:, ; 'Sl:^.:*v: ; •;'■**£s The MINISTEEi , :jin "proposing 7 the ■'•-.' vsecohd reading of. tho Death; Duties. Bill* said ;v:"i;'that:-it:poinbiried '..'tho/.'twfi ■-'"ontirely , different ; ■ : ' :■ : . <6i -estate and -legacy:; duty.;.; The ..-.■•y.f'prpppsed English Knance Bill ptovided a scale 15 -per'-ceni ::■' '■: i-finVaddltidh' to -two '.other'■existing death duties. ":.'--' object:'of-tho irae nPw -.dealing :.,•::■ .vwa3;:toibrinß-ithe.tasing ; stalratp. of :New, ■>i- ; .V-:::Zeala'nd>mPr&:into: accordv.wfth" that Sox; other■:;:;\WcoUhtrie3.-" Great :Britain2had-been:: taken, ;as,a '■:■:'■■■'■■■'■. guide,v.biit alterations had been made to suit i;: ■'.- ?.;; thpV different ;-'cdnditipns: of -this cquntryV;;\The ■•'•■!'. ■■'.': ''<■ nidximunV s "'s6alo-; ; of ?. duty -was , ' reached' earlier. .'-■ v: s ':'than'an-.the;English'-Bul.\'Thp rate' of duty I v-,';-p-Jidid hot: : arid 520.000,-and ■'■..-:i;- v ,'.whoro'itiwas 'necessary 'or' , ; desirable; -provision • V, : - -. Jhad beeri''made*fpr-a''morq" uniform- and- mowly ,-';.•;: ascending' scalp, r Exemption: was 'allowed 'up V;.;-,;- •proyisipris.,i_n fegafd/.to ;^'^';--r^t; 'UulyVwere4'6undvto'.-Be ;, in'eff(i(!tivoj ;- and--the' :> ;■; j3ilj tprpjided-; for 'duty\ ; 6nft gifts; aid;; money; ?.' '.:■■,::; which? passed '.without .instruments,: in , ; writing.' ::!;:.i'':','At;jirbsent ,; .a'.-great ; de'al 'of, gift money, escaped v.''■■'.•■>' to;.bo ■-;:.:.i';,;,ithe.l fairest .and-'Vost'equitable of 'all:-taxes.; i.'vV-; ; >Theii existinK':: : Death;^uties ;; iiA.ct-was. ; many ' '?■*s'£ jeii's/ old.'.jThe" , death , 'r'dnties'.in 'New : .V:?j ; /:::n'ad '-teeri.'less- than.>in"England-.and ;ma"ny: v thb buiiden; ':.'.';;:•,-'on.■smair.estates'.was through;this :- , /^;^'sßilli ! ';ftM,VestafrA:left ;; 'splelsr-'-to'-a widow would ftyi; i>ay.;::;no.; duty; y;'A::':New:'--.Zealand Y , millionaire, ::.,".i ; ..j,'uiiderjtho: , ofd : :Act,'could, '-.by-,means of; , gifts, ;'.•?:,':'s'h'a'ye'v'eyadedKduty. toVthefamount":of .j£50,f100.- ...■ ,v.>';;;- l i.Hc/ , -'was;:'certoiii\;fiißt;;:.e<eepti.;tei..-a..':.y*Jfy- : ".few ,*' ; l" '•'■■ ?pefsons, : the; Temoyal :bf ■ ih.bcuhf&if j'nequitabto : '' l '^-'antt-:iinjusf: > cpnditiOTV.'of";-thiiigs"'sthait'fbatl.':pre-' '.■'■ Ki- ■;':' : ,vi6usly : . ;'obtained;• j^;.regard, : ;-to -death ; :: •'-. give- .latisf actioh.r.i.Tho 'BilL.'did not - p'rbto ;take '.an, unreasonable', proportion: from ;":.'!.; ■v.'nnybody.; i Theibld, condition , ' under 'which largo .J: of ■. duty '.had ;.been allowed ' to' escape ,*;:j.':; : ; ,a_lt6gothor be'reversed,'a /•:-'; , '^;:.;-/'-^;^- - :/-!;^^--;.;;;^''.': ; K,':;^M|V^(!en'J- : YiSHX 'Mr; ■ :.';'■.?:-, the'lpreseiit-la^'was^anonialous;,and should fco' '-i.bfc .<^ ; :.7v:\tweenv : .os.tates:;le'ft'i to V; widows;, and; widowers, :'■■•&'^bich'■■he... did," riot'-: think! it '/was" fair ■ to" dr&w. .:^'::V:;;There ; wero cases the widow'was'just 'as ::,■':-;;?inch-thcibreadwinner.astheVwidow3r., : .:No- al- •.■'::;,' .-Manes was made.for phildreri'';6rgraridchildron,' v;v:'ji:*hp>;were;deprived =;6f ;tho; J- per:cent.vremis-. v.i'■ v!l?l o ri£'PWdeith-,yduti^ ..i'J.-y.lHe/.could npt raise;any 'objectio'n' r tp,tho rates "^i-'.v.gpwposed:inLthe;'newOßill.;:^He : ;thonght :thnt ;::..-,-;, > i;.the..exempti6h, ; .;which''had bsen : .-raised "from ■ still further-'raised.: 'r.-'\:?:i'ln|New.-Spilth.Wales'theiexemptionXwiis up , to .;j.:-.::ympjexem'ption ; fe'^V^ianipmitsj'-proppssd','for : -the:death:dutyV- itself i-£: VjjSeoped■:;to.:hini : to";bfr:-reasonabloi;;lt;Was.-"a '■ .'rHr-iqucstioncforvconsideratipn-whether tho'regiila-:?-A-Vi tipns;> in?-regard; to ?pifbperty. -'should fbe '. ; niad» : ■.■;!rotrbspectivo.;;;: : -to ; ■ : V-zi Sjf' (duties -were" a;■ considerable" depftrturo ifroin :-:-. :, vA the:;a)rescnt:;law.':; ; He.\thought''it,.was:re'asori- ; ;:";. ;;iable,' ; ..that .'somp .alteration 'should 'bs ; niade, fit., -;'|.bbt;. | tho';.p6yerqmettt.',w(ie:goirip-top' far, and' going ;t6 : ;(liso6.u.raß: : e;whatvit,'o'ujht to enef ,;■-1 e,OY,rage,' namely,: the distribution' of a"person's V ;; /.^Eri;i>ert3;W J dnring.-.his, lifetime;to , jhis.children jilv-'ftiand orelatiyßS.'v ; Eathers :.be- p encpur(i(reil,'' ;.-,.,i>'.alSo,' itoi-provide::soinethih|?.:for itheir' children' >i ■^■■■'^eoSe.'^F.uythe'jp):^ lM ite^^F &0 iaid v itwas : almost Vm-' >*;. 4;cpossiblo i to-.,frame:.! ajBill;; that.";would i':;:; ; ;Cvin!ff: : preyentiev'»sion"Pf:dutyXiriZthe"c , ase'bf: ::J S#giit|;.betwcen v had•iv'tb' T# '■ -v ?°?!^ €r^ £ nn y .'"Jse •.puttirig--,-a 'Ciaiiso •/|' s .." 'in js the,; statutpwwhich J. conld: be -evaded. ';■: Hβ" :.'; , ' : : : i'' , ;vDeli^T^-:that;itiwd , fiiot.*"lt-yas , o'illy hypocrisy' i ;-^;'te^P"t:itt,clause<in::the/Bill- I which -would 'only M.'iM £O!j;bperativ«Anperi;.lthbse -pedple-' .who- ' were ?v : f:-;t f ,vcaughti" ;::;W:t.'y'"''. T '«--''^i'-;^T' ; Y''i'-v'' : "' ; :-' ■"■' K;""*# l^ BA P*n?'. (Auckiand ;Eas« 'congratulated- ■; ifeKtho.Ministry,oil:hayinK;.'at,last-dealt with this 1 :H He ; :tp6k«y«iTP.'strong/exooption to' ,;:.::;;;..Hie. fetoppa?o.,Of.; the''graduation of tho :death y ;15 :pte;c<<nt.y.The;grndna*ipn";sl)bufd Pr^: 2^v?( V^ji r^^P e Goyerhment i---! "There •'■■ ; Tis h^^v^;.-I >;Tory.?Wi'Re.-increase';: of •Oα; v ■; > :; 't- ; S'-^?s , iJ l Mi o i see -' : flio.'«2cerrtt>tibtv. extended y r .^:(frbm: ! .t/.,f;C2600;-O The'' Stafe; should ':;«>-• ,«™rago ; ;:the.d«gree/ofhthrift^hich^wpuld-en-W ; ,to;leaye;an:'estato-of .tliat: aiiionnt ; ;; ; ' ; V" ;^^s; ?.H.wd!T!anfsr.Critic!^ " : ' ;^^^':^^^^^e,l i^ oD^^th^:t^ ''' ■■ : : , J ; iM? riln °-: -explains! why ;V ' ;W;S;his] j v i ;« ■:■'?■<:*?s(■ ;}nimically : ; :againet : ; this "eountry 1 inr :the' & 'ft* .^'t.S 1 *: ?s!>': itp; the principle 'K.y;' : : *W.Bil.;rtThe;:Pr .p'robvfwr.jaWy'Wll.tnenilthat.theyincreascd" taxation was % •■'■■•.:• one-W ■> the ;p>fenPe .reply,' ho :r^-;;v'wpn| ; tell;,himv;that.:'np Additional'■-'taxation fe « v /it ■; had ' been . .'-.r'..-fo? tho.^oss, extravagance.of ;the.:Grbv«rnnient. :;./■■-:; "»rlng., the'.past :fonr i ;pr fiveyeors. He had ::;■. : -;vtakon'.put ( :some : fijiires:;to show:how the , new '■y-m •prppoeals.'swould.- operate,.;the"CTCCession , and - ''- ''faiief*-i? :.^:■ 00I ?W? rf, '-- : 'TheyV.Woro•:as ■" >: -? '<■ ; ': '■£ C(! y, -:Duty jon; Estate' ;yalwe'd "at" iESOOO. :-'':'.: : ;q : .-' ■y ; -^, : ' : .' ,, ..";v"-,vvv ■■•ii^i>'^x .twoßons. : widow. stranger. ;: ■■•': .' ;> K- "-■■'riu ''■'- ''??&r :: V- : & ■:£y^ : '-:£:- .;'.; - £ .• ■:;■; -.' ■■;;■;•: r:Old::systenl:' i r - 325- ;■' l -w.eqe ■.;";:>■. ;^-";■'•'<-:'';;3;3-Duty; on; : EstaW"of ;U25,o6o;: ; :';; j a: -/:.' !£. Vv ';•: -i &-}i',::■;/,■::■ frs.' ; '¥-'J*tt H ■ lef t to' ; ''' Left to'' //J^laS:;^A';^;; I ;;,.'.;twoepnV-widow, stranger.. .■',■■,;; v C!d; .system 3250 ■ ;' : : r-.i,;':;,-v;'. : . , .?;Pfl>posed system;:» 225Q ; v5v2250 /;, .4250'.;; ; ;S' Scl-i'v'- : :-if'P.olty;;on ; Estate:?qf ; : ;^' v£ ; ;^»:- 'v/- 0 ;;-Left to■■ ■■ -le'ft'iio' , '- •^■'■'■■:^'^ , ;^!■■■'''•^.JyA;^^■■^^ , v^■vv.^■:.v■t'w'β' , '•"■ :> : '- :y-'.'' -'\ ',//:'/ r:; , ;:.^-.- , ' •- ''O"£ "'>■ -'; (£■•• •' ■■: ...'";•" 'system; , .:..'...'.:.ie,OTO""-::.' ;, V'' : nil 26,000 •' ' ;.';;■: ;:/' 1 ':.l , v:; 24,000. :.68,000 . '. '■.'?■.•!'.'-.;.- : f/ip.;:.Laii'r6nson.ApprbvesSy:; 'i'iJyf'^r-:-;.. ' ''y'ri-0 ■&:■ that;tho ,:;>;;,;'Bill had.,the ■approyalcpf.'gS'out-of'every-100 y- .;■,- ■-::people^ini New, ; Zealand. ; ;It aimed atthfl m'oro Vt; .:■' even distribution of:wal.th; ■■ Sone of wealthy \-:-;i did a; noteworthy .thing. ;; :-.".... . v;: ;■' ■ -Mr,: BERRIES ho knewmariy ,:j; :.: {eons.who •had.dpnovmorAthah their fathers. thought the; Bill.would have:the hearty snp- ■;■;• ..port of. every-.member'pf-tho'lHouse; ,l The'pro- ,-;;; ...,T)o4als α-deferrent ;. ; .. to• tho paving of ■money.V:'Under." the -Kll suc;::,'i'..^ bo :paid -within .' yA:Bix,',mpntha, but;special'provieion ,would havo ;' : . : f ;lo.bo;made/iyith. reference;to;.settlcd,estates.; ' :Quotos; ; Flgiires.^. ;^i-i: --"- ; ' : :0; ; : J: '-. ~, : i:.".v '.'i:. Tho PRIME 'MINISTER (in roply) mentioned ■ . : .•; : rthat thp;number ■ of-osta,tes' dealt with - during v ;;;'.:':;the:year;:ondcdvMarch;'3l/;;i9oß, v was--as fol- '•■ ■'": ■■ty: r -f'',';''':,C ..■;-.■:,. ': ■■:. ■•- -.=. ;*•■' i ; ; i■^ ;^K'V;'i:.^.;•yi^v^i ! ty--:, v/Co' '<V>:-' H-■'■': '■■-■■ :, ':-4H,. :w. . \2 > ■■:---p'; Christohurch>..'..i:;.:i;i.^':B9 i ?6 : !)o' '■'■'■ -37:- -0'". y:. :, ": : :-:- rDunedin^^iAj.iviW-V^S^T^iTO.:-^^",■■ - : 3v: r '- ; :; IriyercaVgill;;;i;.^;.:;.;;,i.^2a^:i v 3O - "-4 ''-v-'i :v ' ; ; ; •.■i; ; ;XlNew;;l:piymonth.;i/;;^ , iv;';/11-: i -:J2o "■{ i ■ ; t;S : :- :-'.v.:i,' i jGisb6rrie;'A; ; Blpnhe«n;v;i;»:^; ; ;:.',C/«;; '■J^-'-;-'?- , r :^:i/: y r-Napier'';^;;;::^::.:;;^ We' 23 'f- : 9 "'•. "7 : '- '.■;'. .*^t H /Hokilnlta;and;:NolsonTiV; : ", 0V •■'.%;: Sir Joseph'; referred ■to'.'avplea.that the limit 'W:-sv D^;,raised;:^lf.vthatv:cbrild;bo/done;)»i

would, be 'a very nico "thing". td: : do.' .As mem-: bers wore aware,.it was/tho estates under JCIOOO that had been giving a groat deal of the royemie up: till; now. In the ease of ah- estate '■under! JBIOOO, if-it,went" to-childrim .the-estato duty under; the present system ;would bo £11 *55., but .tinder',the proposed scalei it would■ be only .£lO. /With respect to /larger" estates, the; figures;would bo respectively:—£26oo, .£35 and :£iO;MWn,\£® 10s. and £75;£M6, £16 and; .£120; JSOOO, ..-CB7. 10s. and £166; 155.. 4d. : 'Estates under -61009 nnmbered more than half of the. total number i of. estates which ■ paid ■ duty,'.' Succession duty; would be payable as follows undor the Bill:— ■■':■■■' ....... ."-■■■' .•■■■:, .-.-.'•. ■':■':/ If left to ,-: /;.-'; :'"- : -:--Jt left to '■ If left to" stranger Estate of,, ••■..'widower, other relative in blood. ■■:: .51000 '■■ ' -.:: 20 .''" " 50""."' • ■'■•'• 100 '• ■;..■' - J!2i)oo ". -■-■ .:■■■ ■■.:■ id . ■■.-■. .-.-..'•loo ■ ■ •-.:':.. : :.-zoo. ■" ; ";--;-.--J}30OO. : "-: •"■"■"..'■"■•■■CO ■■■"-. ";iSO :W ; 300- : ' ■V. : •'• •■■'. "80. .'• ■• ; 250 '■•'"■■'■ .500 : ;■;, ::.;• 100. -~ ~ 250., \;,-. 500:/ .' With regard to , the: case :of -,an estate of it' 25,000 which had been .referred to by Mr. Hordnianj he'-.'wished to point out that' the • estftte-duhr payable at present,, if-the estate went' to. children, would' be ,£1250, whilst the :pjoposod duty, would, bo j£l7so;:if it went to relations.' other. than:' children it; •; would be ■£1750 at' present, but-£2500 under ..the proposed'"sente; and if it went to ''straiwers in : blood it would be £1750 at. present, and £3250 under, the (suggested scale. .The succession' duty, on such , an estate .would.bo ,as under: If'it.wentto a widower; ,£GoO;:if it went to any" other :Wlative, .£1300;7 and' if it went/to, a-strang'er-in blood, £3000./ Under tho'proposed scale; there .was ; no /inducement to people to ■remove >inoyable-. property from/the Dominion. Adistinction was made between the husband and the widow because , in at least.7suer cent, of". cases', the husband, was . the. bread-winner." The/rotrospcotivo, conditions'': referred to by Mr.' Allen were-necessary:; td prevent a largp, loophole by ■which'people.!would escape the taxation; ;As against : : -Mr.'.- : Herdman's; contentions.: tho -Prime Mi/ilster .fiuoted .the'remis--. sionsof Customs duties to snow that.tho. Got-. brnmont was sbiieitoTis for the interests of, the poor.' /He/ddclarod that Mr.. Herdiman'n aTgu-' ments-woro: one-sided and illogical. It wasabsurd ta.sfiy that tho new. taxes would.cause people'to''leave tho country.' ■■.' ; ". .;;,: Tho :Bill was read a eeeend ■time on the. .voices,'and set doirri for ebmmittal to-day.,,, AND SEAftIEN BILL. : v •;-; SECOND: READ ING AGREED. TO.; '■-}[ ' <The. Hon.; J. A/ MiIjLAR, W.imoving .the •secondi. : reading of this/Bill;, referred -to the , dosirableness".of,a. uniformity-of shipping law in ; the British; Empire.- '■ Ho pointed .out that the whole of- .the- resolutions passed by tho Imperial Shipping ; .Conference '.had/ riot been, "adopted.: He had;.been interviewedi by representatives .of. the ShipownersM I'cderatiou,' and would . also bo. interviewed; by j delegates; of, the i seamen;;' He then gave an' outline of- tho provisions, in''the measure. v .--'■: ''■'.■ ■ - : .-" Mr., HEBREES '.: (Tauranga) held that Section ,39 which'related-to bills Of, ladingwould conflict .with ..tho shipping:-law of other countries. As regards. Section'. 51, which- made /search on" tho part ; of .the; owner essential .when a ship-was it would; never do if it wero'mado to: [: apply •should; be'.vessel: be missing, in distant waters. Thon, again, he, thought that tho ships belonging to the Government, should come -under: tho-new ..'law. :'■:",■;?■■' \- y :.U.;-'' ■■■■-■';>■ •■: V r^T^i'^ ILI ! 0 ?P (Hutt);' congratulated-tho .Minister;, upon; the inclusion -of Section.-: 50, whieh provided-for the Government 'inspection, before,.shipment, 1 -.'of 'wool,: •&>■»> •".- and skins Ihefe could, be:; no doubt-but; that. many, fires ,pri ships...Prigihated.through carelessness prior to. shipment./ The cost of inspection of wool, ,for.'instance,.'would not .come : to■more 1 than Id.' per bale; , : '.%,- -wi: ' :/ .■■■.>;,■-.■'■..■:■ ■■ ;v.Mr,rPOpLEHA.ucldand:.Westj '■'hoped -the (ioyernment inspectors who would"exawinotho Plans, of .■vessels: to. be built: in 'New .Zealand would be', , 'at"any, rate/ as competent- as- the designers; ■: Ho '.wished to seo. tho ship-building . industry .dovolop, but .would point;. out; that tne.names of :many- : bi)ay'whieli had 'been built ™-toe^Dominion.i)ow appeared on'the.missing Question of Inspection.-V ; ; / ;;-,' r :" v;- v,; ::. ensure-that ■the. Government inspection ..of; a;, vessel should, not : take.'.placo;,until■: the.:.vessel, was■ ro'ady to : sail, and-that..after. thfe;in'spe6tipn -.hai;takcn Place'nosmore-.cargo-.shpuld-'be.iallowcdi.to/.be taken-on; board.' -He :understoed---.that--prior }?■'%. Puco,.she,;was j .the. Department .-.and-., afterwards '.[(noro'i-cargo , was;,placed : :on'bpard. and .tho;: disposition: of othpr.cargo was. altere'd. ■•■ If that were the paso the. present. of < -inspection- could ■»<>* fc e regarded-a?i satisfactory.,. He also advocat«rth4t alh.of: the.large.passenger , steamers running; between . New Zealand -'and the ■■ Com-. ■monwealth'should carry ,;a' medical o/ficor. Vlf ! that,: were .insisted upon'-' tho v . addition "to tho fare-.would be only trifling. ; ,:'■■-':'*:.-.-/ ]; Mi; GLOVM'.(Auckland ■ Central) stated: thai' the Bill mot. with; his entim 'synipathy.'- v He ( was of opinion that the . Bill should- go hir-" thor and. provide that all passenger, steamors snould.be possessed of ,twih-scrtws,.'. -■-■'■ . Mr. LpKE (Wellington Suburbs)'hoped, that ;oapable ; men would, be; employed, to :esainine the plans.: of: ships ,to be built iu New Zealand.; ; Tho,.responsibility -which : the. Minister proposed to undeftako in . connection 'with the matter iwas',.a...very...■.serious one. ,'. : ': v '. ; "'-: '

TWo/Sußgestions."/;--.';. ;-;•;;■■ : '■ '■.'.".'■; ■' ;v //■".'■, : .; ; ■'t-Mr.'/'-MtKENSp^.^Lytteltenj'/.thoughV^it l should, be -made.icompulsory- for coastal vessels to:carry a small-medicine."chest." Then' again provision, .which/would; , make boat ■drW .less , .perfunctory than 7 at present, should , be' .inserted.; If the-sqamenihad been'practised in tho: uso of. ;a ;steer . oar. many more "of ■ the Penguin's passengers and crow, might have been saved.;-Something.should also:be done to bring abpufc au:..imprpyemcnt./in:tho ventilation of engine-rbomfj.' j. v - ;•'... ':■:.- . ...-•.- / Mr.- : MT.AEBN;/(Wollington-.East) it .was intended thiit; tho 'Bill. should, go/bo-; fore;a . Select, Committee./ He/pointed out.that ; reprcsentatiyes of - the J seamen's unions ■ might, wish -to'jrive evidence.: , ' 1 : ■::-::.■.,.'..:; .;•.-.. ~Thp jnNISTER ; (in'-his tliat did not .intend'to, send the/Bill td'a" cpinmit- ■ tee.■•-..•80th the Auckland and Dunedin branches of tho Seamens.Union had expressed approvalof tho' measure,' whilst 'the', Wellington -branch would .interview him.'. on the following evening.'; //x/;/.;■ :.-,.. '■;>,.■. ■//.;. .;,•"/,...■- •;■ The • Bill; was read a: second time'; on, the yoiceai ;and .\sot ; down;, for /committal to-day. •: :,-.-' -'DESIQNAJIbN ;0F; DISTRICTS BlLL }■': XThoHon. D: BUDDO moved tha second reading of the Designation of Districts Bill -He explained that, Under the present' Act relating to .tho'-.subjeot rodd districts and town boards .were not 'included. The measure- was intended ,to .remedy the: defect. ■■['■•'.'■->'■.';: \;. ~.. : v :/Thp/second';fcading was agreed to on-tlie voices. .•."■•'.";;,..'..j ;■■.;",..-'.'' -..;..-..::/••■ :; ;'.;.- : ■::..; .'■.'.- .-': LAND SETTLEMENT F^NfNCE:BILL; •;;.J-^;b'i6CU^S|ON: ; '. ■ Considoratipn/iri :■ Committee of ■ the Land ■ Settlement Finance!Bill was then begun.. When Clause 1 was under consideration; ~ ':,.■. . /.Mr. MAICOLM (Clutha) said: that, too/great expense was intended to be entailed on an association: before ;it could -apply;-to the Govern-. ment for:, a .guarantee, in' connection' with "'a proposed purchase;:- // ■■;■;/ ;■':': ; '■■■ ■ that in practice what," would . happen was that; the association and the owners would'first come to hri agree--ment. The Government could, not step iu untU the kind : was done.; •'.;.-' ;; Mr.: GUTHBIE; (Oroua); expressed the Opinion that the inspection-'by the Government i j officialsshpuld...befre6 , of cost..;':;.//■; ■■':■-,' Constitution of ■ '=/; : / ;./ ■/ ' Upon the:consideration of: Clause 2, which deaft'ivith the. constitution .'of associations, //Mr. HOGAN (Wanganui).- suggested that the. number to/form an" association should be re-/ iduoed "from five;to-three.:,: ~ ~-.;;. - .;-; ! ./The/PEIME MINISTER said that at 'first: ho-favoured a larger number than. five. ■ /If they were to reduce it to three/why not one? He thought if.- the , suggestion were approved they- mignt as well, drop tho Bill. ; / :'./■■ Mj! LAtIRENSON. (Lyttelton) eaid he did riot believo in a single clause in tho Bill." ' .'■ -Mr. >M f LARBN (Wellington; East) : remarked that h« wondered when State interference with private";enterprise was going to.xerme.to an , .end. : V'■'•■■' .:''.;■'-' ■'•'.-'-!'■-"r- , .'- ■ ■■'.' .•'.'■"'■'-'■■" .•-".-.:'

Mr. Malcolm (Clutha) moved an addition to, Clause 2 dealing with associ»t;ons ns follows, —"Provided thit prior to entering into an agreement tho applicants shall advise tho Mini, stor fer I'manco of thoir wish to pTircha_so, nnd upon receipt of the advice tho Minister shall di=-<ius3 tho matter with the applicants." Tho amendment was rejected by 55 to 5 Mr. REDD (Bay of Islands) moved that tho land to be purchased by awocintions should include "Native land," but the proposed amendmont was, at the instance of Mr Parata, ruled out of order Primo Minister Gets Angry. Mr. ANDEESON (Matanra) movod to rednco the minimum amount of land that a settler could take up from 50 acres to S acres. Mi. rRASER (Walatipu) asked tho Prime Minister if ho intended to keop to his promiso to lnsort an amendment in tho Bill limiting the land that could be taken up. to first-class land.

\ PRIME MINISTER - suid.' that" he'liad. reconsiderod tho matter', and did not now in. 1 :tend;to proposothe amendnient.. -.-,-' - ; . . vMrl WIT-rST (Kiccarton) bpokein favour of limiting tho minimum area of a holding. - .■'.Sir Joseph: Sc-eiiig that you : are against the Bill, why .argue against it?... . , • .. : Mt. \yittyj' If" 1 feel'inclined"-1. .am going to argue the point if .I want , to. :.<Mr. FRASEH (Wakatipu) declared that he would liko. to support .the' amendment, but would not do so, becauso if it wero carried the Prime. Minister might, drop- the Bill.' He would prefer to, let Sir Joseph havo his Bill, and then by next year h« woild soe wh« had ,boen; in the right. ....".- ~; V: .':' : Mr. HALL (Waipawa) said he supported the Bill: with all hi shcart, but he thought the minimum area of>an allotment,should be rediiced. Sir. Joseph should'take no notice of town'members, but take hisadvico as that of a friend. "I hope Sir.Joseph will regain his temper," he added. 1 -...\- : .- ... ; Mr. EEED: (Bay.of.lslands)i'ureed that ,with' a maiimum of 200 acres the Bill wbutd.be absolutely imperative in his district. '.Mr.; SCOTT- (Tuapoka) thought that./more latitudo should be allowed in regard to the area. : ■•• . ......" ■.. . ;., : . t>, ■.:;■. ' . ..-:.■ . .Mr. : .Davey (Christohuroh JEast) and Mr. Hanan;(lnvorcargill) suspecWi an attempt to kill the Bill. . ■■ •'..•■•'■ .-•' ; The PRLME MINISTER said he, could not give, war in regard to the limitations of,area. Thore wasno suggeetion to. repeal the Lands for. , Settlement Act, .or .make it less effective than [it was now. He.could notsee whytho question of tenuro should bo introduced, as tho Bill would only deal with 'lands that were freehold already. • :.-' ■-.:•■ .'v- ; -Mr. NOSWORTHY (Ashburton) warmly .supported the Bill, and stated that the Opposition .was doing all it could to g(>t tho Bill passed.. - Mr. ! . PHILLIPPS (Waitemata) spoke in port of the Bill. ■ ■." .-■ - v; : - ; Mr. ARNOLD (Dunedin Central) said he had hitherto supported the Bill, but' he.;now thought it was in 'consequence of:'. pressure brought to,-bear on them by their constituents ; who wished to sell part ot their estates that certain mombcTs of. tho House were support, '.ine'.it-'-' '.-'-.• '■■'■■ .'■ ;'■ . "-; ■ :': ■~".'y-':. ■'' ' ■ Mr. Nosworthy denied this accusation. ■,'■ ': Tho minimum, in the; Bill was retained, by td:B. " .-' : ''' : ■ ■':• \'■■:'' .•'■'..- •; Mi. REED: (Bay 'of Islands) moved : an • amendment - : to addito the maximum.of 200 acres a maximum, of .500 acres, of .land '■ inferior, '".to first, or second-class; ' . : . ;: ; ...'..' : 'It-wai agreed that the amendment should,not be adopted. :■ '.•'• ';."■'-' 'f At; 2.80 ; n.in. thn'Bill Wnis reported without, amendment, nnd ,'oht third reading: set down for , ; to-day. v - p ; ;.;: ;.\-' '.'},. ',■..•;;■ '/:>,:.;:,.