TUESDAY, AUGUST 22.

Clutha Leader, Volume III, Issue 112, 1 September 1876, Page 3

TUESDAY, AUGUST 22.

At the evening sitting, The House proceeded to discuss the Question as to the boundaries of the proposed counties. Mr Se}'raoiir suggested that there Should be no schedule in the Bill at all. As it was at present it was not acceptable to anybody. The whole country had been cut up into Road Boards, with boundaries such as circumstances and necessities led up to, and, on the whole, he thought satisfactorily. The best plan, therefore, would be to allow Road Boards to unite themselves into Counties according to the wants of the different districts, and they would no doubt fall into Counties in a natural and easy manner. Under the present proposal they ran the risk of having two of laws in operation within one boundary.

Mr Sheehan then announced he would move an amendment that the responsibility oi fixing the boundaries of Counties rest upon the Government. He did this on the ground that the Government were pitching- the Bill at the House. It was not right they should expect the Opposition to put work into &hape. Messrs Hodgkinson and Rees strongly supported the amendment, and protested against the attitude of the Government in this matter. The Premier said they desired to iallow the utmost freedom of discussion between members from different parts of the Colony. Mr Woolcock said he did not believe in allowing the Government to have the sole control in determining such a question, which was one of those in which the whole House was better calculated to decide than any Ministry. Mr Ormond pointed out that the question involved no question of principle, and went on to argue there was no need for the establishment of boundaries at all. As it was clear, to a great extent, that the Road Board system would be maintained, he thought it would be better not to deal with this matter at all until the Bill had proceeded further, and therefore moved that the debate be adjourned. The Premier said the Government were prepared to agree with the adjournment, which would enable the Government lo bring down to the House the new arrangements which they propose to introduce into the Bill. Debate adjourned until that day ■week.

In Committee on the Municipal Bill, the remaining clauses T^ passed without alteration. In Committee on the Rating Bill, a discussion took place upon the point as to what property should be rated, and eventually the Bill was postponed until the Goldfields Committee bring up their report. In Committee on the Building Societies Bill, Mr Stout strongly objected to one central registrar. Registrars of joint stock companies should be registrars of building societies. He also objected on the grounds that this was creating a new department. The Hon. Mr Bowen said there was no intention to create a new department. Mr Stout's suggestion was put as an amendment, and carried by 24 to 22. Several clauses were struck out and others adopted, and progress was reported. WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 23. Mr Macfarlane' moved that in the opinion of the House all persons entitled to pensions from the Oolony should, after the 30th March, 1870, be paid the same on personal application only, at such public office or offices as the Government may appoint within the Colony for that purpose. The Premier said the motion was one that looked very wise and good, but was quite impracticable; and, as the Government would oppose it ; he hoped it would be withdrawn. Sir R, Douglas suggested that if the motion were made to apply to future pensions there would be no objection. Sir G, Grey moved an amendment that persons residing at Home and in receipt of pensions from the Colony should have the same amount deducted from their pensions as the Imperial Government deducted from persons in the Colony in receipt of Imperial pensions. Being himself an Imperial pensioner; he had to pay £400 out of his salary of £800, as Superintendent of Auckland. The Premier pointed out that the question was one of a very large nature, and should not be decided hastily. Mr Sheehan moved that the House regrets the delay in the construction oi the railway from Riverhead to Auckland, and considers the reasons given for delay in the Public Works Statement not satisfactory ; and that the work should be undertaken at once. The Hon. Mi' Richardson deprecated the terms in which the resolution was couched. The Government never had any other intention than to construe! the line, but there had been considerable unavoidable delay in consequence of a proposed deviation and the consequent acquisition of information. A good deal of discussion ensued j Sir G. Grey urged that the Government should give a definite answer, and say, within three months, wher they would commence the line. .

Mr Brown (Ashley) said it was judicious not to be hasty in these matters, as the Government had been absolutely robbed of an immense amount of money in regard to acquiring lands for railways in the South Island, especially in Canterbury. The motion was ultimately withdrawn.

Mr Sheehah moved that the House considers that the provisions proposed to be made for roads and works in the districts north of Auckland, is entirely inadequate to meet the requirements and necessities of those districts, and much smaller than the share to which those districts are entitled, regard being- had to area, population, and contributions to Customs revenue. The district had been so grossly overlooked that he could only account for it by the fact that the Government were unaware of its existence.

The Premier thought the resolution was one addressed rather to the constituency than to the House. If siich a resolution were passed every member would be justified in bringing forward i a similar one. It was the more surprising-, too, that such a resolution should be moved by one who was an ardent Provincialist. If the district had been neglected it had been by the Auckland Provincial Government, and the first expenditure in that district had been by the General Government. He believed if there was one thing more than another for which the House would reproach itself in the past, it would be that they had not several years before given effect to that resolution which was to come into force at the end of the session.

At the evening sitting, The adjourned debate on the question that tenders should not be accepted for a central gaol at New Plymouth, was resumed. Mr Whitaker said this was no time to incur such an expense, and moved as an amendment, that the question stand over till next session, no tenders being accepted in the meantime. The amendment was seconded by Mr Andrew. Mr Brown was of the opinion of Judge Johnston that our gaols were a scandal to the Colony, and therefore did not consider it would 'be for the interest of the Colony that the erection of a central penal establishment should be postponed for another year. He hoped the House would not reverse its decision of last year in the matter.

Mr Carrington said there was one o two things that must be dons — either erect that gaol, or go to probably as great an expense in increasing the accommodation of all our present gaols.

Mr Stout supported the amendment. He thought there was very little in all the talk they had heard about classification in gaols. He did not see how it was to be done. . They had no more system in England than in New Zealand. The one was searching for a system as well as the other. This problem was one of the most difficult in life, and yet the Govnrnment proposed to effect everything in regard to classification by getting a hai'bor at Taranaki. It would be wiser to wait for another year to see what system England would adopt, as she was now considering the question. Under the condition of the Colony it would not be right to rush into such an expensive experiment. He had no objection to support a grant annually towards making a harbor for Taranaki, because he believed it to be requisite, but he objected to indirect means of accomplishing that object.

Mr Pearce, speaking of the condition of the Provincial gaols, said that common humanity demanded instant ac-

tion towards the improvement of their present means of classification of their criminals. In the Wellington gaol there were 100 men, though there was not room for 30.

The Hon. Major Atkinson said it seemed to be forgotten that there was not sufficient cell accommodation in any of the prisons of the Colony, and this question had been pressing for settlement for not one or two years; but for ten.

Mr De Lautouv thought the establishment of a good system of technical education was more required than a central penal establishment even if they had to pay a hundred thousand pounds per annum for it. That would soon empty their gaols by bringing up children with knowledge and powers to earn an honest living. Sir G. Grey was pained at thfe condition of our gaols, and for this condition the Ministry were greatly to blame. It wag their personal extravagance, their reckless expenditure upon public buildings, such as that on the reclaimed land, a monstrous growing and expensive civil service, that placed the Colony in such a position. Until they returned to a simple mode of livings and had a smaller and less highly paid Civil Service, and encouraged the cultivation of virtue and truth, they would not be able to rid the Colony of those horrible scenes they had heard of in the gaols.

Mr Rolleston looked at the question practically* and agreed with the Minister of Justice that something must be done in the matter. But there were two sides to the question and as the subject had not been argued out fairly, a Select Committee to inquire into the whole matter would be advisable.

The Premier said the House hardly did justice to the action of the Government in the matter. It certainly

was one that did not so soon strike the imagination as roads and bridges ; but, considering the position of the Colony nowj and the years that this question had been before the House, it was *i reproach to the Colony that something had not been done before in the direction indicated. A great deal had been made of the fact that the establishment was to be built at Taranaki. Grave imputations had been thrown oiit that the House would show their abhorrence of such charges by opposing these resolutions. If the establishment were not erected there, Taranaln would be ifc. no way prejudiced as to getting her harbour, because that had already been arranged for by the House. The resolutions ought to be thrown out, and let the House deal with the question as regarded expense) when the matter came up on the Estimates. He denied that the question was one which should be looked on in connection with the temporary depression of the country, because whatever might be said of the Condition of the country^ the people of New Zealand were perfectly competent to bear all expenses of the admistration of the country. Thel'e was no doubt that the people were in a better position to bear their burdens than before^ and when their railways were in a more advanced state of completion they would be in a still better position.

Mr Rees said the real object of the Central Prison was that a breakwater should be made at Taranaki. He protested against accomplishing such an object in an indirect way* They were told of the wretched state of many Co-

lonial gaols, but was it not surprisingthat the Government had not spent a few thousand pounds to improve these gaols out of the enormous sums of money which they had been expending with a lavish hand ?

Mr Murray, who was the mover of ihe original resolution, said he would cave it to be decided on the voices.

Upon the amendment being put, a division was called for, and the amendment was carried by 38 against 25, nine who usually voted with the Government voting for the amendment.

In consequence of the ruling of the Speaker that Harbor Board Bills were to be- endorsed, and also in consequence bf members in charge of some of these Bills having been inadvertently delayed by the action of the Government in getting their Bills pressed forward, The Premier said that the Government would now facilitate the passage of such of these Bills as they approved of, and would bring them down by message, which would be an expedient way. The adjourned debate — That it is desirable that the gold mining industry of the Colony should be relieved of exceptional taxes How imposed upon it — was resumed. Mr Pyke deprecated any further dis- i cussion upon the question until the j Gold Mining Committee's report came lip, but added that there was nothing in the motion that prevented any one from agreeing with it. The motion was formally agreed to. Mr Stout moved the second reading of the Dunedin Municipal Bill. The Premier would not oppose the second reading of the Bill, out o r consideration to the horn gentleman, but hoped he would see his way not to press it beyond the second reading. The Bill contained 384 clauses, . and he thought other means could be adopted, such as introducing a few clauses in the Govei-nment Bill, to meet the wants of the case. He admitted a great deal of care had been displayed in drafting the Bill. | The Bill was read a second time. The Stewart Island Grants Act Amendment Bill, and the Warehoused Goods Bill, were passed. There was a number of second readings of local Bills.